Do students from low ranking MD schools even get interviews at top 10 radiology residencies?

[Qwerty122]

Hey all, hoping to get some input from radiology residents, especially those from a "low ranking" MD school. I wanted to know the influence of school prestige on interview invitation from top 10 radiology residencies, given that you have excellent boards, clinical grades, ECs, research, etc. I've heard that it's more on you to pull your weight rather than relying on your med school's name, but seeing the residents at top 10 radiology residencies, it seems most of them are from higher ranked medical schools. So I was wondering about the validity of this statement, and whether or not top 10 radiology residencies do send out interviews to students from a low ranking med school.

I'm asking because one of the top 10s is literally next to family, and I wanted to know actually how plausible matching into a place like that is.

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[RealHumanBean1]

Hey all, hoping to get some input from radiology residents, especially those from a "low ranking" MD school. I wanted to know the influence of school prestige on interview invitation from top 10 radiology residencies, given that you have excellent boards, clinical grades, ECs, research, etc. I've heard that it's more on you to pull your weight rather than relying on your med school's name, but seeing the residents at top 10 radiology residencies, it seems most of them are from higher ranked medical schools. So I was wondering about the validity of this statement, and whether or not top 10 radiology residencies do send out interviews to students from a low ranking med school.

I'm asking because one of the top 10s is literally next to family, and I wanted to know actually how plausible matching into a place like that is.

Attending a prestigious medical school definitely helps you pull interview invites, but attending a less prestigious e.g. a state school doesn't preclude you if you're a superstar applicant with a compelling application. I know of several students from state schools with multiple Top 10-20 DR interviews, but they're all stellar applicants. Strong family ties can be boost your application even more if you're already a competitive applicant. It's true that you're at a bit of a disadvantage compared to students from top medical schools, but you're not precluded from interview invitations if you craft an incredible application (top board scores, mostly or all clinical honors, excellent LORs, rads-specific research, a compelling narrative about your journey and career goals). Doing so, though, is easier said than done.

Two caveats, the latter two being mostly for other readers:
1. This differs from program to program. Some top programs take students from a more heterogenous medical school background, while others seem to be more "Ivy League"-heavy. I think it's worth noting which programs are which, but if you're a stellar applicant then it doesn't hurt to shoot for the stars anyways.
2. This is just a reminder that I'm speaking to interview invites because the match process is such that we can only know where people end up, not how a program actually ranked applicants in past matches (you seem to realize this based on your question, but I wanted to reiterate for all readers). It's possible that there's some self-selection on applicants' parts that contributes to the makeup of the finalized residency classes.
3. If by "less prestigious" you had meant a DO medical school, you'd no doubt have had a difficult time getting invitations from Top 10-20 DR programs. That's just the reality of things at this point in time. If this had been the case, you'd have wanted to do a thorough review of all DR programs to see which have a history of taking DO applicants - and focus your application around those programs.

 

[Qwerty122]

Yeah you bring up an interesting point. There are two filters then, one for interview invitation, and the other for ranking the invited applicants. My assumption has been that once you get the interview, you're on equal ground with everyone else and it's your personality that has to carry you over to the finish line. So then, I'm thinking if I can pass the selection process (interview invitation) which takes into account your medical school ranking much more, relative to the process of rank list creation by the residencies, then I can be more confident in my chances after I obtained the top 10 interview, knowing that I won't have a bias against me due to my medical school at that point.

So that's why I was inquiring specifically about the interview invite process: If students from low ranking MDs get top 10 invites, then that's all I need to know. But still, I'm not sure about this line of thinking and might need others to correct me if need be. Hopefully, it is correct though and that bias doesn't carry on to when residencies make their rank list and only for the initial interview invite.

 

[The Last Ankibender]

Hey all, hoping to get some input from radiology residents, especially those from a "low ranking" MD school. I wanted to know the influence of school prestige on interview invitation from top 10 radiology residencies, given that you have excellent boards, clinical grades, ECs, research, etc. I've heard that it's more on you to pull your weight rather than relying on your med school's name, but seeing the residents at top 10 radiology residencies, it seems most of them are from higher ranked medical schools. So I was wondering about the validity of this statement, and whether or not top 10 radiology residencies do send out interviews to students from a low ranking med school.

I'm asking because one of the top 10s is literally next to family, and I wanted to know actually how plausible matching into a place like that is.

It is possible you need to be an Allstar, at my unranked med school, couple top student have match in rads at MGH, JHU, etc.

 

[Cognovi]

My assumption has been that once you get the interview, you're on equal ground with everyone else and it's your personality that has to carry you over to the finish line.

It's not true that you're on equal ground with everyone else at the interview stage. Interview selection is done by one person based on your paper application, but then ranking is done by your interviewers based on a combination of your paper application and your interview and in balance with the ranks of other applicants interviewed by other interviewers. Moreover, interviewers go into your interview having prejudged you based on your paper application, and then your interview completes the picture. Your interviewers could very well point out that you're from a bad medical school and that would hurt your ranking. I have seen it happen. That said, speaking from the point of view of a top radiology program, we interview and rank highly plenty of applicants who are allstars from low ranked medical schools.

 

[Hippocrates II]

Look at the residents of the program and that will probably answer your question.

 

[AzBasRad]

Hey all, hoping to get some input from radiology residents, especially those from a "low ranking" MD school. I wanted to know the influence of school prestige on interview invitation from top 10 radiology residencies, given that you have excellent boards, clinical grades, ECs, research, etc. I've heard that it's more on you to pull your weight rather than relying on your med school's name, but seeing the residents at top 10 radiology residencies, it seems most of them are from higher ranked medical schools. So I was wondering about the validity of this statement, and whether or not top 10 radiology residencies do send out interviews to students from a low ranking med school.

I'm asking because one of the top 10s is literally next to family, and I wanted to know actually how plausible matching into a place like that is.

I am from a bottom tier MD school who interviewed this cycle and received 5 top 10 interviews. I switched at the end of my third year to rads. Here's what worked in my favor:

1) Steps I, II > 250, mostly honors in 3rd year
2) AOA
3) Interesting ECs: This is often underrated by many in SDN. Most top tier residencies are not only research powerhouses but also have many interesting opportunities in other areas (med ed, global health/rad aid, business etc). I founded an advocacy initiative in my institution, which was brought up in every single interview. I spoke diligently about my motivations and how my advocacy fits into radiology residency and career. Everyone interviewing from bottom tier institution will have *some* rads specific research. However, I strongly recommend differentiating yourself with another compelling narrative.
4) Research. This is a checkbox. I had a fews pubs in IM but none in rads. For rads, I had 1 abstract accepted to a national radiology conference and several case reports pending
5) LoRs: I had strong LoRs *with specific examples* from both rads (1) and non-rads (2) attending physicians.

Best of luck!

 

[Qwerty122]

I am from a bottom tier MD school who interviewed this cycle and received 5 top 10 interviews. I switched at the end of my third year to rads. Here's what worked in my favor:

1) Steps I, II > 250, mostly honors in 3rd year
2) AOA
3) Interesting ECs: This is often underrated by many in SDN. Most top tier residencies are not only research powerhouses but also have many interesting opportunities in other areas (med ed, global health/rad aid, business etc). I founded an advocacy initiative in my institution, which was brought up in every single interview. I spoke diligently about my motivations and how my advocacy fits into radiology residency and career. Everyone interviewing from bottom tier institution will have *some* rads specific research. However, I strongly recommend differentiating yourself with another compelling narrative.
4) Research. This is a checkbox. I had a fews pubs in IM but none in rads. For rads, I had 1 abstract accepted to a national radiology conference and several case reports pending
5) LoRs: I had strong LoRs *with specific examples* from both rads (1) and non-rads (2) attending physicians.

Best of luck!

Thanks for the insight! Good luck with the match!

Just as an estimate, but how many pubs do you think is competitive for t10s. I don't want to just throw out some bs pubs, but hopefully will do a project I'm actually interested in. But I still think it's useful to get a general estimate of what can be achieved by the end of M3 year

 

[AzBasRad]

Thanks for the insight! Good luck with the match!

Just as an estimate, but how many pubs do you think is competitive for t10s. I don't want to just throw out some bs pubs, but hopefully will do a project I'm actually interested in. But I still think it's useful to get a general estimate of what can be achieved by the end of M3 year

Thanks!
Hard to say how many pubs would be competitive for t10. I would say both quantity and quality are important. RSNA case collection, ACR case in point and educational abstracts/posters at national conferences are easy to pump out.

None of my rads projects were noteworthy - they were fodder for my padding my ERAS CV tbh since I switched at the end of my 3rd year.

 

[rashmile]

Thanks for the insight! Good luck with the match!

Just as an estimate, but how many pubs do you think is competitive for t10s. I don't want to just throw out some bs pubs, but hopefully will do a project I'm actually interested in. But I still think it's useful to get a general estimate of what can be achieved by the end of M3 year

Yeah, I'm from an unranked med school but got several top10ers likely bc of holistic review. You should be fine as long as you can speak to how those experiences contributed to your path to medicine/radiology or shaped you as a team player or person that someone would get along with.

 

[Cognovi]

Doximity Top 10:
University of California (San Francisco)
Massachusetts General Hospital/Harvard Medical School
Washington University/B-JH/SLCH Consortium
NYU Grossman School of Medicine
Duke University Hospital
Johns Hopkins University
Stanford Health Care-Sponsored Stanford University
University of Pennsylvania Health System
University of Michigan Health System
Mayo Clinic College of Medicine and Science (Rochester)

USNR Top 10:

• Johns Hopkins University.
• Harvard University.
• University of California--San Francisco.
• University of Pennsylvania (Perelman)
• Duke University.
• Stanford University.
• Washington University in St. Louis.
• University of Michigan--Ann Arbor
• UCLA - Geffen
• Mayo Clinic

So is NYU top 10? Is UCLA top 10? What is the real top 10?

Doximity - we're talking about the radiology programs, not the medical schools

 

[efle]

Doximity - we're talking about the radiology programs, not the medical schools

US News does specialty rankings now, and I believe the specialty rankings are based on a national survey of senior faculty members, with the question being "please list the 15 best places to train in [specialty]"

So it's basically the same idea as Doximity, except the voting is limited to med school faculty instead.

 

[Cognovi]

US News does specialty rankings now, and I believe the specialty rankings are based on a national survey of senior faculty members, with the question being "please list the 15 best places to train in [specialty]"

So it's basically the same idea as Doximity, except the voting is limited to med school faculty instead.

Yea but the USNWR survey doesn't make sense, since Harvard Medical School doesn't train you in radiology, Mass General does, and Mount Auburn does, and those programs are quite different. Unless you're talking about medical student education in radiology, which is just as silly for different reasons.

 

[efle]

Yea but the USNWR survey doesn't make sense, since Harvard Medical School doesn't train you in radiology, Mass General does, and Mount Auburn does, and those programs are quite different. Unless you're talking about medical student education in radiology, which is just as silly for different reasons.

I'm sure they can correct for one university having multiple affiliations, you can probably put down MGH or Brigham or BIDMC and they'll tally whichever as +1 to Harvard. It's definitely a faculty ranking of residencies though (best programs in each specialty to use their term) to compete with Doximity.

 

[sandstorm223]

I’m a DO and currently an R1 at a top 20 program. It’s certainly possible with effort.

 

[Qwerty122]

I’m a DO and currently an R1 at a top 20 program. It’s certainly possible with effort.

Congrats! Great to see it!

Any advice for DOs who may read this in the future who similarly share your aspirations?

 

[sandstorm223]

@dllsl7 It’s tough to say now that Step 1 is pass-fail. I am certain that my Step 1 score is what got me into this program, as well as my interviews at other quality programs. Otherwise there was really not much to set me apart, as it seems that most people interviewing at these programs honored most of their rotations and we all had at least some quality research completed while in medical school. I would recommend doubling down on everything that still has a number attached. Blow your COMLEX tests and Step 2 out of the water and you may still have a chance. It’s a tough world for DO students now, and certainly the process is much less meritocratic in favor of medical school hierarchy instead.