CRNA versus Anesthesiologist -> Resident Life versus Life of MDA

[Pockets09]

Hey everyone, I'm a 21 year old college student and I am currently working on my BS in Nursing in NY. I guess I'm the type who like to think far in advance about my career path. I do not see myself as a floor nurse for the rest of my life; thus, I want to do something "thrilling and interesting." From what I was told and through research, administering anesthesia and assisting in an operating room during surgery are truly thrilling and a very satisfying career choice; thus, I want to pursue CRNA or MD in Anesthesiology (MDA).

This is a two part forum:

PART I

At first, I was contemplating getting a degree as a CRNA because in some hospitals in NY, some CRNA have a three day work week/ sometimes four. Thus, this gives them time to pursue other interest like traveling or picking up an instrument and to me this is very appealing. But I've heard that most hospitals prefer to hire anesthesiologist because of their extensive training. Is there any truth to this?

But now, I'm thinking about going to medical school to further my knowledge. I am aware that this mean 4 years of medical school then 4 years of residency, but I'm up for the challenge!

School and hard work aren't the problem. The problem is life! I mean after all the schooling I've put myself through, I want a life!!! I want to live a little instead of going from being totally immersed in my schooling to being fully overwhelmed by my work.

Is there a difference in lifestyle between a CRNA and an anesthesiologist? For example (from what I was told):
CRNA are not on call, usually work 40 hrs/week, gets paid about 90-130k
MDA sometimes have wacky hours, gets paid about 150-300k, [I'm not sure if they are one call]

So ultimately what are the pros and cons in being a CRNA or MDA?

PART II

And if I do pursue medical school then residency, what is the difference in lifestyle between a resident of anesthesiology and a working medical doctor of anesthesiology?

I understand that a resident is expected to work at crazy hours of the day and they work about 60 hrs/week or more and is paid approximately $40,000-$50,000. The training is stressful and extensive. I can live with that for four years if it's necessary for me to achieve my goals. However, after residency, will things change?

I know the pay for an anesthesiologist is wonderful so I'm not concern about that. I just want to know the following:

1. What are the hours like for an anesthesiologist?
2. Are you on call?
3. Do you have time to pursue other interest or have time to be in the presence of your family?

If there's anything you, the reader, want to add or comment on, please advise. I know this is a very long thread, but thank you so much for taking your time out to read (and comment) [on] it!! Have a wonderful day

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[periopdoc]

It has been said that you should only be a physician if there is nothing else in the world that you can imagine being. I concur.

If you want time off pick a career where you can dictate that. The risk/ reward ratio favors CRNA for someone just starting off right now.

My schedule for this month looks like this.

I am off this Sat and Sun, next Mon, Wed, Thurs.

That's it for the month, assuming I don't get called in on any other days next week.

I love my job.

- pod

 

[Pockets09]

I do agree that in order to have a fulfilling career, passion is a must! Sadly, I'm not sure if I have much passion for anything. However, I was going to work as a nurse for two years (1. to save money for further education and 2. to get experience) before I decide which path I'm going to take. And, I think I might shadow both a CRNA and an anesthesiologist to get a better understanding of what is expected from each profession.

Thanks for your reply.

 

[ICd8U]

I do agree that in order to have a fulfilling career, passion is a must! Sadly, I'm not sure if I have much passion for anything. However, I was going to work as a nurse for two years (1. to save money for further education and 2. to get experience) before I decide which path I'm going to take. And, I think I might shadow both a CRNA and an anesthesiologist to get a better understanding of what is expected from each profession.

Thanks for your reply.

If you are "not sure if you have passion for anything" a career in anesthesia, weather as a crna or an anesthesiologist is probably not for you. Just saying.......

 

[Consigliere]

Take the easy route, kid. Become a CRNA.

 

[Pockets09]

I understand what you are saying, BUT passion doesn't just develop because you say "I'm so passionate about this or that" without attempting it first. I'm still at my early stage of development; thus, I've stated that I hope to shadow a CRNA or MDA to get the "lay of the land." You just don't wake up with "passion" for a particular field, you create it by exploring and attempting.

I haven't found my "calling" in life, and that's why I'm exploring!

 

[Bertelman]

If you are "not sure if you have passion for anything" a career in anesthesia, weather as a crna or an anesthesiologist is probably not for you. Just saying.......

Let's be fair- we tend to ridicule undergrads here for having "passion" for a specialty before they've even begun med school. We can't also pass judgment on someone for lacking passion in a field they have never been exposed to.

If you poll most 21 y/o undergrads, their passions probably include football, drinking and the beach. I think the OP has actually posted some well-thought questions. And to be perfectly honest, I don't think most MDs or CRNAs can truly say they have a "passion" for their work, but that doesn't stop them.

 

[Bertelman]

1. What are the hours like for an anesthesiologist?
2. Are you on call?
3. Do you have time to pursue other interest or have time to be in the presence of your family?

1) You can tailor this to your own desires, to some extent. This may depend on the city/market you work in. Avg for physicians is probably 55-65, but there are plenty who do 40 or less. These tend not to be partnership tracks, which means you will get paid less, but if hours are more important than salary, then you can make it happen.

2) Again, it depends. Typically, yes, but not always in house. And you can find positions (again, typically not partner) that have no call. Places I have seen with inhouse physician call also tend to have inhouse CRNA call, so in general I don;t think choosing one career over the other would protect you from inhouse call.

3) Again, you can make it happen if you want it bad enough. Sell your calls. Buy vacation time from your partners. But in general, I would say CRNAs typically work less hours than physicians. Can't say what kind of vacation time CRNAs get, probably depends on hospital HR policies, but it's pretty common for anesthesiologists to get 6-12 wks per year.

 

[pgg]

I do agree that in order to have a fulfilling career, passion is a must! Sadly, I'm not sure if I have much passion for anything. However, I was going to work as a nurse for two years (1. to save money for further education and 2. to get experience) before I decide which path I'm going to take. And, I think I might shadow both a CRNA and an anesthesiologist to get a better understanding of what is expected from each profession.

This is a reasonable plan.

Be aware that MOST people who enter medical school with a particular specialty in mind will end up doing something different. Anesthesia may be the pinnacle of clinical achievement open to nurses, but there are lots of challenging and rewarding fields physicians can choose.

The things about anesthesia that make it enjoyable to most of us are difficult to perceive from the outside. Anesthesia done well often looks boring, because crises are prevented or averted, not managed.

The CRNA profession appears to be rapidly overproducing graduates. It's not crazy to think that a lot of new CRNAs in 5-10 years will either be working as RNs in "desirable" cities or relocating to BFE to find work as CRNAs.

There is room for a normal, non-dysfunctional family life and other interests as an anesthesia attending and med student. It can be done, though it's harder, as a resident.

I mostly agree with periopdoc; the risk/reward ratio probably tilts toward CRNAs but there's a definite lawyer-like overproduction trend going on there. And I love my job enough that I enjoy talking about it places like this forum when I'm not working.

 

[ssmallz]

You will never have a "normal life" in hospital based anesthesia. You do not control who, what, or when cases come to the OR and the OR operates 24/7 365. The best you can hope for is shift work or outpt surgery centers. If you want a decent lifestyle, don't go into anesthesia, especially as a doc. CRNAs have the luxury of shift work, most MDs don't

 

[pgg]

If you are "not sure if you have passion for anything" a career in anesthesia, weather as a crna or an anesthesiologist is probably not for you. Just saying.......

My passion for medicine was ground out of me somewhere between my MS1 biochem class and first medicine ward month as a MS3. Fortunately I found anesthesia ...

 

[Consigliere]

My passion for medicine was ground out of me somewhere between my MS1 biochem class and first medicine ward month as a MS3. Fortunately I found anesthesia ...

Man, if I was Blade or one of the other SDN-savvy guys I would say "well you gotta get that passion back" and then post a YouTube clip from Rocky II (or III, or IV? who knows) where he is in the gym with Apollo Creed and Apollo says "see these guys....they're hungry....they got the eye of the tiger." Then I'd post that clip.

 

[pgg]

Man, if I was Blade or one of the other SDN-savvy guys I would say "well you gotta get that passion back" and then post a YouTube clip from Rocky II (or III, or IV? who knows) where he is in the gym with Apollo Creed and Apollo says "see these guys....they're hungry....they got the eye of the tiger." Then I'd post that clip.

Oh I still love anesthesia ... it's just that when I started med school I was thinking neurology, because brains are cool, and before long that enthusiasm was crushed by the realization that I'd rather gouge out my eyeballs with a rusty spoon than work in a field where the daily grind consists of talking to stroke patient after dementia patient after [degenerative neurologic disease] patient in a clinic, all the while knowing that their conditions were incurable and the best I could reasonably hope for was some sort of slowing of their inexorably fatal and disabling disease process.

I'm pretty sure that other than soul-sapping clinic work, the only other thing neurologists do is cause PDPHs with 20g cutting needles.


It's not unlikely that the OP will be equally disillusioned with anesthesia once he's really exposed to it and discovers what he loves and hates about medicine. I think that's impossible to know before living the dream for a little while, no matter how many message boards one reads.

 

[Pockets09]

Thanks everyone for the feedback.
I know that you can go into something with a certain mindset and in the end come out of it with something different. Nothing is set in stone, but I like to explore different options

With the advancement of any career, certain questions need to be entertained. But, I hope to actively figure out this path myself through experience because no amount of online research can prepare you for reality and the hands on work required.

 

[cchoukal]

Thanks everyone for the feedback.
I know that you can go into something with a certain mindset and in the end come out of it with something different. Nothing is set in stone, but I like to explore different options

With the advancement of any career, certain questions need to be entertained. But, I hope to actively figure out this path myself through experience because no amount of online research can prepare you for reality and the hands on work required.

It may be trite, but since no one else here has said it yet, I will. First decide whether you want to be a physician or a nurse.

If you go on to become a nurse, there will be all sorts of possible career paths in various areas: administration, patient care, advanced clipboard-holding, and nurse-practitionerships in a wide range of specialties (from anesthesia to dermatology to neurosurgery). You will practice in these areas as a nurse or a nurse practitioner.

If you go on to become a physician, there will be all sorts of possible career paths in various areas: clinicians, researchers, administrators, and a wide range of specialties (from anesthesia to dermatology to neurosurgery). You will practice in these areas as a physician.

It is beyond the scope of this post to differentiate for you between a nurse/NP and a physician, but that has been covered elsewhere.

As a side note, in many cases, whether or not you are qualified to be admitted to medical school will already have been decided by the time you are a 21 year old college student (junior, senior year?). This may all be a moot point for you.

 

[Mman]

It may be trite, but since no one else here has said it yet, I will. First decide whether you want to be a physician or a nurse.

If you go on to become a nurse, there will be all sorts of possible career paths in various areas: administration, patient care, advanced clipboard-holding, and nurse-practitionerships in a wide range of specialties (from anesthesia to dermatology to neurosurgery). You will practice in these areas as a nurse or a nurse practitioner.

If you go on to become a physician, there will be all sorts of possible career paths in various areas: clinicians, researchers, administrators, and a wide range of specialties (from anesthesia to dermatology to neurosurgery). You will practice in these areas as a physician.

It is beyond the scope of this post to differentiate for you between a nurse/NP and a physician, but that has been covered elsewhere.

As a side note, in many cases, whether or not you are qualified to be admitted to medical school will already have been decided by the time you are a 21 year old college student (junior, senior year?). This may all be a moot point for you.

100% agreement. The choice is medicine vs nursing, not Anesthesiologist vs CRNA. Gotta decide if you want to be the doctor or the nurse. I'd venture a guess that the vast majority of medical students end up choosing a specialty that is different from what they would've guessed prior to starting medical school. Lots of reasons for that, but the primary one is that you likely just haven't been exposed to every area of medicine. I never considered anesthesia as a field until my M3 year and didn't solidify it as a choice until my M4 year. Had to see what I liked and what I didn't like about other fields and pick one that fit me best.



If you decide you want to go to medical school, it is unlikely you will choose to be an anesthesiologist even if that's what you lean to right now. I mean you might, but probably not. So don't go to medical school because you think an anesthesiologist would be a better job than a CRNA.

 

[Coastie]

What's an MDA?

Statistically, the worst degree to get into med school in undergrad is a nursing degree.

The science isn't up to snuff and the dedication is questionable.

Go get a solid science degree. Get some solid science pre-reqs if you don't plan on getting a new degree.

But, once again I ask, what's an MDA?

Hey everyone, I'm a 21 year old college student and I am currently working on my BS in Nursing in NY. I guess I'm the type who like to think far in advance about my career path. I do not see myself as a floor nurse for the rest of my life; thus, I want to do something "thrilling and interesting." From what I was told and through research, administering anesthesia and assisting in an operating room during surgery are truly thrilling and a very satisfying career choice; thus, I want to pursue CRNA or MD in Anesthesiology (MDA).

This is a two part forum:

PART I

At first, I was contemplating getting a degree as a CRNA because in some hospitals in NY, some CRNA have a three day work week/ sometimes four. Thus, this gives them time to pursue other interest like traveling or picking up an instrument and to me this is very appealing. But I've heard that most hospitals prefer to hire anesthesiologist because of their extensive training. Is there any truth to this?

But now, I'm thinking about going to medical school to further my knowledge. I am aware that this mean 4 years of medical school then 4 years of residency, but I'm up for the challenge!

School and hard work aren't the problem. The problem is life! I mean after all the schooling I've put myself through, I want a life!!! I want to live a little instead of going from being totally immersed in my schooling to being fully overwhelmed by my work.

Is there a difference in lifestyle between a CRNA and an anesthesiologist? For example (from what I was told):
CRNA are not on call, usually work 40 hrs/week, gets paid about 90-130k
MDA sometimes have wacky hours, gets paid about 150-300k, [I'm not sure if they are one call]

So ultimately what are the pros and cons in being a CRNA or MDA?

PART II

And if I do pursue medical school then residency, what is the difference in lifestyle between a resident of anesthesiology and a working medical doctor of anesthesiology?

I understand that a resident is expected to work at crazy hours of the day and they work about 60 hrs/week or more and is paid approximately $40,000-$50,000. The training is stressful and extensive. I can live with that for four years if it's necessary for me to achieve my goals. However, after residency, will things change?

I know the pay for an anesthesiologist is wonderful so I'm not concern about that. I just want to know the following:

1. What are the hours like for an anesthesiologist?
2. Are you on call?
3. Do you have time to pursue other interest or have time to be in the presence of your family?

If there's anything you, the reader, want to add or comment on, please advise. I know this is a very long thread, but thank you so much for taking your time out to read (and comment) [on] it!! Have a wonderful day

 

[Pockets09]

What's an MDA?

Statistically, the worst degree to get into med school in undergrad is a nursing degree.

The science isn't up to snuff and the dedication is questionable.

Go get a solid science degree. Get some solid science pre-reqs if you don't plan on getting a new degree.

But, once again I ask, what's an MDA?

"Statistically, the worst degree to get into med school in undergrad is a nursing degree."
I dare to disagree since I know of people who have graduated with a BA in English, Dancing, etc. and were successful in their admission into medical school. And from my knowledge English major or Dance major does not require as much science courses as does Nursing major. Thus, it is not necessary to go get a "solid science degree." And last time I checked, in the realm of health care, nursing is a crucial, active component unlike biologists or chemists.

Regardless of major, everyone who apply to med school must meet the following requirements: 1 year of bio, physics, and english, and 2 years of chemistry. Thus, I do not quite understand your statement: "The science isn't up to snuff" since everyone have to fulfill said courses. Along with these science courses that nursing majors have to study, we also have to take health/ physical assessment, theory and research, and dedicate two years to clinical rotations. So, I do no know where you derived this "statistics" from, but I vehemently disagree.

MDA- acronym for Medical Doctor of Anesthesiology.

 

[RT2MD]

I'll take a crack at this one... I'm kinda surprised you haven't had to pull out your flame ******ant underwear yet!

I was in a similar spot several years ago. I was a respiratory therapist, interested in anesthesia. I was trying to figure out what I wanted to do. I knew I had to either go to AA school, or medical school... RN-->working-->CRNA school would have taken me about as much time as medical school... so that wasn't really an option.

I'll echo the bit about do you want to be a nurse or a physician. I had worked for ~4 years before I made my decision. That was 4 years in an academic hospital, actively searching out different medical specialties, etc. I actually had submitted my application to an AA program when I had several patients in the ICU that made me realize that I needed to try medical school. These patients were extremely sick, and I realized how much I enjoyed taking care of them. Once I understood that I would not be exposed to that level of care as a midlevel provider, I knew that I needed to apply to medical school to be happy. I withdrew my AA application and submitted my med school application. The rest is history. You have to really know what you want out of life. I am about 2 years into medical school, have been actively involved in the anesthesia interest group, etc, and still think that anesthesia seems like the coolest thing in the world. With that being said, I'm still keeping an open mind to other specialties, which I think is imperative.

Also, I'll agree with what Coastie said. Being an RT and applying to medical school was slightly difficult b/c everybody kept asking "why not stay in RT?" The interviewers wanted to know that I really wanted medical school. I think anybody in the healthcare world would get similar questions. I've heard that music/engineering majors have some of the highest rates of acceptance... but I don't know if that's true.

The bit about the MDA was aimed at the fact that some anesthesiologists are offended by that term.... it's kind of a silly term, anesthesiologist is a much better way to refer to physician providers of anesthesia.

Best of luck, feel free to ask me anything you want. If I'm able to help you out, I'll definitely try!

 

[Pockets09]

I'll take a crack at this one... I'm kinda surprised you haven't had to pull out your flame ******ant underwear yet!

I was in a similar spot several years ago. I was a respiratory therapist, interested in anesthesia. I was trying to figure out what I wanted to do. I knew I had to either go to AA school, or medical school... RN-->working-->CRNA school would have taken me about as much time as medical school... so that wasn't really an option.

I'll echo the bit about do you want to be a nurse or a physician. I had worked for ~4 years before I made my decision. That was 4 years in an academic hospital, actively searching out different medical specialties, etc. I actually had submitted my application to an AA program when I had several patients in the ICU that made me realize that I needed to try medical school. These patients were extremely sick, and I realized how much I enjoyed taking care of them. Once I understood that I would not be exposed to that level of care as a midlevel provider, I knew that I needed to apply to medical school to be happy. I withdrew my AA application and submitted my med school application. The rest is history. You have to really know what you want out of life. I am about 2 years into medical school, have been actively involved in the anesthesia interest group, etc, and still think that anesthesia seems like the coolest thing in the world. With that being said, I'm still keeping an open mind to other specialties, which I think is imperative.

Also, I'll agree with what Coastie said. Being an RT and applying to medical school was slightly difficult b/c everybody kept asking "why not stay in RT?" The interviewers wanted to know that I really wanted medical school. I think anybody in the healthcare world would get similar questions. I've heard that music/engineering majors have some of the highest rates of acceptance... but I don't know if that's true.

The bit about the MDA was aimed at the fact that some anesthesiologists are offended by that term.... it's kind of a silly term, anesthesiologist is a much better way to refer to physician providers of anesthesia.

Best of luck, feel free to ask me anything you want. If I'm able to help you out, I'll definitely try!

Thank you for your input. I'm definitely keeping an open mind about things, and I definitely do not plan on jumping the gun. I hope to work for a few years and hop to build a solid understanding of what I want out of my career and life. "I've heard that music/engineering majors have some of the highest rates of acceptance... but I don't know if that's true." - That's interesting, I've never heard of that before!

And I used MDA, not as a title but more of an acronym since anesthesiologist is kind of long to continuously type over and over

Thanks again for your feedback!!

 

[Impromptu]

He is probably just pointing out that there is no such thing as a medical doctor of anesthesiology, but rather an anesthesiologist is a medical doctor who has then gone on to do extensive specialty training in anesthesiology.

I agree with the others that the choice is really between medical physician or nursing. There is a major difference in training when comparing medicine to nursing, especially in the way one thinks about and solves problems. Nurses are vital. They just have different training and fulfill a different purpose than physicians.

When discussing a nursing degree verses a hard science degree that many take prior to entering medical school, the requirements are the same, but the hard science majors will often fulfill them with higher level courses which are much more difficult. The competition to get into medical school is tough, so everyone is looking for a way to stand out, or at least to reach the same level as all the others.

 

[saratoga733]

Nursing major?? I didn't realize there was such a thing in college! As a pre-med in a sea of pre-health students I don't remember meeting a SINGLE person who (at least openly) wanted to be a nurse-- yes, I realize they play a vital role in healthcare and I do appreciate their role. Likely a function of where I went to school. Although I suspect its not a coincidence that local community colleges are hotbeds for nursing programs.

Sure "everyone have to fulfill said courses..." but fortunately for our patients its HOW you fulfill those courses that determines who writes the orders and who follows them.

 

[scudrunner]

And I used MDA, not as a title but more of an acronym since anesthesiologist is kind of long to continuously type over and over

Get used to it. Stop using MDA. There is no such thing as a medical doctor of anesthesiology.

When deciding between the two career paths, ask yourself if you want to become a physician who learns extensively about all aspects of medicine and then specializes in anesthesiology or do you want to be a nurse who learns how to administer anesthesia. There is a stark difference. The choice should be easy.

 

[cchoukal]

Nursing major?? I didn't realize there was such a thing in college! As a pre-med in a sea of pre-health students I don't remember meeting a SINGLE person who (at least openly) wanted to be a nurse-- yes, I realize they play a vital role in healthcare and I do appreciate their role. Likely a function of where I went to school. Although I suspect its not a coincidence that local community colleges are hotbeds for nursing programs.

Sure "everyone have to fulfill said courses..." but fortunately for our patients its HOW you fulfill those courses that determines who writes the orders and who follows them.

I don't want to lend unearned credence to nursing or non-science majors, but the pre-reqs are what they are no matter what your major and there's no way to be sure that taking a higher level of organic chemistry will increase your chances or your skills. I was a psych major, did the bare minimum pre-reqs while in grad school (decided on med school late), and still graduated AOA, and trained and now work at what many consider to be a top program. Plenty of German majors go on to ent and ophtho.

All that said, I think it's more the OP's mindset ("what's the easiest route to a great lifestyle"?) and the specific nursing major that are the much larger impediments to successful admission than the fact that he's not a bio major.

 

[Pockets09]

Get used to it. Stop using MDA. There is no such thing as a medical doctor of anesthesiology.

I've realized that. I honestly do not see a problem with trying to eliminated the tedious motion of typing the same, long word again and again. Ego aside, its purpose is to abbreviate, nothing more.

 

[deleted307836]

I've realized that. I honestly do not see a problem with trying to eliminated the tedious motion of typing the same, long word again and again. Ego aside, its purpose is to abbreviate, nothing more.

You've learned that the abbreviation is offensive to some anesthesiologists, and you're on a forum asking for help from anesthesiologists. Might want to concede this one .

 

[Pockets09]

You've learned that the abbreviation is offensive to some anesthesiologists, and you're on a forum asking for help from anesthesiologists. Might want to concede this one .

I've never realized it to be "offensive" to some anesthesiologists. And once it was brought up, if you've read my posts meticulously, you'd notice I have not since used the abbreviations, but still I had to provide my reason for doing so.

 

[Bertelman]

Nursing major?? I didn't realize there was such a thing in college! As a pre-med in a sea of pre-health students I don't remember meeting a SINGLE person who (at least openly) wanted to be a nurse-- yes, I realize they play a vital role in healthcare and I do appreciate their role. Likely a function of where I went to school. Although I suspect its not a coincidence that local community colleges are hotbeds for nursing programs.

Sure "everyone have to fulfill said courses..." but fortunately for our patients its HOW you fulfill those courses that determines who writes the orders and who follows them.

There wasn't a nursing program at my undergrad campus, either, but plenty of nurses graduate each year with the "BSN" degree you see on their badges. RN-BSN means they attended a nursing undergrad program.

I think those programs are more common at health science centers. My med school had programs for MD, DDS, OT, PT, PA, BSN

And community college is not where you would earn a BSN.

 

[pretenda]

There was definitely a well respected, competitive nursing program at my undergrad.

OP, have you considered becoming an RT then going to AA school or are you too far along in nursing to consider that route? You'd never have to wipe a single tush but your own...

 

[RT2MD]

There was definitely a well respected, competitive nursing program at my undergrad.

OP, have you considered becoming an RT then going to AA school or are you too far along in nursing to consider that route? You'd never have to wipe a single tush but your own...

You could go to AA school as an RN, I know somebody who did... The bigger issue would probably be if the OP lived near an AA school.

 

[Pockets09]

There was definitely a well respected, competitive nursing program at my undergrad.

OP, have you considered becoming an RT then going to AA school or are you too far along in nursing to consider that route? You'd never have to wipe a single tush but your own...

I'll be graduating in May 2013 so I'm kind of too far into the program to "give up" now. I hope to get my BSN and then specialize in a specific field but I like to ponder and weigh other options as well.

From my research, CRNA have more autonomy than AA; unlike an AA, CRNA can administer andsthesia without the presence of an anesthesiologist. However, there are fears that in a few years the supply of CRNA can surpass the demand for CRNA creating a surplus. But I'm going to do more research on AA. Thank you for your suggestion!!!

 

[Gern Blansten]

I've realized that. I honestly do not see a problem with trying to eliminated the tedious motion of typing the same, long word again and again. Ego aside, its purpose is to abbreviate, nothing more.

This may help you understand. Say your name is Bartholomew, which is a long name and hard to write out each time. One of the people who works under you decides that your name is too hard to say each time, so they decide to start calling you prick. You tell that person that your name is Bartholomew and that you do not appreciate being called prick. They persist, despite your objection. You say, I am not a prick and it is disrespectful to call me that. Their fellow employees eventually all decide to call you prick because, they agree, it is much easier to say than Bartholomew and it is so much easier to write. So in email and text discussions, you are now "prick." It becomes so accepted that your boss now calls you prick instead of Bartholomew. He acknowledges you are a nice guy deserving of respect, but come on, prick really rolls right off the tongue with such ease. So, now we will all call Bartholomew "prick" because it will make things so much simpler.

We will call you Bartholomew and you call us anesthesiologists. Sorry, that is the best analogy I could come up with on the spur of the moment to illustrate the ire that the term MDA provokes in some anesthesiologists. It is a term of disrespect coined by CRNA's to try to cheapen our practice of medicine.

 

[Coastie]

You "dare to disagree" despite the fact that you have no clue what you're talking about. Biologists/chemists have no crucial role in healthcare?

The statistics are clear.

Oh, and again I ask, what's an MDA?

Stick to nursing.

"Statistically, the worst degree to get into med school in undergrad is a nursing degree."
I dare to disagree since I know of people who have graduated with a BA in English, Dancing, etc. and were successful in their admission into medical school. And from my knowledge English major or Dance major does not require as much science courses as does Nursing major. Thus, it is not necessary to go get a "solid science degree." And last time I checked, in the realm of health care, nursing is a crucial, active component unlike biologists or chemists.

Regardless of major, everyone who apply to med school must meet the following requirements: 1 year of bio, physics, and english, and 2 years of chemistry. Thus, I do not quite understand your statement: "The science isn't up to snuff" since everyone have to fulfill said courses. Along with these science courses that nursing majors have to study, we also have to take health/ physical assessment, theory and research, and dedicate two years to clinical rotations. So, I do no know where you derived this "statistics" from, but I vehemently disagree.

MDA- acronym for Medical Doctor of Anesthesiology.

 

[Gern Blansten]

There were several nurses in my med school class. They had some distinct advantages over me as far as experience of how things worked in the hospital and having some baseline medical knowledge. They also had a distinct disadvantage in that I did not have as many things to "unlearn."
Sometimes it is easier to teach someone who is starting from scratch than it is to teach someone who thinks they already know it all, but really know a lot of wrong dogmas and 20 year old medical information and are still touting things such as "renal dose dopamine."

 

[auburnO5]

You will never have a "normal life" in hospital based anesthesia. You do not control who, what, or when cases come to the OR and the OR operates 24/7 365. The best you can hope for is shift work or outpt surgery centers. If you want a decent lifestyle, don't go into anesthesia, especially as a doc. CRNAs have the luxury of shift work, most MDs don't

Do you literally just copy and paste this into every thread on this site?

 

[Pockets09]

This may help you understand. Say your name is Bartholomew, which is a long name and hard to write out each time. One of the people who works under you decides that your name is too hard to say each time, so they decide to start calling you prick. You tell that person that your name is Bartholomew and that you do not appreciate being called prick. They persist, despite your objection. You say, I am not a prick and it is disrespectful to call me that. Their fellow employees eventually all decide to call you prick because, they agree, it is much easier to say than Bartholomew and it is so much easier to write. So in email and text discussions, you are now "prick." It becomes so accepted that your boss now calls you prick instead of Bartholomew. He acknowledges you are a nice guy deserving of respect, but come on, prick really rolls right off the tongue with such ease. So, now we will all call Bartholomew "prick" because it will make things so much simpler.

We will call you Bartholomew and you call us anesthesiologists. Sorry, that is the best analogy I could come up with on the spur of the moment to illustrate the ire that the term MDA provokes in some anesthesiologists. It is a term of disrespect coined by CRNA's to try to cheapen our practice of medicine.

Thanks for this very exaggerated analogy. I feel that people read what they want to read and not what is really written, I have stated that I never intended to come across as disrespectful to anyone and once it was brought up, I stopped using the abbreviation and I also explained why I did it.

 

[periopdoc]

Sure there are MDA's... and today, this MDA is doing knee arthroplasties with a MDO. Yesterday I was doing coronary artery bypass grafting with a MDCS and tonight I am on call with a MDOB/Gyn.

This just makes so much sense.



- pod

 

[periopdoc]

If you are going to be doing nursing for two years either way, you will be so close to CRNA, that it just wouldn't make sense to go back and start all over again to become a physician then anesthesiologist if your only goal is giving anesthesia in the OR.

I reiterate. Unless you can't stand not being a physician, you should not go to med school

- pod

 

[Gern Blansten]

Biologists/chemists have no crucial role in healthcare?

You didn't know that? Automobile designers also have no major role in motor vehicle safety either.

 

[Pockets09]

Thank you to those who gave me informative and valuable feedback! I greatly appreciate it and will evaluate all the alternatives provided.

And for those who posted just for the purpose of trolling: http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-IHmZeGAA2pw/Tw9HHzmr2RI/AAAAAAAAB6I/wcW9a5I8Wk0/s1600/troll+face.jpg

Trolls are going to troll

Even so, everyone here seems to love what they do, and I hope I can also find a profession/concentration that I would love to spend the rest of my life doing!
Have a wonderful and prosperous life everyone!!

 

[Gern Blansten]

Thank you to those who gave me informative and valuable feedback!

You're welcome and best of luck in your decision.

 

[Mman]

I've realized that. I honestly do not see a problem with trying to eliminated the tedious motion of typing the same, long word again and again. Ego aside, its purpose is to abbreviate, nothing more.

On a serious note, if you are trying to save typing long things out, the abbreviation is MD. The A is unnecessary and unrelated to the degree. MD. If you want to be particular an MD who is BC/BE by the ABA is also acceptable. MDA is just adding an unnecessary letter on to the end of a well known 2 letter abbreviation.

 

[RT2MD]

If you are going to be doing nursing for two years either way, you will be so close to CRNA, that it just wouldn't make sense to go back and start all over again to become a physician then anesthesiologist if your only goal is giving anesthesia in the OR.

I reiterate. Unless you can't stand not being a physician, you should not go to med school

- pod

I think this is probably the best advice that you can get... I am so glad that I chose the path I chose, I've never regretted it, but what I want isn't what everybody wants. The last line in the quote above is right on the dot. Med school is hard enough that you have to want it more than anything else... otherwise I don't think you will be happy.

 

[MTGas2B]

Sure there are MDA's... and today, this MDA is doing knee arthroplasties with a MDO. Yesterday I was doing coronary artery bypass grafting with a MDCS and tonight I am on call with a MDOB/Gyn.

This just makes so much sense.



- pod

Aren't you actually an MDCA on days you work with the MDCS?

Does that make me an MDI or MDCC?

 

[KungPOWChicken]

How about all the DO's out there. I guess to be respectful they should be referred to as DOA's

 

[W222]

Whats wrong with this poster, and most in this generation, is that they don't have a "passion" for anything that involves the "W" word.....work that is. They all want to collect a six figure paycheck and shop for toys without doing anything. I blame this partly on the "internet culture" where kids in college think they are going to graduate and be given a new job at facebook with 20+ weeks vacation.

If you want to be a nurse, be a nurse. If you want to be a doc, be a doc. Don't do something soley based on lifestyle because you will be disappointed.

 

[Libertas]

I cant say **** or **** or bull****. Why can't you mods figure out a way to censor MDA into ***?

 

[periopdoc]

They all want to collect a six figure paycheck and shop for toys without doing anything.

Sign ME up baby!!!

Of course I would spend most of my time working on my little farm and doing part-time anesthesia, which would, of course, morph into a lot more work than I commit to at first... Hmm maybe I ain't as much a part of that generation as I thought, but I would still take the offer.

I cant say **** or **** or bull****. Why can't you mods figure out a way to censor MDA into ***?

- pod

 

[periopdoc]

Aren't you actually an MDCA on days you work with the MDCS?

Does that make me an MDI or MDCC?

Well since you are military, shouldn't it be more like MDA-I or MDA-CC? I could be MDA-CA, PhD LMFAO right?

- pod

 

[Gern Blansten]

Of course I would spend most of my time working on my little farm and doing part-time anesthesia

We need more beet farmers!