Covid Relief Spending

[anbuitachi]

how much money are they giving to hospitals?? it's a covid relief bill in a pandemic. why does it seem like hospitals are barely getting money compared to other industries?

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[aafisahar]

We have such a ill informed and ignorant voting populace not b/c Americans on avg are ill informed or ignorant. It is we allow everyone to vote once they hit a certain age. I am not hear to argue if this is right or wrong because this is probably the best form of Government.

jim crow called, said you're doing a bang up job son

 

[nimbus]

how much money are they giving to hospitals?? it's a covid relief bill in a pandemic. why does it seem like hospitals are barely getting money compared to other industries?

I don’t know but hospitals already got $100billion from CARES Act.

 

[nimbus]

Here’s the whole thing. I haven’t read it.

https://www.congress.gov/117/bills/hr1319/BILLS-117hr1319enr.pdf

 

[pgg]

Just read an article yesterday that the most likely cause of the next big war will be taiwan, and from the simulation games our military has been doing, we'd get crushed by china.

china will dominate. that's the future

China's ascension is like cold fusion and flying cars, always 50 years away.

They're a regional power, nothing more. Their army is not going to swim to Taiwan.

We'll never go to war with them for all the same reasons we never went to war with the USSR.

They have a couple generations of domestic problems to work through. Their growth came at a price.

Angst over China is misplaced.

 

[Goro]

China's ascension is like cold fusion and flying cars, always 50 years away.

They're a regional power, nothing more. Their army is not going to swim to Taiwan.

We'll never go to war with them for all the same reasons we never went to war with the USSR.

They have a couple generations of domestic problems to work through. Their growth came at a price.

Angst over China is misplaced.

In addition they're facing a population bust. It's getting harder for them to get recruits for the armed forces, especially the technically savvy ones needed for the Navy and Air Forces.

Here's a worthwhile listen:

 

[GassYous]

I don’t know but hospitals already got $100billion from CARES Act.

I know of a few systems that lost hundreds of millions last year

 

[anbuitachi]

I don’t know but hospitals already got $100billion from CARES Act.

doesnt seem much since there are thousands of hospitals in the US. like 5 to 6k?
my hospital system said even accounting for the aid from cares act, they are facing 600m loss, a lot of stuff are going to get cut

 

[anbuitachi]

China's ascension is like cold fusion and flying cars, always 50 years away.

They're a regional power, nothing more. Their army is not going to swim to Taiwan.

We'll never go to war with them for all the same reasons we never went to war with the USSR.

They have a couple generations of domestic problems to work through. Their growth came at a price.

Angst over China is misplaced.

you dont think china will ever attack taiwan? im going to disagree with that one

 

[nimbus]

The response to China’s takeover of Hong Kong’s election is underwhelming. There’s basically no consequence for China and the CCP.

US says electoral changes in Hong Kong ‘assault on democracy’

US Secretary of State Antony Blinken says new rules run counter to promises made at the handover in 1997.

www.aljazeera.com

 

[pgg]

you dont think china will ever attack taiwan? im going to disagree with that one

No, just no, absolutely not.

Political and economic pressure, sure. Election tampering, sure. General South-China-Sea-dickishness, sure. There are all kinds of thing China can do to be a spoiler.

Invasion? No. 100 miles of ocean is a long way, and China's navy isn't going to cross it without getting slaughtered by Taiwan, whether or not the US gets drawn into the turkey shoot. The window for an amphibious invasion was decades ago when it was at least remotely plausible that ships with Chinese troops could survive the trip. Technology is moving the other direction, it's harder and harder for ships to move around. Anti-ship missiles and related technologies are fast outpacing ship defenses.

There's a reason why one of the great naval debates of our time is whether or not our own large capital ships are becoming obsolete (or are obsolete already) because shore- and air-based anti-ship weapons have just become too good. If you look at a US carrier group today, the plan for force projection against a near-peer adversary is a looooong standoff distance (hundreds if not the better part of a thousand miles), and longer and longer range strike aircraft, usually involving at least one mid-air refueling event. There's a 100 mile moat around Taiwan, and China can't cross it. Now, or ever. Full stop.

Beyond Taiwan, China's blue-water navy is nonexistent, and generations away from anything resembling force projection. Even accounting for a possible paradigm shift away from large ships with manned aircraft toward smaller ships and UAVs, just no.

 

[pgg]

The response to China’s takeover of Hong Kong’s election is underwhelming. There’s basically no consequence for China and the CCP.

US says electoral changes in Hong Kong ‘assault on democracy’

US Secretary of State Antony Blinken says new rules run counter to promises made at the handover in 1997.

www.aljazeera.com

Well, they've been running their own well-documented little holocaust and ethnic cleansing campaign vs the Uighurs for a few years now, and no one cares. What's a Hong Kong election worth in the shadow of that?

 

[anbuitachi]

No, just no, absolutely not.

Political and economic pressure, sure. Election tampering, sure. General South-China-Sea-dickishness, sure. There are all kinds of thing China can do to be a spoiler.

Invasion? No. 100 miles of ocean is a long way, and China's navy isn't going to cross it without getting slaughtered by Taiwan, whether or not the US gets drawn into the turkey shoot. The window for an amphibious invasion was decades ago when it was at least remotely plausible that ships with Chinese troops could survive the trip. Technology is moving the other direction, it's harder and harder for ships to move around. Anti-ship missiles and related technologies are fast outpacing ship defenses.

There's a reason why one of the great naval debates of our time is whether or not our own large capital ships are becoming obsolete (or are obsolete already) because shore- and air-based anti-ship weapons have just become too good. If you look at a US carrier group today, the plan for force projection against a near-peer adversary is a looooong standoff distance (hundreds if not the better part of a thousand miles), and longer and longer range strike aircraft, usually involving at least one mid-air refueling event. There's a 100 mile moat around Taiwan, and China can't cross it. Now, or ever. Full stop.

Beyond Taiwan, China's blue-water navy is nonexistent, and generations away from anything resembling force projection. Even accounting for a possible paradigm shift away from large ships with manned aircraft toward smaller ships and UAVs, just no.

im not understanding this. why does taiwan have to send in navy ships like that. there are other ways to get to taiwan. bomb the crap out of it first, then fly there or then ship there. who says you got to ship there whil getting destroyed by missiles..

'We're going to lose fast': U.S. Air Force held a war game that started with a Chinese biological attack

Many foreign affairs and national security experts believe the global pandemic has accelerated trends that were already pushing the U.S. and China toward a potential confrontation.

www.yahoo.com

 

[pgg]

Don't read too much into reports of war games we "lose" so badly. They're typically staged in ways that deny us use of resources, particular technologies, systems for battlefield integration. Most are designed for us to "lose" because they're training events, and there's nothing to be learned from kicking ass and high-fiving each other on the way to the bar to celebrate with some shots.

Seriously - the example you linked was a fabricated scenario involving a biological weapon attack and surprise missile attack on the US! You realize, I hope, that US strategic doctrine to a WMD attack initiated by a state actor has been unchanged for SEVEN DECADES and consists of emptying the silos with a strategic nuclear response?

Likewise, when a US politician or Pentagon officer speaks two sentences one after the other, the first will usually be a justification for the desperate and imminent need for funding in the second.

China's not crossing the Taiwan strait with guns drawn. They're not going to bomb it for grins or spite. Air attacks short of nuclear weapons aren't going to degrade Taiwan's anti-ship capabilities to the point that any Chinese soldiers will survive the trip to put boots on the island. It's just not going to happen.

 

[Destalchemy]

Why stop there? why not 100$ min wage

Slippery slope fallacy. Why stop at 100? Why not make it 1000? Hell, let’s eliminate jobs and give everyone their money for free.
Congrats, if you support a 15 minimum wage, you are a communist.

 

[emergentmd]

For some reason 15/hr is the "minimum living wage". WTH is that. Tell me where they get this number. Do people not understand economics?

Name me one country with a 15/hr min wage.

Ill be back tomorrow to find this long list.

Just more political rhetoric to drum up votes when any logical person would know that it will hurt more than help the economy and the poor people. I think the only person who really thinks this is a good idea is AOC who also thinks that unemployment is low b/c some people have to take on two jobs.

 

[anbuitachi]

For some reason 15/hr is the "minimum living wage". WTH is that. Tell me where they get this number. Do people not understand economics?

Name me one country with a 15/hr min wage.

Ill be back tomorrow to find this long list.

Just more political rhetoric to drum up votes when any logical person would know that it will hurt more than help the economy and the poor people. I think the only person who really thinks this is a good idea is AOC who also thinks that unemployment is low b/c some people have to take on two jobs.

cause its bs!

 

[MirrorTodd]

For some reason 15/hr is the "minimum living wage". WTH is that. Tell me where they get this number. Do people not understand economics?

Name me one country with a 15/hr min wage.

Ill be back tomorrow to find this long list.

Just more political rhetoric to drum up votes when any logical person would know that it will hurt more than help the economy and the poor people. I think the only person who really thinks this is a good idea is AOC who also thinks that unemployment is low b/c some people have to take on two jobs.

I thought it was all tied into inflation. Like if the minimum wage had kept up with economic growth and inflation over the past 10 or 15 years or however long it's been since the last minimum wage hike, we'd be sitting at around $15 an hour as our minimum wage.

 

[chocomorsel]

You haven't been reading the posts or the actual bill. Most of the money isn't going to the poor or homeless. The Biden Covid relief bill is filled with about 500+ billion in pure pork. I would support a real Covid relief bill costing 600 billion focusing on those in need in this country. That is NOT what we got with the Biden bill.

6 trillion dollars. Do you realize how much money that is? With 6 trillion being allocated there shouldn't be a homeless or hungry person in America.

Why do you keep going on and on about pork. What does “pork” mean in your rant? Please explain.

 

[Twiggidy]

Why do you keep going on and on about pork. What does “pork” mean in your rant? Please explain.

"Pork" is when they just throw things into a bill that largely have nothing to do with the bill and is just extra spending. An example in the current bill is there is a 58 billion dollar bail out for private sector pensions.

<i>Pork barrel</i>

 

[emergentmd]

All of these massive bill is about 25% actually helpful and the rest free hand outs to get their constituents $$$ thus vote.

I would bet almost anything that NONE of our state rep/senators have read the whole bill. Just like NONE of them read the ACA.

Its sad that they are too lazy to sit down to read something before voting.

 

[emergentmd]

I may be completely ignorant when it comes to economics but I don't see any outcome other than increased unemployment (which is a given) and increased poverty for those currently in poverty.

I just don't see, in the long term, anyway someone currently making $7/hr would be in a better position when their pay increases to $15/hr. In the short term, absolutely.

Payroll is typically one of the largest costs for any small business. Not only does your pay increase, All low salary for all businesses that you use has to increase pay. Those making $20/hr would quit of expect to make $25-30/hr. Imagine is you are a manager at a restaurant making $20/hr and the bus boy is now making $15/hr. You will either get a raise or leave.

So now eventhough you take home twice as much per hour, your number of hours will likely decrease. So instead of taking home twice as much, you may just take home 50% as much.

But now your childcare doubles, eating out doubles, everything touched by a small business doubles.

I just don't see this making the minimum wage worker's life any better. You are worth what someone else is willing to work in the same job. The only way to increase your pay independent higher inflation is to get a better paying job. Make yourself worth $20/hr.

 

[chessknt]

I may be completely ignorant when it comes to economics but I don't see any outcome other than increased unemployment (which is a given) and increased poverty for those currently in poverty.

I just don't see, in the long term, anyway someone currently making $7/hr would be in a better position when their pay increases to $15/hr. In the short term, absolutely.

Payroll is typically one of the largest costs for any small business. Not only does your pay increase, All low salary for all businesses that you use has to increase pay. Those making $20/hr would quit of expect to make $25-30/hr. Imagine is you are a manager at a restaurant making $20/hr and the bus boy is now making $15/hr. You will either get a raise or leave.

So now eventhough you take home twice as much per hour, your number of hours will likely decrease. So instead of taking home twice as much, you may just take home 50% as much.

But now your childcare doubles, eating out doubles, everything touched by a small business doubles.

I just don't see this making the minimum wage worker's life any better. You are worth what someone else is willing to work in the same job. The only way to increase your pay independent higher inflation is to get a better paying job. Make yourself worth $20/hr.

Does this apply to medicine too? If pcps got to make 500k would you expect to make 1 mil because you are worth more?

 

[DocMcCoy]

All of these massive bill is about 25% actually helpful and the rest free hand outs to get their constituents $$$ thus vote.

I would bet almost anything that NONE of our state rep/senators have read the whole bill. Just like NONE of them read the ACA.

Its sad that they are too lazy to sit down to read something before voting.

1000 page pieces of legislation. You don’t need to know anything about politics to know they are primarily fluff and pork.

How is anyone supposed to read, understand and digest that before voting on it.

Government is a bloated mess and its beyond aggravating.

 

[emergentmd]

Does this apply to medicine too? If pcps got to make 500k would you expect to make 1 mil because you are worth more?

This is just ignorant.

If somehow PCPS makes 500K then that has no affect on my job and it should not. But market forces would kick in and most med students would go into FM until something corrects.

But If someone in a higher positional job ie manager making 20/hr should absolutely expect to be paid more if the bus boy gets $15/hr. Their expectations only will be met if they are deemed worth it. If not, then they will find someone to become manager for 20/hr.

You can't screw around with economics by injecting new rules/regulations.

 

[nimbus]

Speaking of pork, I got a slice of pork in my paycheck this month and I ain’t giving it back!

 

[chessknt]

This is just ignorant.

If somehow PCPS makes 500K then that has no affect on my job and it should not. But market forces would kick in and most med students would go into FM until something corrects.

But If someone in a higher positional job ie manager making 20/hr should absolutely expect to be paid more if the bus boy gets $15/hr. Their expectations only will be met if they are deemed worth it. If not, then they will find someone to become manager for 20/hr.

You can't screw around with economics by injecting new rules/regulations.

Im sure your anesthesiologist house would now cost twice as much due to competition so I'm sure it would have a pretty big impact on you. So you would just quit until you found someone willing to pay you more relative to the pcps? You know you're worth more than them because you're supposed to make more money because historically that has been the case and you have an extra year of training yes?

 

[chocomorsel]

Im sure your anesthesiologist house would now cost twice as much due to competition so I'm sure it would have a pretty big impact on you. So you would just quit until you found someone willing to pay you more relative to the pcps? You know you're worth more than them because you're supposed to make more money because historically that has been the case and you have an extra year of training yes?

This is a stupid argument. We aren’t their superiors and totally different specialities. We don’t necessarily have any more experience than they do.
This is not the same thing.
Let them make that 500k. Good for them. We all know why we get paid what we do. Ain’t because we are in charge of sh it.

 

[chessknt]

This is a stupid argument. We aren’t their superiors and totally different specialities. We don’t necessarily have any more experience than they do.
This is not the same thing.
Let them make that 500k. Good for them. We all know why we get paid what we do. Ain’t because we are in charge of sh it.

I would argue that same attitude would be adopted by the managers in this hypothetical scenario. The assistant manager of a grocery store is not going to quit and try to find double pay because the bag boy makes 70% of his salary.

 

[chocomorsel]

I would argue that same attitude would be adopted by the managers in this hypothetical scenario. The assistant manager of a grocery store is not going to quit and try to find double pay because the bag boy makes 70% of his salary.

Well then just say that. Compare apples to apples. Not to oranges. Totally different.
And quite frankly I don’t know what the pay differential is between worker bees and managers so I can’t tell you. However, if their juniors end up making more why would they not just go back to being worker bees?

 

[Twiggidy]

Well then just say that. Compare apples to apples. Not to oranges. Totally different.
And quite frankly I don’t know what the pay differential is between worker bees and managers so I can’t tell you. However, if their juniors end up making more why would they not just go back to being worker bees?

This happened on The Office. Michael found out sales made more money so he tricked Jim into being manager and went back to sales. He later missed having his own “office” and that he also had to do actual work in sales. So, despite the pay difference, some people work in management for the perks of being in management

 

[emergentmd]

This is a stupid argument. We aren’t their superiors and totally different specialities. We don’t necessarily have any more experience than they do.
This is not the same thing.
Let them make that 500k. Good for them. We all know why we get paid what we do. Ain’t because we are in charge of sh it.

If you think a manage typically making 2x what a HS/college student/unskilled makes bagging groceries at 7/hr suddenly gets bumped to 15/hr would be happy with this the manager is dumb and deserves what he makes.

Most managers would either ask for a similar raise, do less work as a bag boy, or look for another job.

A more similar comparison is if my PA who makes $70/hr and suddenly makes $140/hr, and I make 140/hr, then I surely would be unhappy. Let me be a PA taking care of cough/colds with very little liability or I am bolting.

 

[chocomorsel]

If you think a manage typically making 2x what a HS/college student/unskilled makes bagging groceries at 7/hr suddenly gets bumped to 15/hr would be happy with this the manager is dumb and deserves what he makes.

Most managers would either ask for a similar raise, do less work as a bag boy, or look for another job.

A more similar comparison is if my PA who makes $70/hr and suddenly makes $140/hr, and I make 140/hr, then I surely would be unhappy. Let me be a PA taking care of cough/colds with very little liability or I am bolting.

Exactly. Like compare the same job with different levels. Not two different ones that have nothing to do with each other who get paid differently for different reasons.
Of course when you point that out people want to roll their eyes even though they make no damn sense and sound ignorant AH.

 

[chocomorsel]

Im sure your anesthesiologist house would now cost twice as much due to competition so I'm sure it would have a pretty big impact on you. So you would just quit until you found someone willing to pay you more relative to the pcps? You know you're worth more than them because you're supposed to make more money because historically that has been the case and you have an extra year of training yes?

Still an ignorant ass comparison. Haha.
Duh.

 

[pgg]

I may be completely ignorant when it comes to economics but I don't see any outcome other than increased unemployment (which is a given) and increased poverty for those currently in poverty.

I just don't see, in the long term, anyway someone currently making $7/hr would be in a better position when their pay increases to $15/hr. In the short term, absolutely.

Payroll is typically one of the largest costs for any small business. Not only does your pay increase, All low salary for all businesses that you use has to increase pay. Those making $20/hr would quit of expect to make $25-30/hr. Imagine is you are a manager at a restaurant making $20/hr and the bus boy is now making $15/hr. You will either get a raise or leave.

So now eventhough you take home twice as much per hour, your number of hours will likely decrease. So instead of taking home twice as much, you may just take home 50% as much.

But now your childcare doubles, eating out doubles, everything touched by a small business doubles.

I just don't see this making the minimum wage worker's life any better. You are worth what someone else is willing to work in the same job. The only way to increase your pay independent higher inflation is to get a better paying job. Make yourself worth $20/hr.

Your argument is just as good (or bad) as the argument that opposes any minimum wage at all. If it was $2/hour, employers could hire more people, right? Wouldn't that be great? Why not $1/hr and some credit at the company store?

The more compelling argument for a $15 minimum wage is simply that the existing minimum wage hasn't kept pace with inflation for the last 30 years - despite enormous growth in corporate profits in that time.

Whats more, if a business can only stay afloat by offloading some of its labor costs to the government (add up all the ways government keeps low wage workers afloat, from food stamps to WIC to welfare to medicaid to various refundable tax credits and even these stimulus checks) then the business model is broken.

Taken to an absurd extreme, your argument is the same as an 1860 slave owners who wrung their hands over how their business model would fail if they had to actually pay for labor. Beyond room and board in the slave quarters, anyway. Sounds ridiculous, right?

We should back up a bit - do you think there should be a minimum wage AT ALL? And if so, how should it be set?

 

[coffeebythelake]

Don't read too much into reports of war games we "lose" so badly. They're typically staged in ways that deny us use of resources, particular technologies, systems for battlefield integration. Most are designed for us to "lose" because they're training events, and there's nothing to be learned from kicking ass and high-fiving each other on the way to the bar to celebrate with some shots.

Seriously - the example you linked was a fabricated scenario involving a biological weapon attack and surprise missile attack on the US! You realize, I hope, that US strategic doctrine to a WMD attack initiated by a state actor has been unchanged for SEVEN DECADES and consists of emptying the silos with a strategic nuclear response?

Likewise, when a US politician or Pentagon officer speaks two sentences one after the other, the first will usually be a justification for the desperate and imminent need for funding in the second.

China's not crossing the Taiwan strait with guns drawn. They're not going to bomb it for grins or spite. Air attacks short of nuclear weapons aren't going to degrade Taiwan's anti-ship capabilities to the point that any Chinese soldiers will survive the trip to put boots on the island. It's just not going to happen.

China will not wage a war against the US. Certainly not as the aggressor. Not militarily. There is no need to.

 

[nimbus]

 

[emergentmd]

Your argument is just as good (or bad) as the argument that opposes any minimum wage at all. If it was $2/hour, employers could hire more people, right? Wouldn't that be great? Why not $1/hr and some credit at the company store?

The more compelling argument for a $15 minimum wage is simply that the existing minimum wage hasn't kept pace with inflation for the last 30 years - despite enormous growth in corporate profits in that time.

Whats more, if a business can only stay afloat by offloading some of its labor costs to the government (add up all the ways government keeps low wage workers afloat, from food stamps to WIC to welfare to medicaid to various refundable tax credits and even these stimulus checks) then the business model is broken.

Taken to an absurd extreme, your argument is the same as an 1860 slave owners who wrung their hands over how their business model would fail if they had to actually pay for labor. Beyond room and board in the slave quarters, anyway. Sounds ridiculous, right?

We should back up a bit - do you think there should be a minimum wage AT ALL? And if so, how should it be set?

Arguing a 15/hr min wage being similar but polar opposite to a $1/hr min wage is not in the same economic universe. $15/hr forces a floor where all min wage workers will immediately be pegged to. Doing a $1/hr or no min wage does not force anyone to go down. I would argue that very little workers would be affected.

I don't think people understand the unintended consequences that occurs when government tries to manipulate the basic supply/demand economic model. This typically never ends well. What will happen is the strong will survive and the marginal business will die off.

Lets assume most Mcdonald's and mom/pop restaurants pays their employees $7/hr min wage. Currently, both survives but as you know restaurants have thin margin. Tomorrow, all employees are paid $15/hr.

What will Mom/Pop do? They will have to raise prices, cut hours, fire workers thus making whoever is left work harder. It will be a combination of all of this and now a burger is $8 instead of $5.

What does Mcdonalds do? They will do all the same except they will automate alot of tasks. So now, instead of someone manning the register, they will have check out Kiosk. So now the burger is $6 instead of $5.

Mom and Pop can't automate b/c its too expensive and eventually their revenue will drop then go out of business. Mcdonalds continues to flourish and actually does better b/c they are able to automate with increased market share.

Now what happens to these workers who Make $15/hr? Sure they will make more $$$ but inflation will be higher as everything will be more expensive. They may see a marginal increase in buying power. What happens to the workers who had hours cut/fired? They now have less income but everything costs more thus lower buying power.

To your questions if I think there should be a min wage? I would say yes just to protect people who are willing to work for sweat shop owners but don't see any economic basis for a min wage. You are worth what people are willing to pay you. If you want to be worth more, then make yourself worth more.

The US currently has the 12th highest min wage in the world ahead of S Korea, Spain, Portugal. If we set a $15/hr min wage, that would be 50% higher than UK, Canada, Germany.

 

[deleted126335]

The US currently has the 12th highest min wage in the world ahead of S Korea, Spain, Portugal. If we set a $15/hr min wage, that would be 50% higher than UK, Canada, Germany.

Those countries probably have a somewhat better social safety net.

No question that increasing the minimum wage will be a job killer. But the minimum wage is not a living wage for almost anybody either. It was fine for teenagers and college students to gain work experience and pay for extras. Not for people to raise families. Raising it has unintended consequences. Not raising it also sucks -just in a different way.

 

[emergentmd]

We all know min wage is not a living wage and should be a platform for college/HS students to help pay for extras living with parents/supplementing with student loans.

But if someone out of college after 5 yrs is still making min wage, then its on them. Don't flip burgers for Mcdonalds as your first job and 5 yrs later still flip burgers. Just because they did not improve themselves and continues to flip burgers should they suddenly have a living wage.

No reason for a HS student to earn a living wage..... oh wait, these HS students likely will never get a job b/c who is going to pay them $15/hr with essentially zero skills?

This likely will be a moot point b/c we are moving towards a more liberal/progressive voting block and we will have a $15/hr min wage, higher taxes, free college, and universal basic income. I am hopeful that I will not be part of the educated workers paying substantially higher taxes just because we feel everyone should be entitled to a good standard. I will disagree all day long that someone who failed out of HS should not be entitled to making $15/hr flipping burgers. There is no reason they should be making 30K/yr when they did not put the work and failed out of HS.

 

[D P356]

John Galt is watching from afar.
he took gme, amc and bb to the moon

💎🙌🚀🌕

 

[anbuitachi]

We all know min wage is not a living wage and should be a platform for college/HS students to help pay for extras living with parents/supplementing with student loans.

But if someone out of college after 5 yrs is still making min wage, then its on them. Don't flip burgers for Mcdonalds as your first job and 5 yrs later still flip burgers. Just because they did not improve themselves and continues to flip burgers should they suddenly have a living wage.

No reason for a HS student to earn a living wage..... oh wait, these HS students likely will never get a job b/c who is going to pay them $15/hr with essentially zero skills?

This likely will be a moot point b/c we are moving towards a more liberal/progressive voting block and we will have a $15/hr min wage, higher taxes, free college, and universal basic income. I am hopeful that I will not be part of the educated workers paying substantially higher taxes just because we feel everyone should be entitled to a good standard. I will disagree all day long that someone who failed out of HS should not be entitled to making $15/hr flipping burgers. There is no reason they should be making 30K/yr when they did not put the work and failed out of HS.

percent of population completed college degree is <40%...

i agree with min wage increase. just not to 15$

 

[nimbus]

The problem is that there are essential jobs that don’t currently offer a living wage. When granny goes to a nursing home, do you want her lying in her own s***?
How are people who do these jobs supposed to survive? UBI? Deal drugs? Or just f’em?

 

[aafisahar]

I am hopeful that I will not be part of the educated workers paying substantially higher taxes just because we feel everyone should be entitled to a good standard.

You don't get it do you? You pay either way, either it's in taxes for Medicaid, food stamps, and welfare since we shouldn't let these people starve to death or go without a modicum of healthcare, or we provide a living wage so that people can actually have some social mobility.

As for a good standard, tell that to the lady with fulminant myocarditis who we just sent home to hospice. Her supposedly good insurance doesn't cover LVAD or transplant and she makes too much as a pharmacy tech to qualify for Medicaid. Mother of 2 young boys. This is the America we live in.

 

[chessknt]

You don't get it do you? You pay either way, either it's in taxes for Medicaid, food stamps, and welfare since we shouldn't let these people starve to death or go without a modicum of healthcare, or we provide a living wage so that people can actually have some social mobility.

As for a good standard, tell that to the lady with fulminant myocarditis who we just sent home to hospice. Her supposedly good insurance doesn't cover LVAD or transplant and she makes too much as a pharmacy tech to qualify for Medicaid. Mother of 2 young boys. This is the America we live in.

Was it a health ministry plan? I can't envision a scenario where an insurance plan after the ACA wouldn't cover life saving services after deductible etc met.

 

[aafisahar]

Was it a health ministry plan? I can't envision a scenario where an insurance plan after the ACA wouldn't cover life saving services after deductible etc met.

Lots of plans have carve outs for extremely expensive stuff like transplant.

For example, my plan in residency didn't cover any developmental issues in children, a couple resident families had to pay out of pocket for their autistic child needs.

 

[aafisahar]

Was it a health ministry plan? I can't envision a scenario where an insurance plan after the ACA wouldn't cover life saving services after deductible etc met.

quick 2 minute google search:

No Cash, No Heart. Transplant Centers Require Proof Of Payment. - KFF Health News

The case of a Michigan woman told to fundraise $10,000 for a heart transplant sparked viral outrage, but experts say “wallet biopsies” are common.

khn.org

 

[chessknt]

quick 2 minute google search:

No Cash, No Heart. Transplant Centers Require Proof Of Payment. - KFF Health News

The case of a Michigan woman told to fundraise $10,000 for a heart transplant sparked viral outrage, but experts say “wallet biopsies” are common.

khn.org

That is different than not covering the procedure and related to income and drug coverage. Developmental issues for kids being uncovered I have seen before but having worked in a transplant center the only scenarios where people got rejected for financial reasons were related to people with no other member of the family that could work to continue to provide insurance coverage. I never saw one where the insurance plan actually completely refused to pay as the primary problem.

 

[chocomorsel]

View attachment 332498

So, it was higher than 10 an hour, then it went down? Why?

 

[anbuitachi]

So, it was higher than 10 an hour, then it went down? Why?

cause it didnt keep up with inflation? same as how our incomes dont keep up with inflation. or medicaid reimbursement rates not keeping up with inflation