Considering Podiatry as a Child of a Podiatrist

[Undecided2003]

I'm currently a undergraduate student and am deciding between becoming a podiatrist vs. a physician. I have a lot of insight into Podiatry due to my father being a respected podiatrist in the community with his own practice. I have shadowed both him and a family medicine physician, and enjoy his job more due to the hands on aspect. My older sibling is currently in podiatry school and may take over his practice. If I become a podiatrist also, we would most likely become partners.

I know that there is a lot of doom and gloom about this profession (based on what I've read on SDN), but I've spoken to my father in depth about this field. He enjoys his profession greatly and works great hours. He also knows many other colleagues that also has this viewpoint. I'm just wondering if it seems unwise to choose Podiatry over DO/MD (considering if I can even get in).

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[thepoddude]

Take everything on SDN with a grain of salt as it'll be the ones wanting change to be the ones creating the most noise too, evident by the consistency of the same handful of posters. You have shadowed both careers and have identified what you like better, have a father's viewpoints, and an older brother who will be going through the process to give you insight as well so it's upto you to decide. No one can ever definitively say what the right choice is besides you weighing all the options and what your passion is for. Reminder you will be the one waking up to that alarm clock every morning so find something you enjoy and will be content with rather than the opinions of anonymous posters influencing you a certain direction. Medicine has a strong grass is greener phenomenon and each specialty has threads showing up wishing they chose that over this.. etc.

As far as your fathers practice goes hopefully all stays well but things can drastically change 7-8 years from when you will be practicing so don't take that as a given to your success following training, you should have your own plan and strive to be the best trained doctor you can be and take whatever path you so choose after residency. Best of luck!

 

[heybrother]

I work with a podiatrist who is the son of a podiatrist. The father did not want to retire. The son does not like his job and it shows. He tells me if he could go back in time "he would work for the government and get a pension". How he came to a podiatrist - I have never directly asked. His father was well respected in the community. Knew everyone. Operated on everyone. The son tried to go back to college after becoming a podiatrist but ultimately stuck it out.

Your situation is entirely different than others. Obviously the hope is that your father can offer you greater insight than what most pre-podiatrists will have. You are also in a situation to ask questions that others don't.

-You can ask your father what direction he thinks reimbursement is heading. What did United pay for a bunion 15+ years ago and what does it pay now? Does he believe money is made in the operating room or in the clinic? Does he like selling things? Do you like selling things? My partner's father believed we were meant to be in the operating room every week. Neither my partner nor his father every checked the billing or knew what anything was was reimbursed at.

-Is he rearfoot certified? How many people does he think will be coming to his clinic who will be interested in pursuing a calcaneal osteotomy, triple arthrodesis or ankle fusion. How many fibular fractures does he receive a year? You will need those cases for rearfoot certification. You may leave residency thinking - I'm going to offer good things to good people but find your scope of practice stifled by the opportunities that are presented to you.

-How many patients over 70 present stating they have an "infected ingrown toenail" but are are really there because they want their nails cut. How many people present for "foot pain" or a "wart" but are really there for a callus. These sort of encounters may cease to bother you in time. You learn to roll with the punches. You ultimately just accept it as revenue or an opportunity to help people. You are "using your hands" - patients appreciate that. Unfortunately, a lot of podiatry encounters roll around these mundane services and a lot of podiatrists ultimately try to make them something more than they are. Medicare is coming down on some of the nail surgery codes because so many podiatrists abused them to turn "nail cutting" which is often "uncovered" into "nail surgery". During a job interview I saw a podiatrist submitting callus trimming as biopsies and lesion excisions. I wrote to a friend a few years ahead with my concerns and they suggested that once you are in practice you'll do what you have to do to stay in business.

-Your starting financial position is likely greatly improved by having a parent who is already in the game. There are still going to be clouds on the horizon. Everyone early in the game believes that somehow you are bringing something new - that your surgical training and opportunities are going to be better than everyone who came before you. They are all dinosaurs. We are fresh, amazing, and different. Who do you think came up with those things and ideas that you will be implementing? How many of our fancy surgeries require non-weight bearing and time off work? The number one "mechanical" complaint presenting to podiatry offices is plantar fasciitis. I like it treating it. It can even be lucrative at times. But it resolves conservatively.

 

[de Ribas]

I'm currently a undergraduate student and am deciding between becoming a podiatrist vs. a physician. I have a lot of insight into Podiatry due to my father being a respected podiatrist in the community with his own practice. I have shadowed both him and a family medicine physician, and enjoy his job more due to the hands on aspect. My older sibling is currently in podiatry school and may take over his practice. If I become a podiatrist also, we would most likely become partners.

I know that there is a lot of doom and gloom about this profession (based on what I've read on SDN), but I've spoken to my father in depth about this field. He enjoys his profession greatly and works great hours. He also knows many other colleagues that also has this viewpoint. I'm just wondering if it seems unwise to choose Podiatry over DO/MD (considering if I can even get in).

Have you shadowed any other specialty besides FM?

 

[icebreaker32]

IMO the cons of podiatry are not necessarily exaggerated on this forum. You can likely avoid most of them though by having a practice you can join as a partner essentially guaranteed. I will echo what has been said a lot can change in 8 years and nothing is guaranteed. What if the practice is not busy enough for 2 podiatrists to do well and referral patterns have changed due a hospital employing PCPs and having their own podiatrist by the time you graduate? I would still try to do your best in school and get the best training you can in residency if you choose podiatry. Podiatry can and will continue to be competitive for good jobs and especially so in desirable locations.

If you can get into MD/DO school, I would still give those career option some very serious consideration, but it is your life and you must choose your path.

In your situation you would likely do fine in podiatry and the ROI for podiatry would likely make sense.

 

[DexterMorganSK]

I'm currently a undergraduate student and am deciding between becoming a podiatrist vs. a physician. I have a lot of insight into Podiatry due to my father being a respected podiatrist in the community with his own practice. I have shadowed both him and a family medicine physician, and enjoy his job more due to the hands on aspect. My older sibling is currently in podiatry school and may take over his practice. If I become a podiatrist also, we would most likely become partners.

I know that there is a lot of doom and gloom about this profession (based on what I've read on SDN), but I've spoken to my father in depth about this field. He enjoys his profession greatly and works great hours. He also knows many other colleagues that also has this viewpoint. I'm just wondering if it seems unwise to choose Podiatry over DO/MD (considering if I can even get in).

I would also suggest shadowing other specialties besides FM. If, after the shadowing, you still want to pursue DPM, go for it. GL!

 

[Undecided2003]

I plan to shadow other specialties besides FM in the next couple of months to solidify my decision. What I'm worried about however is the increasing competitiveness of getting into residency programs due to Step 1 becoming pass/fail, and how that would impact students at less competitive MD/DO schools. I'm just wary about what happens if I do not enjoy family medicine/internal medicine.

Another consideration is the location of the Podiatry school I plan to attend. If I do end up choosing this route, I would have relatives in the area, and spending time with my family greatly benefits my mental health. Also if I go to Podiatry school rather than Medical school, I believe that I would have the ability to be able to go straight into Podiatry school without taking a gap year, saving myself a year.

I do agree with the Cons mentioned above, however. I understand that I won't know what's going to happen in the next 10 years and how difficult it is to get a job if I do not plan to go back to my hometown. I just want to thank everyone for their opinions on this manner and I will surely take all of your words seriously.

 

[de Ribas]

I plan to shadow other specialties besides FM in the next couple of months to solidify my decision. What I'm worried about however is the increasing competitiveness of getting into residency programs due to Step 1 becoming pass/fail, and how that would impact students at less competitive MD/DO schools. I'm just wary about what happens if I do not enjoy family medicine/internal medicine.

Another consideration is the location of the Podiatry school I plan to attend. If I do end up choosing this route, I would have relatives in the area, and spending time with my family greatly benefits my mental health. Also if I go to Podiatry school rather than Medical school, I believe that I would have the ability to be able to go straight into Podiatry school without taking a gap year, saving myself a year.

I do agree with the Cons mentioned above, however. I understand that I won't know what's going to happen in the next 10 years and how difficult it is to get a job if I do not plan to go back to my hometown. I just want to thank everyone for their opinions on this manner and I will surely take all of your words seriously.

Your chances of matching into something besides FM is higher than getting ABFAS. Go with MD/DO and don't look back. You will match just fine. Even with FM you can do lots of 1-year fellowships and be better off than most pods. Do sports med fellowship after FM if you need to.

 

[PTPuser]

I can't image 10 years down the road MD/DO will be worst than pod. But it's up to u.

 

[heybrother]

I want to throw something out there just for comparison and consideration.

I have a nice friend. Went to a good college. Didn't party at all in college. Met some nice people after graduating while working - namely myself and my evil friends. We might have taught him to party. He got into a really nice medical school but kind of enjoyed partying a little too much. Failed a very important 3rd year course. Had to repeat it like the next year and it threw his entire schedule/match etc off. Called up a couple of family medicine programs who said - apply and you can have a spot. Completed residency without any issues at a community program.

Immediately hired for a high salary in the most competitive market in Texas. Drives the fancy car of his dreams. Makes more money than me. Tells me he loves family medicine. The guy red flagged up his pretty good pedigree and still got everything he wanted. Try doing that a podiatrist.

 

[icebreaker32]

I want to throw something out there just for comparison and consideration.

I have a nice friend. Went to a good college. Didn't party at all in college. Met some nice people after graduating while working - namely myself and my evil friends. We might have taught him to party. He got into a really nice medical school but kind of enjoyed partying a little too much. Failed a very important 3rd year course. Had to repeat it like the next year and it threw his entire schedule/match etc off. Called up a couple of family medicine programs who said - apply and you can have a spot. Completed residency without any issues at a community program.

Immediately hired for a high salary in the most competitive market in Texas. Drives the fancy car of his dreams. Makes more money than me. Tells me he loves family medicine. The guy red flagged up his pretty good pedigree and still got everything he wanted. Try doing that a podiatrist.

I even know many that are doing very well with Caribbean medical school. All things considered I think podiatry school is a greater risk. I don’t know anyone that went to a Caribbean medical school that had any difficulty finding a good job in a large metro of their choice,

 

[DexterMorganSK]

I even know many that are doing very well with Caribbean medical school. All things considered I think podiatry school is a greater risk. I don’t know anyone that went to a Caribbean medical school that had any difficulty finding a good job in a large metro of their choice,

I have to disagree. Podiatry is still a safer option than any Caribbean medical school.

 

[icebreaker32]

I have to disagree. Podiatry is still a safer option than any Caribbean medical school.

I know a couple that graduated about 10 years ago. Not any smarter than an average podiatry student. If you went to one of the 4 best ones, with really only 1 of them being hard to get into, you had no problems matching if you could pass USMLE.

Could things have changed since then with all the new DO schools? It is possible. Certainly don't go this route without a lot of research.

 

[TriiPod]

I'm currently a undergraduate student and am deciding between becoming a podiatrist vs. a physician. I have a lot of insight into Podiatry due to my father being a respected podiatrist in the community with his own practice. I have shadowed both him and a family medicine physician, and enjoy his job more due to the hands on aspect. My older sibling is currently in podiatry school and may take over his practice. If I become a podiatrist also, we would most likely become partners.

I know that there is a lot of doom and gloom about this profession (based on what I've read on SDN), but I've spoken to my father in depth about this field. He enjoys his profession greatly and works great hours. He also knows many other colleagues that also has this viewpoint. I'm just wondering if it seems unwise to choose Podiatry over DO/MD (considering if I can even get in).

I'd suggest to shadow different specialities and make the best decision based on what you enjoy most. As mentioned above, every field has its pros and cons. You may know the pros and cons of podiatry best since your father is a DPM and your sibling is going to podiatry school.
you are going to invest time and money in whatever field you choose, so you have the make the decision yourself on what is best for you.

Members above mentioned that it may be easier with Podiatry since you have an established private practice. That may be true. The opposite can be true as well. The same goes for an MD route. Anything can happen anytime, we do not know what will happen in 10 years, what laws will change etc.

Talk to podiatry and medical students, students who go to the schools you are looking to apply and try to shadow physicians in the area you think of practicing after graduation. Do not base your future in the comments going around SDN. All these comment, like mine as well, are all opinions. Anyone can add a comment in these threads, you do not know who you are getting an advice from, so please do a deeper research outside of SDN.

 

[wakaflocka88]

I have to disagree. Podiatry is still a safer option than any Caribbean medical school.

Even if a IMG barely scrapes by and grads, there are plenty of FM/IM positions they can get into. No one will care which FM/IM program you did. You can still easily find a well paying job anywhere in the USA. Not even close for podiatry.

 

[DexterMorganSK]

Even if a IMG barely scrapes by and grads, there are plenty of FM/IM positions they can get into. No one will care which FM/IM program you did. You can still easily find a well paying job anywhere in the USA. Not even close for podiatry.

Without derailing this thread much: There are too many "IFs" when going the Carrib route. We all know people that made it and also who didn't. Ask them how many started in their class and how many ended up getting residency placements. In this regard, at least for now, Podiatry is still better. Even the top school like St. George's has a 40-50% placement.

I am not talking about job prospects for an IMG; I'm saying matching and graduating is riskier than getting a DPM degree. In the end, anyone considering between the two should choose Podiatry.

 

[icebreaker32]

Without derailing this thread much: There are too many "IFs" when going the Carrib route. We all know people that made it and also who didn't. Ask them how many started in their class and how many ended up getting residency placements. In this regard, at least for now, Podiatry is still better. Even the top school like St. George's has a 40-50% placement.

I am not talking about job prospects for an IMG; I'm saying matching and graduating is riskier than getting a DPM degree. In the end, anyone considering between the two should choose Podiatry.

Attrition rate is higher at Caribbean medical schools and you must pass USMLE. Is it a stressful environment, I am sure.

Is podiatry stressful while in school. For some, I am sure. Some flunked out, mainly hard workers that were in over their head more than lazy or personal problems actually in my class. It is not easy once you get in. I am sure plenty of hard workers in Caribbean medical school flunk out also. The lazy ones just seemed to be in the bottom of the class, but make it through. Attrition is no where what it used be a long time ago, but is higher than one might expect. Many of podiatry's larger problems start after graduating school.

I would say both podiatry and Caribbean medical schools have certain risks you that need to dig deeper to discover. Plenty have done well with both options. If you flunk out in Caribbean medical school your parents could potentially be on the hook as a cosigner for loans. If you make it through you might have more debt and seek a PSFL eligible job....way more of those available than for podiatry.

Plenty do well enough eventually with podiatry despite the weak job market and typical less than desirable first jobs.

That is why we say consider US MD/DO, then possibly PA or RN to NP/CRNA. Not everyone will get into US MD/DO and alternative careers like those mentioned above or being a dentist will not appeal to everyone.

Do not fool yourself just because you will currently get a residency in podiatry it does not mean it does not have its problems and risks one should really consider beforehand. I will agree the same can be said for Caribbean medical school. Both options also seem to really appeal to people whom are dead set on being a doctor and do not take an honest look at the ROI and pros/cons of other career options.

 

[newfeet]

Attrition rate is higher at Caribbean medical schools and you must pass USMLE. Is it a stressful environment, I am sure.

Is podiatry stressful while in school. For some, I am sure. Some flunked out, mainly hard workers that were in over their head than lazy actually in my class. I am sure plenty of hard workers in Caribbean medical school flunk out also. The lazy ones just seemed to be in the bottom of the class, but make it through. Attrition is no where what it used be a long time ago, but is higher than one might expect. Many of podiatry's larger problems start after graduating school.

I would say both podiatry and Caribbean medical schools have certain risks you that need to dig deeper to discover. Plenty have done well with both options. If you flunk out in Caribbean medical school your parents could potentially be on the hook as a cosigner for loans. If you make it through you might have more debt and seek a PSFL eligible job....way more of those available than for podiatry.

Plenty do well enough eventually with podiatry despite the weak job market and typical less than desirable first jobs.

That is why we say consider US MD/DO, then possibly PA or RN to NP/CRNA. Not everyone will get into US MD/DO and alternative careers like those mentioned above or being a dentist will not appeal to everyone.

Do not fool yourself just because you will currently get a residency in podiatry it does not mean it does not have its problems and risks one should really consider beforehand. I will agree the same can be said for Caribbean medical school. Both options also seem to really appeal to people whom are dead set on being a doctor and do not take an honest look at the ROI and pros/cons of other career options.

As a risk overt person I would consider podiatry to be the safer bet in terms of matching into a program. That's it. That is the only benefit of going DPM. It was not worth playing safe at all. Podiatry school was stressful as hell. The residency shortage in 2011 was terrible.

I would say if you are not into podiatry and are looking for a safe bet don't do it. Take the risk and go to the Caribbean, Ireland, Australia or wherever. The possible gains are higher with the risk.

If you want to join your parent's practice and like podiatry go for it.

 

[de Ribas]

Without derailing this thread much: There are too many "IFs" when going the Carrib route. We all know people that made it and also who didn't. Ask them how many started in their class and how many ended up getting residency placements. In this regard, at least for now, Podiatry is still better. Even the top school like St. George's has a 40-50% placement.

I am not talking about job prospects for an IMG; I'm saying matching and graduating is riskier than getting a DPM degree. In the end, anyone considering between the two should choose Podiatry.

Does 50% placement clumps everyone together, US and foreign students? Caribbean schools have local, foreign and US students. That overall 50% might not be useful for US students. I am not sure if there are separate statistics but it is just common sense that US students would have much higher residency placement for several reasons. They know English, have citizenship and don't require sponsorship/visa, they have connections, they are probably more successful academically, etc. I see plenty of Caribbean grads as residents. Pretty much everyone I see are originally from US. It would be good to know what is actual residency placement for Carib grads who are originally from US. That number could be 80-90%, which I could belive.

 

[icebreaker32]

Does 50% placement clumps everyone together, US and foreign students? Caribbean schools have local, foreign and US students. That overall 50% might not be useful for US students. I am not sure if there are separate statistics but it is just common sense that US students would have much higher residency placement for several reasons. They know English, have citizenship and don't require sponsorship/visa, they have connections, they are probably more successful academically, etc. I see plenty of Caribbean grads as residents. Pretty much everyone I see are originally from US. It would be good to know what is actual residency placement for Carib grads who are originally from US. That number could be 80-90%, which I could belive.

To be honest one has to dig deeper than statistics I am sure. The schools will publish one number and the naysayers will publish another set no doubt. The truth is likely in the middle. US citizens numbers are higher I am sure.

I am being sincere in that the ones I know who went and ended up if primary care or less competitive specialties were no smarter than a typical podiatry student, and definitely not equal to a top podiatry student.

If you did not absolutely bomb the MCAT and have some ability to take standardized tests and are willing to work extremely hard the risks were not that high 10 years ago for this option. Certainly the risks are much greater than the US MD/DO route. With so many DO schools now opening and taking MD residency positions it might be more competitive than it used to be, not sure.

 

[Adam Smasher]

Speaking of FMGs:

One of the hospitalists where I work went to a Carribbean school. He showed me their tuition and it was about 40% of what P-schools are charging. Very talkative guy. FM residency + 1 year hospitalist medicine fellowship. Did really well, complains about how many physician recruiters are hounding him.

In residency, almost all the path residents were FMGs. Their govts paid their tuition. Jerks

We had an applicant to my residency in my PGY1 year. He got his MD from Jaurez Medical School, did a 1 year Gen Surg Internship but couldn't match into anything else so he went to DPM school, and he still couldn't match into podiatry residency, was reapplying for our program!

Also when I was in residency I got to know one of the documentation goons. You know the people who checked our charts to make sure we documented the size of our ulcers when we debride, what type of instrument we used, and used the word "excisional debridement." Anyway, it turns out he went to a Carribbean school, matched into FM, the residency folded, and he couldn't work anywhere else, gave up hope on being a doctor.

So the FMG route can work, but when it backfires it backfires horribly!

 

[Prehealth1011]

We rotate with both IMGs and FMGs from a community program nearby. I know three of their step scores. It blows mine out of the water. They all ranked my program above theirs

I like to think I would’ve made it out of Caribbean schools but I’m not confident if my pedigree of residency would’ve been the same

Personally if I couldn’t get into MD/DO, I would try PA, RN to CRNA or NP, Anesthesiology assistants in that order

 

[DexterMorganSK]

Does 50% placement clumps everyone together, US and foreign students? Caribbean schools have local, foreign and US students. That overall 50% might not be useful for US students. I am not sure if there are separate statistics but it is just common sense that US students would have much higher residency placement for several reasons. They know English, have citizenship and don't require sponsorship/visa, they have connections, they are probably more successful academically, etc. I see plenty of Caribbean grads as residents. Pretty much everyone I see are originally from US. It would be good to know what is actual residency placement for Carib grads who are originally from US. That number could be 80-90%, which I could belive.

Plenty of threads out there detailing the match of these carrib schools. The last time I checked, it was less than 50% overall for St. George's, regardless of US citizenship status. Search the premed forums and see threads by Goro or Gonnif.

 

[DexterMorganSK]

Attrition rate is higher at Caribbean medical schools and you must pass USMLE. Is it a stressful environment, I am sure.

Is podiatry stressful while in school. For some, I am sure. Some flunked out, mainly hard workers that were in over their head more than lazy or personal problems actually in my class. It is not easy once you get in. I am sure plenty of hard workers in Caribbean medical school flunk out also. The lazy ones just seemed to be in the bottom of the class, but make it through. Attrition is no where what it used be a long time ago, but is higher than one might expect. Many of podiatry's larger problems start after graduating school.

I would say both podiatry and Caribbean medical schools have certain risks you that need to dig deeper to discover. Plenty have done well with both options. If you flunk out in Caribbean medical school your parents could potentially be on the hook as a cosigner for loans. If you make it through you might have more debt and seek a PSFL eligible job....way more of those available than for podiatry.

Plenty do well enough eventually with podiatry despite the weak job market and typical less than desirable first jobs.

That is why we say consider US MD/DO, then possibly PA or RN to NP/CRNA. Not everyone will get into US MD/DO and alternative careers like those mentioned above or being a dentist will not appeal to everyone.

Do not fool yourself just because you will currently get a residency in podiatry it does not mean it does not have its problems and risks one should really consider beforehand. I will agree the same can be said for Caribbean medical school. Both options also seem to really appeal to people whom are dead set on being a doctor and do not take an honest look at the ROI and pros/cons of other career options.

I wasn't referring to what I said above based on my opinions. I was stating it based on residency placement facts for Caribbean graduates.
IMO, if it came to doing anything else in the US Vs. attending any Caribbean medical school, I'd choose anything else in the US....this is my opinion.

 

[DexterMorganSK]

I think we all derailed this thread pretty well. OP, I hope you got the answer you were looking for. Shadow other specialties and see if you like them. Podiatry schools will still await you if you decide to pursue it. You def have an advantage going the Pod route but do shadow other medical specialties.

I suggest searching this site for anyone else thinking about going to a Caribbean medical school vs. doing podiatry. Plenty of info in the pre-med and med forms for why you shouldn't go down the Caribbean route.

Closing!