Baylor or UT-Houston

[usmlestep12]

Hi everybody....
I am kind of new in this forum...
Just curious about the things...going on in the texas medical center currently...
Since baylor cut ties with Methodist and joined hands with St. Luke's will it affect the quality of teaching for Baylor since Methodist was an excellent teaching and research partner....
also do any of the residents from UT-houston get cards at St. Luke's after IM...
just curious since TMC is a big place and as their leaders say that all the institutes live in harmony with each other...but reading Houston Chronicle and other daily news I got a different kind of gut feeling....
I mean is it a rivalry between Baylor and UT-Houston or is it the old see-off between Dr. Clooney and Dr. DeBakey...or something else...
I think texans would know better than someone like me from New York...
anybody wanna shed some light on this .....

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[Pili]

Hi everybody....
I am kind of new in this forum...
Just curious about the things...going on in the texas medical center currently...
Since baylor cut ties with Methodist and joined hands with St. Luke's will it affect the quality of teaching for Baylor since Methodist was an excellent teaching and research partner....
also do any of the residents from UT-houston get cards at St. Luke's after IM...
just curious since TMC is a big place and as their leaders say that all the institutes live in harmony with each other...but reading Houston Chronicle and other daily news I got a different kind of gut feeling....
I mean is it a rivalry between Baylor and UT-Houston or is it the old see-off between Dr. Clooney and Dr. DeBakey...or something else...
I think texans would know better than someone like me from New York...
anybody wanna shed some light on this .....

Both Baylor and Ut Houston have top notch faculty. In fact, as faculty goes, UT-Houston has the best faculty. All hospitals in the TMC are similar. UT Houston does not have a VA, but it does have a community hospital, LBJ. UT Houston still needs to attract better residents, being a younger institution. Baylor has currently the better program, with some reputation for being malignant. But my prediction is that in 10-20 years, UT Houston will equal and then surpass Baylor in reputation. Just not yet.

 

[Fantasy Sports]

Hi everybody....
I am kind of new in this forum...
Just curious about the things...going on in the texas medical center currently...
Since baylor cut ties with Methodist and joined hands with St. Luke's will it affect the quality of teaching for Baylor since Methodist was an excellent teaching and research partner....
also do any of the residents from UT-houston get cards at St. Luke's after IM...
just curious since TMC is a big place and as their leaders say that all the institutes live in harmony with each other...but reading Houston Chronicle and other daily news I got a different kind of gut feeling....
I mean is it a rivalry between Baylor and UT-Houston or is it the old see-off between Dr. Clooney and Dr. DeBakey...or something else...
I think texans would know better than someone like me from New York...
anybody wanna shed some light on this .....

I go to the same school as Im guessing Pili attends, and my roommate goes to BCM. The thing about the BCM-Methodist split is that Baylor will retain somewhere along the lines of 90% of its faculty who will transfer to St. Lukes. I have done "away" rotations at every hospital in the TMC save the VA, and let me tell you, St. Lukes might be the most impressive hospital in the medical center from a resources standpoint, and from living in Houston all my life, I can tell you that they are a close 2nd in marketing themselves after Memorial-Hermann. From what I hear from my roommate and while I was on rotation, Baylor will probably end up having no benefit from switching to St Lukes in the short run, but in the long run will probably be better off.

BCM and UTH aren't really rivals. There might be some student pissing contests, and some professors make some snide comments about BCM, but its all in good fun. The two institutions attract different types of individuals, and I think we both benefit.

To Pili, who I assume is my classmate, I think you make some valid points about us needing to do a better job of recruiting residents. To say UT-H has the best faculty, well Im not sure. If you are talking about preclinical perhaps, but if you're talking about clinical, Ive had some wonderful experiences at St Lukes, Methodist, and Texas Childrens (though the latter was in a non-rotation setting) with the BCM faculty. Ive also had great interaction with our own faculty at UTH.

I dont think there is any reason to think that UTH will surpass BCM anytime soon, and frankly Im not sure if I want it to. UTH is a great school, and there are few things I would like to change-- the atmosphere is great. So while I think my friend Pili is exaggerating, I would definitely check out both programs. They are both going to be on the rise over the next couple decades, as the medical center is growing at an astounding rate. There is PLENTY of room for both programs, and they're both solid. I really dont think BCM is having too many huge issues with moving to St. Lukes, and I think Hermann is growing appropriately as well.

 

[Pili]

I go to the same school as Im guessing Pili attends, and my roommate goes to BCM. The thing about the BCM-Methodist split is that Baylor will retain somewhere along the lines of 90% of its faculty who will transfer to St. Lukes. I have done "away" rotations at every hospital in the TMC save the VA, and let me tell you, St. Lukes might be the most impressive hospital in the medical center from a resources standpoint, and from living in Houston all my life, I can tell you that they are a close 2nd in marketing themselves after Memorial-Hermann. From what I hear from my roommate and while I was on rotation, Baylor will probably end up having no benefit from switching to St Lukes in the short run, but in the long run will probably be better off.

BCM and UTH aren't really rivals. There might be some student pissing contests, and some professors make some snide comments about BCM, but its all in good fun. The two institutions attract different types of individuals, and I think we both benefit.

To Pili, who I assume is my classmate, I think you make some valid points about us needing to do a better job of recruiting residents. To say UT-H has the best faculty, well Im not sure. If you are talking about preclinical perhaps, but if you're talking about clinical, Ive had some wonderful experiences at St Lukes, Methodist, and Texas Childrens (though the latter was in a non-rotation setting) with the BCM faculty. Ive also had great interaction with our own faculty at UTH.

I dont think there is any reason to think that UTH will surpass BCM anytime soon, and frankly Im not sure if I want it to. UTH is a great school, and there are few things I would like to change-- the atmosphere is great. So while I think my friend Pili is exaggerating, I would definitely check out both programs. They are both going to be on the rise over the next couple decades, as the medical center is growing at an astounding rate. There is PLENTY of room for both programs, and they're both solid. I really dont think BCM is having too many huge issues with moving to St. Lukes, and I think Hermann is growing appropriately as well.

Hey there. I do not attend med school in Houston but have done research at UT AND two aways at Baylor, as I was seriously considering the TMC for residency. I am at UTSW. However, my fiancee and I are going to start a family soon after marrying and Houston might not be the best place to do that (see thread on this), and I don't want to stay at UTSW for the same reason. I however know quite a bit of people at the TMC. I agree with you about St Lukes and Hermann. I hope you will agree with me that the quality of the residents is vastly superior at Baylor, at the moment. This might be a result of the probation years. Faculty at UT are true leaders, as are Baylor. UT faculty seem more approachable, though, and less arrogant. I totally agree that both institutions will grow exponentially. When I was at Baylor I was amazed at the rate of construction of new buildings in the TMC. I disagree with you in that Baylor will not be harmed by the Methodist split. I think it will, and this has nothing to do with St Lukes, which is a great hospital. Methodist will also be harmed. I think that UT will take advantage of it to become the leader, thanks to their smart and ambitious leaders, Dr. Willerson and Dr. Kone in IM. The institutions collaborate in good spirit as it is to be expected, but there is only so much NIH money around. Of course they are rivals. But this is only guessing.

 

[Fantasy Sports]

Hey there. I do not attend med school in Houston but have done research at UT AND two aways at Baylor, as I was seriously considering the TMC for residency. I am at UTSW. However, my fiancee and I are going to start a family soon after marrying and Houston might not be the best place to do that (see thread on this), and I don't want to stay at UTSW for the same reason. I however know quite a bit of people at the TMC. I agree with you about St Lukes and Hermann. I hope you will agree with me that the quality of the residents is vastly superior at Baylor, at the moment. This might be a result of the probation years. Faculty at UT are true leaders, as are Baylor. UT faculty seem more approachable, though, and less arrogant. I totally agree that both institutions will grow exponentially. When I was at Baylor I was amazed at the rate of construction of new buildings in the TMC. I disagree with you in that Baylor will not be harmed by the Methodist split. I think it will, and this has nothing to do with St Lukes, which is a great hospital. Methodist will also be harmed. I think that UT will take advantage of it to become the leader, thanks to their smart and ambitious leaders, Dr. Willerson and Dr. Kone in IM. The institutions collaborate in good spirit as it is to be expected, but there is only so much NIH money around. Of course they are rivals. But this is only guessing.

I respect your opinion, but I sincerely think that you will view things differently if/when you are actually working at the med center over an extended period. I agree with you on most counts, but I think the Methodist thing has been overblown out of porportion and while I do think that UTH will rise in stature, I think BCM will as well. You assume that NIH money or faculty or resources is zero-sum for the TMC-- its not. More than likely, both schools will grow, possibly at the expense of other American schools.

I think a lot of people have the misconception that when you have multiple schools close together in a given city, that their relationship will be zero-sum. Houston (BCM, UTH), SF (UCSF, Stanford), LA (UCLA, USC), NY (Columbia, Cornell, etc). But this is not true at all. The best thing that can happen to the city of Houston and the TMC is for both schools to keep improving.

The environment between the schools is very collegial. When there were floods that drowned out BCM, several students came into our tanks for anatomy and things worked out very well. I honestly think that the "rivalry" is overblown-- mainly since we don't really intersect at any hospitals. I just want to stress that I really dont think things are as adverserial as some try to make it seem, especially once you're on the wards. In any case, if you're looking at Houston, definitely check out both programs. They're both excellent and have different things to offer you.

 

[usmlestep12]

I respect your opinion, but I sincerely think that you will view things differently if/when you are actually working at the med center over an extended period. I agree with you on most counts, but I think the Methodist thing has been overblown out of porportion and while I do think that UTH will rise in stature, I think BCM will as well. You assume that NIH money or faculty or resources is zero-sum for the TMC-- its not. More than likely, both schools will grow, possibly at the expense of other American schools.

I think a lot of people have the misconception that when you have multiple schools close together in a given city, that their relationship will be zero-sum. Houston (BCM, UTH), SF (UCSF, Stanford), LA (UCLA, USC), NY (Columbia, Cornell, etc). But this is not true at all. The best thing that can happen to the city of Houston and the TMC is for both schools to keep improving.

The environment between the schools is very collegial. When there were floods that drowned out BCM, several students came into our tanks for anatomy and things worked out very well. I honestly think that the "rivalry" is overblown-- mainly since we don't really intersect at any hospitals. I just want to stress that I really dont think things are as adverserial as some try to make it seem, especially once you're on the wards. In any case, if you're looking at Houston, definitely check out both programs. They're both excellent and have different things to offer you.

My concern is from so called rumours that I have heard.....
Baylor is definitely more prestigious than UT-Houston...al though UT-houston has some greatest of the great people on their faculty list...including one and only nobel laureate Dr. fred Murad...
however I am planning for cards after Internal medicine and given the overall reputation of TMC & St. Luke's I am stronlgy considering UTH...
Do residents get cards at St. Luke's after completing ther IM residency at UT-Houston or it's like Baylor gets more preference 0ver UT-Houston in this regards ?????....

Thnx in advance guys.......

 

[Fantasy Sports]

My concern is from so called rumours that I have heard.....
Baylor is definitely more prestigious than UT-Houston...al though UT-houston has some greatest of the great people on their faculty list...including one and only nobel laureate Dr. fred Murad...
however I am planning for cards after Internal medicine and given the overall reputation of TMC & St. Luke's I am stronlgy considering both programs (though I am not sure I will get matched at Baylor but quite confident about UT-Houston) ...
Do residents get cards at St. Luke's after completing ther IM residency at UT-Houston or it's like Baylor gets more preference 0ver UT-Houston in this regards ?????....

Thnx in advance guys.......

Yeah, I definitely understand your concern over the switchover of Baylor to St. Lukes. But honestly, the hype is way overblown. Over 90% of the faculty will end up staying at BCM and moving to St Lukes or the new clinic, so I think there are no problems there.

I think both BCM and UTH match very well into cards currently, but then again, St. Luke's wasn't affiliated with anyone during that time. One can imagine that now that St. Luke's is BCM's "home" program that the current situation, in which students from both programs were well-represented (but possibly BCM moreso), is likely to change in the near future. So while I would love to give you a definitive answer, I'm just not sure what is going to happen 3 years down the line. But if you made me put money on it, based on the arrangements of other medical schools, I would imagine BCM will start matching more and more into St. Luke's as it becomes integrated into their medical school as their home program.

However, Hermann's cards is definitely on the rise as well, considering the HUGE new expansion we're building as a CV disease research institute. So there are definitely good things on the horizon here too.

 

[vitaminjb]

I hope you will agree with me that the quality of the residents is vastly superior at Baylor, at the moment. This might be a result of the probation years.

What do you mean about the probation years?! Please explain, thanks.

I am interviewing in Houston solely b/c of couples match. I only applied to one program because I have to do so many interviews, and the advice given to me by my advisors at my school was to apply to UTH. I am concerned that I will not be at a program with residents that will be at the level I am accustomed to at my home institution (which has a top-10 program), and I have to decide whether or not I could rank the program. (Though, of course, I will see for myself when I go down there, just interested in your thoughts.)

Thanks and I hope everything is going well for everyone.

 

[vitaminjb]

So does anyone know what is up with UT Houston and "probation years?" Any help would be much appreciated.

 

[HAM2]

I think they were on probation 2 years ago (dony know why) but my boyfriend interviewed there and said he liked the program a lot, they get good fellowships. I dont think they have a problem now (though I dont even know why they were on prob before, so dont take my word for it)

 

[Pili]

So does anyone know what is up with UT Houston and "probation years?" Any help would be much appreciated.

They were on probation a few years ago due to excessive resident work hours. That has changed and they have been now off probation for a few years, and recently accredited, although only for I think 2 years, not the full 4 that is possible. During those years there were many IMGs, last year they acepted only 3-4 IMG and the rest US grads. The program is definitely transitioning into a top program, which it deserves to be. Fellowship placement is excellent, being in the TMC there are trillions of opportunities. Texas Heart Institute is down the street, UT residents rotate there. Hermann has state of the art cath labs and top faculty in cardiology. You can't go wrong with either institution.

 

[dochuffman]

Got an interview at Baylor Houston late. Finished the interview today and I thought the program was very strong. UT Houston was strong as well.