Any evidence regarding men vs woman surgeons?

[Merely]

I have a surgeon that I know that is telling me that he “doesn’t feel comfortable” with a woman operating on him. I told him that I didn’t believe there was any evidence that woman were inferior surgeons. Does anyone have any evidence or studies done about this? This seems like an absurd claim but maybe there are biological differences in spatial reasoning or something I’m not really sure. Anyone know anything about this?

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[mikeGR]

I'm so sick of this notion. There's tons of evidence to the contrary. A couple of recent examples:
www.bmj.com/content/359/bmj.j4366
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/29695473

 

[deleted480308]

I have a surgeon that I know that is telling me that he “doesn’t feel comfortable” with a woman operating on him. I told him that I didn’t believe there was any evidence that woman were inferior surgeons. Does anyone have any evidence or studies done about this? This seems like an absurd claim but maybe there are biological differences in spatial reasoning or something I’m not really sure. Anyone know anything about this?

Possible he just doesn’t want to be naked in front of her?

I had a number of ladies ask me not to catch their baby, none questioned my ability

 

[Merely]

Possible he just doesn’t want to be naked in front of her?

I had a number of ladies ask me not to catch their baby, none questioned my ability

Wait im not sure I understand are you a male or female? Also his argument pertained to technical skill pretty much he thought that technically females were inferior surgeons that’s why I wanted some studies to take a look at

 

[dpmd]

Possible he just doesn’t want to be naked in front of her?

I had a number of ladies ask me not to catch their baby, none questioned my ability

It would make more sense to request male circulator in that case. The surgeon often doesn't come in until the patient is draped. Unless it is a perineal case I suppose.

 

[Merely]

I'm so sick of this notion. There's tons of evidence to the contrary. A couple of recent examples:
www.bmj.com/content/359/bmj.j4366
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/29695473

This is exactly what I was looking for thank you! Are you aware of any articles that come to the opposite conclusion? In other words, is there a consensus on this topic or is it controversial? I don’t really understand why an academic surgeon would be saying what he said, felt kinda inappropriate unless the evidence bears it out

 

[dpmd]

This is exactly what I was looking for thank you! Are you aware of any articles that come to the opposite conclusion? In other words, is there a consensus on this topic or is it controversial? I don’t really understand why an academic surgeon would be saying what he said, felt kinda inappropriate unless the evidence bears it out

I don't think it is at all controversial aside from people with a strong bias against women in the field at baseline. But like sb said it is possible the comfort is less about skill and more about personal feelings.

 

[deleted480308]

Wait im not sure I understand are you a male or female? Also his argument pertained to technical skill pretty much he thought that technically females were inferior surgeons that’s why I wanted some studies to take a look at

Oh, thanks for clearing that up.

Your friend is an idiot, his ilk are drastically outnumbered

 

[Merely]

Oh, thanks for clearing that up.

Your friend is an idiot, his ilk are drastically outnumbered

Yeah I mean I’m not sure if he like had any evidence to back this up or it was just prejudice on his part. I assume probably the latter as we didn’t get too much into it

 

[WinslowPringle]

Yeah I mean I’m not sure if he like had any evidence to back this up or it was just prejudice on his part. I assume probably the latter as we didn’t get too much into it

Perhaps the person you should ask for evidence for his opinions is the person making the claims/statements.
Or maybe you could ask him why he would feel uncomfortable with a female surgeon operating on him - as mentioned, maybe he just doesn't want his opposite-sex colleagues to see him naked or maybe he's just a sexist.

Also, I'm sure your med school library has a medical/reference librarian with a masters in the field who would *love* to help you research this.

 

[Merely]

Perhaps the person you should ask for evidence for his opinions is the person making the claims/statements.
Or maybe you could ask him why he would feel uncomfortable with a female surgeon operating on him - as mentioned, maybe he just doesn't want his opposite-sex colleagues to see him naked or maybe he's just a sexist.

Also, I'm sure your med school library has a medical/reference librarian with a masters in the field who would *love* to help you research this.

I am asking practicing surgeons as this is their field and perhaps someone has experience with this topic and has done some research on it as one of the posters above had. If you don’t know about this topic no one is forcing you to respond..as I stated earlier it’s not sexist to state that a man or woman is better at a particular thing if the evidence bears this out..it’s all about the evidence at the end of the day

 

[anonperson]

I am asking practicing surgeons as this is their field and perhaps someone has experience with this topic and has done some research on it as one of the posters above had. If you don’t know about this topic no one is forcing you to respond..as I stated earlier it’s not sexist to state that a man or woman is better at a particular thing if the evidence bears this out..it’s all about the evidence at the end of the day

How about seeing if Black surgeons have better outcomes than white surgeons. Or versus Asians.

What makes someone good in a procedural specialty depends on several factors.

How well they were trained (there is not a one sized fits all approach to this).

The surgeons own aptitude and intrinsic ability.

How much work they put into getting better (reviewing anatomy, practicing skills-laparoscopic or robotic for example, reviewing surgical videos etc).

Repetition. Typically a surgeon who does a specific procedure a lot will feel more comfortable and generally have better outcomes.

These things are not intrinsic to one gender.

The person saying they don't think women have specific technical skills has their own hangups and personal biases they are projecting.

 

[HighwayVagabond]

Why quote RCT's when we have new T Swift lyrics instead?

I'm so sick of running
As fast as I can
Wondering if I'd get there quicker
If I was a man
And I'm so sick of them
Coming at me again
'Cause if I was a man
Then I'd be THE man

Gotta fight trolls with trolling, right?

 

[kitsunepixie]

Possible he just doesn’t want to be naked in front of her?

I had a number of ladies ask me not to catch their baby, none questioned my ability

This is definitely a factor. I had a bunch of female hospital workers needing spine surgery flock the resident clinic when they found out a female neurosurgery would be the chief resident because they didn't want the guys to see them naked. They told me so.

 

[OrthoTraumaMD]

Plenty of published evidence showing no difference in patient outcomes based on surgeon gender. Just search pubmed. No convincing evidence to the contrary.