Additional income as veterinarian

[drjenvet1]

I am currently working as a small animal veterinarian in a small town in Canada and I love vet medicine and animals but I am truly discouraged with the veterinary salary! Have any of you existing vets comeby any means of generating additional income in our field? Would appreciate any input

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[Minnerbelle]

I don't know about Canada, and I don't know how it would work out with your schedule, but some people will take some ER relief shifts or join an at home euthanasia company for some extra dough.

 

[CalliopeDVM]

A lot depends on what's available in your "small town", and how small it is. Yes, you could try to pick up some locum work, or you could consider a general "ask the vet" type of show/article/blog for a local paper or TV station - though if you do that, make sure you stay within your any provincial restrictions about what you say. I don't know too many vets who have a secondary vet income other than locum work, though I know some who have a secondary income from something unrelated.

 

[chickenlittle]

Also, I'm not sure about how work regulations vary in Canada, but make sure to look into your employment contract (if you have one) before getting into anything. All of my contracts have prohibited me from moonlighting at other veterinary clinics (even emergency work) during my employment, and my contract specifically prohibits me from making ANY additional income related to veterinary medicine. Not sure how they'd find out about it, prove it, or sue for it.... but it's still a consideration.

 

[DVMDream]

All of my contracts have prohibited me from moonlighting at other veterinary clinics (even emergency work) during my employment, and my contract specifically prohibits me from making ANY additional income related to veterinary medicine. Not sure how they'd find out about it, prove it, or sue for it.... but it's still a consideration.

For how long? Those have limits. Not only that, they have to be reasonable and "not allowed to make ANY additional income related to vet med" would most likely (not guaranteeing but it is highly unlikely) to hold up in a court of law. Usually those have a certain boundary... like not working with in a 5 mile radius. Also they are limited in length of time.

Also, I would never sign a contract that prohibits me from gaining any additional income from what I obtained my degree in. I see what their worry is, but with how bad the job market is now and how high student loans are, if I need an additional part time job to make ends meet, I need that option open and it is absurd for a vet clinic to dictate how you can or can not make additional income and if challenged legally would probably be laughed at and disregarded. (The not being able to gain income related to vet med part, they could make something that you can't work within another vet clinic in the immediate area and that would hold ground legally, but the other is laughable).

 

[CalliopeDVM]

For how long? Those have limits. Not only that, they have to be reasonable and "not allowed to make ANY additional income related to vet med" would most likely (not guaranteeing but it is highly unlikely) to hold up in a court of law. Usually those have a certain boundary... like not working with in a 5 mile radius. Also they are limited in length of time.

Also, I would never sign a contract that prohibits me from gaining any additional income from what I obtained my degree in. I see what their worry is, but with how bad the job market is now and how high student loans are, if I need an additional part time job to make ends meet, I need that option open and it is absurd for a vet clinic to dictate how you can or can not make additional income and if challenged legally would probably be laughed at and disregarded. (The not being able to gain income related to vet med part, they could make something that you can't work within another vet clinic in the immediate area and that would hold ground legally, but the other is laughable).

You're talking about a non-compete clause that has a limited time and radius - those apply after someone has left the job. What chickenlittle mentioned is a term in the contract that applies to the time that one is currently employed (not after).

 

[chickenlittle]

You're talking about a non-compete clause that has a limited time and radius - those apply after someone has left the job. What chickenlittle mentioned is a term in the contract that applies to the time that one is currently employed (not after).

Exactly. My current noncompete is a 10 mile radius for 12 months after termination of the agreement. There is another clause, however, that specifies that during the terms of the contract "any and all revenues earned by the associate from the practice of veterinary medicine, on or off the premises, belong to the hospital."

A prior job had a noncompete radius of 10 miles for 3 years, but also specified "The employee also expressly agrees as a condition of her employment during the term of the agreement that she will devote her entire working time, energies, and skill to the exclusive service of the Company's interest."

Job before that: noncompete 10mi/3yrs, "Associate agrees to not compete by 'moonlighting' during employment."

Would those agreements hold up in court? Who knows.... but having it declared illegal in court won't help much once you've lost your job. You can say that you won't sign a contract with those sorts of clauses, and maybe you'll never have to, but if you're at all tied to a specific location you won't always have a lot of options and therefore won't always have a lot of say in the matter. (If you're willing to relocate anywhere in the country, you can afford to be more picky.)

 

[dyachei]

10 mi radii are not likely to hold up in court. But with corporate entities, you will exhaust legal funds before they do

 

[chickenlittle]

10 mi radii are not likely to hold up in court. But with corporate entities, you will exhaust legal funds before they do

Actually, when I worked for Banfield I didn't have any noncompete! I was surprised, but I hear that it varies with them.

I'm in a pretty rural area, so there's a chance that the 10 miles would potentially hold up because it typically only encompasses a couple of clinics. (For example, I currently commute 38 miles each way to work.... 10 miles is considered a short distance in this area.) It's never been an issue for me, because there has never been a clinic hiring that would fall within my noncompete radius for a previous job.

ETA: Also, I'm in a conservative red state that has a reputation for being employer-friendly and not favorable to employees. I'm sure that also comes into play... I know that there are some states that do a better job of protecting their employees, but our state has no protections beyond federal regulations and a good-ol-boys network.

E(again)TA: A quick Google search just turned up documents regarding my state that showed that a radius of 25 miles has previously been upheld by the courts for non-veterinary professionals seeking employment.

 

[dyachei]

Actually, when I worked for Banfield I didn't have any noncompete! I was surprised, but I hear that it varies with them.

I'm in a pretty rural area, so there's a chance that the 10 miles would potentially hold up because it typically only encompasses a couple of clinics. (For example, I currently commute 38 miles each way to work.... 10 miles is considered a short distance in this area.) It's never been an issue for me, because there has never been a clinic hiring that would fall within my noncompete radius for a previous job.

ETA: Also, I'm in a conservative red state that has a reputation for being employer-friendly and not favorable to employees. I'm sure that also comes into play... I know that there are some states that do a better job of protecting their employees, but our state has no protections beyond federal regulations and a good-ol-boys network.

E(again)TA: A quick Google search just turned up documents regarding my state that showed that a radius of 25 miles has previously been upheld by the courts for non-veterinary professionals seeking employment.

I didn't have one either. I would think it would be different with a professional degree. Basically, the way I've heard it explained is that they can't make you move in order to earn a living at your skill. So I'm not sure, but i would be surprised if those were upheld in court for vets

 

[NStarz]

You know what? Those clauses are kind of ridiculous. If I and my classmates are graduating with 250k+ in debt, it's pretty ridiculous to tell me I can't get a job moonlighting on my days off. I know you can't pay me enough to pay off my loans and that's fine, but don't restrict my ability to get an extra job to help do so. I get the employer not wanting the employee to compete and/or come to work burnt out/tired, etc., but people have been moonlighting for years and years with no issues. It's kind of an butthead move, tbh.

 

[DVMDream]

It's kind of an butthead move, tbh.

It isn't kind of a butthead move. It is a butthead move.

 

[Minnerbelle]

While job searching, I ran into everything from 0 noncompetes, to 20 miles for 2 yrs being the most restrictive. I also saw one for a multi hospital entity being 5 miles radius from all hospitals owned by this company (I'm hoping i read that wrong, because that seems rather restrictive. Took another offer before I could ask to clarify but it really stood out to me)

I don't really remember any no moonlighting rules during employment, except for some that requiring that you declare it to the employer, and some restricting it from competing areas.

 

[cowgirla]

While job searching, I ran into everything from 0 noncompetes, to 20 miles for 2 yrs being the most restrictive. I also saw one for a multi hospital entity being 5 miles radius from all hospitals owned by this company (I'm hoping i read that wrong, because that seems rather restrictive. Took another offer before I could ask to clarify but it really stood out to me)

I don't really remember any no moonlighting rules during employment, except for some that requiring that you declare it to the employer, and some restricting it from competing areas.

pretty much every ambulatory job I looked at was at least 20 miles, some even larger depending on how big the practice area was. I'm at 20 miles in a practice that will go about 35 miles from the clinic. Glad I don't plan on leaving anytime soon, but I thought it was pretty reasonable on their part considering that still leaves a good chunk of clients at the outskirts of the practice range.

Can't moonlight at a competing clinic but e-clinics and anything on a volunteer basis is fine.

 

[Minnerbelle]

Ambulatory clinics I can understand. But it's a little much for suburban/ urban small animal hospitals in a densely populated state IMO.

 

[cowgirla]

Ambulatory clinics I can understand. But it's a little much for suburban/ urban small animal hospitals in a densely populated state IMO.

Oh absolutely. No argument there. I just felt like putting in my two cents that there is something other than SA med

 

[chickenlittle]

You know what? Those clauses are kind of ridiculous. If I and my classmates are graduating with 250k+ in debt, it's pretty ridiculous to tell me I can't get a job moonlighting on my days off. I know you can't pay me enough to pay off my loans and that's fine, but don't restrict my ability to get an extra job to help do so. I get the employer not wanting the employee to compete and/or come to work burnt out/tired, etc., but people have been moonlighting for years and years with no issues. It's kind of an butthead move, tbh.

It certainly is possible that I could have negotiated those things out of the contract, but I didn't try because I was more concerned with asking for concessions on other things (salary, vacation time, etc). My point is to read your contract closely, and realize that it's not always as simple as just taking a second job. I haven't been in a situation where I've needed a second job, so that really isn't an issue for me.... and if I were to take a second job, I'd look for something nonveterinary because my brain needs a break from the constant vet med But, at least in my area, these clauses are common... so discomfort with this sort of clause may mean that you would need to make concessions in other areas (accept a lower salary or reduced benefits from what you were initially offered) or turn down a job that otherwise seems perfect. It's not fair at all, and it is 100% a butthead move, but better to know about the possibility before you start job-hunting than to be caught off-guard when the time comes to sign a contract.

I'd be prepared for the possibility of a lot of butthead moves if you intend to work as an associate veterinarian. Current issue that I'm dealing with? I recently requested a week of vacation time 10 months in advance, for a family reunion. My boss initially approved the time, but then came back and said that I need to think carefully about taking that vacation if I may be pregnant at that time (I was very upfront with him on taking the job that we'd be trying for another kiddo, and we plan to start soon) because using a week of vacation just a few months before taking 6 wks of unpaid maternity leave may mean that he decides not to hold my job for me. Exact words: "at some point, you have to ask yourself which is more important - a week at the beach with your family, or having a job to come back to when you're trying to support a second kid?" Total butthead move, but unfortunately not illegal. There are very few legal protections for small business employees, and the stress on veterinary clinic owners means they aren't always willing/able to be very flexible with employees (including DVMs). Be prepared for plenty of butthead moves. Maybe you'll get lucky, but almost all of the classmates that I graduated with (approx 10 years ago) have similar stories of being poorly treated.

 

[Mad Jack]

Probably not an option up in Canada, but teaching a community college course or two is a way a lot of health professionals make extra income around here. It's not a whole lot of money (usually around a thousand dollars per credit hour per semester), but it helps.

 

[dyachei]

Probably not an option up in Canada, but teaching a community college course or two is a way a lot of health professionals make extra income around here. It's not a whole lot of money (usually around a thousand dollars per credit hour per semester), but it helps.

It's what I do - 1-2 classes a semester 1 day a week. And I didn't have a clause in my contract stating I had to declare it. So I did. And then was approached by the chief of staff asking why I hadn't mentioned it. Perhaps it was because any time I went to him about anything, he would act like a 5 year old. But I made sure to double check the contract I had signed.

 

[BASIOUNY]

I am currently working as a small animal veterinarian in a small town in Canada and I love vet medicine and animals but I am truly discouraged with the veterinary salary! Have any of you existing vets comeby any means of generating additional income in our field? Would appreciate any input

Hey Dr,
I am in my way to immigrate to Quebec, and planning to go through BCSE during the upcoming days. But your words regarding the low income of Vets in Canada actually frustrated me. Does it worth it to pass the boarding exams and becoming a licensed vet,from the economic point of view ?
Kindly guide me because I am going to take my final decision within days.
Thanks in Advance

 

[drjenvet1]

Thanks for all the responses unfortunately we don't have emerg clinic in our province so emerg shifts aren't an option. I have contacted local paper re biweekly article/Q&A so we will see how that turns out honestly I feel that future ownership is the only real way to considerably boost income - time will tell
Some of those non-compete clauses sound very restrictive!!!!
As for last post about immigrating to Canada and vet salary.... It's really not that bad... Not sure of exact stats but somewhere between 50k and 85k per year for general veterinarian I would say plus additional for on call etc.
Hope that helps
As for non-veterinary secondary income I am interested in what any of you or your colleagues have done... I always fear losing credibility if going outside vetmed field

 

[dyachei]

If there is a local college that teaches veterinary technicians, you might inquire about an adjunct position.

practice ownership tends to be more lucrative in the long haul

 

[Kissakos22]

I am currently working as a small animal veterinarian in a small town in Canada and I love vet medicine and animals but I am truly discouraged with the veterinary salary! Have any of you existing vets comeby any means of generating additional income in our field? Would appreciate any input

If you're looking for side income, testifying as an expert witness in the veterinary field is a great option!

Expert witnesses are able to generate a significant amount of extra income by consulting on complex litigation issues while still pursuing a full-time career. Full disclosure, I work for an expert witness platform in NY (which is completely free for any professional interested in joining).

We have a page dedicated to veterinary medicine expert witnesses with a variety of resources, case studies and expert witnesses- https://www.theexpertinstitute.com/expert-witness/veterinary-medicine/

Check out the page and please reach out to me directly if you have any questions!

 

[WhtsThFrequency]

If you're looking for side income, testifying as an expert witness in the veterinary field is a great option!

Expert witnesses are able to generate a significant amount of extra income by consulting on complex litigation issues while still pursuing a full-time career. Full disclosure, I work for an expert witness platform in NY (which is completely free for any professional interested in joining).

We have a page dedicated to veterinary medicine expert witnesses with a variety of resources, case studies and expert witnesses- https://www.theexpertinstitute.com/expert-witness/veterinary-medicine/

Check out the page and please reach out to me directly if you have any questions!

And there goes that credibility.

 

[MassDVMMPH]

As for non-veterinary secondary income I am interested in what any of you or your colleagues have done... I always fear losing credibility if going outside vetmed field

Some people can make extra money by turning their hobbies into part-time businesses. I have a couple of nieces who have taught themselves how to make jewelry (necklaces, bracelets, earrings) and have set up businesses on etsy. They each bring in several thousand dollars a year that way. If you make anything as a hobby, that might be an option for you. Both of them have full-time jobs in addition, though not as vets (one is a speech pathologist).

 

[JosephKnechtDVM]

I have seen a practice owner seemingly run a country store by selling her homemade jams, jellies and then her own handcrafted jewelry in her lobby. Do not worry about losing credibility by doing anything unrelated to the profession if you need the money, just make sure you let your veterinary school know about the wonderful non veterinary job opportunity you need to pay off their wonderful education !

 

[chickenlittle]

I have recently been doing freelance medical writing and editing in my free time. Pay is often better than I make as a veterinarian and the work is 1000x more enjoyable... currently sending out resumes and hoping to switch to medical writing full-time. (YAY!! A LIGHT AT THE END OF THE TUNNEL!!)

 

[HopefulAg]

What is 'medical writing and editing'? Just writing papers and stuff in medical terminology?

 

[chickenlittle]

What is 'medical writing and editing'? Just writing papers and stuff in medical terminology?

More or less. Here's some info: http://www.amwa.org/toolkit_new_med_writers

The specific projects that I have been working on? Writing continuing education courses for veterinarians and editing medical academic papers written by non-native English speakers.

 

[lailanni]

I have recently been doing freelance medical writing and editing in my free time. Pay is often better than I make as a veterinarian and the work is 1000x more enjoyable... currently sending out resumes and hoping to switch to medical writing full-time. (YAY!! A LIGHT AT THE END OF THE TUNNEL!!)

So happy to hear that!!! I know it's been a rough road for you, I hope you're headed to smooth sailing stat

 

[CalliopeDVM]

I have recently been doing freelance medical writing and editing in my free time. Pay is often better than I make as a veterinarian and the work is 1000x more enjoyable... currently sending out resumes and hoping to switch to medical writing full-time. (YAY!! A LIGHT AT THE END OF THE TUNNEL!!)

Did you find these jobs through a freelance job website (like elance), or through something more targeted to medical science? If you don't mind sharing, of course.

 

[chickenlittle]

I found the freelance writing through Elance. There's a lot of 'junk' jobs listed on there, but I lucked out with one good assignment that has turned into a repeat customer (writing online CE courses for veterinarians). I've also found a couple of jobs on upwork.com, which is what Elance is transitioning over to. I also do editing for edanzediting.com - it's less enjoyable/lucrative than the writing, but I feel like the training that I'm getting through them is providing a big boost to my own writing.

 

[LuvPups]

I was a singer/songwriter/pianist before going to vet school and I plan on returning to that part-time (but still professionally) after I graduate in July and start my 1st vet job. I always think 2nd jobs in a different field enhance a reputation rather than take away from. Shows a more multi -faceted personality and skill set.

 

[CalliopeDVM]

I always think 2nd jobs in a different field enhance a reputation rather than take away from. Shows a more multi -faceted personality and skill set.

I think, more importantly, it also helps with a vet's mental health and is an outlet to release some stress.

After checking out the freelance websites, I actually got a job taking some photographs for a company that does social media website management. I suppose they'll turn up in blogs somewhere, some time. It's fun, and my first photography job/sale ever, which is kinda cool (I'm a good amateur photographer, but never considered going pro.)

 

[chickenlittle]

I made $150 on Elance one month just by contributing some travel photos (which I had already taken over the last few years) to HiMarco.com - I was pretty psyched about that, but they haven't posted any more ads lately

 

[dyachei]

I found the freelance writing through Elance. There's a lot of 'junk' jobs listed on there, but I lucked out with one good assignment that has turned into a repeat customer (writing online CE courses for veterinarians). I've also found a couple of jobs on upwork.com, which is what Elance is transitioning over to. I also do editing for edanzediting.com - it's less enjoyable/lucrative than the writing, but I feel like the training that I'm getting through them is providing a big boost to my own writing.

Do you mind me asking if you did any of the med writing courses or anything prior to this? As my health continues to be an issue, I am looking for ways to continue working with less physical involvement.

 

[chickenlittle]

Nope, I haven't yet done any of the medical writing courses. I considered it, but then ended up signing on with the editing company and writing the vet CE courses and that pretty much eats up all of the time that I could spend on courses. (40 hrs/wk at Banfield + 10-15 hrs/wk freelance + jobhunting for a FT medical writing job + 3-year-old a home = exhaustion!!) I've heard a lot of people say that the AMWA course is beneficial, though, and I did go ahead and get a membership which has proven very informative.... may take the course later if I ever have a 'lull' in freelance work.

 

[dyachei]

Nope, I haven't yet done any of the medical writing courses. I considered it, but then ended up signing on with the editing company and writing the vet CE courses and that pretty much eats up all of the time that I could spend on courses. (40 hrs/wk at Banfield + 10-15 hrs/wk freelance + jobhunting for a FT medical writing job + 3-year-old a home = exhaustion!!) I've heard a lot of people say that the AMWA course is beneficial, though, and I did go ahead and get a membership which has proven very informative.... may take the course later if I ever have a 'lull' in freelance work.

Thanks!