[2017-2018] Emergency Medicine Application Thread

[GonnaBeADoc2222]

I applied in 2012-13. Didn't go to ACEP. Got 20+ interview invites.

I know that my former PD doesn't go to the fair. Not sure if an APD does either.

Ended up matching at a competitive program. I didn't even attend the pre-interview dinner - gasp!

Personally, I am surprised this practice works to score extra interviews as it hugely discriminates against applicants who cannot go to ACEP secondary to financial / familial limitations or just plain being on a rotation that does not allow absences for things like conferences....or maybe they just don't want to go to ACEP.

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[gamerEMdoc]

I applied in 2012-13. Didn't go to ACEP. Got 20+ interview invites.

I know that my former PD doesn't go to the fair. Not sure if an APD does either.

Ended up matching at a competitive program. I didn't even attend the pre-interview dinner - gasp!

Personally, I am surprised this practice works to score extra interviews as it hugely discriminates against applicants who cannot go to ACEP secondary to financial / familial limitations or just plain being on a rotation that does not allow absences for things like conferences....or maybe they just don't want to go to ACEP.

I mean, there has to be a way for programs to whittle down 800 applications. Once they invite all the rotators, geographic filtered applicants that meet their standards, etc. They are still left with hundreds of people to try and decide on their last interviews. Some go to people that email and you look at their app and find it intriguing. A few went to people who contacted us via the residency fair. In the end, programs have to try to wittle down who actually has an interest in ending up at their program vs who just spammed 200 programs. Its tough, and the way the system is set up, its just an imperfect system.

 

[GonnaBeADoc2222]

I mean, there has to be a way for programs to whittle down 800 applications. Once they invite all the rotators, geographic filtered applicants that meet their standards, etc. They are still left with hundreds of people to try and decide on their last interviews. Some go to people that email and you look at their app and find it intriguing. A few went to people who contacted us via the residency fair. In the end, programs have to try to wittle down who actually has an interest in ending up at their program vs who just spammed 200 programs. Its tough, and the way the system is set up, its just an imperfect system.

I would argue further that rotators shouldn't get auto-interviews either, unless you are interviewing them during the rotation. They've already been on what is essentially a month long interview. If you already decided you don't like them (or maybe you REALLY do like them and they are #1 on your list!), what's the point of putting extra financial / time burdens on them to travel back yet again?

I understand giving extra looks to people who email and express increased interest, that's free of charge and takes no time. Giving advantage to those who have lax med school curricula, and the extra cash floating around, and willing to travel across the country just to say hi to you (btw, do you really think they are there just to see YOUR program and no one else's?) is against the spirit of the system I think.

 

[Perfect Hair Day]

I applied in 2012-13. Didn't go to ACEP. Got 20+ interview invites.

I know that my former PD doesn't go to the fair. Not sure if an APD does either.

Ended up matching at a competitive program. I didn't even attend the pre-interview dinner - gasp!

Personally, I am surprised this practice works to score extra interviews as it hugely discriminates against applicants who cannot go to ACEP secondary to financial / familial limitations or just plain being on a rotation that does not allow absences for things like conferences....or maybe they just don't want to go to ACEP.

I'm not sure that its fair to call it discriminatory - discriminatory would mean they don't review your app/consider you if you don't visit them at ACEP. This is no different than networking and leveraging your professional network to your advantage is normal and expected.

 

[Perfect Hair Day]

I would argue further that rotators shouldn't get auto-interviews either, unless you are interviewing them during the rotation. They've already been on what is essentially a month long interview. If you already decided you don't like them (or maybe you REALLY do like them and they are #1 on your list!), what's the point of putting extra financial / time burdens on them to travel back yet again?

I understand giving extra looks to people who email and express increased interest, that's free of charge and takes no time. Giving advantage to those who have lax med school curricula, and the extra cash floating around, and willing to travel across the country just to say hi to you (btw, do you really think they are there just to see YOUR program and no one else's?) is against the spirit of the system I think.

So, I think that a post-rotation interview is still beneficial both for applicant and program. There may be a significant strength on their application that just doesn't come up on the rotation. For instance, I designed an POCUS elective at my school - why is there a need for me to share this information on a visiting rotation? I'm there to show them I can do the job well and function within their department. All my cool hobbies might not come up because I'm just studying and working on the rotation right? Maybe an applicant would like an opportunity to discuss an adversity they overcame as included on their PS. I think automatic interviews for rotators who aren't absolute trashpile med students on the rotation in reasonable. Just one persons opinion though.

 

[Frazier]

We had several ACEP fair people interview at my program. Most likely it was related.

It doesn't get you bonus points... it just helps you stand out when 10 other people have the same exact application.

But it goes both ways. There were at least 2 people that also got themselves added to the "do not interview" list.

 

[Perfect Hair Day]

We had several ACEP fair people interview at my program. Most likely it was related.

It doesn't get you bonus points... it just helps you stand out when 10 other people have the same exact application.

But it goes both ways. There were at least 2 people that also got themselves added to the "do not interview" list.

Yeesh, what does one do at ACEP to get added to that list?

 

[HopefulEMed]

I'm not sure that its fair to call it discriminatory - discriminatory would mean they don't review your app/consider you if you don't visit them at ACEP. This is no different than networking and leveraging your professional network to your advantage is normal and expected.

I have to agree with this statement. Although I didn't go to ACEP, networking is critical to move forward in your career. The best prepared may not always come out on top over the one that's prepared with great networking skills. It's a life lesson I have had to learn the hard way.

 

[SalemK]

I understand giving extra looks to people who email and express increased interest, that's free of charge and takes no time. Giving advantage to those who have lax med school curricula, and the extra cash floating around, and willing to travel across the country just to say hi to you (btw, do you really think they are there just to see YOUR program and no one else's?) is against the spirit of the system I think.

Who are these people with "lax med school curricula"? We all took the same exams, and I would think that anyone with a poor education would have already been screened out of being competitive for EM, no matter how you feel about the importance of Step scores. I also do not equate a "lesser" school with a lazy or undeserving applicant. I'm sure I will be inundated with "it's your own fault for going to a DO school" comments, but not everyone has the advantages of a home institution, an associated EM residency program, or even EM-specific advising. I met a candidate on the interview trail from Hawaii, who was an MD with similar challenges. Some folks have incredible connections in the EM world simply by virtue of where they went to medical school; it's not even close to "fair" from the start. If you were concerned about getting enough interviews, wouldn't you do everything you possibly could to maximize your chances? I'm not saying that ACEP is a must -- not by any means -- but it could be one part of your overall plan to succeed in matching EM.

Interview season is incredibly expensive and a trip to ACEP is essentially the cost of one more interview. We have all been building our applications for years and most of us probably have a few activities or events that 1. cost money and/or 2. allowed us opportunities to network. If you really think you're better in person than on paper (not going to dignify the SVI with a mention), this is a chance for a few minutes of face time. No one believes you only came to ACEP to stop at their booth, but as an applicant you really only have time to visit a handful, and if you've done your homework, I think this does speak to your genuine interest in that program.

As an aside, it's not a super fun afternoon by any means. It's hot, loud, the crowds can be intense, and if you're like me you spend the next few hours kicking yourself over everything you said/didn't say.

 

[surely]

Who are these people with "lax med school curricula"? We all took the same exams, and I would think that anyone with a poor education would have already been screened out of being competitive for EM, no matter how you feel about the importance of Step scores. I also do not equate a "lesser" school with a lazy or undeserving applicant. I'm sure I will be inundated with "it's your own fault for going to a DO school" comments, but not everyone has the advantages of a home institution, an associated EM residency program, or even EM-specific advising. I met a candidate on the interview trail from Hawaii, who was an MD with similar challenges. Some folks have incredible connections in the EM world simply by virtue of where they went to medical school; it's not even close to "fair" from the start. If you were concerned about getting enough interviews, wouldn't you do everything you possibly could to maximize your chances? I'm not saying that ACEP is a must -- not by any means -- but it could be one part of your overall plan to succeed in matching EM..

I think they meant lax in terms of giving the student lots of time off for interviews and attending ACEP as a 4th year, versus limiting the max number of days off during each rotation. I don't think it was a value judgement on the rigor of the educational experience.

 

[HopefulEMed]

I can't believe we are almost here. How's everyone feeling?

 

[gamerEMdoc]

Excited as always. Match week is the best. Best of luck everyone.

 

[Gray Fox]

I can't believe we are almost here. How's everyone feeling?

Chillin like a villian. We all gonna do good, much love to you all.

In the mean time, have some good laughs:

forums.studentdoctor.net/threads/em-interview-archetypes.1160414/

 

[general987]

Are the rumors about ACEP true? That they have this wonderful residency fair that can help land interviews with programs the applicant may otherwise not have received?

It has been well talked about already but wanted to add another instance. I received an interview invite because of ACEP fair. The PD told me that had I not come to their booth, I would most likely not receive an interview because my step was filtered out.

 

[AlgernonMed]

Matched!! Wahoooo!

 

[HopefulEMed]

MATCHED!

 

[Wroooong]

Matched! So stoked. Looks like there were 13 unfilled EM positions this year. That's pretty high for EM, no?

 

[doggydog]

I seem to remember that last year the initial word was that there were 8 unfilled EM positions and there actually ended up being none.

There have been no open EM positions for like four years.

Congrats to everyone who matched.

 

[theSmurfette]

.

 

[WernickeDO]

MATCHED!!!

 

[Perfect Hair Day]

Matched! So stoked. Looks like there were 13 unfilled EM positions this year. That's pretty high for EM, no?

How do you know that there were 13 unfilled spots?

 

[theSmurfette]

Anyone know of any EM programs that aren't participating in Match this year?

 

[DOGlobetrotter]

Anyone know of any EM programs that aren't participating in Match this year?

This is my question too...there seems to be a mismatch in how many spots are open in SOAP and how many are reported as unfilled

 

[theSmurfette]

This is my question too...there seems to be a mismatch in how many spots are open in SOAP and how many are reported as unfilled

I believe programs can choose to not participate in SOAP and just remain unfilled. I imagine that’s where the 3 spots are.


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[kal2210]

I believe programs can choose to not participate in SOAP and just remain unfilled. I imagine that’s where the 3 spots are.


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So is it 13 unfilled but only 10 spots available in SOAP?

 

[theSmurfette]

So is it 13 unfilled but only 10 spots available in SOAP?

Yes.


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[DOGlobetrotter]

I believe programs can choose to not participate in SOAP and just remain unfilled. I imagine that’s where the 3 spots are.


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So does that mean they wait for the scramble or that they just don't have anyone fill the spots at all for the year because if they just give up the spots, that seems like a huge waste!

 

[clibby]

Last year there was 1 peds/EM spot and 3 EM spots reported as open. Of the 3 EM spots, 2 were reportedly reserved for a Saudi Arabia exchange, but the program filled with us grads instead and the other was reserved for a military spot. No actual em spot was open to soap into. I don’t know anything about this year.

 

[Perfect Hair Day]

Last year there was 1 peds/EM spot and 3 EM spots reported as open. Of the 3 EM spots, 2 were reportedly reserved for a Saudi Arabia exchange, but the program filled with us grads instead and the other was reserved for a military spot. No actual em spot was open to soap into. I don’t know anything about this year.

Yes, there is an exchange program with Saudia Arabia, I believe it's sponsored by the University of Maryland. I wonder how the US grads were able to get the spot, that's interesting.

I believe programs can choose to not participate in SOAP and just remain unfilled. I imagine that’s where the 3 spots are.

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Seems like such a disservice to medical students. I'm surprised the SOAP process isn't part of the all-in rule for participating in NRMP.

Congrats to everyone who matched!

 

[clibby]

Yes, there is an exchange program with Saudia Arabia, I believe it's sponsored by the University of Maryland. I wonder how the US grads were able to get the spot, that's interesting.



Seems like such a disservice to medical students. I'm surprised the SOAP process isn't part of the all-in rule for participating in NRMP.

Congrats to everyone who matched!

I think they are only allowed to train a certain number of residents per year total per RRC, but there are two spots that get SA funding instead of Medicare. This is all hearsay though.

 

[EM2be1957]

Matched as a reapplicant!

If anyone needs advice soaping or for application next year, I'd be happy to talk with you!

 

[EMedGrrl]

Anyone know of any EM programs that aren't participating in Match this year?

St. Joseph's in Stockton, CA is hoping to be accredited this spring and to recruit for July 2018 once accredited. Residency Programs | St. Joseph's Medical Center | Dignity Health

 

[Gomertose]

Anyone know if we can contact a new program like this outside the match without violating NRMP match agreement? In SOAP process now

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[theSmurfette]

Anyone know if we can contact a new program like this outside the match without violating NRMP match agreement? In SOAP process now

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Not until SOAP is over.


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[surely]

The infernal spreadsheet now has a Match List tab! Check it out and put your name down when you get the good news on Friday. Feel free to spread it around among your class and post it on Reddit, too. I can't be the only one who's 40% excited to find out where I match and 60% excited to find out who I match with.

Official 2017-2018 Emergency Medicine Application and Interview Sheet

 

[EM2018orBUST]

The infernal spreadsheet now has a Match List tab! Check it out and put your name down when you get the good news on Friday. Feel free to spread it around among your class and post it on Reddit, too. I can't be the only one who's 40% excited to find out where I match and 60% excited to find out who I match with.

Official 2017-2018 Emergency Medicine Application and Interview Sheet

Let's hope it goes better than the DO match list

 

[Bill Brasky]

Let's hope it goes better than the DO match list

I still haven't met anybody who matched AOA EM.

 

[AlgernonMed]

I know of only one personally...

 

[CajunMedic]

I still haven't met anybody who matched AOA EM.

Pretty much everybody I rotated with but me and one of my classmates. Most of them got their first choices.

 

[dartmed]

Now that Match Day is almost here, is anyone else curious to read your letters? I would love to read my SLOEs, post-match. Haha.

 

[sfwtboy]

 

[theSmurfette]

The only thing I truly learned this season was to trust NO ONE. They flat out lied to me. Said people were going to be disappointed in the match. Sorry, but the only one disappointed was me. And I got nothing. I was the maybe of our match group and no one felt the need to tell me that.


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[gamerEMdoc]

The only thing I truly learned this season was to trust NO ONE. They flat out lied to me. Said people were going to be disappointed in the match. Sorry, but the only one disappointed was me. And I got nothing. I was the maybe of our match group and no one felt the need to tell me that.


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The process totally sucks sometimes. And finding a brutally honest mentor, not just in the match, but in your career going forward, is difficult to find.

 

[Elevencents]

Yep don’t believe the emails. Was told I would be a perfect fit at my #1. Ended up matching my #5. Wish people were just honest.

 

[HopefulEMed]

Matched at a top-tier program that's frequently listed in the top 5 or as #1 for most people on here. This shows that if you have a low Step I (i.e., <205), it's still doable to match into a top program. In all honesty, I owe my success to people on this forum. I promise to write a detailed post in the coming days, hoping that it will be helpful for future applicants.

 

[Apollyon]

It happens EVERY YEAR. Every single year. Yet, no one in the next year will listen or believe it. Especially foolish are "suicide matchers" (people who only rank one place). Liars everywhere. Everything is a lie.

 

[gamerEMdoc]

It happens EVERY YEAR. Every single year. Yet, no one in the next year will listen or believe it. Especially foolish are "suicide matchers" (people who only rank one place). Liars everywhere. Everything is a lie.

The cake is a lie...

 

[gutonc]

Yep don’t believe the emails. Was told I would be a perfect fit at my #1. Ended up matching my #5. Wish people were just honest.

You probably would have been a perfect match. But so, apparently, were a dozen or so other people. That's life man.

 

[GonnaBeADoc2222]

The only thing I truly learned this season was to trust NO ONE. They flat out lied to me. Said people were going to be disappointed in the match. Sorry, but the only one disappointed was me. And I got nothing. I was the maybe of our match group and no one felt the need to tell me that.


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Yep don’t believe the emails. Was told I would be a perfect fit at my #1. Ended up matching my #5. Wish people were just honest.

Yup. This is why post-interview communication should be banned.

If you matched, be thankful. You might be bummed you didn't get program x or y because of some perceived benefit of that program, but honestly, who gives a s**t? You will be BC in EM and that's all that matters.

My wife and I fell about 1/3 down our rank lists. We both killed our USMLEs, top quartile of class, 20+ interviews. Nature of couples' match maybe? Who cares. We were lucky that falling 1/3 still meant an elite program for both of us that afforded us great training in our respective fields, etc, etc.

You will soon learn that for MOST EM jobs, BC/BE in EM, having a pulse, not being an ax murderer, able to semi carry on a conversation is really all that matters.

 

[theSmurfette]

Yup. This is why post-interview communication should be banned.

If you matched, be thankful. You might be bummed you didn't get program x or y because of some perceived benefit of that program, but honestly, who gives a s**t? You will be BC in EM and that's all that matters.

My wife and I fell about 1/3 down our rank lists. We both killed our USMLEs, top quartile of class, 20+ interviews. Nature of couples' match maybe? Who cares. We were lucky that falling 1/3 still meant an elite program for both of us that afforded us great training in our respective fields, etc, etc.

You will soon learn that for MOST EM jobs, BC/BE in EM, having a pulse, not being an ax murderer, able to semi carry on a conversation is really all that matters.

Well, I didn’t match. Not even in SOAP. I had 8 ranks. It was statistically improbable that I wouldn’t match.

I was devastated because of how they made me think I was a shoe-in. I now get to figure out where I went wrong with vague comments and try again next year.


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