would've never gone to D.O. school if I knew what an F-ing joke our boards are!

[playa220]

seriously, WTF???
this is what we work for? i'm sooo sick and tired of being ready for an exam and getting SCREWED because the test itself is garbage.

poorly written questions, med-legal BS....how is that supposed to assess our level of knowledge? I know i was ready for the test, but I ended up failing by ONE point...i'm beyond frusterated. means more money, more time studying, less time preparing for interviews...etc.

I'm now in my 4th year and wish I could go back and change my decision about going to D.O. school. yeah we have the option of taking usmle, but that's not what they prepare us for. so either way, we're screwed.

I would not complain so much if this wasn't what everyone says about the exam....the NBOME needs to wake the F--- up and make changes already...it's embarassing

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[oldManDO2009]

I feel your pain - COMLEX I & II are complete and udder garbage. I took the USMLE I & II and studied UW for both test and did well. The USMLE had long well written stems and sane choices for answers compared to the one or two sentences for a stem on the COMLEX and then answers as if they had explained their position (in the stem). I would just study UW; my COMLEX Step II and USMLE Step II score improved nicely compared to to Step I (USMLE & COMLEX) where I did not use UW (wish I had)

My current concern lies in the venerable COMLEX PE where I have no idea how I did and probably failed. So panic has already set in since I won't get a score until the end of November which gives me a short window to retake that stinking test

I wonder how many people as a % have failed year to year and has this % increased (cash cow from strapped med students) - is this a conscious effort to increase profits??? Class - action law suit to stop the madness and my hijacking threads

rant done!


oldMan

 

[Old_Mil]

seriously, WTF???
this is what we work for? i'm sooo sick and tired of being ready for an exam and getting SCREWED because the test itself is garbage.

It is. That's why DOs who are serious about competing for desirable residencies and/or validating their education take the USMLE. If you take USMLE 1, 2CK, and 2CS that puts you in position to take USMLE 3 and rid yourself of the curse of COMLEX forever.

 

[oldManDO2009]

What? If I take Step II CS -I am COMPLEX free? What do you mean by this? I have taken USMLE I & II but took COMPLEX II CS (and probably failed!)....

Please tell me more

OldMan

 

[NJWxMan]

I wouldn't sweat the CS. You probably did not fail. The numbers are on your side.

 

[chadderdo21]

I feel your pain man. I walked into to Step II feeling great and walked ok expecting a 70 point increase cause how stupid the test was. Boy I was dumb, my score was only 18 higher than my step 1!!! The COMLEX is a damn joke that needs to done away with. I just took the PE 2 hours ago, lets it put this way, I have not had a worse experience than that except for my OB days . I can't wait till this crap is over with!

 

[NJWxMan]

What is expected on the COMLEX II to pass? I remember the rumor for COMLEX I was 60%. I did well on COMLEX I but weirdly, after two months of studying including 2 weeks of 10 hr study days, I'm worried that I may have not passed.

 

[TOXOSIS]

It is. That's why DOs who are serious about competing for desirable residencies and/or validating their education take the USMLE. If you take USMLE 1, 2CK, and 2CS that puts you in position to take USMLE 3 and rid yourself of the curse of COMLEX forever.

It is to my understanding that as a D.O. (student), it is not required to pass USMLE Step I to qualify for USMLE Step II and the same for Step III. I definatley know the first part is true because several of my classmates took only USMLE Step II and bypassed Step I. I don't see why Step III would be different. I believe some (or all?) states accept USMLE Step III in place of COMLEX III.

 

[Old_Mil]

I believe some (or all?) states accept USMLE Step III in place of COMLEX III.

Right. So take the complete set of USMLE exams for licensure, and take Comlex 1 + 2 to get your degree...complete bypassing Comlex III.

 

[TOXOSIS]

Right. So take the complete set of USMLE exams for licensure, and take Comlex 1 + 2 to get your degree...complete bypassing Comlex III.

Why would you take the complete set of USMLE exams for licensure if you don't need to take USMLE I, II, CS in order to take III?

 

[group_theory]

Old_Mil for a while have been advocating for taking USMLE and skipping COMLEX 3. He/She has yet to post a rational reason (or an advantage) to skipping COMLEX 3 (besides pure hatred of the beast). There are certain downside to skipping COMLEX 3. First, certain states absolutely require DOs to have finished the COMLEX series for licensure and will not take USMLE. These are California, Florida, Oklahoma, Pennsylvania, Vermont, and West Virginia. Michigan and Tennessee will not accept USMLE for initial licensure but may accept USMLE if you have another unrestricted license in another state and applying for reciprocity.

Your goal is to be able to have the ability to practice unrestricted in all 50 states. The AOA-internship requirement is already a hurdle - why purposely throw in another hurdle and limit yourself (even if you have no plans to practice in those states now - who can predict the future).

To be eligible to take USMLE Step 3, you need to pass USMLE 1 and 2 (CK and CS).

Whether you want to go ahead and take USMLE-2CS and eventually USMLE Step 3 is up to you ... to me, the benefit is outweigh by the cost (monetary wise with the cost of USMLE-2CS ($1025 as of 2008) and USMLE 3 ($670+) as well as TIME WISE since step 3 is a 2 day exam).

To avoid COMLEX 3 is your option - but make that choice knowing the ramification. COMLEX 3 is a one-day test. Unfortunately it is still poorly worded and similar in style and format to COMLEX 1 and 2. However, to pass, you need a minimum of 350.

 

[USArmyDoc]

Why does everyone need to post stuff like this? I am only a 3rd year and I could only imagine what happened to guys. I havn't been through nearly as much. However, I feel it looks terrible that these tests are degraded in such a public forum.

 

[simpler2]

Its one thing to complain within your profession about aspects that are undesirable but it is a gross misrepresentation and harmful to other D.O.s to do it in this manner. Try voicing your concerns to the bodies that actually write the COMLEX exams instead of devaluing your training just to vent.

 

[playa220]

ummm...i don't think it's a secret that the comlex is a horrible exam. i don't think i'm letting the cat out of the bag here. i'm not devaluing my training as a whole, just the exam itself. they are messing with peoples lives and i will voice my opinion in this format because it needs to be readdressed over and over again until these people get it. maybe one day someone in the nbome will listen to all the numerous complaints.

we work hard in medical school, the least they can do is give us a decent and fair exam. i think we have every right to be mad about this.

anyway, not insulting D.O's as a whole...i believe that they are just as competent as the M.D.s....so why not give us the same exam??? like i before, it's just embarassing

 

[DILF]

chill out...

people exagerate how bad the comlexes are. They are not that bad. In fact, i thought the COMLEX 2 was in ways better than the USMLE, which was incredibly vague.

If you hate the test so much, take the USMLE series 1-3 and be done with it.

But no need to act like a big baby.

 

[NJWxMan]

.

 

[DOCTORSAIB]

I know i was ready for the test, but I ended up failing by ONE point

"Ready" and failing are mutually exclusive. Let's not kid ourselves here. Clearly you did NOT have an in-depth understanding of the material or else you would have passed comfortably -- which honestly is not that hard to do.

So stop dissing on our COMPETENCY exam and start working on what you did wrong and what you could do to improve next time. Man up.

 

[jdinovit]

Playa, what you wrote is based on rumors and is not true. I thought the same as you did until I myself took the USMLE. You write such comments since you did not even experience any USMLE test and don't have any clue about the USMLE. I took both COMLEX step 1 and step 2. I rocked step 2, getting a 2 digit score of 90. I just took the USMLE step 2 today.

Let me tell you that the USMLE step 2, was much more poorly written than the COMLEX step 2. The USMLE had much more esoteric questions than the COMLEX and was much more difficult. The questions were mostly 2 to 4 times the length of the COMLEX questions and it was very difficult to finish the blocks in time due to the length of the questions. If you did not pass COMLEX 2 you will definitely not pass USMLE step 2 since the COMLEX is easier in my opinion. The ethical legal garbage is on both tests by the way. After having taken USMLE step 2 and COMLEX step 2, I think the COMLEX is a better test since it has less unfair questions than the USMLE and you have enough time to actually finish the exam without rushing.

 

[MaximusD]

It is. That's why DOs who are serious about competing for desirable residencies and/or validating their education take the USMLE. If you take USMLE 1, 2CK, and 2CS that puts you in position to take USMLE 3 and rid yourself of the curse of COMLEX forever.

You're a joke. It's a licensing exam. If you think that a few exams in the course of an entire career are worth a damn in anything other than residency placement, you're ******ed.

Want to know how I'm going to "validate my education"? I'm going to a be a sweet ****ing doctor and laugh at idiots like you who are in this for the wrong reasons.

 

[Chrysanthemum]

"Ready" and failing are mutually exclusive. Let's not kid ourselves here. Clearly you did NOT have an in-depth understanding of the material or else you would have passed comfortably -- which honestly is not that hard to do.

Completely agree. There were so many gimmie-questions that I found it hard to not to pass. I do agree that it is hard to understand what the question writers want sometimes however I know plenty of below average students that passed comlex 2 comfortably by working hard.

playa220, i'm curious to know what your study habits were throughout 3rd year and before the exam.

 

[predodoc]

I took my test just over a week ago and I didnt think the test was really that bad(from both difficulty and quality perspective). Lots of easy q's mixed with questions that are worthy of a 3-4th year student. Yeah a few q's with 2 answers, bad pics or just random off the wall knowledge but only a small % were like that(5%). These were probably not counted in the score anyway. I am 99.9% sure I passed and didnt even study hard. I am also 99% sure I could have passed the test the day after comlex I. But that does not mean its a crappy test, just that I know enough knowledge to pass it. So stop bashing this test like ******s made it. Its not that bad.

 

[Old_Mil]

Old_Mil for a while have been advocating for taking USMLE and skipping COMLEX 3. He/She has yet to post a rational reason (or an advantage) to skipping COMLEX 3 (besides pure hatred of the beast).

The best reason to do this: after you get your passing score for 2CK, you can toss your OMM notes and be done with OMT, the AOA, and the NBOME forever. Like the Mastercard ads say, that's priceless.

First, certain states absolutely require DOs to have finished the COMLEX series for licensure and will not take USMLE. These are California, Florida, Oklahoma, Pennsylvania, Vermont, and West Virginia. Michigan and Tennessee will not accept USMLE for initial licensure but may accept USMLE if you have another unrestricted license in another state and applying for reciprocity.

Yep. Given the large amount of overlap between the states that do this and the states that require the rotating intership you're not really losing much more than if you blow off the rotating internship.

Your goal is to be able to have the ability to practice unrestricted in all 50 states.

Why? Sounds like a pretty pointless exercise to me, especially since most people have no intention of spending their career practicing in all 50. Personally, I'd rather be in a situation where I've hung the diplomate of the gold standard in medical licensure on my wall.

To be eligible to take USMLE Step 3, you need to pass USMLE 1 and 2 (CK and CS).

True. Which is why you should take them.

To avoid COMLEX 3 is your option - but make that choice knowing the ramification. COMLEX 3 is a one-day test. Unfortunately it is still poorly worded and similar in style and format to COMLEX 1 and 2.

Another reason not to waste time on it.

 

[group_theory]

Why? Sounds like a pretty pointless exercise to me, especially since most people have no intention of spending their career practicing in all 50. Personally, I'd rather be in a situation where I've hung the diplomate of the gold standard in medical licensure on my wall.
.

Silly me - and here I was planning on hanging my ABMS board certification up on the wall, not my NBME/NBOME certification (which I believe they no longer give out diplomas for)

My biggest concern is that you so vehemently advocate against taking COMLEX 3, and tell people that is an good alternative - yet you do not tell them the downside of skipping COMLEX 3. Even in this post, you give the impression that skipping COMLEX 3 is a viable option with no real consequences when that is clearly not the case. If you are going to advise people to skip COMLEX 3, then you should also warn them about the downside (now you may not feel it is a downside, but people who read your advice may want to practice in California, or Florida, or Pennsylvania, or Michigan or the other states that absolutely require COMLEX)

 

[marie337]

Yes, the exams are not very good. I think everyone agrees. But, apparently you did something wrong, and I think you need to take some responsibility for it. The vast majority of DO students pass these exams without any trouble. So, maybe instead of complaining about it, you should spend your time studying. I'm just saying....