Why lower Step 1 scores for USIMG's?

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Trader56

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I know this does NOT happen in all cases, and this is NOT an attempt to make disparaging remarks about IMG's! But, I've noticed that in a number of cases, USIMG's have lower scores on Step 1, or need more than one attempt to pass. Yes, this happens to U.S. med students, too. Now, with that disclaimer in place, I'd be interested in opinions on this.

I'm sure there can be many reasons that apply to individual circumstances, but what do you suppose the reasons are for lower scores and pass rates for USIMG's when compared to US medical students?

Here I'm considering U.S. born citizens who go to foreign schools, NOT FMG's from other countries.

Is it the quality of education?
Are there some student characteristics that help shape this?
What other factors may play into this?
What do you think could be done to raise scores?

Thanks for any input!

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Trader56 said:
I'm sure there can be many reasons that apply to individual circumstances, but what do you suppose the reasons are for lower scores and pass rates for USIMG's when compared to US medical students?

I'm guessing, but I would think that since admissions standards to those schools are sometimes not as rigorous as US allopathic schools, you will have people without the same skillsets (study skills and test taking ability, for examples) ultimately sitting for the boards, and scoring lower.
 
I haven't seen this data. USIMGs have a lower pass rate than US grads or regular IMGs, but does the USMLE have an average score that they report (for IMGs)? Most every IMG from my med school gets 95+, and I've always thought IMGs who pass tend to score much higher than US students (although the pass rate is lower). I would like to see average scores for first time test takers who pass. Anyway, I know that's a separate topic.

I guess it's the previous poster's point. US IMGs are mostly (not all) students who couldn't get into US med schools. Regular IMGs all competed just like US students did to get in (albeit in different systems). I don't think it's the quality of the education, because then wouldn't US IMGs and Non-US IMGs have the same scores? Of course, most US IMGs are coming from a set of schools in the Carribean.

The beauty of the USMLE is it allows all applicants to be rated against a uniform standard. Those US IMGs who didn't get into med school here, but score a 99, well, I would say they proved they could handle it. And in fact, I guess any IMG who passes has proven they can handle things.
 
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Hey Trader,

Trader56 said:
But, I've noticed that in a number of cases, USIMG's have lower scores on Step 1, or need more than one attempt to pass. Yes, this happens to U.S. med students, too. Now, with that disclaimer in place, I'd be interested in opinions on this.

My experience - and it is purely anecdotal so I have no way of backing it up - is that, for the majority of students in my class, the average 'range' of Step 1 scores was between 195-210. This is lower than the U.S. average. However, there are many other students who, just like in U.S. schools, will hit a homerun on Step 1 and score a 230+. I know of a few in my class that were 250+. Overall (and as was already mentioned), generally the first-time pass rate is what is significantly lower, not the actual scores. But, at the top schools, most of the students who are actually allowed to sit for the test (see further details below) will, on the whole, have comparable pass rates to U.S. students when coming from the "Big Three" Caribbean schools.

Trader56 said:
I'm sure there can be many reasons that apply to individual circumstances, but what do you suppose the reasons are for lower scores and pass rates for USIMG's when compared to US medical students?

...

Is it the quality of education?

No. The educational material is geared to the test, which is what is considered by the NBME to be the important "core curriculum" material that every medical student should know. Also, most schools offer the NBME "shelf" exams that make-up a portion of your overall grade in that course. This, again, represents the material that the NBME will expect you to know during Step 1.

Trader56 said:
Are there some student characteristics that help shape this?

Yes. Some students clearly get their shot by going the Caribbean route, when they probably shouldn't be there at all. Many of these students wash out before even getting to Step 1. Others managed to somehow jump through the hoops and climb over the obstacles provided by school and somehow make it to Step 1, which they can't get past.

Trader56 said:
What other factors may play into this?

Amount of quality study time, individual motivation and dedication, seriousness about the test and even about learning what it means to become a "doctor", maturity, stamina, among many others. Remember, we are dealing with a sub-cohort of students (not the majority) who end-up at a Caribbean program because many of them really didn't have the "stuff" to become a doctor in the first place, as they were pressured by their families to become physicians when it is the last thing in the world they want to do, want to be a doctor without being willing to pay the price, have false notions about what it takes to be a doctor, (etc., etc.). In sort of a passive destructive way, they go through the motions and either fail during their time at the island or can't get past Step 1.

Trader56 said:
What do you think could be done to raise scores?

I think the schools are doing a better job of screening candidates up front and only allowing admissions to those who truly have the drive and tenacity to make it. Med school is more about hard work than it is brain power, and even a truly brilliant kid will fail if he/she doesn't study. So, I think these schools have begun to recognize that, if they continue to admit students who haven't demonstrated a maturity or the requisite habits that reflect hard work, they will then have to lower the bar so as to not have such a ridiculously high attrition rates (a previous problem at Ross) which then allows a higher-than-previous-average number of weaklings to squeak through the program where they subsequently wash-out at Step 1 (etc.). Or, they are going to have to be more selective up front about who they choose to admit (something that SGU seems to have consistently done a better job of).

The best advertisement for these Carib schools is, not to sound too egotistical, the group of graduates that includes people like myself. We go to the island with a high level of focus on the end-game in mind: getting our degrees and getting into residency. Frankly, we tend to be a little more mature, dedicated, and have done our homework knowing that we have to plan for getting through the entire program playing the hand we've been dealt the most effectively. For me, I always focused on and organized myself in such a way that I was looking down the road to see what was coming next. As a result, I headed-off problems before they arose. I'm one of the ones who scored extremely well on both Steps 1 and 2-CK, passed Step 2-CS the first time taking, and landed a very good residency in a competitive field at a University-based program. I played the hand that I was dealt effectively and took my education seriously. A lot of those who don't either don't have the maturity/seriousness/organization/"stuff" to do this, or they really don't want to be there in the first place. The remaining few, and they are definitely the minority, just don't quite have the cerebral power to make it. As a result, all three groups have a lot of struggles and set-backs along the way... if they make it at all.

That is my experience.

-Skip
 
Thanks to everyone who contributed to this thread - you all ahd good observations, and were very helpful!

Skip, I've come to really look forward to your well thought out, complete replies!
 
So you're saying, if you take out those that aren't allowed to take the test, and you take out those who are allowed but fail (33% - http://www.usmle.org/scores/2004perf.htm), then the averages are equal? Seems a bit of a skewed way to compare scores doesnt it?

Also, since MCAT is proven to predict USMLE I (http://www.aamc.org/students/mcat/research/bibliography/blueg001.htm) don't you think it would be intuitive to assume IMG's score lower? I'm sure you and many other IMGs score very well, but I would think the IMG passers score lower on average.
 
deltamed said:
Also, since MCAT is proven to predict USMLE I (http://www.aamc.org/students/mcat/research/bibliography/blueg001.htm) don't you think it would be intuitive to assume IMG's score lower? I'm sure you and many other IMGs score very well, but I would think the IMG passers score lower on average.


What makes you think IMGs take the MCAT? I know this is a kind of US IMG-specific topic, but most IMGs never tried for med school in the US and never took the MCAT. Reminds me of when I applied for an elective at UTSW, they wanted my step I score. I told them, why would I have taken a US licensing exam if I am training in another country? Do US students have to take my country's licensing exams to do electives here??? Pissed me off at the time ....
 
retroviridae said:
What makes you think IMGs take the MCAT? I know this is a kind of US IMG-specific topic, but most IMGs never tried for med school in the US and never took the MCAT. Reminds me of when I applied for an elective at UTSW, they wanted my step I score. I told them, why would I have taken a US licensing exam if I am training in another country? Do US students have to take my country's licensing exams to do electives here??? Pissed me off at the time ....
I think deltamed was referring to USIMG's. I don't think anyone is criticizing you or your med school.
 
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