What's in the name?

[Juniper4]

From the interview trail...

Half way thru the gauntlet and I'm wondering about how to factor in name/program reputation into the rank list. I've been to my share of the top 5 and top 10 programs and I've also been to some of the "mid-tier". It's pretty striking how flawed a couple of the best places have been (especially after reading years of outstanding reviews on this forum for some places) and conversely how impressive a couple of the mid tier places seem. It's taken me a while to let go of my ego and realize that maybe going to the place with the best name isn't the right decision. That said I'm very interested in academics after residency and I'm wondering if any attendings or Pgy5's speak to the importance of program reputation/name with regards to securing an academic job?

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[Gfunk6]

This has been discussed endlessly on this forum. The general consensus is that the 'prestige' of a program is a secondary factor in importance. For academic jobs, at the end of the day, you will be highly favored if you have multiple publications or perhaps a grant. However, all things being equal 'prestige' may tip things in your favor. Also, 'prestige' means 'well-connected faculty' who can also help you.

 

[ohioapplicant]

Prestige also helps for private practice, right?

 

[medgator]

Prestige also helps for private practice, right?

Depends on the practice and location

 

[SJSM001]

I've been trying to ask where graduating seniors are going/ have gone the past few years. If they haven't sent anyone into academics it seems less likely to me that I will be able to do so. Don't know how true that is, but it's one suggestion, I've also been asking if possible about numbers of publications/ presentations by residents.

 

[Neuronix]

I've been trying to ask where graduating seniors are going/ have gone the past few years. If they haven't sent anyone into academics it seems less likely to me that I will be able to do so. Don't know how true that is, but it's one suggestion, I've also been asking if possible about numbers of publications/ presentations by residents.

In my opinion, it's more important to ask about time and resources for research. If you are serious about research, you want a Holman. Otherwise, it's about protected time for research. Do you have time to work on research on rotations or are you too busy clinically? How many protected months do you get for research/electives? Are there a lot of resources at the institution that help generate publications for residents (more output per time invested), or are you almost on your own to do research?

As for graduates: there are a lot of lousy academic jobs out there that use you to generate RVUs and give you little to no protected time and resources. Or also the barely academic jobs like working at an academic satellite with virtually no research going on at your facility. So it's really a false idea to think of all "academics" as the same. Just because someone graduated and went into academics does not mean it was actually their choice. A lot of graduates have a location in mind, and they pick based on what's available in their location. So that does not mean that their job is a quality academic position. Likewise, there is a broad spectrum of job quality and requirements within private practice. Remember, some of the biggest enrollers into clinical trials these days are private practices. This is not a cut and dry issue.

The bigger question is whether graduates are getting the jobs they actually want. A lot of that is out of our control, but things like connections and residency productivity help. The big name programs might help you with connections, but then again you have to be wary that the big name academic faculty might have strong opinions of their own about what you should be doing... i.e. If you told them you want academics when you interviewed and then decide to go into private practice, you might be stuck in academics (and possibly not a good one at that) because you can't get recommendations for private practice positions.

 

[SJSM001]

In my opinion, it's more important to ask about time and resources for research. If you are serious about research, you want a Holman. Otherwise, it's about protected time for research. Do you have time to work on research on rotations or are you too busy clinically? How many protected months do you get for research/electives? Are there a lot of resources at the institution that help generate publications for residents (more output per time invested), or are you almost on your own to do research?

As for graduates: there are a lot of lousy academic jobs out there that use you to generate RVUs and give you little to no protected time and resources. Or also the barely academic jobs like working at an academic satellite with virtually no research going on at your facility. So it's really a false idea to think of all "academics" as the same. Just because someone graduated and went into academics does not mean it was actually their choice. A lot of graduates have a location in mind, and they pick based on what's available in their location. So that does not mean that their job is a quality academic position. Likewise, there is a broad spectrum of job quality and requirements within private practice. Remember, some of the biggest enrollers into clinical trials these days are private practices. This is not a cut and dry issue.

The bigger question is whether graduates are getting the jobs they actually want. A lot of that is out of our control, but things like connections and residency productivity help. The big name programs might help you with connections, but then again you have to be wary that the big name academic faculty might have strong opinions of their own about what you should be doing... i.e. If you told them you want academics when you interviewed and then decide to go into private practice, you might be stuck in academics (and possibly not a good one at that) because you can't get recommendations for private practice positions.

This was a very helpful post, Neuronix. Thanks a lot.