vacation with 7on 7 off

[Ron Swanson]

Hi all,

I had a question regarding benefits for 7 on 7 off. I have interviewed at a position and they noted that they do not offer any PTO for this schedule due to having a week off during your off week. They seem hard to fill with psychiatrist but are unwilling to negotiate on this. Is this common?? if you stay for the entire shift 7/7 you actually work more hours vs normal mon-friday 40 hour work week

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[Merovinge]

Most hospitalists I know (which is a shockingly high number for reasons unclear to me) do get some vacation but it tends to be less than M-F jobs. Often around 2ish weeks and then 1 week of CME with the rest of your time off scheduled around your shifts. Offering 0 days PTO is clearly an attempt to hold 1 job with 2 docs and zero redundancy (aka sickness, child leave) if there is zero negotiation. I assure you the admin who created that job gets PTO.

 

[comp1]

Omph. Hospital jobs HAVE to have significant redundancy in them. This is part of why hospitals are so expensive. Always hire for at least 120% of your apparent clinical needs to account for sick time, vacation and turnover. If people aren't sitting around doing nothing at least part of the time, the system is going to fail in the long term. Avoid this job. There are so many inpatient options out there.

 

[Bartelby]

If people aren't sitting around doing nothing at least part of the time, the system is going to fail in the long term.

I really wish more people understood and accepted this! So true. Squeezing every ounce of productivity out of workers short term leads to massive systemic problems long term as people burn out and drop out.

 

[GHPA]

Sadly, most hospital systems are run by MBA and DNP (that wanted to be called doctor). MD is only needed for the license and DEA.

 

[deleted1100659]

Lol, you get a week every other week and thats your vacation? Typically you work around 80 hours in those 7 days which is equivalent to two regular work weeks, its not like you're getting paid to work 40 hours for 7 days and then you just chill for 7 days? That is some monumentally stupid reasoning on their part. Ive seen inpatient hospitalist jobs offer PTO. PTO is an earned benefit.

With their logic, I feel like bathroom breaks may turn into an earned benefit at that facility. run away

 

[kelminak]

Hi all,

I had a question regarding benefits for 7 on 7 off. I have interviewed at a position and they noted that they do not offer any PTO for this schedule due to having a week off during your off week. They seem hard to fill with psychiatrist but are unwilling to negotiate on this. Is this common?? if you stay for the entire shift 7/7 you actually work more hours vs normal mon-friday 40 hour work week

I literally know next to nothing about contracts and that doesn't make any sense at all. How would they justify you working the equivalent or more of someone working a standard work week but not giving you any PTO?

 

[Merovinge]

I literally know next to nothing about contracts and that doesn't make any sense at all. How would they justify you working the equivalent or more of someone working a standard work week but not giving you any PTO?

Less money to doctor = more money to admin. This is unfortunately a zero sum game in many instances. They might not keep 100% of the reduced compensation they give each doctor but certainly a percentage of it trickles it's way back to the c-suite.

 

[Splenda88]

IM hospitalist here:

I work the 7 on/off (7am-6pm) schedule and have no PTO, but my job is very flexible in giving days off if you ask in advance. I am taking a week off in July (in essence it will be 3 wks off in a row) and will travel. I will work a few extra days (3-4 days) in June by choice to make up for the week off.

I kind of like the 7 on/off schedule so far.

 

[kelminak]

A lot of Hospitals and Admins will try to throw as much junk in your contract as possible and see what sticks. Many doctors will sign pretty much anything that gets put in front of them after an attorneys give them their "stamp of approval...." Be very careful about what you sign.

It can be hard to negotiate with the larger hospital systems on things like PTO etc. because if they give you additional PTO, then other employees have an argument to gain the same benefit. That said, their could be other items in the contract that you could negotiate without placing a larger spotlight on a broad benefit issue like PTO. Though, really is case dependent. Good luck!

Makes sense. I'm just a newly matched psych resident, but when that time rolls around I'm definitely going to get a contract lawyer to look things over for me because it seems too complicated.

 

[Dr. ADT]

Hi all,

I had a question regarding benefits for 7 on 7 off. I have interviewed at a position and they noted that they do not offer any PTO for this schedule due to having a week off during your off week. They seem hard to fill with psychiatrist but are unwilling to negotiate on this. Is this common?? if you stay for the entire shift 7/7 you actually work more hours vs normal mon-friday 40 hour work week

Do you have to stay the whole shift? Or can you round and leave?

 

[nexus73]

Resurecting oldish thread to ask what kind of expectations psychiatrists on 7 on 7 off have about working a set number of hours per day. Like 7a-7p, or 8-6p? Are there expectations to stay and do admits up until the end of shift or do patients arriving later in the day get orders and home meds continued and seen by psych next AM? If you finish at 4pm are you waiting around unitl 7pm just in case an admit shows up?

 

[MedMan80]

Resurecting oldish thread to ask what kind of expectations psychiatrists on 7 on 7 off have about working a set number of hours per day. Like 7a-7p, or 8-6p? Are there expectations to stay and do admits up until the end of shift or do patients arriving later in the day get orders and home meds continued and seen by psych next AM? If you finish at 4pm are you waiting around unitl 7pm just in case an admit shows up?

I would say depends on the place. My place has a locums 7 on 7 off for inpatient and probably can get away by coming in at 9 and leaving by 5 everyday and probably less on weekends.

 

[SmallBird]

Resurecting oldish thread to ask what kind of expectations psychiatrists on 7 on 7 off have about working a set number of hours per day. Like 7a-7p, or 8-6p? Are there expectations to stay and do admits up until the end of shift or do patients arriving later in the day get orders and home meds continued and seen by psych next AM? If you finish at 4pm are you waiting around unitl 7pm just in case an admit shows up

At my system, none. I work 7 on 7 off and I have to get my work done with high quality but not stay a set number of hours. I really like 7 on 7 off because I'm paid as if its a full time job but it is only 70% as much work (ps don't tell anyone).

 

[Sushirolls]

State dependent, but there are labor laws. Pretty sure if you are a W2 employee, you have entitled to benefits like PTO, some states even paid FMLA, sick days, etc.

Again, state dependent. So if you aren't getting those benefits, its lawsuit waiting to happen and they'll be reamed with back wages etc for those benefits they failed to provide.

Only way I could possibly see around this is if they had a 1099 contract and said cover for these weeks in the ensuing year. Be onsite or readily able to be onsite between these hours. Staying true to the flexibility of what 1099 is - or that's also its own lawsuit to hire/pay people as 1099 when they are W2 in actual performance.

 

[nexus73]

At my system, none. I work 7 on 7 off and I have to get my work done with high quality but not stay a set number of hours. I really like 7 on 7 off because I'm paid as if its a full time job but it is only 70% as much work (ps don't tell anyone).

are you employed?

 

[SmallBird]

are you employed?

Yes

 

[dl2dp2]

Hi all,

I had a question regarding benefits for 7 on 7 off. I have interviewed at a position and they noted that they do not offer any PTO for this schedule due to having a week off during your off week. They seem hard to fill with psychiatrist but are unwilling to negotiate on this. Is this common?? if you stay for the entire shift 7/7 you actually work more hours vs normal mon-friday 40 hour work week

Can you explain exactly what this job looks like (i.e. what type of facility, patient population, how does a "shift" work, etc?) I'm curious as well for my own sake but this helps us in further advising you, I think.

 

[MedMan80]

Yes

Give me your gig mon'