US Student Hoping to Study in Ireland?

[kojii]

I'm a high school student in Hawaii- wanting very much so to pursue a medical degree as well as practice outside of the US.

How feasible is it to transition directly from US high school to a 5-6 year Irish medical program? What do most Americans tend to do? What's daunting to me is the idea of diving straight into a MBBS program considering that in the US I would normally spend four years as an undergraduate before even applying to med school. What is the extent of preparation (as far as fundamentals) of Irish high school students entering the programs compared to that of Americans?

It's my understanding that due to differences in our education systems- students in Ireland entering medical schools have already studied higher level courses (A levels? Or is that just in UK?) that an American student would learn in pre-med undergraduate school. Would I be better off getting a bachelor's degree in the states before going to Ireland because of this?


just trying to piece it all together to figure out if a transition from my small island to a considerably larger one is possible for me ~

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[Medstart108]

I'm a high school student in Hawaii- wanting very much so to pursue a medical degree as well as practice outside of the US.

How feasible is it to transition directly from US high school to a 5-6 year Irish medical program? What do most Americans tend to do? What's daunting to me is the idea of diving straight into a MBBS program considering that in the US I would normally spend four years as an undergraduate before even applying to med school. What is the extent of preparation (as far as fundamentals) of Irish high school students entering the programs compared to that of Americans?

It's my understanding that due to differences in our education systems- students in Ireland entering medical schools have already studied higher level courses (A levels? Or is that just in UK?) that an American student would learn in pre-med undergraduate school. Would I be better off getting a bachelor's degree in the states before going to Ireland because of this?


just trying to piece it all together to figure out if a transition from my small island to a considerably larger one is possible for me ~

You can definitely go straight to medical school. I wouldn't recommend doing a bachelor's and spending 4 years of your life on a degree that quite practically is useless in order to go to Ireland. I would recommend it though if you aren't 100% sure and know all the facts and consequences of your decision (since it will allow you to apply to US medical schools).

Look through the Atlantic bridge website, there are 3 medical schools that accept high schoolers and possibly 4 (but only if you are IB or AP). UCD, NUIG, RCSI and TCD (possibly).

The first 3 offer 6 year programs, so you don't need to worry about falling behind. I did high school in Canada, normal not even IB or AP and i'm doing fine in the UK.

The key is are you sure you want to practice outside the US? Going to Ireland makes it difficult to ever come back and if you want to u need to do residency even if you are 40+ years old. Not to mention its not easy to even practice in Ireland if you aren't an EU citizen. Lastly, you are from Hawaii, that would be long flights back home are you sure you want this?

 

[JohnSnow]

I'm a high school student in Hawaii- wanting very much so to pursue a medical degree as well as practice outside of the US.

How feasible is it to transition directly from US high school to a 5-6 year Irish medical program? What do most Americans tend to do? What's daunting to me is the idea of diving straight into a MBBS program considering that in the US I would normally spend four years as an undergraduate before even applying to med school. What is the extent of preparation (as far as fundamentals) of Irish high school students entering the programs compared to that of Americans?

It's my understanding that due to differences in our education systems- students in Ireland entering medical schools have already studied higher level courses (A levels? Or is that just in UK?) that an American student would learn in pre-med undergraduate school. Would I be better off getting a bachelor's degree in the states before going to Ireland because of this?


just trying to piece it all together to figure out if a transition from my small island to a considerably larger one is possible for me ~

Being from Hawaii, from a geographical perspective, I just want to point out that there are Australian and New Zealand medical schools that also offer direct entry from high school and are considerably closer to your Hawaii home.

AP courses are usually viewed as the equivalent, or A Levels, Highers (or whatever name you want to give them). If you've taken AP Biology & AP Chemistry + another AP course and have scored 5s in them you are pretty well set. You'll also be helped by having a transcript littered with As, and not many Bs & Cs.

Definitely check out Atlantic Bridge's website, as a previous poster mentioned, and feel free to email their staff. If you haven't taken AP courses the schools may evaluate you strictly on your high school grades. The UK schools have, from what I can tell, more defined entry requirements (i.e. AP or IB) I think the Irish schools are a bit more open-minded about what they're willing to look at.

 

[kojii]

Thank you very much for your replies! I'm sorry, I know this topic has probably been beaten to death in these forums.

I appreciate your consideration regarding my geographical situation. The fact is I'm actually trying to wander far away from home. I understand that (correct me if I'm wrong) it would be difficult to return to the states and be accepted into American residencies/fellowships. If things work out the way I hope, I'll remain in Europe to practice. I will definitely check out some schools in New Zealand and Australia though. Thanks for that, it'd never occurred to me. (Game of Thrones fan by chance?)

 

[kojii]

I feel tentative because I've found many threads with posts strongly against jumping straight from high school, as well as many US students that have already earned a bachelor's degree in the states and are only now considering the 5-6 year programs. That your transition went well for you however gives me some comfort.

My main worry is that I'll be way over my head in a program with people who've graduated from the (likely superior) European style education system as well foreign grad students already with bachelor's degrees. Are pre-med courses like organic chemistry a part of the 6 years or are you expected to show up having mastered the foundation sciences? Hypothetically could I show up on the first day with the most basic knowledge of chem./physics/bio. and survive the program? I guess what I'm asking is from what level does the program start and do the 6 years cover the equivalent of a pre-med track at a US University?

Of course I will direct these questions to the bridge program and prospective universities - just wanted to hear from other students who made the leap.
I just don't want to make an overambitious decision and arrive only to find out I'm the stupid, unprepared, over-her-head, 18 year old American in the classroom.

 

[kojii]

Also considering spending 1-2 years at a US University- take physics, chemistry, biology, organic chemistry - then maybe doing a year abroad at UCD before entering the 6 year program. Good idea? Bad?

 

[Medstart108]

Also considering spending 1-2 years at a US University- take physics, chemistry, biology, organic chemistry - then maybe doing a year abroad at UCD before entering the 6 year program. Good idea? Bad?

Definitely no. Trust me on this, you won't feel left behind when you go to Europe. First, if you go to Ireland on their 6 year program, the first year is basic sciences like Phys, Orgo, Bio etc. I took normal high school in Canada, nothing special and i didn't feel the UK students knew more than i did (If they did, the teachers will cover it over again for sure).

Basically my point is if you do a few years at a US university and then go to Ireland, those few years may be wasted. Doing a few years at Uni will allow you to enter the 5 year program though which will cut down on a year. If you want more time to make a decision, then stay in the US.

Maybe you can consider applying to the UK. Its more a hassle and harder to get in due to quotas, but the UK degree will at least allow you to stay in the UK (you just will have trouble getting competitive specialties).

 

[JohnSnow]

Also considering spending 1-2 years at a US University- take physics, chemistry, biology, organic chemistry - then maybe doing a year abroad at UCD before entering the 6 year program. Good idea? Bad?

The 5-6 year undergraduate entry programs more than adequately prepare you to be a doctor. The relevant components of general chemistry, organic chemistry, and physics are part of the curriculum. And they're even part of the graduate curriculum to a degree.

The more science you know coming in the better your foundation will be but they're not expecting you to be an organic chemist day 1.

European curriculums are not necessarily superior to US education. If you've taken AP courses in America and done well, I'd say you're on a similar footing compared to UK/Irish students.

I wouldn't recommend spending 2 years doing a premed curriculum in the US first. Always be working towards a degree otherwise you're just throwing away money. I would recommend a 6 year foreign med school over 2 years in the US + 5-6 years overseas. If you think you can get into med school now go for it. 2 years from now you may not have the grades.

Regarding a return to US, it is very possible. Most people who study abroad return. Just work hard in med school, do well on your boards (the USMLEs) and you will have a spot in America. It is very difficult to stay in Europe or Australia after graduation unless you have citizenship or permanent residency in an EU country or Australia/NZ. Which you will have a difficult time getting as a student unless you marry one.

The last point I'll make is that medicine is very demanding. You have to be mature and commited to working hard all year. I definitely wasn't ready for that kind of commitment at 18, but if you feel that you are by all means go for it! And good luck!

 

[kojii]

Talking to you both has helped lessen the uncertainty and worry that's built up around this. I've found something I'm genuinely excited about and interested in, so I'm determined to cling onto it.

Thank you, thank you, thank you. I can't say it enough!