Unhappy With Placement for Rotations

[deleted1129750]

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[Osminog]

I'm sure plenty of other students in your class got locations they didn't want. It would undermine the fairness of the lottery system if the administrators were to change some students' placements and not others. It's just one year. Try to make the best of the situation.

 

[AlteredScale]

My school runs on a lottery system and I did not get the location I wanted. Anyone else not happy with their rotation placement for 3rd year and have you tried to contest it? I've talked to multiple faculty at my school and they say that nothing can be done at this point.

It’s a huge downfall of DO schools. Essentially you pay 1.5-2x as much for the chance to spend your entire third year in a tiny town with little to no experience with residents or managing more complex pathology, and you have no choice but to follow directions. And the schools helps in no way with housing or moving. It’s a huge issue that needs to be fixed.

 

[Cranjis McBasketball]

My school runs on a lottery system and I did not get the location I wanted. Anyone else not happy with their rotation placement for 3rd year and have you tried to contest it? I've talked to multiple faculty at my school and they say that nothing can be done at this point.

Its the major risk with DO schools. My school does the same. Half the class gets these 2 great spots. The other half are scattered into like 8 other locations that are apparently terrible.

 

[Surgeon D.O.]

Welcome to the rodeo cowboy, you're not alone.

In the end, you'll be fine. This too shall pass.

Schedule as many electives / auditions / Sub-I's in an area you wish to be, once you can.

Keep an open mind and make the most of it.

 

[sylvanthus]

My school runs on a lottery system and I did not get the location I wanted. Anyone else not happy with their rotation placement for 3rd year and have you tried to contest it? I've talked to multiple faculty at my school and they say that nothing can be done at this point.

Itll be fine, I got placed in a small town for 3rd and 4th year that was a bad enough primary rotation site that the school later closed it down. Just do as many away/sub I/audition rotations as is feasible. In the end it wont make a difference down the road.

I was piiissssseeeddd at the time though, so I feel ya.

 

[djiboutiman]

Something you might be able to do is trade with one of your classmates if the school allows it. Other than that, I’ve never heard of someone successfully contesting rotation lottery results. At my school we had people with spouses and kids that had to move out of state for the year to do their rotations. It sucks, but all you can do is make the most of it.

 

[FutureInternist]

Maybe a class wide board post or email that asks for swaps?

 

[Ho0v-man]

Try to keep an open mind. It might be a good experience. Worst case scenario is one more away rotation in your desired specialty to get up to speed. For example, my psych rotation kinda sucked. But if I wanted to do psych, I’d just do two aways instead of one and try to get a LOR from the second. Since I didn’t do psych, it just didn’t matter at all.

If you just don’t like the location because it’s too rural; well the silver lining here is that a poor student can save up for an awesome 4th year in a place like that.

 

[BlueBleck]

I have no idea how it will play out for another few months, when I can compare myself to my fellow interns.

I had the same question. I had pretty bad rotation sites. Out of 10 core rotations, 2 had residents. 1 was canceled due to covid. I made the most of each rotation, but compared to what the med students at my residency learn and do, my sites were awful. Some of my sites were more hands on, but the acuity and educational differences (eg no morning report/lunch lecture) were huge.

A mentor told me that I could learn anywhere and that med student rotations were more for choosing a specialty than gaining any level of proficiency. I was skeptical at the time, but in retrospect, I agree.

I'm a bit neurotic about carrying my weight and progressing to safe/independent practice and so I ask for feedback often. Reportedly since July, I've performed roughly on par with the majority of my co-interns (mostly MD). Going to a great school may give you a head start, but it's really just that compared to the distance that you're required to go, even only as an intern.

 

[KirksvilleKrunk]

Try to find a classmate to swap with. The faculty said nothing could be done because they want to ignore it, since more work on their end. If you come up to them with a possible solution it's more likely to work. If they say you can't switch with X student, ask them "why not". If there's not a clear direct answer to this, then go up to a higher person.

Half of my class is spread to multiple states for our rotations 3rd year, I would definitely call that "screwed". One of the biggest, probably the biggest con of DO schools is garbage 3rd year. Also, most of our sites have NO RESIDENTS. That's seriously messed up and another DO con.

 

[hallowmann]

Itll be fine, I got placed in a small town for 3rd and 4th year that was a bad enough primary rotation site that the school later closed it down. Just do as many away/sub I/audition rotations as is feasible. In the end it wont make a difference down the road.

I was piiissssseeeddd at the time though, so I feel ya.

Haha, this takes me back a bit, I definitely remember a very angry sylvanthus describing the joys of midlevel preceptors on med school rotations.

OP, I was very nervous about my rotation site, so I went out of my way to make connections with training programs and do electives at big residency sites. In the end I actually got quite a well balanced training and having the two systems to compare to was actually quite nice to recognize the pros and cons of both. It was stressful at the time, but in retrospect if worked out nicely and helped me better identify what I wanted while still having backup options/connections. Don't worry about it, just work hard to learn as much as you can and do electives at bigger training programs.

 

[sylvanthus]

Haha, this takes me back a bit, I definitely remember a very angry sylvanthus describing the joys of midlevel preceptors on med school rotations.

OP, I was very nervous about my rotation site, so I went out of my way to make connections with training programs and do electives at big residency sites. In the end I actually got quite a well balanced training and having the two systems to compare to was actually quite nice to recognize the pros and cons of both. It was stressful at the time, but in retrospect if worked out nicely and helped me better identify what I wanted while still having backup options/connections. Don't worry about it, just work hard to learn as much as you can and do electives at bigger training programs.

Ooooh I was pissed, it wasnt even a midlevel though, a freakin RN. Wonder why the core site got shutdown? Shocker shocker, what a waste of tjme that was. Ahh well whatevs, triple boarded now, making >400k working <12 shifts a month, so they can kiss my white arse.

 

[hallowmann]

Ooooh I was pissed, it wasnt even a midlevel though, a freakin RN. Wonder why the core site got shutdown? Shocker shocker, what a waste of tjme that was. Ahh well whatevs, triple boarded now, making >400k working <12 shifts a month, so they can kiss my white arse.

Oh man, that's right, worse than I remembered. I just know being in DO school at the time, knowing how worried and angry you were leading up to it, and then hearing how you felt after you matched made me relieved honestly.

More power to you. Reach that FI, then RE or do whatever you want, that's my goal right now.

 

[NotAProgDirector]

"Attending graduation is required, and oh btw, you have to fundraise for your own graduation because we’re not paying for it. Oh, also, you’re required to fundraise to buy us a gift from your class.” What a joke.

Wait, wut? And the class has to buy the school a gift?

 

[Rogue42]

My school runs on a lottery system and I did not get the location I wanted. Anyone else not happy with their rotation placement for 3rd year and have you tried to contest it? I've talked to multiple faculty at my school and they say that nothing can be done at this point.

Agree with everyone above.

I think I have a pretty good idea of the school that you attend, and I can promise you that where you end up for third and fourth year has very little impact on what happens to you in residency, especially for DO schools.

You are definitely more that allowed to try and swap with a classmate, but if you cannot, I promise, it will all work itself out in the end.

 

[ortnakas]

Haha, this takes me back a bit, I definitely remember a very angry sylvanthus describing the joys of midlevel preceptors on med school rotations.

Oh man, I feel old remembering this now, too.
@sylvanthus I’m glad you’re thriving despite your infamous nurse rotation.

 

[ADSigMel]

The lottery for one school where I was accepted placed me in a city over an hour away from my spouse and children. I chose to go to a different school for that reason. If I hadn't had a family, it would have been a different story, but I wasn't going to spend a year away from my family on top of paying to run two separate households.

 

[deleted1129181]

I really hate that you have to go through this OP, I really do. It’s an unfortunate reality at many schools. However - just as with everything in life, you just gotta find a way to make the best of it. What’s done is done, and there’s no way save for quitting medicine altogether. But making the conscious choice to have a positive outlook will make this whole situation a lot better.

 

[FutureDoctor5000]

Happened to me, but it’s been a decent experience. I’ve gotten lots of hands-on time and responsibility for patients. That being said, I have no idea how it will play out for another few months, when I can compare myself to my fellow interns.

DO schools are a racket though. They will squeeze you for every drop they can then tell you that you have no say in how they operate. “Attending graduation is required, and oh btw, you have to fundraise for your own graduation because we’re not paying for it. Oh, also, you’re required to fundraise to buy us a gift from your class.” What a joke.

Your school doesn't pay to have its own graduation ceremony? Lol wut.. your class had to pay for it??

 

[calivianya]

The lottery for one school where I was accepted placed me in a city over an hour away from my spouse and children. I chose to go to a different school for that reason. If I hadn't had a family, it would have been a different story, but I wasn't going to spend a year away from my family on top of paying to run two separate households.

Wait - you found out early enough to make a matriculation decision on it? Or you transferred schools between second and third year when you found out?

That first option is awesome. I would have picked a different acceptance if I had known where I was going to go during third year before I started.

 

[Ho0v-man]

Yup. And it’s a requirement to have a graduation ceremony. Damn scam.

Y’all should buy them a pen or something.

Also, name and shame for that alone.

 

[Mad Jack]

My school runs on a lottery system and I did not get the location I wanted. Anyone else not happy with their rotation placement for 3rd year and have you tried to contest it? I've talked to multiple faculty at my school and they say that nothing can be done at this point.

Try and see if there are any classmates that could trade with you. That's about your only option. If you're not thrilled with 3rd year rotation placements, you're gonna love the Match. Consider this preparation for that ordeal.

 

[Mad Jack]

Yup. And it’s a requirement to have a graduation ceremony. Damn scam.

That should be reported to the COCA. And no one from your school should ever give them a dime.

 

[Cranjis McBasketball]

Yup. And it’s a requirement to have a graduation ceremony. Damn scam.

Yeahhhh that doesnt seem like the norm even for DO schools haha

 

[NotAProgDirector]

Yup. They’ve de-facto made it a requirement and have the brown nosers in student government that will push for it no matter what.

But how can they make you pay for it? It's not tuition. This is crazy. Seems like a well placed newspaper article, or lawsuit, would fix this.

 

[Steve_Zissou]

But how can they make you pay for it? It's not tuition. This is crazy. Seems like a well placed newspaper article, or lawsuit, would fix this.

I’m not trying to cause a big stink before match/graduation lol

 

[ortnakas]

I remember being rather peeved about the “graduation fee” at my school, but at least it was rolled into our cost of attendance so it wasn’t a cash hit as a broke MS4. Even my alma mater didn’t have the cajones to demand a gift.
(But please don’t name and shame. if they’re petty enough for this, they’re petty enough to dox you, and nobody wants that)

 

[Chibucks15]

My friend got the “not optimal” setup at my med school. I got a residency based one. He is now extremely highly regarded in our residency (matched same place, different specialties) attached to an MD school. We’re literally in exactly the same place in regards to success in residency. Yes it’s a downside, but it’ll end up okay. Use a couple months of 4th year to shore up anything you feel you’re lacking. It’s a crappy part of DO life but it passes

 

[Neopolymath]

It's annoying for obvious reasons and is used as a totally BS reason to denigrate DO students on the application trail (feel this way more and more, overall). I had a healthy mix of both styles of rotations. I'm at a competitive TY with coresidents with straight up juggernaut CVs from top schools. It sucks from a reputation standpoint on the trail but it is absolutely not a problem for great students who will go on to become great residents clinically speaking. I was shocked at how much more prepared I was for residency than many of the interns in the other programs at my institution as well as the TYs. I was a bit intimidated leading up to July after seeing who these people were.

DO schools are hot garbage on principles and ethics alone and probably shouldn't exist as they do today but don't let it stop you from getting where you need to go. I don't care if someone went to Stanford if they only carried 2 or 3 patients on their sub-i. They are going to be the same or worse on wards. Go do at least a few rotations you won't be coddled on like a child even if it means being random PP attendings' dancing monkey for a few months. Carry 6-8 patients. Do all the notes. Do billing. Call the families. Do the procedures. Carry the pager. If you are a decent student then your medical knowledge will be fine and will continue to grow. You just won't have the 6 months of hell adjusting to doing actual work during residency that you hear about.

Try to turn this into a positive somehow. But also sorry. DO schools suck.

 

[FutureDoctor5000]

Your rotation site in third year has very very little bearing or impact on how you will be come July 1st of intern year or where you will match. I know my school requires every student to rotate at a residency program and with residents third year, so you should get some traditional wards based experience(if this isn't happening go straight to coca lol), ideally you should aim for as many of those experiences in third year as possible especially in your field of choice to help you prepare for sub-I and audtions. Overall tho, I have done rotations at MD academic centers and I can comfortably say that a few hours of lecture a week(for didactics) was the only true thing I found different from my core rotations with preceptors and the ones in a more formally structured system with residents. Some rotations were like shadowing but I did do a whole lot of "shadowing" on my academic rotations as well. It's a really small thing that makes no impact in the long run. As long as your reading and learning something and getting the most out of your third year to prepare you for 4th year you will be fine. If you feel unprepared just do a few extra electives and sub-I's in your field. 3rd year rotations are really to figure out what you like and don't like rather than to gain any proficiency. 1 month of wards at even a community hospital will prepare you for your audtions and Sub-I's at an academic place IMO... it's all the same stuff anyways (go to morning report, pre-round, table round, present on rounds, go to afternoon didactics, do the notes if they let you and do admissions etc...). I know it sucks when you feel like you got the short end of the stick but it really won't matter.

 

[deleted1129750]

Thanks for the all the replies guys. I will accept my fate at this point and go in with a positive attitude as trades are not permitted.

 

[SurgDoc95]

Thanks for the all the replies guys. I will accept my fate at this point and go in with a positive attitude as trades are not permitted.

I appealed my rotation site location and got it switched. At least an avenue to pursue if possible!

 

[Goro]

I’m not trying to cause a big stink before match/graduation lol

What penal colony do you go to?????????

 

[MedDoc305]

What penal colony do you go to?????????

I have a feeling more schools than not have a graduation fee attached to the tuition statement. Mine does

 

[Redpancreas]

It's annoying for obvious reasons and is used as a totally BS reason to denigrate DO students on the application trail (feel this way more and more, overall). I had a healthy mix of both styles of rotations. I'm at a competitive TY with coresidents with straight up juggernaut CVs from top schools. It sucks from a reputation standpoint on the trail but it is absolutely not a problem for great students who will go on to become great residents clinically speaking. I was shocked at how much more prepared I was for residency than many of the interns in the other programs at my institution as well as the TYs. I was a bit intimidated leading up to July after seeing who these people were.

DO schools are hot garbage on principles and ethics alone and probably shouldn't exist as they do today but don't let it stop you from getting where you need to go. I don't care if someone went to Stanford if they only carried 2 or 3 patients on their sub-i. They are going to be the same or worse on wards. Go do at least a few rotations you won't be coddled on like a child even if it means being random PP attendings' dancing monkey for a few months. Carry 6-8 patients. Do all the notes. Do billing. Call the families. Do the procedures. Carry the pager. If you are a decent student then your medical knowledge will be fine and will continue to grow. You just won't have the 6 months of hell adjusting to doing actual work during residency that you hear about.

Try to turn this into a positive somehow. But also sorry. DO schools suck.

This rings very true. Make use of the 4th year time especially as a DO. Ask to do everything.

GI bleeds, Heart Failures, Lap Choles, Hernia Repairs, Vaginal Bleeds, Strokes present the same and are managed the same everywhere. While your preceptors may not be as decorated with a FXYZ after their MD/DO, they're certainly competent physicians (barring NP, RN preceptor shenanigans as above). Now is the time to dig deep and learn how to manage the common stuff really well and do the job of a physician including all the stuff bolded. Once you master the basics and become a senior in your field or fellow, you can start focusing again on the nuances of things. There was an IMG who rotated with us at our main flagship hospital from a satellite campus and his practice knowledge outstripped everyone else's. Become a connoisseur of the common. Sometimes, academic hospitals suffer from that aspect. To make it worse, medical schools (at least since I graduated) seemed hellbent on ramming pathophysiology down your throat in M2 and testing stuff rarely seen anymore in clinical practice in M3. I had an attending in medical school who made medical students present on his pet topic no one had heard about and I have still not encountered after significant residency experience. Instead, that talk could have been replaced with basic, practical stuff like how to read a damn X-ray (which is not that difficult, but requires some practice).

 

[Lawpy]

Is there a deep, systemic problem going on in the DO world that AOA/COCA clearly know about but don’t care since they’re invested in opening as many DO schools as possible?

Because the issues raised in this thread are alarming

 

[KirksvilleKrunk]

Is there a deep, systemic problem going on in the DO world that AOA/COCA clearly know about but don’t care since they’re invested in opening as many DO schools as possible?

Because the issues raised in this thread are alarming

I'm in the middle of 3rd year rotations, and no one in my class has interacted with a resident yet lol.

 

[Surgeon D.O.]

It's annoying for obvious reasons and is used as a totally BS reason to denigrate DO students on the application trail (feel this way more and more, overall). I had a healthy mix of both styles of rotations. I'm at a competitive TY with coresidents with straight up juggernaut CVs from top schools. It sucks from a reputation standpoint on the trail but it is absolutely not a problem for great students who will go on to become great residents clinically speaking. I was shocked at how much more prepared I was for residency than many of the interns in the other programs at my institution as well as the TYs. I was a bit intimidated leading up to July after seeing who these people were.

DO schools are hot garbage on principles and ethics alone and probably shouldn't exist as they do today but don't let it stop you from getting where you need to go. I don't care if someone went to Stanford if they only carried 2 or 3 patients on their sub-i. They are going to be the same or worse on wards. Go do at least a few rotations you won't be coddled on like a child even if it means being random PP attendings' dancing monkey for a few months. Carry 6-8 patients. Do all the notes. Do billing. Call the families. Do the procedures. Carry the pager. If you are a decent student then your medical knowledge will be fine and will continue to grow. You just won't have the 6 months of hell adjusting to doing actual work during residency that you hear about.

Try to turn this into a positive somehow. But also sorry. DO schools suck.

This is what scares me.

Almost done with my 3rd year rotations and I have not done any of that aside from some notes which I get minimal feedback on.

 

[Ho0v-man]

This is what scares me.

Almost done with my 3rd year rotations and I have not done any of that aside from some notes which I get minimal feedback on.

None of us had done that by the end of 3rd year. 4th year is your chance to start showing up.

Even still, I didn’t do any of that 4th year thanks to Covid. It’s still okay.

While I think clinical Ed should be rehauled at osteopathic schools, the amount of emphasis SDN places on it’s importance is crazy. Yeah do your best on these upcoming rotations. But the most important thing is to be teachable. Everyone is going to start intern year with some deficits compared to others. That’s expected.

 

[Neopolymath]

None of us had done that by the end of 3rd year. 4th year is your chance to start showing up.

Even still, I didn’t do any of that 4th year thanks to Covid. It’s still okay.

While I think clinical Ed should be rehauled at osteopathic schools, the amount of emphasis SDN places on it’s importance is crazy. Yeah do your best on these upcoming rotations. But the most important thing is to be teachable. Everyone is going to start intern year with some deficits compared to others. That’s expected.

The most important thing by far is knowing when to evaluate the patient in person and knowing when to call for help. You can be a total ******* and do fine intern year if you prove to the seniors and attendings that you can do those two very, very easy things. People continue to pretend that isn't true. Yeah, it's been nice being much more autonomous than some of my peers but really what does that actually help me with at the end of the day?

 

[hallowmann]

None of us had done that by the end of 3rd year. 4th year is your chance to start showing up.

Even still, I didn’t do any of that 4th year thanks to Covid. It’s still okay.

While I think clinical Ed should be rehauled at osteopathic schools, the amount of emphasis SDN places on it’s importance is crazy. Yeah do your best on these upcoming rotations. But the most important thing is to be teachable. Everyone is going to start intern year with some deficits compared to others. That’s expected.

I mean to he fair I had already done a lot of that in 3rd year, but I knew fellow med students in my same school that had done none of it by mid 4th year. In all honesty, you learn it either way in intern year, it's just a matter of how steep that learning curve is.

Having rotated with and taught MD students, my impression is that some of their experiences are just as variable as ours were, but they're more organized with it, so even if they don't have great experiences on every rotation, everyone seems to get at least some good experiences over the course of 3rd year to look better in 4th year. The weak students are still weak and strong students are still strong.

Now that all said, I will say for the first time I've been working more with interns and I've noticed a difference between the ones with COVID era rotations and those thay had more normal rotations. They're taking a bit longer to adapt, and things I would have expected to be obvious or second nature are not as such. Maybe I'm just getting too far out from that point in training, but I never expected to truly feel a difference, and I'm surprised that I do. I think they're getting there, but it is definitely taking more time than before. I imagine next year might be a bit worse, but then things will get back to normal.

The most important thing by far is knowing when to evaluate the patient in person and knowing when to call for help. You can be a total ******* and do fine intern year if you prove to the seniors and attendings that you can do those two very, very easy things. People continue to pretend that isn't true. Yeah, it's been nice being much more autonomous than some of my peers but really what does that actually help me with at the end of the day?

The dirty secret is that this is literally all of medicine, and it doesn't end as an intern, senior, or attending. We know so little, but just slightly more than the person behind us. You basically live off of knowing your limitations and when you need to ask for help. The intern asks the senior, the senior asks the attending, the attending asks the specialist, the specialist asks... more specialists or subspecialists or senior faculty or mentors. Everyone just has slightly more information than the next, but builds off of the confidence of each person. It's why in complex cases, specialists always insist on more tests and more consults of other specialties, because they have no idea, and they're hoping a bunch of well educated people will come to a consensus. And when it happens it's awesome and you can see how excited literally everyone involved is. You don't realize this as a med student or intern, you just assume everyone just knows everything.

 

[Redpancreas]

None of us had done that by the end of 3rd year. 4th year is your chance to start showing up.

Even still, I didn’t do any of that 4th year thanks to Covid. It’s still okay.

While I think clinical Ed should be rehauled at osteopathic schools, the amount of emphasis SDN places on it’s importance is crazy. Yeah do your best on these upcoming rotations. But the most important thing is to be teachable. Everyone is going to start intern year with some deficits compared to others. That’s expected.

I mean, alternatively we can just be content with the glorified shadowing many M3s receive, MD or DO and just resign ourselves to the notion that anything important will be taught in residency. That's not going to be in anyone's favor aside from people going into specialized branches that don't really get taught a whole lot in medical school like most surgical subspecialties, rads, derm, etc.

A good clinical education is everything. It is why the medical student goes to medical school. I'm not saying it's exclusively good at prestigious schools and bad at other schools. A good clinical education is a product of the student coming in with enough prerequisite know-how, a teacher thoughtful and perceptive enough to find where the student needs gaps filled, and patient enough to teach. The environment and culture also play parts as no matter how thoughtful the teacher, if the higher ups prioritize scut, you will get scutted. You can have glorified shadowing at top tier MD schools and amazing practical experience with a case-reportable case at DO schools.

 

[Drrrrrr. Celty]

It’s a huge downfall of DO schools. Essentially you pay 1.5-2x as much for the chance to spend your entire third year in a tiny town with little to no experience with residents or managing more complex pathology, and you have no choice but to follow directions. And the schools helps in no way with housing or moving. It’s a huge issue that needs to be fixed.

The biggest downfall is that your faculty half the time aren't even currently involved with modern medicine. They can't vouch for you to the people that matter. And half the time their lessons are derivations of common non-science based practices that were being done when they were residents.

I will agree that having a few rotations with residents is important. But it's nothing to do with seeing more pathology. As a 3rd year my goals are that you can at least identify and do basic treatment for a PE, PNA, HF, and a collection of the simple stuff so that I can actually teach you early on in residency the important stuff. How to manage and treat something complex like DI in a post-pit resection from the first day isn't going to impress when 10 of our 15 census is here for respiratory complaints and a fib.

The resident component is so that you actually understand how pre-rounds, rounds, and the structure of authority works. Which I think you can get down from like a few rotations.

 

[ADSigMel]

Wait - you found out early enough to make a matriculation decision on it? Or you transferred schools between second and third year when you found out?

That first option is awesome. I would have picked a different acceptance if I had known where I was going to go during third year before I started.

Yep. I found out in, I think February, when I was trying to decide which school to attend. Once I found out switching sites wasn't really possible at that school (even though it would otherwise have been one of my top choices), it really helped me narrow down my list of offers to consider.

 

[AlteredScale]

The biggest downfall is that your faculty half the time aren't even currently involved with modern medicine. They can't vouch for you to the people that matter. And half the time their lessons are derivations of common non-science based practices that were being done when they were residents.

I will agree that having a few rotations with residents is important. But it's nothing to do with seeing more pathology. As a 3rd year my goals are that you can at least identify and do basic treatment for a PE, PNA, HF, and a collection of the simple stuff so that I can actually teach you early on in residency the important stuff. How to manage and treat something complex like DI in a post-pit resection from the first day isn't going to impress when 10 of our 15 census is here for respiratory complaints and a fib.

The resident component is so that you actually understand how pre-rounds, rounds, and the structure of authority works. Which I think you can get down from like a few rotations.

Pathology is important if you area a bigger program. At my program, we are lucky to have 1-2 patients that are "bread and butter" on our general medicine team. The rest are transplant patients with complex physiology. If you want to go to a university program, you need that pathology to practice HOW to do presentations because that one liner becomes exceptionally important when presenting.

 

[getfat]

My school placed some students at downright pathetic sites. Carry zero patients, shadow the entire time with zero teaching. Private Practice doc works one week on one week off. So a 4 week rotation is basically a 10 day rotation. My site rotation you were assigned patients, called patients, performed procedures blah blah blah. Had an assigned intern, senior for every core. Assigned resident for electives. Personally, I felt i zero advantage on the interview trail. No one asked about where i rotated or cared. I didn't feel any more "advanced" over my cointerns. you'd be surprised some of the better MD schools have terrible rotations sites too haha.

My suggestion is to take advantage of it and study for step/level 2. Publish Case Reports at your regional ACP Abstract Competition.

 

[getfat]

This is what scares me.

Almost done with my 3rd year rotations and I have not done any of that aside from some notes which I get minimal feedback on.

You can get the opportunity at your Sub-I.

If you don't you'll be fine for intern year. Thats what the senior is there for.

 

[Drrrrrr. Celty]

Pathology is important if you area a bigger program. At my program, we are lucky to have 1-2 patients that are "bread and butter" on our general medicine team. The rest are transplant patients with complex physiology. If you want to go to a university program, you need that pathology to practice HOW to do presentations because that one liner becomes exceptionally important when presenting.

So... what you're saying is you replaced the mag of 1.6 to 2.0 today?

My intern forgot

 

[Redpancreas]

The biggest downfall is that your faculty half the time aren't even currently involved with modern medicine. They can't vouch for you to the people that matter. And half the time their lessons are derivations of common non-science based practices that were being done when they were residents.

I will agree that having a few rotations with residents is important. But it's nothing to do with seeing more pathology. As a 3rd year my goals are that you can at least identify and do basic treatment for a PE, PNA, HF, and a collection of the simple stuff so that I can actually teach you early on in residency the important stuff. How to manage and treat something complex like DI in a post-pit resection from the first day isn't going to impress when 10 of our 15 census is here for respiratory complaints and a fib.

The resident component is so that you actually understand how pre-rounds, rounds, and the structure of authority works. Which I think you can get down from like a few rotations.

I would argue that there are gems in the stuff they have to teach you. It was actually a community hospitalist who thought me about post-pit/DI's oscillating polyuria. The stuff that's missing is what you have to know if someone's gotten CAR-T treatment and how to treat critically ill cirrhotics and end stage CHF'ers about to get transplanted/LVADs, etc., which can actually be a con because a lot of that management is made by big honcho subspecialists without much resident involvement.

Some residents get the latter taught to them instead of the basics like how to manage HF and are glorified scribes to the subspecialist masterminds.