UCSF (Full+COA), UMich (Full), Columbia (Full+COA), HMS Pathways(~34kloans/yr)

[G0t2Katchdem@ll]

Money is important, prestige is a bit important, non-competitive environment is important. being close to New England is important
UCSF MD only (Full + COA)
Pros

• Great location (NorCal)
• Ranked top 5 in research and primary care = top notch, well-rounded education
• COA is covered on top of tuition so will not cost anything to live in a very expensive city
• enjoyed my time there during interview day, good vibes
• Diverse patient population, major presence in SF

Cons

• SF is far from home (New England), expensive to travel back and forth
• unsure about Bridges Curriculum
• might be a bit competitive (hearsay and definitely class dependent I feel)
• public funding at risk due to political climate but also in California (#resist)
• AOA (competitiveness)

UMich MD only (Full no COA)
Pros

• Full Tuition
• One year preclinical
• best interview day, people here are amazing
• great branding, everyone is excited to be here
• Flextime with Quizzing
• Easier to get to New England
• Top ten grad programs for second degree

Cons

• COA not included (lowest cost of living), if estimated at $25k/year, that's $100K
• smaller city in midwest (unsure about that, not necessarily con), less to do
• Living in a red state during this political climate (both good and bad because can do a lot of activism here but also there's a lot of difficult things to deal with)
• Patient population less diverse than Detroit
• public funding at risk due to political climate
• AOA (competitiveness)

Columbia P&S MD only (Full + COA)
Pros

• Great location (NYC), lots of friends and family near by
• Cheap to travel home
• Loved second look, lots of friends will be going here next year from college
• COA is covered on top of tuition so will not cost anything to live in a very expensive city
• P&S club is extensive and shows that students have great work/life balance
• Diverse Class and patient population
• 1.5 year preclinical (not sure how it compares to 1 but will be more free to do other things during M1)

Cons

• NYC might be too big of a city for me/overwhelming but Washington Heights is fine
• AOA (competitiveness)

HMS Pathways (34k unit loan/Year=$136K total debt)

Pros

• 1 year pre-clinical curriculum, more time in hospital
• lots of friends in the Boston Area
• Prestige that will go far in academic medicine
• Top Hospitals that I eventually want to work in (I want to match at Harvard Hospital)
• Dream school to get into (not sure about to go to though)
• No AOA

Cons

• Most expensive $136K debt
• interview day left much to be desired (hoping revisit will be better)

Summary: Would love to stay on East Coast but West Coast option is also adventurous and might be worth the growth. Money is a big factor: UCSF vs Columbia on money, Harvard is the dream but super expensive and Michigan I loved my experience there.

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[libertyyne]

1. Congrats on all of this!
2. 136K is not a whole lot in the grand scheme of things.
3. Michigan is more of a purple state.
4. I doubt funding issues related to the political climate will be defining characteristics of your medical school experience.


If you want to match into a harvard hospital the best choice would obviously be harvard.

 

[WedgeDawg]

Current Columbia student in the middle of clinical year

To address your concerns: even during clinical year, Columbia is not competitive. There is no quota for honors - everyone or no one can get honors on any individual rotation. How you do depends on your own performance, not your performance against your peers. You absolutely do not need AOA to match at top programs in any specialty coming out of Columbia. To get AOA, you need to be in the top 50% (in terms of # of honors) in your class and then the rest is totally subjective and no one knows how it's done, but again, you do not need it to match exceptionally well in anything. People get stressed out, but you will get that anywhere because medicine is stressful, and Columbia does indeed value quality of life, especially during your clinical year when it becomes most important.

I'm not a big city person at all, but Washington Heights is super manageable, and the A/C/1 get you anywhere you need to go (except the upper east side in which case you can either walk across the park or take a bus, but it's rare you'd need to go there).

You have a ton of time during preclinical to do whatever you want. Competition is 100% non-existant during this time.

I think this should be a choice between Columbia and Harvard, based on what is important to you and your career goals.

If you have any questions, let me know. Congrats on your wonderful options.

 

[deleted480308]

Just do what makes you happy. You earned the blessing of great options

 

[Lawpy]

Hmm I want to know the reasons for choosing HMS and taking on debt over Columbia and UCSF essentially for free.

 

[libertyyne]

Hmm I want to know the reasons for choosing HMS and taking on debt over Columbia and UCSF essentially for free.

Family, friends, desire to live in NE, wanting to match at Havard Hospitals.

 

[Lawpy]

Family, friends, desire to live in NE, wanting to match at Havard Hospitals.

Are these all worth $136K in debt? We're comparing between HMS and its peer schools. None of the choices will limit OP's long-term career plans, even if he wants to match at a Harvard hospital.

 

[Cyberdyne 101]

Agree with @libertyyne. 136k isn't too bad if you absolutely want to practice at a Harvard hospital. Although, I don't think you'd have any difficulty matching there from UCSF.

 

[libertyyne]

Are these all worth $136K in debt? We're comparing between HMS and its peer schools. None of the choices will limit OP's long-term career plans, even if he wants to match at a Harvard hospital.

I dont disagree, 136K is a small price to pay in the grand scheme of things, plus much higher chances of landing HMS hospital.

 

[Lawpy]

I dont disagree, 136K is a small price to pay in the grand scheme of things, plus much higher chances of landing HMS hospital.

what is the contributing factor for the bolded? the only thing I can think of is HMS is notorious for massive inbreeding.

 

[libertyyne]

what is the contributing factor for the bolded? the only thing I can think of is HMS is notorious for massive inbreeding.

Landing a residency is more than just numbers. Having the connections, face time with PD's, Letters from the same people ranking you, building relationships in the department with residents / attendings. If there are two ideal candidates for an MGH hospital one is from harvard and the other is from UCSF, one you have interacted with over years and know what they are about vs the person you interviewed for a day. Which one would you opt for ?

 

[WedgeDawg]

what is the contributing factor for the bolded? the only thing I can think of is HMS is notorious for massive inbreeding.

Look at Harvard's match lists for the past 10 years
Look at any other school's match list
QED

 

[Lawpy]

Landing a residency is more than just numbers. Having the connections, face time with PD's, Letters from the same people ranking you, building relationships in the department with residents / attendings. If there are two ideal candidates for an MGH hospital one is from harvard and the other is from UCSF, one you have interacted with over years and know what they are about vs the person you interviewed for a day. Which one would you opt for ?

I don't think the differences between peer schools are significant, and I doubt PD's are acting on mere exposure effect. But I don't know what Harvard PD's do so maybe there's massive inbreeding involved and aversion towards graduates from non-Harvard schools (unlikely honestly, they aren't irrational).

When there's a comparison involving schools of similar level, usually the cheaper option predominates, followed by location preferences. So that's why I went for Columbia.

Look at Harvard's match lists for the past 10 years
Look at any other school's match list
QED

There's probably a small home advantage but that's really not a limiting factor nor does it justify the extra costs involved.

 

[To be MD]

Money is important, prestige is a bit important, non-competitive environment is important. being close to New England is important
UCSF MD only (Full + COA)
Pros

• Great location (NorCal)
• Ranked top 5 in research and primary care = top notch, well-rounded education
• COA is covered on top of tuition so will not cost anything to live in a very expensive city
• enjoyed my time there during interview day, good vibes
• Diverse patient population, major presence in SF

Cons

• SF is far from home (New England), expensive to travel back and forth
• unsure about Bridges Curriculum
• might be a bit competitive (hearsay and definitely class dependent I feel)
• public funding at risk due to political climate but also in California (#resist)
• AOA (competitiveness)

UMich MD only (Full no COA)
Pros

• Full Tuition
• One year preclinical
• best interview day, people here are amazing
• great branding, everyone is excited to be here
• Flextime with Quizzing
• Easier to get to New England
• Top ten grad programs for second degree

Cons

• COA not included (lowest cost of living), if estimated at $25k/year, that's $100K
• smaller city in midwest (unsure about that, not necessarily con), less to do
• Living in a red state during this political climate (both good and bad because can do a lot of activism here but also there's a lot of difficult things to deal with)
• Patient population less diverse than Detroit
• public funding at risk due to political climate
• AOA (competitiveness)

Columbia P&S MD only (Full + COA)
Pros

• Great location (NYC), lots of friends and family near by
• Cheap to travel home
• Loved second look, lots of friends will be going here next year from college
• COA is covered on top of tuition so will not cost anything to live in a very expensive city
• P&S club is extensive and shows that students have great work/life balance
• Diverse Class and patient population
• 1.5 year preclinical (not sure how it compares to 1 but will be more free to do other things during M1)

Cons

• NYC might be too big of a city for me/overwhelming but Washington Heights is fine
• AOA (competitiveness)

HMS Pathways (34k unit loan/Year=$136K total debt)

Pros

• 1 year pre-clinical curriculum, more time in hospital
• lots of friends in the Boston Area
• Prestige that will go far in academic medicine
• Top Hospitals that I eventually want to work in (I want to match at Harvard Hospital)
• Dream school to get into (not sure about to go to though)
• No AOA

Cons

• Most expensive $136K debt
• interview day left much to be desired (hoping revisit will be better)

Summary: Would love to stay on East Coast but West Coast option is also adventurous and might be worth the growth. Money is a big factor: UCSF vs Columbia on money, Harvard is the dream but super expensive and Michigan I loved my experience there.

I don't know how everyone and their mother gets into Harvard on SDN (joke but seriously, wow... congrats), but I would always choose the absolute best school in the world first.

If you don't want to take on the debt, that's cool. UCSF and Columbia are both freaking incredible.

The one you rule out 100% is UMich.

If you're really focused on research networks, obviously HMS is the best choice if you want to stay in NE for the long haul.

Personally, I'd just think about where you want to be in 20 years. If it's Boston, pick Harvard. California? Pick UCSF. New York? Pick Columbia.

 

[libertyyne]

I don't think the differences between peer schools are significant, and I doubt PD's are acting on mere exposure effect. But I don't know what Harvard PD's do so maybe there's massive inbreeding involved and aversion towards graduates from non-Harvard schools (unlikely honestly, they aren't irrational).

When there's a comparison involving schools of similar level, usually the cheaper option predominates, followed by location preferences. So that's why I went for Columbia.

I would reevaluate your perception of absolute rationality when it comes to these decisions. People dont function in a vaccum. Most of the time people make these decisions first and then rationalize backwards.

 

[efle]

Prestige differences here are negligible, UCSF completely equals Harvard and neither of those names is going to get you a residency interview that Columbia/Michigan couldn't. This really comes down to whether it is worth ~150k to greatly increase your odds of a Harvard match.

 

[Lawpy]

I would reevaluate your perception of absolute rationality when it comes to these decisions. People dont function in a vaccum. Most of the time people make these decisions first and then rationalize backwards.

I mean PD's are humans and are swayed by subjective biases but I don't think it's that extreme. Maybe it is, who knows. But even then, OP will apply to residency 4 years from now? We're assuming his career goals will remain unchanged during this time, which is risky.

I think even going to HMS at full cost, there isn't a guarantee of matching into a Harvard hospital.

 

[libertyyne]

I mean PD's are humans and are swayed by subjective biases but I don't think it's that extreme. Maybe it is, who knows. But even then, OP will apply to residency 4 years from now? We're assuming his career goals will remain unchanged during this time, which is risky.

I think even going to HMS at full cost, there isn't a guarantee of matching into a Harvard hospital.

Going to HMS is the closest guarantee to matching at a Harvard Hospital.

 

[Lawpy]

Going to HMS is the closest guarantee to matching at a Harvard Hospital.

assuming OP's career goals are unchanged, OP feels the extra debt is worth it, OP wants 100% certainty in matching at Harvard no matter what etc. to me, these are all unrealistic, but who knows.

i think none of the schools listed will limit OP from matching where he wants and should go for the free option with geographical proximity, and hence the Columbia vote. OP may feel different and wants to go Harvard. it's up to him. there were similar threads in the past where people went to Harvard over peer schools for free, and in the end, only they can decide whether they made the right decision.

 

[libertyyne]

assuming OP's career goals are unchanged, OP feels the extra debt is worth it, OP wants 100% certainty in matching at Harvard no matter what etc. to me, these are all unrealistic, but who knows.

i think none of the schools listed will limit OP from matching where he wants and should go for the free option with geographical proximity, and hence the Columbia vote. OP may feel different and wants to go Harvard. it's up to him. there were similar threads in the past where people went to Harvard over peer schools for free, and in the end, only they can decide whether they made the right decision.

I agree with you, none of these schools will limit OP's ability to match well. However, OP wants to match at Harvard Hospitals. If OP was Ok with matching at Tufts or BU then USCF is a no brainer, however OP has specific hospitals and programs in mind. Harvard makes sense. If OP wanted to match at UCSF hospitals I would have told OP to go to UCSF.

As far as op's mind changing etc, who knows?

 

[Lawpy]

I agree with you, none of these schools will limit OP's ability to match well. However, OP wants to match at Harvard Hospitals. If OP was Ok with matching at Tufts or BU then USCF is a no brainer, however OP has specific hospitals and programs in mind. Harvard makes sense. If OP wanted to match at UCSF hospitals I would have told OP to go to UCSF.

As far as op's mind changing etc, who knows?

Wait why is UCSF your second choice and not Columbia?

 

[libertyyne]

Wait why is UCSF your second choice and not Columbia?

I was just giving an example.

 

[deev04]

If OP was Ok with matching at Tufts or BU then USCF is a no brainer

I agree that inbreeding is real and HMS would give anyone the best chance of landing a Harvard residency. But you lost me on this. Am I missing the chunk of UCSF/Columbia's match list that is "resigned" to Tufts/BU (still great programs). Sure, less match at Harvard than at their own top-top tier programs, but very few go to Tufts/BU.

$136k(+debt) isn't unreasonable if OP has their heart set on HMS. That said, full COA at two of the best schools in the country is sweet and definitely worth considering if matching at HMS is the thing making that $136k look not so bad. Plenty of students at UCSF/Columbia match at Harvard residencies. Plenty of students at HMS decide other residencies are better suited to their interests. Residency is only a few years. You can always train somewhere and make your way back to Harvard in the long-term.

OP you're golden with any of these. There's no wrong choice. Congrats!!

 

[begoood95]

Hmm I want to know the reasons for choosing HMS and taking on debt over Columbia and UCSF essentially for free.

Because it's Harvard? And 137k of debt is nothing in the face of that. Seriously, that will barely make a dent in the lifestyle-salary of a physician, in reality. OP also wants to stay on the east coast, and prestige is of medium importance -- prestige also comes with a number of tangible and intangible benefits. Columbia is fine and all, but the cons of Harvard don't seem too damning, and while Columbia is not a bad medical school whatsoever, Harvard will still provide more options if OP wants in on academic med. (--As it will if OP decides against academic med.)

If I were you OP, I'd go to Harvard and not think twice. Amazing school, amazing faculty, amazing people, amazing opportunities. They're really unparalleled, and anyone that tells you otherwise, I think, is in a bit of denial.

 

[efle]

Because it's Harvard? ... Harvard will still provide more options if OP wants in on academic med

only on SDN is the prestige/resource difference of Harvard vs Columbia worth 150k smh

Harvard will give much better odds of matching to Harvard. After that it's not even close to worth it, if he just wants to be at one of the many major academic centers in the northeast for residency going to Columbia is never ever ever going to close doors HMS would have had open

 

[begoood95]

only on SDN is the prestige/resource difference of Harvard vs Columbia worth 150k smh

Harvard will give much better odds of matching to Harvard. After that it's not even close to worth it, if he just wants to be at one of the many major academic centers in the northeast for residency going to Columbia is never ever ever going to close doors HMS would have had open

Shake your head all you want, reality is still reality and there is a difference between the talent and pedigree of Harvard faculty and opportunities whether you're willing to admit it or not. This may be because I haven't struggled for money (parents pay for most everything, and are upper-middle class) but 137k is not that much. You're going to be a practicing physician for the rest of your life for crying out loud -- that is nothing.

And yeah, Harvard increases odds of matching into Harvard. And why does that matter? Because you'll be centered at arguably the best medical institution in the world. Look at the authors in major journals (Nature, Science, etc.), and count how many are from Harvard or Harvard-affiliated institutions. If you want a career in academic medicine, and you have an acceptance at Harvard, it's a no brainer.

Yeah, you can "be the best" if you work hard anywhere. But being at (arguably) the best facilities, being mentored by (arguably) the best faculty, and being surrounded by (arguably) the best overall institution is going to help.

I stand by my assertion that 137k is not that much, and that Harvard provides opportunities that would otherwise not be available, or at leasts facilitates them.

 

[begoood95]

Of course, I still think OP should think about it. It just doesn't make sense to think about it without the reality of what Harvard brings to the table.

Every time Harvard is at the table, people try grabbing for straws trying to figure out why OP shouldn't go there, presumably as an attempt to (maybe) shield/protect their ego. Instead, weigh the reality of each medical school equally. OP did say money was important, so maybe I'm losing sight of that, but I still think that 137k of debt is minuscule in the long-term.

 

[efle]

You're confusing Harvard's size with superior quality. Of course they are going to have more Harvard-affiliated high impact pubs when their size/network is several fold places like bay area peers. Per-capita though is a different story. You're not going to struggle to find a leading lab in an interesting area at Stanford or UCSF.

I'm also interested how you know so much about the relative quality of Harvard for education since you didn't go to school there and haven't interviewed there or at peers ? Like what is your basis for thinking it's in some league of it's own ? Lets say I think Johns Hopkins has arguably the best facilities and mentors and is overall the strongest institution in medicine, what are we gonna compare to decide ?

 

[efle]

people try grabbing for straws trying to figure out why OP shouldn't go there, presumably as an attempt to (maybe) shield/protect their ego

the full COA scholarship to UCSF is far more impressive than the HMS admit, imho

 

[begoood95]

You're confusing Harvard's size with superior quality. Of course they are going to have more Harvard-affiliated high impact pubs when their size/network is several fold places like bay area peers. Per-capita though is a different story. You're not going to struggle to find a leading lab in an interesting area at Stanford or UCSF.

I'm also interested how you know so much about the relative quality of Harvard for education since you didn't go to school there and haven't interviewed there or at peers ? Like what is your basis for thinking it's in some league of it's own ? Lets say I think Johns Hopkins has arguably the best facilities and mentors and is overall the strongest institution in medicine, what are we gonna compare to decide ?

I agree with your first paragraph, and don't have much to say. You're right that it could be an artifact of large network size. Still, though, if OP wants to eventually match into a Harvard-affiliated hospital, then it would make sense to go to Harvard.

Eh, I'll concede that I don't know much beyond hearsay and my personal impressions that I've gathered along. I haven't interviewed there, nor do I go there, and nor do I know anyone who goes there. You got me. I don't know how we'd settle that disagreement, and I don't think we're going to operationalize such a question here within this thread, so I'm not gonna worry about it!

 

[futuremdforme]

Congrats for 4 amazing opportunities. Personally I would take UCSF but I love the west coast. If you could accept the distance, I think this would be a great option.

Of the other options, I would not do U Mich (not COA allowance and not as prestigious as the others IMO). HMS vs Columbia - consider the money only if you think it will change your happiness in med school or your career choices afterward. Otherwise do HMS if your ultimate goal is to end up in residency/working there.

 

[deev04]

Every time Harvard is at the table, people try grabbing for straws trying to figure out why OP shouldn't go there, presumably as an attempt to (maybe) shield/protect their ego.

Eh, I'll concede that I don't know much beyond hearsay and my personal impressions that I've gathered along. I haven't interviewed there, nor do I go there, and nor do I know anyone who goes there.

We're all just faceless trolls/heroes so I really don't mean for this to be so directed at you @begoood95 (I think you made some good points), but I think what @efle was trying to get at was the discrepancy between lay (and premed) perception and 1) reputation within the medical community and 2) opportunities afforded by these opportunities. I'm a student at an institution everyone would consider top tier. Nobody considers Harvard to be in a tier of its own. Harvard is undoubtedly one of the most recognizable international names and is an elite institution worthy of its reputation, but particularly in the medical community, nobody is putting it in a tier above UCSF/Hopkins/Stanford/Penn. When students hold multiple acceptances to these schools, even without scholarships, HMS is never a given. Faculty certainly don't flock there for the Harvard name. It's about individualized opportunities and circumstances.

This is not me searching for reasons for OP to not go to Harvard and this is definitely not about my ego. OP is a baller. If Harvard is best, OP should go to Harvard. My comments are more meant to try and speak to the realities of how Harvard is viewed relative to peer institutions within the medical community, particularly since there seems to be widespread misconceptions about this (as evidenced by some of your comments). Harvard is Harvard and shiny and crimson and all but that Harvard is Harvard seems to matter more to grandma and people outside this top tier medical community. Asserting that going to another elite medical institution will offer less opportunities is silly.

Shake your head all you want, reality is still reality and there is a difference between the talent and pedigree of Harvard faculty and opportunities whether you're willing to admit it or not.

This is just factually incorrect. Go actually spend some time browsing through the website of UCSF/MGH/BWH/Hopkins/Penn and see where various faculty went to school and did their training. So much moving around. Plenty stay at their institution, maybe a higher percentage are at the institution they went to school at, but after residency the inbreeding effect becomes less noticeable. Many people decide to go to x medical school and then stay there for residency (stay/move for fellowship) before eventually heading back to where they're from long term or joining the exodus out of popular cities seeking high $$$ jobs. There are DOs (oh the horror) leading programs at Harvard and plenty of non-"top" tier pedigrees (and tons and tons of ppl from other top schools). Likewise, other top tier schools have faculty littered with HMS grads. If you hold that HMS is some special unicorn (which I would object to), then the caliber of faculty at these schools would also seemingly be top notch.

This may be because I haven't struggled for money (parents pay for most everything, and are upper-middle class) but 137k is not that much.

I'll concede that 137k (+interest) is not that much for medical school debt and if HMS is where OPs hearts at, it's probably worth it. But as someone who doesn't come from money, I can affirm that 137k (VERSUS LITERALLY FREE) seems like a big deal.

Blessing/burden of going to elite schools as a not so rich person: getting to learn/hear all about what life with money is like (and hopefully finding other ppl who understand the money struggle life).

 

[begoood95]

@deev04 very thoughtful post. I'm probably guilty of being swayed by the shiny allure of Harvard and the lay conception of what it is; I'll try to be more careful! I think one of the most important points in your post is when you say it's about "individualized opportunities and circumstances." If OP thinks they fit there, and doesn't think the money is an issue, then of course go there. From your post I take that Harvard is not actually some tier above the rest, and while indeed a great institution, OP's other acceptances should not be dismissed too easily.

I also think my statement about the difference between "the talent and pedigree of Harvard faculty and opportunities" was an exaggeration, and could have been taken as me sh*tting on the other "top" programs -- by no means did I mean that! Of course UCSF/Hopkins/Penn et al are amazing! Each in their own right. Indeed, any medical school you go to in the US will give you a great education; at this point we're talking about things that are very debatable, as I'm sure we all understand.

We each have our own experiences with money, and as such our expectations, willingness to take on debt, and etc will vary. I can 100% understand and feel for someone who is weary to take on that amount of debt; I do not think they'd be going wrong avoiding it. In fact, taking on less debt is probably the smarter thing to do! From my perspective though, money ranks low on my list of priorities and "things that bother me," so I wince less at decreases potential decreases in salary (in the form of debt re-payment). Again, if money is an issue, than it makes sense to go to the school offering you what is essentially a full ride -- that's an incredible opportunity!

I (and probably OP) really appreciate your post @deev04.

 

[deev04]

@begoood95 just saw that your LizzyM is 81. Can't help but think you'll probably be in a similar "dilemma" next year.

Some good advice I heard is that once you get to school, it's going to be you and your peers. At job interviews it's going to be you and your resume/training. Sure, having grandma all hot and bothered over the "brand name" school you attend is nice for the two times a year you journey home, but it's really your life now and making decisions for any reason other than what is best for you is going to erode your future happiness.

 

[efle]

Wait uh 3.8 + 525 is like a 78

Dude once you visit California for interviews maybe bay area will be the new dream, it's way too cold in the far Northeast

 

[begoood95]

@begoood95 just saw that your LizzyM is 81. Can't help but think you'll probably be in a similar "dilemma" next year.

Some good advice I heard is that once you get to school, it's going to be you and your peers. At job interviews it's going to be you and your resume/training. Sure, having grandma all hot and bothered over the "brand name" school you attend is nice for the two times a year you journey home, but it's really your life now and making decisions for any reason other than what is best for you is going to erode your future happiness.

Hopefully! We'll see how this application cycle goes -- I'll be sure to make an "X vs Y school" thread lol.

And I agree with your last paragraph 100%.

Wait uh 3.8 + 525 is like a 78

Dude once you visit California for interviews maybe bay area will be the new dream, it's way too cold in the far Northeast

I actually thought I'd end up on the west coast, and obviously if I were accepted into the likes of UCSF/Stanford et al I'd have something to think about. But after meeting a few people from the east coast and spending time over there (New York/Philadelphia) idk... I love the "hustle and bustle" feel as much as the laid back(ish) feel in California. I'm from Oklahoma, and our winters can get very cold, so that doesn't bother me though the lack of seasons in Ca might, which points me towards the east.

We'll see!

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G920A using SDN mobile

 

[dfa1513]

interested in reviving this thread because 1) am wondering where OP ended up!!??? and 2) curious as to whether all the Full Tuition + COA were based on need or merit!

Thanks for the insight! (currently in similar position)

 

[dfa1513]

any idea where the UCSF Full CoA Scholarship is coming from?

 

[Magus5454]

This thread is from last year

 

[sadkmladkds]

Looking long term where you want to match it seems that Harvard is the best move since you want to literally work there.