The Irony

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Franklo

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Had a discussion with a couple of the attending's on our floor about whether they would do it all again (they're nearing or are in retirement currently and teach for fun). While none of them specifically said they wouldn't do it again, they made it clear that the accumulated rise in the cost of dental school plus with the state of the overall market they would not consider this career option again. Kinda depressing when these guys are your mentors and they're telling you that it wasn't a good idea :/

Anybody else gotten the same response from their attending?

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No offense to your attendings, but these are typically those dentists that were either disabled or found the business side of practicing dentistry too difficult. They are biased in their opinions. Yes .... most are nearing retirement. My point .... these are NOT the opinions you should listen to. Go out and speak to the many successful dentists in your area. There are many dentists that are very happy with their salary and quality of life.
 
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I echo 2th mvr. Older dentists who have not moved ahead with the times continually talk about the good old days. Truth is, these days are just fine and dentistry is much more enjoyable to practice in the 21st century. It is often too complex for older practitioners to embrace. New modalities and technology are not within their scope. See this in many professions.
 
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Had a discussion with a couple of the attending's on our floor about whether they would do it all again (they're nearing or are in retirement currently and teach for fun). While none of them specifically said they wouldn't do it again, they made it clear that the accumulated rise in the cost of dental school plus with the state of the overall market they would not consider this career option again. Kinda depressing when these guys are your mentors and they're telling you that it wasn't a good idea :/

Anybody else gotten the same response from their attending?

Most of the faculty that teach end up there either because they have a passion for teaching or they are not fit for private practice. Most of them fall into the latter category. The best ones to ask are the part-timers that have or had their own successful practice and have a passion for teaching dentistry. There's the other type of attending that only teaches just to have something on their resume.
 
Yeah that's what I figured. I mean they're old foggies (no disrespect meant) but it just kinda makes you feel real ****ty when the guys that are supposed to be your mentors are being so doom and gloom
 
I absolutely agree with TanMan above. It is entirely possible to reach a difficult point in your career where you may want to slow down and sell but are not quite at retirement age yet; hence, dental school faculty. Some are passionate about teaching the next generation... others are not that interested or perhaps didn't realize they were embarking on an entirely new career (education) that requires a whole new set of skills, talents, and interests. All of this is compounded by the fact that many doctors carry a lot of baggage and dogma from being in solo practice for so long.

Shadow different practices around your dental school, plan for the future, and make certain your career looks how you want it to.
 
Your instructors were not wrong in stating two very real problems: 1. dentistry is on the decline (due to oversaturation of dentists, openings of new dental schools, medicaid cuts, lower insurance reimbursements, rising overhead costs of running a practice etc) and 2. High student loans debt.

I don't think I could duplicate the same kind of financial success that I currently enjoy right now, if I graduated today with 500k student loan. It was also much easier for me to find jobs 10-15 years ago than it is now. With that much debt and lack of good paying jobs, it would take me a lot longer to reach the same level where I am at right now....maybe in 30+ years when I become 60-65 years old. I graduated when I was 29 and I am 45 right now.

So if you ask me if it is worth borrowing $500k to become a dentist, I don't think I can give you a straight yes answer. It depends on the individual's business skills and clinical skills. A dentist, who has good business skills, is willing to take the risk to start his/her own practice and does whatever it takes (ie taking CE classes, working on weekends and late hours etc) to make it successful. Good clinical skills allow him/her to treat higher volume of patients in a day, manage more difficult cases, make more $$$, make fewer clinical mistakes, get fewer complaints from patients, and earn more trust from the patients etc. If you don't have any of these skills and plan to work for someone else for the rest of your life, then all the things that the instructors at your school told you are correct....pursue another profession with fewer debt and less strain on your hands and back.

If you are not willing to take the risk of practice ownership, then you will have a ceiling on income earning potential like the pharmacists, who work at Wallgreen, CVS or the MD's, who work at hospitals.
 
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Your instructors were not wrong in stating two very real problems: 1. dentistry is on the decline (due to oversaturation of dentists, openings of new dental schools, medicaid cuts, lower insurance reimbursements, rising overhead costs of running a practice etc) and 2. High student loans debt.

I don't think I could duplicate the same kind of financial success that I currently enjoy right now, if I graduated today with 500k student loan. It was also much easier for me to find jobs 10-15 years ago than it is now. With that much debt and lack of good paying jobs, it would take me a lot longer to reach the same level where I am at right now....maybe in 30+ years when I become 60-65 years old. I graduated when I was 29 and I am 45 right now.

So if you ask me if it is worth borrowing $500k to become a dentist, I don't think I can give you a straight yes answer. It depends on the individual's business skills and clinical skills. A dentist, who has good business skills, is willing to take the risk to start his/her own practice and does whatever it takes (ie taking CE classes, working on weekends and late hours etc) to make it successful. Good clinical skills allow him/her to treat higher volume of patients in a day, manage more difficult cases, make more $$$, make fewer clinical mistakes, get fewer complaints from patients, and earn more trust from the patients etc. If you don't have any of these skills and plan to work for someone else for the rest of your life, then all the things that the instructors at your school told you are correct....pursue another profession with fewer debt and less strain on your hands and back.

If you are not willing to take the risk of practice ownership, then you will have a ceiling on income earning potential like the pharmacists, who work at Wallgreen, CVS or the MD's, who work at hospitals.

Interesting. I guess it's too late for me to turn back at this point, only time will tell if this was the right decision. If you weighed your feelings for dentistry now vs when you first started out, how would you say they compare. Do you feel like if you were 25 again you would still have the same drive to go to dental school?
 
So, what? Respect their honesty. 500k isn't worth it. Period. Keep whining or not. You should have taken all of that into account before you matriculated.
 
So, what? Respect their honesty. 500k isn't worth it. Period. Keep whining or not. You should have taken all of that into account before you matriculated.

:wtf:
A) where did I whine?
B) where did I say my school cost 500k?
C) when did I say I was taking out loans to pay for school?

Class of 2021? LMAO k D1 get off your high horse you just started
 
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Interesting. I guess it's too late for me to turn back at this point, only time will tell if this was the right decision. If you weighed your feelings for dentistry now vs when you first started out, how would you say they compare. Do you feel like if you were 25 again you would still have the same drive to go to dental school?
No, you can’t turn back now and you should use this as motivation to work as hard as you can while in school and after school. Facing difficulties in life helps motivate a person. Failure is not an option.

Neither your instructors nor I are ideal people to seek advice from because we didn’t have to go through the same hardship (high loan burden, lack of good paying jobs etc) that the current students will have to face. In order to have the same amount of success like ours, you guys will have to be a lot better than us and work a lot harder than us. All successful dentists I know don’t work 3-4 days/week. Many of them work on weekends and late hours. I choose to book a lot of my patients in one day so I only have to work 3 days/week at 4 of my own offices. I do that so I can have the other 2 days in a week to work for a corporate chain to supplement my income.

Yes, I would still go to dental school because there are not a lot of better alternative options out there. Can’t do anything with a BS degree. Just look at the majority of the college grads, who have to move back home and rely on their parents for financial supports. I hope my kids will follow my footsteps. Who wouldn’t want their kids to be financially independent? I’ll probably make my kids take out loans for their education and for starting a practice so they’ll learn.
 
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Interesting. I guess it's too late for me to turn back at this point, only time will tell if this was the right decision. If you weighed your feelings for dentistry now vs when you first started out, how would you say they compare. Do you feel like if you were 25 again you would still have the same drive to go to dental school?


I can't speak for General Dentistry, but I can tell you being an Ortho specialist is not what it used to be. Unfortunately market conditions has turned 24 months of specialized orthodontic treatment into a "commodity". In other words ..... "Hey Doc, what's a set of braces cost nowadays? I was quoted $2900 at McBraces. Can you beat that?"

To answer your inquiry .... yes .... knowing all that I know .... I would still become an Orthodontist because I LOVE what I do. Again ... I can't speak for general dentistry. I've practiced for 25 years. All 25 years as an owner of my own practices. The 1st 15 years were financially amazing. Beach vacation home. Rental properties. Porsche Turbos. R8. Bought a office condo to house my 2nd practice. Then ..... the recession hit. The next 10 years were not amazing. I still made a good living, but it was a far cry from what I used to make. Luckily I made some good retirement decisions during the 1st 15 years.

At present .... I am selling my 2 practices and already have a job with corporate. I'm tired of paying bills. :)
 
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I can't speak for General Dentistry, but I can tell you being an Ortho specialist is not what it used to be. Unfortunately market conditions has turned 24 months of specialized orthodontic treatment into a "commodity". In other words ..... "Hey Doc, what's a set of braces cost nowadays? I was quoted $2900 at McBraces. Can you beat that?"

To answer your inquiry .... yes .... knowing all that I know .... I would still become an Orthodontist because I LOVE what I do. Again ... I can't speak for general dentistry. I've practiced for 25 years. All 25 years as an owner of my own practices. The 1st 15 years were financially amazing. Beach vacation home. Rental properties. Porsche Turbos. R8. Bought a office condo to house my 2nd practice. Then ..... the recession hit. The next 10 years were not amazing. I still made a good living, but it was a far cry from what I used to make. Luckily I made some good retirement decisions during the 1st 15 years.

At present .... I am selling my 2 practices and already have a job with corporate. I'm tired of paying bills. :)

Man corporate :eek:...that just seems to be how things are headed. More and more practices becoming centralized. Looks like its turning into medicine
 
:wtf:
A) where did I whine?
B) where did I say my school cost 500k?
C) when did I say I was taking out loans to pay for school?

Class of 2021? LMAO k D1 get off your high horse you just started

If you read his signature and personal quote, it shows that he hasn't been smacked down by D1 yet.

Man corporate :eek:...that just seems to be how things are headed. More and more practices becoming centralized. Looks like its turning into medicine

That's why I encourage everyone to get in and get out quickly. Work as hard as you can now, because the grass may not be as green in 20-30 years.
 
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If you read his signature and personal quote, it shows that he hasn't been smacked down by D1 yet.



That's why I encourage everyone to get in and get out quickly. Work as hard as you can now, because the grass may not be as green in 20-30 years.

Depressing but honest and truthful
 
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