Shadowing a neurosurgeon next week

[NAVYLABTECH08]

Hi guys,

I have shadowed several medicine specialities ranging from Hemo/OC to PEDs. I have never shadowed a surgeon before. A neurosurgeon has invided me to a case next week in the OR. He even told me a good time to come so the interns are not flocking all around. What should I do to prepare and and what are some cool questions to ask him regarding his profession?

Will I be on an observation deck or actually in the OR?
Scrubs or dress pants, shirt, and tie?

I don't know about civilian DOcs, but military docs get annoyed when you shadow them and know nothing about their trade. Last week, I had to present a presentation on breast cancer for Oncologists. In order to get a good LOR, you really have to shine becasue they normally run you through a mild version of the program 3rd and 4th year med students go through and I did not get a LOR the first shadowing opp i got from PEDs when I did not prepare.

Being a hematology/CHM/Micro Medical technologist, I had no problems relating lab values to medical conditions and even found myself expaining to doctors specifics about cetain tests or rare antibodies. However, reading a book, memorizing some lab values is different from surgery. Wish me luck!

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[njbmd]

Hi guys,

I have shadowed several medicine specialities ranging from Hemo/OC to PEDs. I have never shadowed a surgeon before. A neurosurgeon has invided me to a case next week in the OR. He even told me a good time to come so the interns are not flocking all around. What should I do to prepare and and what are some cool questions to ask him regarding his profession?

Will I be on an observation deck or actually in the OR?
Scrubs or dress pants, shirt, and tie?

I don't know about civilian DOcs, but military docs get annoyed when you shadow them and know nothing about their trade. Last week, I had to present a presentation on breast cancer for Oncologists. In order to get a good LOR, you really have to shine becasue they normally run you through a mild version of the program 3rd and 4th year med students go through and I did not get a LOR the first shadowing opp i got from PEDs when I did not prepare.

Being a hematology/CHM/Micro Medical technologist, I had no problems relating lab values to medical conditions and even found myself expaining to doctors specifics about cetain tests or rare antibodies. However, reading a book, memorizing some lab values is different from surgery. Wish me luck!

Ask the neurosurgeon that invited you what your dress should be. Even if you are actually in the OR, you will be shown where to change your clothes. Ask your questions before the case begins and don't speak unless you are spoken to during the case. If you are in the actual OR, do exactly what the team tells you to do.

Some ORs have a dome and some have a stool in the corner and some have you actually "scrub in" meaning you are at the OR table itself. You can actually see more in a neurosurgery case if you are in a dome. You can also write down questions as you have them and ask them at the end of the case.

Enjoy your self and follow the lead of your precepting neurosurgeon.

 

[MSKalltheway]

njbmd is an experienced surgeon, so obviously I don't have anything to say in opposition...it was very solid advice. Even despite the stereotype that surgeons can be intense, I dont think anyone wants to be bothered too much when theyre inside someones body (who could blame em?), so following his lead would be the best thing you can do.

To add a students perspective, I have shadowed in the OR a few times, and the reason njbmd put "scrub in" in quotations was because you probably wont really scrub in and be sterile to do things to assist the surgeon. As an MS-2, I dont even know the procedure yet since the surgeons I have shadowed didnt want me to assist (kind of a duh statement, i was only shadowing). It seems like he has been accommodating, so he'll show you some cool stuff (seeing a neurosurgery is pretty cool in itself! seeing a live brain and delivering a baby are must do's before I graduate).

One additional thing you can do is...make sure you dont touch or brush anything!!! It may sound stupid, but anything you touch in the OR thats supposed to be sterile will no longer be if you even touch it slightly. Unfortunately, this is from personal experience Thats a story for another time...

Also, make sure to have eaten and hydrate well. Neurosurgeries can be long and you will be on your feet the whole time. Wear comfortable shoes too...if you have crocs (though i know most people hate them) they will be your best friend in the OR!

Also, if you are in the OR youll wear scrubs. The observation deck will likely require a shirt and tie. Im a little surprised docs got annoyed if you didnt know anything...thats a little unfair in my opinion. They dont even expect MS-3's to know a whole lot, and the reason for that is our pre-clinical training--you study a lot but its nothing compared to what you learn on your clinical rotations. I think you should be fine if you go in knowing nothing, I dont even know where you would start learning! The important thing for you would be showing enthusiasm and appreciation for being there. There's way too much to know to worry about knowledge...

 

[NAVYLABTECH08]

njbmd is an experienced surgeon, so obviously I don't have anything to say in opposition...it was very solid advice. Even despite the stereotype that surgeons can be intense, I dont think anyone wants to be bothered too much when theyre inside someones body (who could blame em?), so following his lead would be the best thing you can do.

To add a students perspective, I have shadowed in the OR a few times, and the reason njbmd put "scrub in" in quotations was because you probably wont really scrub in and be sterile to do things to assist the surgeon. As an MS-2, I dont even know the procedure yet since the surgeons I have shadowed didnt want me to assist (kind of a duh statement, i was only shadowing). It seems like he has been accommodating, so he'll show you some cool stuff (seeing a neurosurgery is pretty cool in itself! seeing a live brain and delivering a baby are must do's before I graduate).

One additional thing you can do is...make sure you dont touch or brush anything!!! It may sound stupid, but anything you touch in the OR thats supposed to be sterile will no longer be if you even touch it slightly. Unfortunately, this is from personal experience Thats a story for another time...

Also, make sure to have eaten and hydrate well. Neurosurgeries can be long and you will be on your feet the whole time. Wear comfortable shoes too...if you have crocs (though i know most people hate them) they will be your best friend in the OR!

Also, if you are in the OR youll wear scrubs. The observation deck will likely require a shirt and tie. Im a little surprised docs got annoyed if you didnt know anything...thats a little unfair in my opinion. They dont even expect MS-3's to know a whole lot, and the reason for that is our pre-clinical training--you study a lot but its nothing compared to what you learn on your clinical rotations. I think you should be fine if you go in knowing nothing, I dont even know where you would start learning! The important thing for you would be showing enthusiasm and appreciation for being there. There's way too much to know to worry about knowledge...

Thanks for your input. I will take it all into consideration and make sure I do't ask any questions during the case or bump into anything. I don't have aby crocs however. Did you buy your own scrubs or were they given to you. At my hospital, I think staff are assigned scrub cards. Me, being a medical technologist must wear my regular uniform, no scrubs. I am very excited!

 

[brainiak4431]

My experience observing surgeries has been just showing up in casual clothing. Then they instruct you to change into scrubs in the locker room. Then you walk around all day with scrubs and then you can get back into your casual clothing and leave. There really should be no reason to wear formal clothing since you will not be allowed to wear it when following the doctor on rounds and definitely not allowed in the OR. And also dont get too close to the sterile field. That will definitely get you into trouble. And watch your distance from the patient. The only reason im saying this is that the surgeon I followed wanted me to be really close up and he would ask me to come take a look at the specimen multiple times and one time I got sprayed on the head with some bubbling fluid that came out of the incision. GROSS!! but I guess that happens all the time because the doctor started laughing at me and then told me to take a good shower later.

 

[MSKalltheway]

There really should be no reason to wear formal clothing since you will not be allowed to wear it when following the doctor on rounds and definitely not allowed in the OR.

For the most part this is true, but I would caution to say it isn't ALWAYS true. Our school has a shadowing experience the first week of classes, where everyone in the class picks one of the major specialties and shadows. I had a suit on and went into the OR with it on, dress shoes and all. Of course I had the booties, mask, and they threw a gown on me, but the suit was def underneath. I suppose the rational was that we werent scrubbing in anyway, so it doesnt make sense for 20 of us to change to watch surgery for 1.5hrs then change back. Scrubs are the norm and will likely happen, but you never know...this field can be really unpredictable.