Psychiatric nurse practitioner mentor

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Tbrock1994

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My name is Trey Brock and I am currently a firefighter paramedic and in nursing school as well. I have seen many people take their life as they did not have access to the help they need, but I have also saved many people simply from talking and listening to their story. I plan to attend a rn to msn psychiatric nurse practitioner program after I obtain my associates. I am looking for a mentor more or less about the psychiatric mental health field, starting your own practice, and anything and everything possible. I am always wanting to learn to better help my patients that I encounter! I want to open a practice potentially after I obtain my psychiatric mental health nurse practitioner geared around treating first responders with mental health issues whether it's job related or they had mental health disorders that are intensified by our line of work. I feel that the issue with mental health as a whole in America is we treat the symptoms of the disorders and it's very algorithmic in the way that pateints are treated. I feel that to truly help the patients we need to treat the underlying cause as well. Long story short I am looking for a mentor ship to ask advice, learn, and better myself as a whole and as a clinician. Is this something you would potentially be interested in?

Warm regards and I look forward to hearing from all of you!

Trey Brock Nremt-p

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My name is Trey Brock and I am currently a firefighter paramedic and in nursing school as well. I have seen many people take their life as they did not have access to the help they need, but I have also saved many people simply from talking and listening to their story. I plan to attend a rn to msn psychiatric nurse practitioner program after I obtain my associates. I am looking for a mentor more or less about the psychiatric mental health field, starting your own practice, and anything and everything possible. I am always wanting to learn to better help my patients that I encounter! I want to open a practice potentially after I obtain my psychiatric mental health nurse practitioner geared around treating first responders with mental health issues whether it's job related or they had mental health disorders that are intensified by our line of work. I feel that the issue with mental health as a whole in America is we treat the symptoms of the disorders and it's very algorithmic in the way that pateints are treated. I feel that to truly help the patients we need to treat the underlying cause as well. Long story short I am looking for a mentor ship to ask advice, learn, and better myself as a whole and as a clinician. Is this something you would potentially be interested in?

Warm regards and I look forward to hearing from all of you!

Trey Brock Nremt-p
I have a 5 year background in EMS prior to 3 years of medical school. I am very aware that I could cause serious harm by misdiagnosing someone and possibly lead them to suicide. This is because I am very aware that I do not have the appropriate training to do this. For the love of god, be careful with whatever license our government lets you get your hands on. I realize you have benevolent intentions, but EMS provides almost no training on psychiatric treatments outside of talking someone off the ledge. NP school is not long enough for appropriate psych training, even if they hand you a license to fling drugs at people.
 
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I have a 5 year background in EMS prior to 3 years of medical school. I am very aware that I could cause serious harm by misdiagnosing someone and possibly lead them to suicide. This is because I am very aware that I do not have the appropriate training to do this. For the love of god, be careful with whatever license our government lets you get your hands on. I realize you have benevolent intentions, but EMS provides almost no training on psychiatric treatments outside of talking someone off the ledge. NP school is not long enough for appropriate psych training, even if they hand you a license to fling drugs at people.
I understand where you are coming from and what you mean. By no means am I using any info, advice, etc to offer psychiatric help to patients with diagnosis, treatment plans etc. I just want to better understand the mental health conditions that people can suffer from as there are many more than we are taught about. In the state I reside(Ohio) a nurse practitioner is required to work under an MD or DO in the specialty that they practice.

Warm regards,

Trey
 
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I have a 5 year background in EMS prior to 3 years of medical school. I am very aware that I could cause serious harm by misdiagnosing someone and possibly lead them to suicide. This is because I am very aware that I do not have the appropriate training to do this. For the love of god, be careful with whatever license our government lets you get your hands on. I realize you have benevolent intentions, but EMS provides almost no training on psychiatric treatments outside of talking someone off the ledge. NP school is not long enough for appropriate psych training, even if they hand you a license to fling drugs at people.
Maybe we should have only a 3-month psych residency and call it a day... If NP can do it in 600 hrs, physicians should be able to do it as well.
 
You guys already do it. How much psyche is done on the front lines of primary care? Lots. And it’s done in less than 15 minute increments, until all the low hanging fruit is bruised up, and approaches that would have worked if they were provided with appropriate guidance, are by then already used up. But since a doctor wasted all that time spitballing, it’s not really wasted.

To the OP.... you have the right approach, as manifested when you politely dismissed the haters here. That’s a tell that you’ll do fine in psyche. There is always room for folks that have the knack for it, whether it’s learned, or innate. You’ll save more lives than when you were in EMS. And in real life working as a psyche NP, I’ve never been treated poorly by a physician. I have physician patients, and even see family members of physicians, which to me is more of an endorsement than having just doctors come to see me.
 
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You guys already do it. How much psyche is done on the front lines of primary care? Lots. And it’s done in less than 15 minute increments, until all the low hanging fruit is bruised up, and approaches that would have worked if they were provided with appropriate guidance, are by then already used up. But since a doctor wasted all that time spitballing, it’s not really wasted.

To the OP.... you have the right approach, as manifested when you politely dismissed the haters here. That’s a tell that you’ll do fine in psyche. There is always room for folks that have the knack for it, whether it’s learned, or innate. You’ll save more lives than when you were in EMS. And in real life working as a psyche NP, I’ve never been treated poorly by a physician. I have physician patients, and even see family members of physicians, which to me is more of an endorsement than having just doctors come to see me.
^ This, sadly this website often turns into a haven for rabid NP bashers so you have to be cognizant of that. Take the time to get good at your craft and seek as many mentors as possible during your journey. As long as you value patient safety first and foremost you will be fine.
 
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I have a 5 year background in EMS prior to 3 years of medical school. I am very aware that I could cause serious harm by misdiagnosing someone and possibly lead them to suicide. This is because I am very aware that I do not have the appropriate training to do this. For the love of god, be careful with whatever license our government lets you get your hands on. I realize you have benevolent intentions, but EMS provides almost no training on psychiatric treatments outside of talking someone off the ledge. NP school is not long enough for appropriate psych training, even if they hand you a license to fling drugs at people.
That's ridiculous. Five years of EMS. Paragod anyone? So in your experience as a third year med student you get like what four weeks of psych clerkship and a course in psychopathology? The majority of psych complaints are fielded by family medicine, internal medicine, pediatrics, gynecologists (anyone acting in primary care), and I get patients routinely coming in with "my cardiologist prescribed Xanax. It really helps, and I need you to prescribe it" or "my surgeon had me on Percocet and Klonopin. My PCP will do the Percocet but said you'd have to prescribe the Klonopin." How much focused behavioral training do any of those residencies get? Once primary care is unable to prescribe anything beyond a subtherapeutic dose SSRI or treat everything with Seroquel they punt the patient to psych. You guys don't realize that experience accrues with time. Most NPs are REALLY skittish when they start working because of their lack of exposure and their own indoctrination as RNs of "safety first." But they don't stop with 700 hours. They work....for decades, and they learn along the way just as any specialist does.
 
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My name is Trey Brock and I am currently a firefighter paramedic and in nursing school as well. I have seen many people take their life as they did not have access to the help they need, but I have also saved many people simply from talking and listening to their story. I plan to attend a rn to msn psychiatric nurse practitioner program after I obtain my associates. I am looking for a mentor more or less about the psychiatric mental health field, starting your own practice, and anything and everything possible. I am always wanting to learn to better help my patients that I encounter! I want to open a practice potentially after I obtain my psychiatric mental health nurse practitioner geared around treating first responders with mental health issues whether it's job related or they had mental health disorders that are intensified by our line of work. I feel that the issue with mental health as a whole in America is we treat the symptoms of the disorders and it's very algorithmic in the way that pateints are treated. I feel that to truly help the patients we need to treat the underlying cause as well. Long story short I am looking for a mentor ship to ask advice, learn, and better myself as a whole and as a clinician. Is this something you would potentially be interested in?

Warm regards and I look forward to hearing from all of you!

Trey Brock Nremt-p
I'll be glad to help you out if I can accept private messages or something on here. I was a NREMT-P back in the day.

Very few people are opening their own practice. Credentialing with insurance companies and EMR requirements make that a burden along with overhead costs. You'll likely see telehealth continue to replace outpatient face to face psych visits.

Treating first responders is noble, but as you see the majority of them won't go in search of mental healthcare. It's a guarded population. There are people doing research in this field, however, and more needs to be done. CISD are becoming thought of as potentially harmful (which I agree with). Unfortunately, you'll need psychotherapeutic training beyond your MSN program to really "be" a therapist although you'll be credentialed to conduct and bill therapy. What most police/fire/EMS need are early therapy, and their roles preclude a lot of psych meds. Ironically, it's much easier to "do" therapy in private practice. There are lots of ways of becoming a therapist, but most patients want the quick fix of pills or combination of pills and talk. On top of that, the majority of "therapists" offer supportive counsel rather than evidenced based psychotherapies with little evidence supporting supportive counseling as beneficial. The "underlying cause" absolutely needs to be addressed, yet a lot of patients choose not to do anything to address boundaries, childhood trauma, etc. When you have the pleasure of treating kids with DMDD and various other childhood disorders (and taking on the intended role of inundating them with antiepileptic drugs and atypical antipsychotics) in the future you'll find yourself inviting the parents for treatment. Of course the kid is going to flip out in class when because that's what everyone is doing at home in the living room every night.

Mental health is actually not very algorithmic at all. In fact, it's somewhat too subjective and complicated by our system of diagnoses (and insurance coding). Take a case of bipolar for example. Poll a room of providers and you'll probably get major depressive disorder, borderline personality disorder, cyclothymia, bipolar I, bipolar II, schizoaffective d/o, ADHD, and many other possible diagnoses to that bipolar individual.

Psych is great. I encourage you to pursue it. Unfortunately, the majority of patients don't want to pull the root. They give it lip service, but they're usually content to mow the weed down (which pops back up days later) or sprinkle it with some type of chemical agent.
 
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Dang. Great comments. And accurate to my experience. Additionally, when I’ve worked and trained alongside physicians, I could ask a different physician the same question about an approach and get a different answer each time.



Everyone in primary care looks at STARD and feels empowered.... for a few minutes. Then their patients respond back with explanations why they can’t be on this med or that.... ie “ive tried this already and it didn’t work”, or “didn’t like the side effect from that”. Any number of factors derail a quick fix, and get it kicked to psych providers. You also get folks that burn through all the “easy” options (that suddenly prove to not be all that “easy”), and I’m left with a reduced palate of medications to use.... many of them which would have worked for the patient if I had prescribed them due to me having the time to manage expectations. Primary care has about enough time to write a script and say “try this and see if it makes you feel better” before they need to get folks out the door. The patient walks away not knowing what “better” means. Most of the value in what I do involves getting buy-in, and explaining the process to get beyond the solution people are looking for where a pill is the holy grail. A pill is certainly a big part of it. Clearly, you get more mileage out of this approach with a patient that is of relatively sound mind vs a lot of the folks we see in mental health that are more acutely ill, but if one is lucky enough to have a practice geared toward the “easy” patients, you can have a lot of people noticing how well your outcomes are, and you draw in more clientele, and are always busy.



My whole life I’ve worked under the notion that cream rises to the top, and magic is manufactured by winners. Indeed, this seems to be the case in my psyche practice. Yes, anyone can be busy in a field that has so many patients needing to be seen, but quality speaks for itself when the environment tightens up. Bosses might not look to value when even a mediocre prescriber can churn out productive numbers, but when you aren’t mediocre, you can get things done more efficiently, and leave the practice open to fewer headaches. When you do things the right way, you can still churn out numbers while your patient feels like they get the attention they need. I’ve hear other providers in other specialties be like “well if I had a half hour with a patient, I could get similar results as you.” Maybe. But I think if we traded shoes, they would see how hard it is. The difference is that I recognize how hard it is for a primary care provider to work on psyche issues, but many of them don’t quite see things that same way. I don’t win because I tell people what they want to hear, I win because I can efficiently tell them what they don’t want to hear without making them feel slighted or shorted. Bosses will pay for that. Word gets around quickly. And even with a glut of workers, some of us will remain less impacted. You can’t avoid forces of nature that lower the salary ceiling a bit, but that hits everyone. Productivity in all industries leads to adjustments like that.



We were always going to see the day that the industry got disrupted by something. The status quo of physicians making 7 or more times the average US wage wasn’t going to stand up forever. It was delayed by the AMA pressuring politicians to restrict the supply of medical grads to prop up their wages. That led to where we are today with PAs and NPs taking their place. The next step will be the government stepping in to pay for medical school. After that, there won’t be a justification for the high wages because physicians will be told “you didn’t pay for that”, and they will be forced to settle for whatever the powers that be choose to pay them. “Quality will go down!”... will be the lament. The retort will be “quality doesn’t matter.” And it really won’t matter. Access will be what matters. The world is changing around us. I’d be interested to see if it would be cheaper overall for the government to come in and pay off all medical students loans, (and then cap their salary) vs maintaining the system we have now.
 
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