Prelim and Transitional Years applications ERAS 2013

[gasblaster]

I'm mainly referring to charleston, Spartanburg, emory, Newport news, tn ones etc.

I guess Virginia down?

Spartansburg and Riverside are both competitive mainly because they are the only TYs that have been known to be cushy in the south, so I'm guessing a lot of the Southerners look into it (like you are).

Emory is not a terrible TY program despite being at an academic hospital. You actually will be "interviewed" for it the same day as your anesthesia interview. And by "interviewed" I mean they will give you info on it and you don't have to anything else.

No idea about any of the TN ones.

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[afteranesthesia]

Well, I have family very near one of them so that is the reason I'm looking into it vs cushy, but that's good to hear!

Emory is def one I hope I have a shot at too.

Thanks for the feedback!

 

[deleted103644]

Well, I have family very near one of them so that is the reason I'm looking into it vs cushy, but that's good to hear!

Emory is def one I hope I have a shot at too.

Thanks for the feedback!

Emory TY shouldn't be too competitive.

They reserve some spots for their advanced programs, but you can apply to the normal TY too (may require a separate interview for that).

It would be two separate TYs on NRMP - normal + anesthesia TY.

 

[XRanger]

Hey, I have similar stats step1/step2 in the 240s. Mostly HPs. Good LORs. Research.

Right now I have 10 TYs and 8 prelims (4 tys/6 prelim in california and 6 tys/2 prelims in massachussets). Do you think that's enough or should I add more? I'm worried I won't get any in cali since I heard it's very competitive

 

[deleted103644]

Hey, I have similar stats step1/step2 in the 240s. Mostly HPs. Good LORs. Research.

Right now I have 10 TYs and 8 prelims (4 tys/6 prelim in california and 6 tys/2 prelims in massachussets). Do you think that's enough or should I add more? I'm worried I won't get any in cali since I heard it's very competitive

Are you based in CA or MA?

I would add more MA prelims. Those are both fairly competitive markets for TYs (unless you applied to an awful rural non-competitive TY in MA - unfamiliar with the MA TYs).

 

[gasblaster]

Are you based in CA or MA?

I would add more MA prelims. Those are both fairly competitive markets for TYs (unless you applied to an awful rural non-competitive TY in MA - unfamiliar with the MA TYs).

Agree. Obviously already know about the competitiveness of CA. Boston TYs, such as Carney, NWH, and CHA, are pretty competitive as well.

 

[XRanger]

Are you based in CA or MA?

I would add more MA prelims. Those are both fairly competitive markets for TYs (unless you applied to an awful rural non-competitive TY in MA - unfamiliar with the MA TYs).

I'm from CA but I go to school in MA. That's why I'm only applying to these states, either go back home or stay here so I don't have to move around too much for residency. ok I'll try to add more programs. Thinking of adding NY too but that's a competitive market too and i'm not too familiar with NY programs

 

[deleted103644]

I'm from CA but I go to school in MA. That's why I'm only applying to these states, either go back home or stay here so I don't have to move around too much for residency. ok I'll try to add more programs. Thinking of adding NY too but that's a competitive market too and i'm not too familiar with NY programs

NY prelims are not competitive. No one outside of NY wants them.

Apply to a few academic prelims in MA as backups
and you'll be fine.

 

[studentdoc911]

hmm

 

[deleted103644]

Applying rads with a step I of 228, step 2 pending (top 20 school, good research and pubs). From midwest.
TY chances? 10 TY, 10 prelims?

As long as you include a couple of academic prelims in bad locations you won't scramble.

You should apply very broadly for rads though - many programs have a 230 Step 1 cutoff (good programs go as high as 240, maybe higher).

 

[ilyada]

Hi
I need an urgent advise.
I am an ophthalmologist, IMG and on a fellowship right now. I would like to repeat my residency in US. This year however I am not applying to ophto but only transitional prelim postions since I would like to be at the same geographic area with my husband who is applying to IM positions. Some of my friends told me that programs would not rank me if I do not match into a PGY2 position. Is it true? Shall I apply for ophto residency also?
Any advise appreciated.
Thanks

 

[Sheldor]

So when do we expect to start hearing about interviews? Seems like last year it was around this time (but applications had gone out a few weeks earlier.)

Anybody gotten an interview offer yet?

 

[anonobro]

Got one today.

 

[TeaKae]

Got a TY interview offer today, submitted 9/15. Actually kind of surprised I even got one, considering that I'm competing against all you ROAD folks (I'm going PM&R). Reading all of the posts here, I'm nervous...only applied to 10 each TY/prelim med.

 

[EyesOnThePryze]

Got one today, submitted on Monday.

 

[afteranesthesia]

Do you guys mind sharing what you got? I'm trying to gauge whether or not I have a shot at what I applied to and whether or not I need to apply to other things...would absolutely help to hear what is being offered....

 

[gasblaster]

Last year they put up a TY interview invite thread. One of you guys could start that.

 

[deleted103644]

Got a TY interview offer today, submitted 9/15. Actually kind of surprised I even got one, considering that I'm competing against all you ROAD folks (I'm going PM&R). Reading all of the posts here, I'm nervous...only applied to 10 each TY/prelim med.

Some TYs are tough and not competitive.

 

[gasblaster]

Some TYs are tough and not competitive.

Ouch

 

[drizzt3117]

Got a TY interview offer today, submitted 9/15. Actually kind of surprised I even got one, considering that I'm competing against all you ROAD folks (I'm going PM&R). Reading all of the posts here, I'm nervous...only applied to 10 each TY/prelim med.

I remember you from when we were applying to med school, I'm guessing you took a year off?

 

[TeaKae]

I remember you from when we were applying to med school, I'm guessing you took a year off?

Yeah, right after M1 first semester, actually. Long story, you can PM me if you care to know more.

And, good point, I guess I must have gotten the interview from one of those crappy programs that none of the rest of you geniuses want...

 

[fizzle]

I wish I had seen this thread earlier. I applied to around 60 prelim medicine and 30 TYs...sounds ridiculous compared to the recommendations I'm seeing here...haha

 

[Sheldor]

I wish I had seen this thread earlier. I applied to around 60 prelim medicine and 30 TYs...sounds ridiculous compared to the recommendations I'm seeing here...haha

Wow, you're going to get to turn down like 70 interviews!

 

[gasblaster]

I wish I had seen this thread earlier. I applied to around 60 prelim medicine and 30 TYs...sounds ridiculous compared to the recommendations I'm seeing here...haha

Holy ****. That has to be more than the advanced programs you applied to. No one advised you otherwise (upper years, advisors, faculty, etc)???

 

[fizzle]

Holy ****. That has to be more than the advanced programs you applied to. No one advised you otherwise (upper years, advisors, faculty, etc)???

I guess I was being a bit paranoid and overestimated how competitive the prelims/TYs would be. There's not nearly as much data openly out there about the numbers needed to get into a good residency as there is for applying to medical schools, so I had little to compare myself to.

 

[studentdoc911]

.

 

[deleted103644]

I applied to a bunch of TY years with a not so great Step 1. Any advice for prelim IM programs? I'm adding these slowly.

Add a couple academic medicine prelims as fail safes against a scramble into a prelim surgery year.

Other than that, you need to focus on a location. That's the most important criteria.

 

[studentdoc911]

I've been focusing on the Illinois area. I supposed I'll apply for a few academic IM spots in the Chicago area.

 

[drizzt3117]

I wish I had seen this thread earlier. I applied to around 60 prelim medicine and 30 TYs...sounds ridiculous compared to the recommendations I'm seeing here...haha

Wtf, that was like 2k? I think most people would apply to more than the three I applied to but 90 is extreme.

 

[deleted103644]

Wtf, that was like 2k? I think most people would apply to more than the three I applied to but 90 is extreme.

Yeah. I applied to far too many and that was 20 prelims + 10 TY (not sure I even made it a full 10 TY, there are almost none in my region).

 

[Sheldor]

We've talked a lot about how many TYs and Prelims to apply to, but as they start rolling in its hard to say no! How many TY interviews is it reasonable to attend?

For a strong candidate, would 7-8 TY's and 5 prelim be enough? Or is important to hit 10 TY interviews?

 

[username456789]

We've talked a lot about how many TYs and Prelims to apply to, but as they start rolling in its hard to say no! How many TY interviews is it reasonable to attend?

For a strong candidate, would 7-8 TY's and 5 prelim be enough? Or is important to hit 10 TY interviews?

Really depends how competitive you think you are, and whether you interview particularly well (hint: everyone overestimates their interview skills). TYs are competitive, but often in areas that are less desirable and so even highly qualified people may end up deciding to rank them low due to locational constraints.

Personally, I interviewed at 4 TYs and 6 prelims (the prelims were all very local). I got my first choice TY, but honestly I was just hoping I matched at any of the TYs. I did end up canceling 3 TY interviews because they either interferes with derm interviews, or were just so late in the season.

Anyway, I guess I haven't really answered your question exactly. I you're not limited by geography, I'd say shoot for 6-10 TYs and then cancel if you deem it necessary later. It may seem like overkill, but I'd rather interview at too many TYs than end up in a bad (or any) prelim medicine year.

 

[drizzt3117]

I think 6 TYs is a good #. I applied to and interviewed at 3 TYs and interviewed at one designated prelim surg program.

 

[Dr. USMLE]

We've talked a lot about how many TYs and Prelims to apply to, but as they start rolling in its hard to say no! How many TY interviews is it reasonable to attend?

For a strong candidate, would 7-8 TY's and 5 prelim be enough? Or is important to hit 10 TY interviews?

If by important you mean >90% likelihood, then yes. You can look at the probability curve from charting outcomes if you want to be more exact but the bottom line is that the pain of matching to a prelim med/surg will, in one week, exceed the pain of the extra TY interviews. Just cancel all 5 prelims and replace with 3-5 cush TYs.

 

[gasblaster]

Really depends how competitive you think you are, and whether you interview particularly well (hint: everyone overestimates their interview skills). TYs are competitive, but often in areas that are less desirable and so even highly qualified people may end up deciding to rank them low due to locational constraints.

Anyway, I guess I haven't really answered your question exactly. I you're not limited by geography, I'd say shoot for 6-10 TYs and then cancel if you deem it necessary later. It may seem like overkill, but I'd rather interview at too many TYs than end up in a bad (or any) prelim medicine year.

Agree with this. As long as you have prelim meds, there really shouldn't be a problem matching an intern year. However, getting a TY is likely your end goal so I'd say scheduling what you can of those would be safest. You can always cancel interviews later on (just give them sufficient warning in advance). You never know how competitive some of the TYs you interview at really are. I knew mine was pretty competitive but my PD recently gave me the stats how much it was and I was surprised.

If by important you mean >90% likelihood, then yes. You can look at the probability curve from charting outcomes if you want to be more exact but the bottom line is that the pain of matching to a prelim med/surg will, in one week, exceed the pain of the extra TY interviews. Just cancel all 5 prelims and replace with 3-5 cush TYs.

I'd at least leave a few prelim med in case. The very last resort....

 

[username456789]

The very last resort....

Very last resort indeed. I remember thinking "eh what's the big deal between TYs and prelim medicine, it shouldn't make that much of a difference" back towards the end of third year/beginning of fourth year.

I can safely say now that only one week into my first actual "real" intern year rotation that if I was stuck doing inpatient internal medicine for a year (hell, for half a year) I would end up severely clinically depressed.

And I'm a pretty happy normal guy.

 

[gasblaster]

Very last resort indeed. I remember thinking "eh what's the big deal between TYs and prelim medicine, it shouldn't make that much of a difference" back towards the end of third year/beginning of fourth year.

I can safely say now that only one week into my first actual "real" intern year rotation that if I was stuck doing inpatient internal medicine for a year (hell, for half a year) I would end up severely clinically depressed.

And I'm a pretty happy normal guy.

I call those days (insert advanced specialty) appreciation day.

 

[DannyB]

A lot of people applying seem confused about what TY's are. TY doesn't automatically mean super cush year, in fact many are worse than prelim med years. It makes it impossible to predict how many interviews you should go on/how many to rank. You're going to need to do research about how hard it is to match at these programs and go from here. At the end of the day, don't go on more than 5-7 intern year interviews, and don't end up at a bad TY just because you're using the general rule that TY=easy

 

[drizzt3117]

Very last resort indeed. I remember thinking "eh what's the big deal between TYs and prelim medicine, it shouldn't make that much of a difference" back towards the end of third year/beginning of fourth year.

I can safely say now that only one week into my first actual "real" intern year rotation that if I was stuck doing inpatient internal medicine for a year (hell, for half a year) I would end up severely clinically depressed.

And I'm a pretty happy normal guy.

I'm done with one month of medicine and ICU Cush TYs are still easier than prelims even in the ward months, etc, but ward medicine BLOWS in general. There's a reason why we didn't go into it! I can't imagine having 8-9 months of wards like the IM interns at some places (5 months med, 1 month NF, 2 months ICU, 1 month cards, etc). Their other months would be like a consult service, emergency med, and one ambulatory month... Whew.

 

[username456789]

I'm done with one month of medicine and ICU Cush TYs are still easier than prelims even in the ward months, etc, but ward medicine BLOWS in general. There's a reason why we didn't go into it! I can't imagine having 8-9 months of wards like the IM interns at some places (5 months med, 1 month NF, 2 months ICU, 1 month cards, etc). Their other months would be like a consult service, emergency med, and one ambulatory month... Whew.

We don't have any ICU/CCU requirement at all.

 

[drizzt3117]

We don't have any ICU/CCU requirement at all.

I'm actually really glad we have it. I did 20 central lines and a bunch of A-lines during the month, and got to read a ton of imaging with real implications; we don't have rads in house at night so we have to read our own studies or call for tele-reads which are awful; so reading it ourselves is honestly better. It's prolly not that useful if you're going into derm but it's awesome for someone doing rads/IR.

 

[DrBowtie]

Carefully weigh the hassle of moving twice vs. the difficulty of the prelim year. I opted for a tough prelim at my advanced program so my wife and I didn't have to move twice, but sometimes we both regret it given how little free time I have. Other times we are thankful since our house is now settled and my wife is employed.

 

[anisotropy]

The more TY and Prelim IV I schedule, the more I am leaning toward a prelim year, even though I know it will be more medicine and less electives - so I question my decision either way.

Can anyone comment on the importance of large vs small program, particularly in light of the resident hour changes?

Also, if you want to moonlight once you get into into PGY2 and beyond - does it matter where you do a prelim year? I was told to avoid TY for moonlighting opportunities later. I would rather do ICU months than surgery months since ICU is where the real learning happens. A couple of TY have told me that they do not allow ICU rotations - but do require surgery months, which I assume is because of the resident work hours, so they want coverage aka warm bodies?

I really like academic type teaching programs - and I am not knocking a community TY or Prelim - but discussing EBM is not a chore to me - I like the esoteric discussion during rounds. I know some of the smaller community programs do teach, and they teach "real" medicine, but it is hard to tell how much of that happens on one day of interviews. Websites do not help much either. So what should I look for/ask on interview days at the community programs?

Thx!

 

[deleted103644]

Can anyone comment on the importance of large vs small program, particularly in light of the resident hour changes?

Generally? No. It all depends on the workload per resident. Larger programs may have more resources, or they may be sweatshops exploiting your cheap labor and Medicare subsidization.

Also, if you want to moonlight once you get into into PGY2 and beyond - does it matter where you do a prelim year?

This all depends on your advanced program. Many won't allow you to moonlight at other random institutions, but might allow you to moonlight at affiliates. This would be within your specialty though, so TY vs prelim shouldn't matter much.

This is irrelevant to me going into rads, so I haven't looked into it much.

I really like academic type teaching programs - and I am not knocking a community TY or Prelim - but discussing EBM is not a chore to me - I like the esoteric discussion during rounds. I know some of the smaller community programs do teach, and they teach "real" medicine, but it is hard to tell how much of that happens on one day of interviews. Websites do not help much either. So what should I look for/ask on interview days at the community programs?

Thx!

For more academic community programs, look for the affiliates of the top places.

Eg Stamford for Columbia, Mt Auburn for Harvard, etc etc.

Didn't look at these myself so can't say for sure, but they will definitely have top doctors on the floors, whether they care to teach you or not is another story.

You will get tired of EBM when you just want to get your work done so you can leave remotely on time.

 

[anisotropy]

So I had asked if most programs invite once, and call it a day for the season. I would guesstimate based on conversation with friends and personal experience quite a few will invite in batches(both TY and Prelim) - no one bothers to post after the initial invites are up. So the question becomes how much weight should you put into the second invite? Waste of time to go on these?

 

[deleted103644]

So I had asked if most programs invite once, and call it a day for the season. I would guesstimate based on conversation with friends and personal experience quite a few will invite in batches(both TY and Prelim) - no one bothers to post after the initial invites are up. So the question becomes how much weight should you put into the second invite? Waste of time to go on these?

For prelims?

Plenty.

Some programs try to lump their prelims at the beginning, more at the end, and the rest combine them with categoricals.

They are mainly concerned with getting people who really want to go there, no more, no less.

Some of the uber competitive ones may have more stringent criteria, but that's going to vary by the whims of the specific PD.

You are going to be a better candidate than most of their normal residents, so it's really pretty random who actually gets picked for an interview.

Once you get picked for an interview, they mainly want to make sure you're not an ******* (aka "are a good fit") b

 

[anisotropy]

General number for prelims to rank - if you rank say 7-10 TY, how many prelims? 2, 3, 5? Just trying to figure out how many interviews to go on. This is getting expensive super quick.

 

[Sheldor]

General number for prelims to rank - if you rank say 7-10 TY, how many prelims? 2, 3, 5? Just trying to figure out how many interviews to go on. This is getting expensive super quick.

Seconded. I applied to way too many and am needing to trim down the numbers!

 

[DrBowtie]

Isn't the pricing fixed for up to 10 per specialty? Those of you applying to <10 might as well add more if you haven't gotten enough interviews.

 

[gutonc]

Isn't the pricing fixed for up to 10 per specialty? Those of you applying to <10 might as well add more if you haven't gotten enough interviews.

It's the interviews that get expensive.