Out of all DO schools which one would you most want to attend??

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Based on academics and residency placments alone, which DO school would each of you want to attend and why?

Remember... location, family in area etc. are not being taken into account.
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For Academics: Kirksville Coll. Ost. Med.

For Residency Placement: Inconsistent. Varies with graduating classes. I'm tempted to say Chicago-COM, Michigan State-COM, or Philadelphia-COM, or New York-COM; but I'd just be guessing.

Good luck.
 
One year ago this week...


Where I WOULD go:

PCOM, KCOM, NSUCOM, MSUCOM, CCOM, UMDNJSOM


Where I would CONSIDER going:

NYCOM, UNECOM, OUCOM, OSUCOM, UHSCOM


Where I would HESITATE to go:

LECOM, PCSOM, Touro, EVVCOM, WVSOM, COMP


No real opinion either way:

DMUCOM, TCOM, AZCOM


Those are my personal opinions, primarily based on location. School reputation factors in somewhat, as did residency placement and intended area of practice. I'm more into the big city schools and schools associated with larger universities...EVVCOM aside. UNECOM being an acception because I don't see how there can be any negative reason for not wanting to live in Maine...but I'm a native New Englander.

Just my humble opinion.

Best of luck.
 
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JP,
what part of New England are you from??

-EMW
 
Connecticut.

I see you are from Massachusetts. Or, "Connecticut with worse drivers" as I like to call it!

Kidding, kidding. I like Mass. Family there. Decent skiing as well.

Have a good night.
 
JP...can I ask why you would have been hesitant with western/comp?

I might have a tough decision to make......i'm from los angeles....but I loved CCOM
 
any school that will take me
 
TOURO. Great program, great professors, great attitude, great location. I plan to stay in the Bay Area after I graduate so getting in to school here will only make that easier.
 
Of course, UNECOM! The schedules are great and manageable (especially if you have a family and you'd like to see them once in a while). The professors are great, and the students have consistently been placed in great programs such as Mayo Clinic, Brigham & Women's, St. Luke's (NYC), etc. You can see the resideny placement for last years grads at:

http://www.une.edu/com/clinical/pdf/GradsState2002.pdf
 
If I could take a school and NOT have to factor in location then:

KCOM
UNECOM
TUCOM
 
Originally posted by SM-UCLA tech
JP...can I ask why you would have been hesitant with western/comp?

I might have a tough decision to make......i'm from los angeles....but I loved CCOM
Click to expand...

Don't know much about the school itself. I do know a prof who was there. He is absolutely awesome. I am sure the education is good.

Just don't like the area. I could never live out there.

Also, there has been much talk in the last few years about a very unfriendly faculty and staff...particularly on the administration side.

I had that in undergrad. I don't need that in big kid school too.
 
Ugh... these threads are basically the promotion of whatever school you attend, OR what school has sent you interviews...

but here are my two cents (for what its worth... and that's 0.02)...

I am a 4th year NSUCOM student... wouldn't really hesitate to go back here... although the tuition is getting high...

I would stay away from the newer schools... like PCSOM and EV-VCOM...

Can't go wrong with the older/bigger schools like PCOM/KCOM...

Wouldn't mind going to AZCOM...

I interviewed at Des Moines... I would put it as an average school in most categories.

can't comment on the rest of the schools.
 
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NSUCOM is a good school as well. I put it in my "would go" category.

Although...I don't think I could study on the beach... :D
 
Nonsense JP! I study on the beach just fine. It takes a little sense of humor and a cool head about it, but you definitely get used to it. There is a Border's book store a few of us go to right on the intercoastal wateway downtown with an outdoor patio with tables and umbrellas. It is an excellent place to study. I do some of my best work there. I was very close to going to philly, and if I did, I would have found a nice coffee shop in Mannyunk (sp?) to study in. I personally need scenery to study. Libraries make me oh so depressed. I've come to realize that even though med school is hard, there is no reason not to enjoy yourself. Give my love to philly. As far as what schools i would go to... Residency placement isn't always a great gauge for D.O. schools, well at least the lists they put out aren't. This is because many people choose to do rotating internships. If you want reputation as a factor, Philly, and Chicago, KCOM are the old brass of Osteopathy. They all have good reputations and are well known. I did not apply to KCOM because I know I could not live in Kirksville for 2 years. Happiness should always be a number 1 factor in choosing a med school. I ended up being accepted to my two top choices, PCOM and NOVA and it was a tough decision because I really loved both schools. NOVA was different to me. I'm from Detroit and it was appealing to go to school in FL. Both have very good reputations; PCOM being an old rock and NOVA being an up and coming school. Both have great rotations as well, i just went with my gut on this and so far, it has worked out great.
 
rockandrolldoc - I just did the exact same thing you did. I'm from Philly and I got accepted at both PCOM and NSUCOM and it was a really tough decision to make considering most of my family is close to Philly, but my brother lives in Fort Lauderdale. Also, for the past couple years I've had my heart set on PCOM and everything I did was for PCOM, and then when I went down to Nova for my interview, it was like everything had turned upside down.

In previous trips to Florida, I've tried studying on the beach, and I just can't do it. But Nova's library is AMAZING. I pretty much need to be in a library or some place like that to study, and I know I sound like a dork, but I really couldn't get over their library. Maybe Nova doesn't have a reputation like PCOM, but most people I know have never heard of either school or osteopathic medicine, so I really don't think that aspect mattered too much. But you're right, Nova was different and I felt like I needed that after four years of being in a tiny school in the middle of Philadelphia. Even though I don't start until the fall, I really think I made the right choice.

Good to see other people out there who have made a similar decision and are happy with it. :)
 
JD-

A couple comments...

*sigh* This is coming from a 4th year NSUCOM student who has been on this website for about... oh 5 years or so...

I think its kind of funny that pre-meds and first or second years talk about "reputation" of a school. Because, ESPECIALLY at DO programs, there really isn't a difference in "reputation." Really, the only difference is this...

Obviously Philadelphia residencies and PA/NY residencies are more familiar with PCOM students, because they are geographically nearer to PCOM and likely see more of their students. Likewise, residencies in Miami/Tampa or in the SE like GA/AB/MS are more likely to be familiar with NSUCOM students because they are geographically nearer to NSUCOM and likely see more of THEIR students.

I have gotten interviews at Philly EM programs as well as several other PA programs and several NY and NYC programs. Is it because NSUCOM has a great reputation that gave me these interviews? No, it is because of my individual application and my individual merit.

The school that you attend has very little significance (if any) on your application to residency and what sort of job you pull after residency. And that's the TRUTH! (Not opinion)

As an aside, I met several PCOM students on the interview trail up in Philadelphia and PA. But I did not see any PCOM students down here in the south or in OH or MD.

And beware the NSUCOM library... I may have left a stain in one of the study rooms (promiscuous first year!).
Q
 
Quinn,

What our recently accepted colleague jd was reffering to, no doubt, was the new library. I'm not so sure if this was completed when you were taking classes at nova. It is a very nice library, but I'm not a library person. And speaking of that, please tell me what study room that is in the HPD library. I will be sure never to study there :rolleyes: . Good luck with the resideny interviews... my fellow M-1's and I are just finishing up our first semester finals, tomorrow is OPP and Friday is Radiology and then Friday night will be drunken madness at the beach. I have to set aside some bail money just incase. Take care, and congratulations jd, hell of an accomplishment getting accepted to nova.
 
Oh man!.....I think I should have applied to NOVA !!!

but then again....quinn will already be gone :(
 
Originally posted by QuinnNSU


The school that you attend has very little significance (if any) on your application to residency and what sort of job you pull after residency. And that's the TRUTH! (Not opinion)
Click to expand...

Absolutely true, according to all the best cited sources on gaining a residency spot.
 
I find it uneducated for Quinn to list PCSOM in the to new to consider catergory when in fact she knows nothing about PCSOM. TUCOM is as new as we are(1997). Comparison to a school that hasn't even started yet is also unfair(EVVCOM). I don't want a prospective PCSOM student read this and change their mind about applying to PCSOM. Hopefully most would research more than SDN, but some don't.

PCSOM is the only school that backs up its commitment to underserved areas. We complete nearly all our training in rural areas and are the only new school to set up several residency programs in underserved areas. How many programs does TUCOM have? 3 How about WVSOM? 3 They have been around alot longer than us but still do not have enough residency slots in WV for their own students. (Don't get me wrong, WVSOM is an AWESOME school. Just trying to prove a point.) How can you expect to retain physicians to underserved areas when you do not allow them to train there. It is a proven fact that most docs practice within a 90 mile radius of where they did their residency. PCSOM has established 4 residency programs and is in the accrediting stage on three others (not including EM here in Pikeville). We are also in the process of getting AOA accreditation for several MD programs in IN, KY, VA, TN, MS, AR, and NC. These programs were targeted since they were in underserved areas. We already have other MD programs accredited (check our website www.pc.edu.)

PCSOM has also sent students to prestigious residencies like Cleveland clinic etc, however the majority of our students stay in rural areas in Primary care fields just like the stated mission. Also, why is it that PCSOM is the only school establishing new residency programs. I have seen a few new ones pop up mostly from OUCOM and TCOM, but really no new openings from the more established schools. There is still a huge deficient of Osteopathic residencies yet some schools continue to increase class size with no plans of increasing # of residencies (UHS increased class size thirty spots without even the accreditation to do so).

Back to Pikeville. We recently signed a deal with FIVE southern states(LA, AR, MS, AL, GA) to increase our class size ten spots with students from these states. These states realized that we were the best at producing primary care docs for underserved areas. I don't think they would have dished out government funds on a school that is too new to consider. We have already entered discussions with MD programs about AOA accreditation and are talking with other hospitals about establishing AOA residency programs in the five states. Our OPTI director is very good at his job.

It is frustrating when people ask questions like this because it always leads to some uneducated answers. It is even more frustrating to see people rate your own first class school in the hesitant catergory when we are in fact way ahead of where we should be. PCSOM is in fact responsable for the very existence of EVVCOM. They would not have recieved initial accreditation from the AOA if we had not let them in our OPTI. This clearly illustrates our commitment to Appalachia.

Other schools have practices that should definitely be questioned, but I won't mentioned them here. I will say that some of the schools seem to be more into the business of making money rather than training quality docs. Therefore, my list of schools to attend would be much different from the previous ones listed. Sorry if I came off as too harsh. This was not meant as a personal attack against Quinn. Sorry if it seems that way.
 
True in most cases (referring to the fact that what school you attend does not matter in terms of residency selection).

The one exception that I know of involves where I work.

Children's Hospital of Philadelphia (CHOP)

In terms of pediatric residency, it is extremely difficult to get into CHOP and Children's Hospital, Boston. Both are well regarded and highly ranked (in USNews, the 3rd rank pediatric hospital doesn't even come close to the scores of CHOP and Boston)

Every year, they get close 2,000 applicants (MDs and DOs) for just 37 residency spots

What a member of the residency selection committee told me when I was deciding which medical school to attend was this:

Choose which ever medical school you feel best suit your needs and desires. There is no bias against DOs here or anywhere that I know of. However, there is one thing that you might want to consider. Since all of our applicants have high board scores and lots of EC while in medical school, we sometimes have to pick based on their overall class standing and what school they're in. I have never heard of UNECOM or Nova before, so I don't know how to evaluate you based on your class standing. I don't know if it is similar to being #1 at Hopkins or #1 at SLU. And with thousands of applications to go through, it is just easier to pass it than to ask people what they know about these schools.

Is it possible to get interviews at these highly competitive places? YES. Do you need to go to a reputable (whatever your definition of it is) medical school to get the interview? NO. Will it help? Definately. It helps if the selection committee knows your school, the curriculum, and past students/alumni.

Anyway, being in Philadelphia, he knows about PCOM and UMDNJ-SOM. Those are the DO schools off the top of his head that he could list. I didn't probe further because I had work to do :(

Group_theory
Penn Class of 2003 - Biochemistry/Chemistry/Physics
PCOM Class of 2007
 
Group-therapy-

Your point is similar to mine. Of course a Philadelphia residency would be more prone to taking PCOM students... because of the geographic location. A program director or a residency director knows of the school and has likely seen some of the students or other residents who are from PCOM.

Likewise, if you went to University of FL, or University of Miami, in any of their residencies, you will likely find PD's who are much more familiar with NSUCOM than PCOM or UNECOM.

If you go to Washington state, I bet they're more familiar with AZCOM, Touro, COMP or any of the schools out in that area. Is it because they're better schools or have been aroudn for X number of years? No. Its because they've seen those students before... how many UNECOM or PCSOM students likely rotate out there?

Pikevillemedstudent-
Its great that you are in support of your school. But don't go around saying that there are no other DO programs that start up residencies. NSUCOM has done the same (off the top of my head, I know they started an ortho residency, geriatrics fellowship, and a bunch of other residencies/fellowships when I was a 2nd year... unfortunately I cannot quote you how many spots it was or the exact # of programs... although I don't think its necessary that I get you exact #s).

The original post said out of which of the DO schools would you most want to attend. I gave my OPINION... and my opinion is just that. I am in a similar position as many of the pre-meds now... is it good to join a program from its start? Univ of S. FL is starting an EM residency this year... and if I rank it first, I will likely get the spot. Do I want to be part of a residency that is just starting? Do I want to be around for all the growing pains? Or would I rather just try for a residency that has 20+ yrs of experience (EM is a new field). Pros and cons to all the arguements. In regards to medical school, I, personally, would rather go to a school that has been around for a while... just so the residency arena atleast knows the geographic location of my school.

JPHazel-
I know the article you refer to. It has a list of like 20 things that PDs adn RDs look for in candidates. Medical school attended is at the tail end of that list.

I am about 2/3 of the way through the interview trail... and many times I ask the PDs and RDs their opinion. Thankfully, in Emergency Medicine, everyone is laid back and very informal (character trait of most EM physicians). The major criteria are... (obviously), grades, board scores, clinical rotations, LORs. The other unseen criteria are your personality, your work ethic, if they can get along with you... I even asked one PD if the school attended had any effect on his interview list or ROL. He said "that don't mean $hit, I dont' care about that."

When you're workign 12 hours in the ED... you dont' give a flying fark about what school they were from. WHen you're up to your elbows in charts-to-be-seen... you just want someone good.

I will say that FMGs and IMGs have a harder time getting residency spots/interviews than MDs or DOs. Of course you coudl say that "see, Quinn, I told you the medical school makes a difference." Well. You got me.

Rockandroll-
I think you're right. I just remembered that the new library was being built. It looked pretty good on teh pictures on the wall. I guess I'll see it when I come down in January for boards.

And the room that I fouled out with my juices was on the left. take a left into the left sided rooms... and it was the 2nd or 3rd room on your left. Don't worry it doesn't smell like fish.
 
When I was trying to make my decision between Nova and PCOM, I had a lot of people tell me that I should go to PCOM because it is "more reputable." However, from reading these boards and from talking to other people, I learned exactly what Quinn has been saying.... that the med school you go to has no effect on which residency you get or where you will practice once you are finished everything. A lot of people who know nothing about medicine told me I was wrong.... Like my cousins who go to Wellesley for undergrad who think that just because they go there, they are going to be the best of the best in the real world. But honestly, who cares about all of this? My brother went to Slippery Rock, a state school in Western PA, and got offered a job at Morgan Stanley for financial stuff before he even graduated from there. And when I'm out practicing, if a patient doesn't want me to see them because of where I went to school or even because I'm a DO, then that's their problem, not mine.

Okay, now that I've gone off on a tangent, I'll get to my point. I told my grandparents and anyone else who had a problem with my decision that up here in PA, no one has ever heard of Nova. And down in Florida, I doubt people know about PCOM. Quinn seems to be right about this.

Anyway, when I go to Nova this summer, I'll definitely stay away from that room that Quinn is talking about.
 
I would go the med school you felt the most comfortable with. I'm going to PCSOM, not because it was the only school I could get into, but because I felt at home there. The professors are awesome, staff great, and every student I talked too seemed to love it. Also, it dosen't matter where you go...what matters is your grades and comlex scores. Each school is going to teach the same material and it's you, the student that must put forth the effort to learn the material. Remember each school has flaws, and each school has it's pluses...but in the end we all get the same quality of education.
 
I agree with the previous. best to go with the school you are most comfortable with. Its quite risky really to let your choice (your life chaging choice) to be swayed by peoples' opinions about which school sucks or which school is great. Its persuasive b/c its opinion, but really thats all it is, opinion. I'm a third year DO student deep in the heart of rotations and I can tell you a few things that I've learned.

1) The farther you get along in the medical thing, the less it matter which medical school you went to. In the same way that what high school you went to matter little by the time you graduated from college and how your B.S. degree from IVY U turned into exactly that (BS) once you take your first Neuro/Pharm/Micro/This wasnt in the notes Exam. What really matters is the person. I've worked with DO and MD students from all over (UCSF, AZCOM, my own school, Back east, down south, whatever), but if you dont work at it and your attitude sucks...well it becomes really obvious really fast. And the same is true for the docs i've worked with. I've worked with Stanford docs who were questionable and hobunk DO docs who like Hippocrates himself (and viceversa of course). When you get out there, all that degree stuff is just fancier paper to put on the wall.

2) I've have had to be reminded about opinions too often now that I'm clinical. I here too much of "oh that doctor is a jerk" or the "er staff is mean" or "this rotation is easy" and its difficult not to be influenced. but too often i find that my assessment of the sitution was completely different from who ever said what. And I had gone into the situation with a biased preconception. Unless the person actually has attended a particular school for at least a year (the longer the better), I would take that person's opinion with a whole lot of salt....at least 1000grains/kg. and even then I'd use some serious judgement I think i could say things about my school, but not even the schools I interviewed at and was accepted to. Bottom line is that medical efficacy is based on case studies or flawed experiments...use that same sorta mentality when making this kind of important choice.

3) Once you get there, take it seriously b/c at times its not easy and also because I'll have to work with you and you better know what you're doing. But also remember that having a career does not equal having a life. So try and have as much fun as possible. I suggest going to Europe for 16 weeks...suggestions: Bruges, Belgium; Cinque Terre, Italy; Croatia, Spain in general, Paris, Prague, Budapest (all the usual suspects), But not Marsielle, FR. That city is a cess pool. Of course thats just my Opinion..............
 
At this stage, any school that will take me :)

Haha, but if I had my way, Kirksville.
 
hey blike,

why kirksville??? Just curious:D
 
Originally posted by jd star
And down in Florida, I doubt people know about PCOM.
Click to expand...

Doubt that's true.

NOVA OPTI has the following schools, followed by the school that the DME (Director of Medical Education) attended:

Westchester General Hospital: DMUCOM

Columbia Hospital West Palm Beach: NYCOM

Florida Hospital - East Orlando: DMUCOM

Georgia Osteopathic Institute: The Medical Center: PCOM

Miami Children's Hospital: UNTHSC-COM

Miami Heart Insitute & Medical Center: PCOM

Mt Sinai Medical Center of FLorida: NSUCOM

North Broward Hospital District: PCOM

NSU, North Broward - Geriatrics: UNECOM

Palm Beach Country Health Department: NSUCOM

Palmetto General Hospital: NSUCOM

Sun Coast Hospital: CCOM

University Community Hospital - Carrolwood: KCOM


COUNT: NYCOM - 1, CCOM - 1, KCOM - 1, UNTHSC-COM - 1, UNECOM - 1, DMUCOM - 2, NSUCOM - 3, PCOM - 3



A search of osteopathic physicians working in the immediate area as NSUCOM shows only 4 schools represented. NSUCOM (obviously), PCOM, MSUCOM, and DMUCOM.

NSUCOMs Dean is a PCOM grad.

Chair of Internal Mewdicine is a PCOM grad.

Chair of OB/GYN is a PCOM grad.

Chair of Pediatrics is a PCOM grad.

Chair of Surgery went to KCOM, but did residency in Philadelphia.

Surgery Department: Anesthesiology: PCOM grad.
Surgery Department: Urology: PCOM grad.

Nephrology: PCOM grad.

Pulmonary Medicine: PCOM grad.

Radiology: residency at PCOM.
Professor Emeritus: PCOM grad.

Wasn't NSUCOM also founded by PCOM grads?

Seems to me that PCOM is very well known and extremely well represented in Florida. In fact, Des Moines has even more of a showing that PCOM and NSUCOM.

Don't get me wrong. For the 21 years that NSUCOM has been around, they have graduated some excellent doctors and don't a great deal for the name of osteopathic medicine in Florida.

As far as the public not knowing about PCOM, that is really insignificant as far as educational and residency reasons.

Have a good holiday
 
Mr. JPHazelton -

I didn't really mean about hospitals, etc. in Florida knowing about PCOM. I just meant the general public. I know that doesn't really mean anything, but I was just saying that. I know that PCOM is a great school and well-represented all over the country. I guess my main point of saying that was just to say that I don't care what the general public says about either school... and I know that most of what matters is how I will feel at that school.

By the way, you have way too much time on your hands over your break to look up all that info. And the Dean of NSU-COM is also a graduate of my undergrad school (and yours too :) ) where he received his first doctorate degree, but yet when I interviewed there, I had to explain why I was a biology major at a pharmacy school and tell them the different programs at my school so they understood.

Anyway, JP - Don't mess with me. I know where you live... And you're just upset because you're gonna miss me when I go to Florida next year. :)

Happy Holidays to you and everyone else!
 
Originally posted by jd star


Anyway, JP - Don't mess with me. I know where you live... And you're just upset because you're gonna miss me when I go to Florida next year. :)
Click to expand...

:D

You got me.

:)
 
Originally posted by JPHazelton
:D

You got me.

:)
Click to expand...


Good. Merry Christmas.... I'll see you (hopefully) after the winter break. :)
 
Quinn...I thought you were a guy? Did you get a sex change?:D
 
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