Opps, my +1.00 readers failed me; hehehe!
Opps, my +1.00 readers failed me; hehehe!
No need for prism, I'm an Optometrist! I just do my calculations & adjust my PDs for that prismatic effect
Maybe because you are under the assumption that an attending has to be a medical doctor?
Merriam-Webster Definition:
: serving as a physician on the staff of a teaching hospital.
If I were at your teaching facility, I would be an attending and you...still the resident! I personally know of ODs who also are faculty and ATTENDINGS at ophthalmology teaching institutions.
So how about getting over yourselves...trust me, it makes for a MUCH better physician/surgeon!
In the United States, an attending physician (also known as an attending, or staff physician) is a physician who has completed residency and practices medicine in a clinic or hospital, in the specialty learned during residency.
So how about getting over yourselves...trust me, it makes for a MUCH better physician/surgeon!
Because I was also working part time at a teaching hospital at the time I joined.
Outside of surgery, how is an ophthalmologist's healing different than an optometrist? Medicine is not just pills & needle pricks, even though it seems that's all you godly MDs seem to retain from school. Aside from surgery, in the office you are no different than me except for who has more breadth of knowledge and artful skill.
As was stated in a previous thread, this is all about turf. I would have more respect if you would just admit that and stop pretending.
As for the title, I don't need it to define me. I'll change it to stand proud of who I am: an Optometric Physician
!I doubt if you can find even FEW ophthalmologists that can match my care, which I believe should be standard. I take pride in my service, so yes some of us call ourselves optometric physicians. Because we EARNED it.
Obviously it should not be an MD because there is a big conflict of interest there. The professions collectively decide and provide rationale, proof of training, competence etc.
Podiatrists all have differing scopes in different states. Some states they are limited to the foot, others can do up to the knee, some states they can do some hand surgeries. They have proven their competent and showed they are trained to handle such.
Outside of that, its just plain as day TURF WAR.
Huh? In what universe are podiatrists doing HAND surgery? That's news to me.
I can't fathom seeing a podiatrist if I needed surgery on my hand.
The reality is whenever the examples of podiatrists and dentists doing all sorts of surgical procedures (and NO they have no Medical School training) is brought up in an argument to show that you could have a 4 yr residency after an OD program to produce an eye surgeon, the OMD, MD, or whoever you are talking to never wants to acknowledge it. They just change the subject because that reality is telling. OMD's are just protecting their profession and don't want to admit that OMFS's and DPM's safely performing surgery for years with no real medical school training in their respective dental and podiatric schools. Both of these surgeons go to a 3-4 yr residency program after dental and podiatry school.
One example of a 4-yr oral surgery residency with the requirement for the program being a DDS/DMD degree NOT an MD.
http://www.whcenter.org/body.cfm?id=639 (80% of OMFS docs have the 4 yr residency and no MD)
Dental students are not trained "systemically" in the same sense as medical students---not even close rather they are trained in a focused area of dental medicine with systemic relationships just like optometry and podiatry...... I took most of my hardest basic science courses along side with the dental students.....
Dental, optometric, and podiatry doctoral programs are NOT equivalent to medical school they are just different. If I was an OMD I probably would be just as protective and hostile about the idea of an optometric surgery residency but I am not lol...so I support the other side. It is what it is.
Recently I had a very interesting conversation with a general ophthalmologist about this very subject. This OMD was an attending at a rotation I was on and basically layed it out very simply, "Ophthalmologists deep down , many of them, not all, feel that they had to go through a longer and tougher road to get to where they are. Most of them aren't even aware of your training or really even care about it. Even though Oral Surgeons went to dental school and most did only a 4 yr residency following that, they do not directly compete with any medical field most of the time. Generally, I just think that we are just protecting our turf whether or not another "pathway" could be established. There really is no need for it as the way things are now with OD's doing most of the primary care and us doing surgery and complex care works well." This is not word for word but almost exactly what she said! I would just like someone on SDN's Ophthalmology forum here to be honest and just say that they feel deep down that as an OMD they are superior to OD's and they don't want them cherry picking surgery from them.......I for one am really tired of all of this maneuvering, "patient safety" scare tactics, and hubris. I know that is how some of these OMD's feel ---> I have overheard them talk and I have been told to my face by one older OMD that we should be basically refracting and that is it! This is after I told him that OD's can prescribe oral medicines in 47 states...He flipped out! LOL And yes, I interact with a lot of OMD's and most of them are great.
Optometry is at fault here too in regard to their perception in the ophthalmology community with some of the OD's I know sending out simple things rather than treating them to reap more profits from the optical. I know 2 optometrists in the area that really treat nothing medical and send out basically every "red eye" they see. In the process they are making all of us look bad because the majority of OD's I know practice some form of medical optometry. The further I get into this profession of optometry (ultimately being the primary eye doctor) I realize that this nonsense between OMD's and OD's will NEVER end. I am actually really sick of it. And although I don't agree with 90% of what KHE says I do agree with him on the concept that most OD's want nothing to do with surgery--that is very true because the economic reward is just not there when you have a group of established ophthalmic surgeons. Most of the OD's just want to be able to practice at the level they were taught. In my case that would include periocular injections. I am just going to "take the good/ leave the bad" and practice medical optometry at the highest level that I can ( 4 year OD degree, 1 year residency, board certification (ABO--new entity 2009), glaucoma fellowship (new entity--2009). I will learn everything I can from the OMD's I encounter so I thank them wholeheartedly in advance.
The US got jobbed in the World Cup game against Slovenia!!!!!!
The reality is whenever the examples of podiatrists and dentists doing all sorts of surgical procedures (and NO they have no Medical School training) is brought up in an argument to show that you could have a 4 yr residency after an OD program to produce an eye surgeon, the OMD, MD, or whoever you are talking to never wants to acknowledge it. They just change the subject because that reality is telling. OMD's are just protecting their profession and don't want to admit that OMFS's and DPM's safely performing surgery for years with no real medical school training in their respective dental and podiatric schools. Both of these surgeons go to a 3-4 yr residency program after dental and podiatry school.
One example of a 4-yr oral surgery residency with the requirement for the program being a DDS/DMD degree NOT an MD.
http://www.whcenter.org/body.cfm?id=639 (80% of OMFS docs have the 4 yr residency and no MD)
Dental students are not trained "systemically" in the same sense as medical students---not even close rather they are trained in a focused area of dental medicine with systemic relationships just like optometry and podiatry...... I took most of my hardest basic science courses along side with the dental students.....
Dental, optometric, and podiatry doctoral programs are NOT equivalent to medical school they are just different. If I was an OMD I probably would be just as protective and hostile about the idea of an optometric surgery residency but I am not lol...so I support the other side. It is what it is.
Recently I had a very interesting conversation with a general ophthalmologist about this very subject. This OMD was an attending at a rotation I was on and basically layed it out very simply, "Ophthalmologists deep down , many of them, not all, feel that they had to go through a longer and tougher road to get to where they are. Most of them aren't even aware of your training or really even care about it. Even though Oral Surgeons went to dental school and most did only a 4 yr residency following that, they do not directly compete with any medical field most of the time. Generally, I just think that we are just protecting our turf whether or not another "pathway" could be established. There really is no need for it as the way things are now with OD's doing most of the primary care and us doing surgery and complex care works well." This is not word for word but almost exactly what she said! I would just like someone on SDN's Ophthalmology forum here to be honest and just say that they feel deep down that as an OMD they are superior to OD's and they don't want them cherry picking surgery from them.......I for one am really tired of all of this maneuvering, "patient safety" scare tactics, and hubris. I know that is how some of these OMD's feel ---> I have overheard them talk and I have been told to my face by one older OMD that we should be basically refracting and that is it! This is after I told him that OD's can prescribe oral medicines in 47 states...He flipped out! LOL And yes, I interact with a lot of OMD's and most of them are great.
Optometry is at fault here too in regard to their perception in the ophthalmology community with some of the OD's I know sending out simple things rather than treating them to reap more profits from the optical. I know 2 optometrists in the area that really treat nothing medical and send out basically every "red eye" they see. In the process they are making all of us look bad because the majority of OD's I know practice some form of medical optometry. The further I get into this profession of optometry (ultimately being the primary eye doctor) I realize that this nonsense between OMD's and OD's will NEVER end. I am actually really sick of it. And although I don't agree with 90% of what KHE says I do agree with him on the concept that most OD's want nothing to do with surgery--that is very true because the economic reward is just not there when you have a group of established ophthalmic surgeons. Most of the OD's just want to be able to practice at the level they were taught. In my case that would include periocular injections. I am just going to "take the good/ leave the bad" and practice medical optometry at the highest level that I can ( 4 year OD degree, 1 year residency, board certification (ABO--new entity 2009), glaucoma fellowship (new entity--2009). I will learn everything I can from the OMD's I encounter so I thank them wholeheartedly in advance.
The US got jobbed in the World Cup game against Slovenia!!!!!!
