OMFS hopeful - Horrible gpa/class rank, but good CBSE (74). How is this combo viewed?

[shousen2]

Does a decent/high CBSE score make up for a poor class rank?

My rank/gpa is atrocious compared to most OMFS applicants. I'm probably right at the 50/60th percentile or lower, for my class.

I studied for, and took the CBSE though, and got a 74.

I've been told I'm sh** out of luck - but do you guys think my CBSE score makes up for my rank a little? Think I have a shot at 6 year programs?

Honestly, the grading at my school is so messed up - exams only have like 40-50 questions - missing 2 or 3 questions drops you a grade. The averages on exams are so high (low 90s), I gave up 1st year trying to memorize all the stupid little facts, and focused instead on understanding the underlying concepts - which is probably why my CBSE is so high.

Seriously - whats the *actual* difference between someone who scored a 41 and someone who scored a 44? In reality, their knowledge base is probably the exact same - this is probably why most medical schools are pass fail (and purportedly why the NBDE is now pass fail too)

Alot of medical residencies don't even care about pre-clinical grades, just step 1 scores for med applicants. So why do Oral Surgery residencies (which are often linked to hospitals/med schools) care about preclinical grades/rank so much, and don't just weight the CBSE more?

You guys think some directors will be willing to overlook my rank? Or am I stuck doing an internship?

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[DaleDoback]

Does a decent/high CBSE score make up for a poor class rank?

My rank/gpa is atrocious compared to most OMFS applicants. I'm probably right at the 50/60th percentile or lower, for my class.

I studied for, and took the CBSE though, and got a 74.

I've been told I'm sh** out of luck - but do you guys think my CBSE score makes up for my rank a little? Think I have a shot at 6 year programs?

Honestly, the grading at my school is so messed up - exams only have like 40-50 questions - missing 2 or 3 questions drops you a grade. The averages on exams are so high (low 90s), I gave up 1st year trying to memorize all the stupid little facts, and focused instead on understanding the underlying concepts - which is probably why my CBSE is so high.

Seriously - whats the *actual* difference between someone who scored a 41 and someone who scored a 44? In reality, their knowledge base is probably the exact same - this is probably why most medical schools are pass fail (and purportedly why the NBDE is now pass fail too)

Alot of medical residencies don't even care about pre-clinical grades, just step 1 scores for med applicants. So why do Oral Surgery residencies (which are often linked to hospitals/med schools) care about preclinical grades/rank so much, and don't just weight the CBSE more?

You guys think some directors will be willing to overlook my rank? Or am I stuck doing an internship?

Apply to a wide range. Cast a broad net. Do some externships. We would interview those numbers. People have matched with worse. Good luck.

 

[armorshell]

That's a good score, and a good attitude. I particularly liked this part here:

Honestly, the grading at my school is so messed up - exams only have like 40-50 questions - missing 2 or 3 questions drops you a grade. The averages on exams are so high (low 90s), I gave up 1st year trying to memorize all the stupid little facts, and focused instead on understanding the underlying concepts - which is probably why my CBSE is so high.

Apply widely as double-D's said, and you should get interviews. Probably not everywhere, and probably not everywhere you want, but you'll get interviews. When the issue of your trash class rank comes up, I'd say what you said above, but be careful with how you phrase it. To generalize, OMS hate BS, and hate excuses even more. So you don't want it to sound like an excuse. Something along the lines of "My strategy for my pre-clinical years was definitely not a very good one for getting fantastic grades. I focused more on the fundamental concepts and I didn't see until later that strategy didn't work under my schools grading system. However, it did pay off later in that I had a great base of knowledge to build on when I studied for the CBSE."
Take the credit for your mistakes and I think you'll find you'll get way more points.

Seriously - whats the *actual* difference between someone who scored a 41 and someone who scored a 44? In reality, their knowledge base is probably the exact same - this is probably why most medical schools are pass fail (and purportedly why the NBDE is now pass fail too)

I personally have issues with the use of the CBSE as an entrance exam because it's not statistically validated for such a use, but the reality is most program directors do not see it like I see it. What you describe here is standard error of measurement (SEM) and that can be calculated for any test. Know what your score means, and feel free to educate when you interview. The SEM of the CBSE for example is 3, meaning for an individual test taker, there's a 68% chance your score would fall in the range of 71-77 on any given day. It also means there's a 95% chance it would fall between 68-80. Correlation r-values between CBSE and USMLE Step 1 ranges from around .5-.8 in most studies,which represents a moderate to good correlation, and the NBME feels confident enough in that to even publish a conversion chart. This means, even on your worst day, statistically you're very likely to pass USMLE Step 1. This means one less potential headache for a 6-year program director.

Alot of medical residencies don't even care about pre-clinical grades, just step 1 scores for med applicants. So why do Oral Surgery residencies (which are often linked to hospitals/med schools) care about preclinical grades/rank so much, and don't just weight the CBSE more?

Why do oral surgery residencies care about pre-clinical grades? I'm not so sure if they do. Despite whatever causative theory you subscribe to, there seems to be a predilection of residents in oral surgery from P/F dental schools, which would seem to indicate program directors do not see dental school grades as particularly predictive. If a program director does think they're important, and still accepts residents from P/F schools, that represents some kind of cognitive dissonance.

 

[CanaDMD]

That's a good score, and a good attitude. I particularly liked this part here:



Apply widely as double-D's said, and you should get interviews. Probably not everywhere, and probably not everywhere you want, but you'll get interviews. When the issue of your trash class rank comes up, I'd say what you said above, but be careful with how you phrase it. To generalize, OMS hate BS, and hate excuses even more. So you don't want it to sound like an excuse. Something along the lines of "My strategy for my pre-clinical years was definitely not a very good one for getting fantastic grades. I focused more on the fundamental concepts and I didn't see until later that strategy didn't work under my schools grading system. However, it did pay off later in that I had a great base of knowledge to build on when I studied for the CBSE."
Take the credit for your mistakes and I think you'll find you'll get way more points.



I personally have issues with the use of the CBSE as an entrance exam because it's not statistically validated for such a use, but the reality is most program directors do not see it like I see it. What you describe here is standard error of measurement (SEM) and that can be calculated for any test. Know what your score means, and feel free to educate when you interview. The SEM of the CBSE for example is 3, meaning for an individual test taker, there's a 68% chance your score would fall in the range of 71-77 on any given day. It also means there's a 95% chance it would fall between 68-80. Correlation r-values between CBSE and USMLE Step 1 ranges from around .5-.8 in most studies,which represents a moderate to good correlation, and the NBME feels confident enough in that to even publish a conversion chart. This means, even on your worst day, statistically you're very likely to pass USMLE Step 1. This means one less potential headache for a 6-year program director.



Why do oral surgery residencies care about pre-clinical grades? I'm not so sure if they do. Despite whatever causative theory you subscribe to, there seems to be a predilection of residents in oral surgery from P/F dental schools, which would seem to indicate program directors do not see dental school grades as particularly predictive. If a program director does think they're important, and still accepts residents from P/F schools, that represents some kind of cognitive dissonance.

That last part : are you saying what I think you're saying? Does going to a P/F school technically mean you have higher chances of being accepted into oms?

 

[agent2362]

Yes you can definitely do OMS! Of course this is cliche but 'where there is a will there is a way.' I have almost the exact same stats as you (middle of my class at UoP and a 73 on the CBSE) and I am starting my 4 year OMS training near Seattle in a couple months. However let me throw in some lessons I learned from my multiple mistakes along the way.

First my background: I am a military dentist several years in at a base in Texas that had an OMS program. My constant exposure to this program renewed my interest in OMS and kept the dream alive. I also had several OMS attending that wrote good letters of recommendation based off their experience with me and my drive to join OMS. I applied once before to the military and was rejected, but second time did it. I also applied to civilian OMS programs and received interviews at both 4 and 6 year programs but was accepted at the military OMS first and had to sign my contractual agreement before match, which limited me in postmatch interviews (didn't matter since I didn't match).

Some of the lessons I learned along the way.
1. Prepare for the fact that you might not match, so have your app ready to send out on match day. Also, even more importantly, keep your grades up in case you end up having to do an internship in OMS.

2. get your PASS application completed with letters of recommendation sent and all additional forms sent ASAP. Some programs start handing out interviews in August. I didn't finish my application until very late and that may have impacted the # of interviews I received.

3. Apply very broadly, as in 50+ schools. Sure it's expensive, but I never would have predicted the places that gave me interviews in a million years. Also you need about 7-8 interviews to have a 90% chance of matching. However, nothing is guaranteed as I saw someone match to San Antonio (with Ellis) with only 1 interview and another guy (#2 in his class and a CBSE score of 80) with 12 interviews who didn't match.

4. Extern in as many places as possible. You can get letters of recommendation from these places and submit them directly to these programs in addition to your PASS letters from your own dental school OMS PD. Ultimately one of my interviewers ended up calling another OMS attending at my base who knew me. Their conversation played a significant part in my acceptance.

5. Do your research and put your best foot forward at every single interview, even if you have 10+ interviews. Good performance during an interview at a program is no guarantee. Be humble and admit your mistakes, like armorshell advised

Ultimately you MAY have to do an internship in OMS in order to match. If you aren't willing to do an internship, then I would question your motivations to enter OMS. Best of luck. Feel free to PM me with any specific questions.

 

[vellnueve]

I was ranked like 50-something out of over 150 and my CBSE was low 60s and still got interviews at 5 out of the 8 I applied to. Like agent I'm also military and got letters from military dentists and specialists so my experience (like his) will vary from yours.

I will echo his thought of getting everything in as early as possible. My last letter didn't get in until about a week before the first deadline and it could have cost me an interview or two on the schools that cut off early. I would definitely recommend externing, both locally and at programs that you're highly interested in. I'd look at 4 and 6 year programs - preaching from pre-dents, dental students, and others aside, the fact of the matter is that your scope of practice will almost certainly be the same once you finish school - most doctors referring to you won't care whether you're dual degreed or not. The strong CBSE won't hurt you with the med schools, though.

Don't blame your dental school program. Honestly, the testing regimen sounds very similar to other programs. Own the fact that you didn't do well early and point at signs of positive progression in your grades and performance.

Finally, keep trying. It took me four tries until the .mil selected me, but they rewarded me for the persistence with outservice training. I think I could have had many more interviews had I applied to more than 8 programs but I applied to the ones I was most interested in. If you have the money, definitely apply to any program that you'd be willing to attend.

 

[armorshell]

That last part : are you saying what I think you're saying? Does going to a P/F school technically mean you have higher chances of being accepted into oms?

Nope! I even qualified my statement to help illustrate the subtle difference. It's the difference between "There are a lot of people in OMFS residency from P/F schools" and "Going to a P/F school helps you get in to residency." Those statement are not mutually exclusive, but you can believe the first without believing the second.

 

[CanaDMD]

Nope! I even qualified my statement to help illustrate the subtle difference. It's the difference between "There are a lot of people in OMFS residency from P/F schools" and "Going to a P/F school helps you get in to residency." Those statement are not mutually exclusive, but you can believe the first without believing the second.

I see what you're saying... However, going to a non P/F fail puts you inherently at a disadvantage if you aren't part of the top x in your school

that isn't possible in P/F schools now is it o.o

My school isn't P/F; I feel a ton of pressure to perform lol

 

[agent2362]

I see what you're saying... However, going to a non P/F fail puts you inherently at a disadvantage if you aren't part of the top x in your school

that isn't possible in P/F schools now is it o.o

My school isn't P/F; I feel a ton of pressure to perform lol

Based off my very limited personal experience and contact with others, yes I agree. If you aren't top 20-30% at your school, then your rank hurts you (even with a high CBSE score) and it would be better to be at a pass/fail school. Case in point: I had average grades and CBSE in the 70s and STRUGGLED to get into a 4 year program. A friend of mine in the military went to a P/F program and had a similar CBSE score in the 70s and he matched to... wait for it.... PARKLAND. A third mutual friend of ours had a top 10% rank and a low CBSE score (sub 60) and he matched to San Antonio (I have heard that Ellis prefers high class rank over just high CBSE).

At the end of the day, program directors have different ideas of what they value in candidates. Some 6 year programs are limited by the medical schools as to who they can accept. One program I interviewed at in the midwest could not rank candidates unless they had at least a 67 on the CBSE (and that's why they had 2 unmatched spots this last cycle). Personally at the end of the day, I wish I had cared more about my class rank at UoP...or even better, just have gone to a P/F school (damn, I shouldn't have skipped my interview at Columbia).

 

[Bereno]

I kinda look at grades, exam scores, and letters of rec like a system of checks and balances... If all three are there, then I imagine that the applicant is golden. If one or more are not, then a few flags might be raised. The thing is that very few people have all three in perfect order. Like Armor said, own your shortcomings - never give an excuse. Be aware of your shortcomings, so that you know how to manage them.

 

[CMistry]

You are not SOL. You may have to do an internship. If your personality is half decent, which it seems to be from your attitude, you will match. OMFS isn't as hard to match into as people lead you to believe.

 

[CanaDMD]

You are not SOL. You may have to do an internship. If your personality is half decent, which it seems to be from your attitude, you will match. OMFS isn't as hard to match into as people lead you to believe.

That's a suprising statement, no?

 

[armorshell]

I see what you're saying... However, going to a non P/F fail puts you inherently at a disadvantage if you aren't part of the top x in your school

that isn't possible in P/F schools now is it o.o

My school isn't P/F; I feel a ton of pressure to perform lol

I don't think there's anything inherent about it. Does it put you at a disadvantage vs. P/F schools? Maybe? If I'm evaluating two applicants and candidate A has grades and is ranked in the middle of their class and candidate B has no grades and no rank, how am I supposed to compare those two people based on that metric?

To be internally consistent, there are only really two options, depending on your outlook on the importance of rank and pre-clinical and clinical grades:
1. If you believe grades and rank are an important part of a residency candidates application: Rule out candidate B entirely on the premise that they are missing a key part of their application.
2. If you believe grades and rank are an unimportant part of a residency candidates application: Eliminate the consideration of candidate A's rank/grade status as irrelevant and compare the two applicants based on other criteria.

 

[CanaDMD]

I don't think there's anything inherent about it. Does it put you at a disadvantage vs. P/F schools? Maybe? If I'm evaluating two applicants and candidate A has grades and is ranked in the middle of their class and candidate B has no grades and no rank, how am I supposed to compare those two people based on that metric?

To be internally consistent, there are only really two options, depending on your outlook on the importance of rank and pre-clinical and clinical grades:
1. If you believe grades and rank are an important part of a residency candidates application: Rule out candidate B entirely on the premise that they are missing a key part of their application.
2. If you believe grades and rank are an unimportant part of a residency candidates application: Eliminate the consideration of candidate A's rank/grade status as irrelevant and compare the two applicants based on other criteria.

Do schools actually use one of these two options? If not, how do they actually determine who's more qualified for the spot; let's assume both candidates, for example, have the same CBSE and interview score, ;o

 

[Golfguy]

I don't think there's anything inherent about it. Does it put you at a disadvantage vs. P/F schools? Maybe? If I'm evaluating two applicants and candidate A has grades and is ranked in the middle of their class and candidate B has no grades and no rank, how am I supposed to compare those two people based on that metric?

To be internally consistent, there are only really two options, depending on your outlook on the importance of rank and pre-clinical and clinical grades:
1. If you believe grades and rank are an important part of a residency candidates application: Rule out candidate B entirely on the premise that they are missing a key part of their application.
2. If you believe grades and rank are an unimportant part of a residency candidates application: Eliminate the consideration of candidate A's rank/grade status as irrelevant and compare the two applicants based on other criteria.

Nice breakdown.

I think the thing that's missing (and hard to quantify) is the extra resources one can use to spend on standardized exams when they only simply have to pass. I think a smart director would expect higher CBSE scores from those with pass/fail curriculums and a med school pre-clinical regimen.

 

[Bereno]

Nice breakdown.

I think the thing that's missing (and hard to quantify) is the extra resources one can use to spend on standardized exams when they only simply have to pass. I think a smart director would expect higher CBSE scores from those with pass/fail curriculums and a med school pre-clinical regimen.

Being that I am about to graduate from one of those P/F schools, I will say that the idea of "simply passing" is a misleading one, for sure. Passing is a very tough thing to do at my school! Here, they focus on letting you learn in a community setting - they do not want us to find our classmates as rivals or obstacles that get in the way of our class rank. That said, they also know that with no class rank, some might be inclined to "simply pass", so they make passing pretty damn hard on its own. Most of my classmates are plenty stressed at exam time because they have a legit fear of failing, not just getting a good grade. I have seen many people on this forum say how just passing dental school is easy if you want, and that might be true for many schools out there, but it is certainly not the case for UConn. Just my $0.02

 

[CanaDMD]

Being that I am about to graduate from one of those P/F schools, I will say that the idea of "simply passing" is a misleading one, for sure. Passing is a very tough thing to do at my school! Here, they focus on letting you learn in a community setting - they do not want us to find our classmates as rivals or obstacles that get in the way of our class rank. That said, they also know that with no class rank, some might be inclined to "simply pass", so they make passing pretty damn hard on its own. Most of my classmates are plenty stressed at exam time because they have a legit fear of failing, not just getting a good grade. I have seen many people on this forum say how just passing dental school is easy if you want, and that might be true for many schools out there, but it is certainly not the case for UConn. Just my $0.02

Lol, so you think just passing in grade schools is easier? Certainly not at my school! Getting good grades is a whole other story

 

[Bereno]

Lol, so you think just passing in grade schools is easier? Certainly not at my school! Getting good grades is a whole other story

Just like most dental students, I have only attended one dental school. That said, after attending for 4 years, and meeting many people at many other dental schools, I hold the belief that "just passing" here at UConn is decidedly more difficult than "just passing" at most (definitely not all) dental schools. Note that this has nothing to do with getting good grades since, I would not know much about that haha.

 

[CanaDMD]

Just like most dental students, I have only attended one dental school. That said, after attending for 4 years, and meeting many people at many other dental schools, I hold the belief that "just passing" here at UConn is decidedly more difficult than "just passing" at most (definitely not all) dental schools. Note that this has nothing to do with getting good grades since, I would not know much about that haha.

Fair enough!

 

[AmishForeskin]

I would argue that if you go to a school that historically does well on the CBSE then your score needs to be in line with your peers'. If you go to a school like mine that does not expose you to the medical curriculum then a good score would prob be different, and I feel like comparing both is like comparing apples to oranges.

 

[Sublimazing]

I would argue that if you go to a school that historically does well on the CBSE then your score needs to be in line with your peers'. If you go to a school like mine that does not expose you to the medical curriculum then a good score would prob be different, and I feel like comparing both is like comparing apples to oranges.

That's definitely true, but are program directors actually doing this? I can't see them giving preference to a 68 from UIC over a 78 from Columbia. Who knows.

And programs that require you to pass Step 1 before July 1st would likely universally take the higher score since they aren't evaluating score potential, they want a sure bet. These programs also fall victim to over valuing CBSE score at the expense of the things that actually make a good resident.

To the OP: it's been said above, you'll match for sure if you apply broadly. Won't hurt to be prepared for the scramble though.

 

[kyak]

OP, I'm in a similar spot when applying. Except a little ****tier. GPA isn't great (3.1). CBSE 66. EC/research/extern/shadow/CV is solid. Class rank 50%.

I'll be thrilled if I can land an interview. I'd be shocked if I match. And I'll be damned if that's gonna make me change my plans.

What it comes down to is what Agent said above = does a NonCat Intern year really seem like the end of the world? Because for me it sounds like a great opportunity to learn - a realistic one, and absolutely necessary in my case. And while I'm sure I'll be exhausted as **** for those extra 4, errr wait +MD so 6, No wait, +Intern 7 years of training out of dental school, there is absolutely nothing else I would rather do with my life.

My dental school friends will have made their first mil, will be hanging out on the golf course every other day by the time I even approach my OMFS chief year. Not sure how you feel about that, but I feel Fan****inTastic, like I'd be getting the sweeter end of the deal, hands down, no contest. I'll be doing what I love, gloves all bloody, fixing people's faceholes.

I used to be scared that I wouldn't match first time around, and I'd have to go do a NonCatIntern year. Now I realize: that I almost surely won't match, that I might be lucky to get that 1yr internship, and that more than a first-cycle residency match what I really want for christmas will be, 5/10/15 years from now at 2am in the ED, to still be as passionate about being a quality and caring surgeon as I am today.

If you reflect on it, you might realize that you really aren't afraid of not matching. You might realize like I did, that you are actually just afraid that your true fear is that your passion will wane during the extra year or 2 or 3 that it takes to match into a categorical position.

....Hope to see you on the interview trail OP.

 

[CanaDMD]

OP, I'm in a similar spot when applying. Except a little ****tier. GPA isn't great (3.1). CBSE 66. EC/research/extern/shadow/CV is solid. Class rank 50%.

I'll be thrilled if I can land an interview. I'd be shocked if I match. And I'll be damned if that's gonna make me change my plans.

What it comes down to is what Agent said above = does a NonCat Intern year really seem like the end of the world? Because for me it sounds like a great opportunity to learn - a realistic one, and absolutely necessary in my case. And while I'm sure I'll be exhausted as **** for those extra 4, errr wait +MD so 6, No wait, +Intern 7 years of training out of dental school, there is absolutely nothing else I would rather do with my life.

My dental school friends will have made their first mil, will be hanging out on the golf course every other day by the time I even approach my OMFS chief year. Not sure how you feel about that, but I feel Fan****inTastic, like I'd be getting the sweeter end of the deal, hands down, no contest. I'll be doing what I love, gloves all bloody, fixing people's faceholes.

I used to be scared that I wouldn't match first time around, and I'd have to go do a NonCatIntern year. Now I realize: that I almost surely won't match, that I might be lucky to get that 1yr internship, and that more than a first-cycle residency match what I really want for christmas will be, 5/10/15 years from now at 2am in the ED, to still be as passionate about being a quality and caring surgeon as I am today.

If you reflect on it, you might realize that you really aren't afraid of not matching. You might realize like I did, that you are actually just afraid that your true fear is that your passion will wane during the extra year or 2 or 3 that it takes to match into a categorical position.

....Hope to see you on the interview trail OP.

A lot of what you say is true. Appreciated your post.

However, I truly believe the only people who are able to think of it in such a lovely way are the dental students who are not completely crushed in debt, with a family to support NOW. That extra year may make them think twice... Am I wrong? Sometimes you've got to say to yourself, is my passion worth putting my family through an EXTRA ****ty year with me being basically not there, on top of all the other ****ty years in the normal omfs residency? Dunno. It's a grey line in my book.

 

[vellnueve]

OP, I'm in a similar spot when applying. Except a little ****tier. GPA isn't great (3.1). CBSE 66. EC/research/extern/shadow/CV is solid. Class rank 50%.

I'll be thrilled if I can land an interview. I'd be shocked if I match. And I'll be damned if that's gonna make me change my plans.

What it comes down to is what Agent said above = does a NonCat Intern year really seem like the end of the world? Because for me it sounds like a great opportunity to learn - a realistic one, and absolutely necessary in my case. And while I'm sure I'll be exhausted as **** for those extra 4, errr wait +MD so 6, No wait, +Intern 7 years of training out of dental school, there is absolutely nothing else I would rather do with my life.

My dental school friends will have made their first mil, will be hanging out on the golf course every other day by the time I even approach my OMFS chief year. Not sure how you feel about that, but I feel Fan****inTastic, like I'd be getting the sweeter end of the deal, hands down, no contest. I'll be doing what I love, gloves all bloody, fixing people's faceholes.

I think you're overestimating what new dentists are making and underestimating the amount of time it takes many to pay off their debt.

 

[OMFSunited]

@OP or @kyak any updates about your oms path?
i am in similar predicament and wanted to see what has happened since you posted

 

[kyak]

@OP or @kyak any updates about your oms path?
i am in similar predicament and wanted to see what has happened since you posted

out on the trail this year for categorical, meeting my colleagues and looking at programs as places to learn and work and heal. how about you all?

 

[FutureDoc15342]

out on the trail this year for categorical, meeting my colleagues and looking at programs as places to learn and work and heal. how about you all?

Are you doing an internship currently? How did eveyrthing go for you? i'm in a similar position as you and need some motivation gah

 

[FutureDoc15342]

Does a decent/high CBSE score make up for a poor class rank?

My rank/gpa is atrocious compared to most OMFS applicants. I'm probably right at the 50/60th percentile or lower, for my class.

I studied for, and took the CBSE though, and got a 74.

I've been told I'm sh** out of luck - but do you guys think my CBSE score makes up for my rank a little? Think I have a shot at 6 year programs?

Honestly, the grading at my school is so messed up - exams only have like 40-50 questions - missing 2 or 3 questions drops you a grade. The averages on exams are so high (low 90s), I gave up 1st year trying to memorize all the stupid little facts, and focused instead on understanding the underlying concepts - which is probably why my CBSE is so high.

Seriously - whats the *actual* difference between someone who scored a 41 and someone who scored a 44? In reality, their knowledge base is probably the exact same - this is probably why most medical schools are pass fail (and purportedly why the NBDE is now pass fail too)

Alot of medical residencies don't even care about pre-clinical grades, just step 1 scores for med applicants. So why do Oral Surgery residencies (which are often linked to hospitals/med schools) care about preclinical grades/rank so much, and don't just weight the CBSE more?

You guys think some directors will be willing to overlook my rank? Or am I stuck doing an internship?

How did everything go for you?

 

[futuresurgeon00]

Are you doing an internship currently? How did eveyrthing go for you? i'm in a similar position as you and need some motivation gah

I'm a bit confused about the whole internship/residency part for dentistry. I understand the process in medicine, but am still quite confused about the dental equivalents.

Is it mandatory to complete an internship before a residency? If it isn't mandatory, why do people choose to do it and what benefit/value does it add? Is it possible to apply and jump straight into a residency? (I understand that some of these questions are a bit redundant, but I'm just trying to clarify everything).

 

[Manic324]

I'm a bit confused about the whole internship/residency part for dentistry. I understand the process in medicine, but am still quite confused about the dental equivalents.

Is it mandatory to complete an internship before a residency? If it isn't mandatory, why do people choose to do it and what benefit/value does it add? Is it possible to apply and jump straight into a residency? (I understand that some of these questions are a bit redundant, but I'm just trying to clarify everything).

It is not necessary. Internships are just there for those that do not match into a residency and need something to do in the meantime that will strengthen their application, or to give omfs a test run for one year before committing to a 4 or 6 year residency/ rest of their career in omfs.