Number of Residency program applications

[kmoogs]

Just out of curiosity, what is considered a good number of programs to apply for? I've heard anything from 4-5 up to 10-15 programs (assuming the applicant is interested in all the programs and not just blindly applying).

Probably a little late to ask this but I was just curious what people think.

edit: I applied to about 13 because I was more on the cautious side and felt it was better to be safe than sorry/regret not applying for more.

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[EML9255]

I did the same as you.

I still haven't heard back from 10 and I'm feeling super anxious about it

 

[GoldfishPharmD]

When I applied for a PGY-1, it was to 13 programs. Most were big name programs. I ended up getting 4 interview, and I didn't match. I had to scramble in the end. If I had to do it over again, I would have spent more time researching some of the smaller programs out there that aren't associated with big name academic centers. I think 7-10 programs with varying degrees of competitiveness is a good number.

 

[kmoogs]

When I applied for a PGY-1, it was to 13 programs. Most were big name programs. I ended up getting 4 interview, and I didn't match. I had to scramble in the end. If I had to do it over again, I would have spent more time researching some of the smaller programs out there that aren't associated with big name academic centers. I think 7-10 programs with varying degrees of competitiveness is a good number.

I guess a follow-up question would be, are East Coast programs more/less/equally competitive than West Coast programs? I wasn't able to find statistics on this during my research but the overall feeling I got from asking around was that East Coast was more competitive because of the lower density of PGY-1 programs and higher density of graduates ... basically a numbers game in the wrong direction. But since I couldn't find any evidence, it's mostly hearsay from other pharmacists and students, which could mean it's completely unsubstantiated and just perpetually propagating through the grapevine.

 

[Kenzi11611]

I guess a follow-up question would be, are East Coast programs more/less/equally competitive than West Coast programs? I wasn't able to find statistics on this during my research but the overall feeling I got from asking around was that East Coast was more competitive because of the lower density of PGY-1 programs and higher density of graduates ... basically a numbers game in the wrong direction. But since I couldn't find any evidence, it's mostly hearsay from other pharmacists and students, which could mean it's completely unsubstantiated and just perpetually propagating through the grapevine.

In my viewpoint, big name academic medical centers are competitive regardless of the coast they are located on. Also based on my experience this year, I have two co-residents that specifically applied to places that have the PGY-2 they were interested in so they could early commit....seemed like at Midyear a lot of interest in PGY-1 applicants in the early commit process, which could make places with PGY-2 spots more competitive.

I applied to 4 places and interviewed at 3. Was all about location for me and that's why I didn't apply to more. I didn't view myself as a very competitive candidate so I would have avoided the big name places anyways.

 

[Tink14]

I applied to 9 programs... I'm starting to think I should've applied to more though. All of them are spread between two major cities that are fairly saturated and competitive. I did apply to some smaller hospitals in addition to a couple large academic MCs.

 

[Dred Pirate]

I applied to 9 programs... I'm starting to think I should've applied to more though. All of them are spread between two major cities that are fairly saturated and competitive. I did apply to some smaller hospitals in addition to a couple large academic MCs.

I hear this a lot - small hospitals are back up programs (not saying that is what you think). I work in a large community hospital (400+ beds) but surrrounded by large well know "brand name" teaching institutions - many of our applicants apply to us and "them". We have always matched with residents (newer program - 4 years old) in our top 4. There are a LOT of qualified applicants out there - so thinking I will apply to a small hospital that is my back up can backfire on you unless you tailor your letter of intent to make us think you want a community hospital and not say that you want to teach in a large academic institution because it will be very evident that you are not interested in us other than a backup - you won't get the job, likely won't get an interview

 

[constantvariabl]

I applied to 7 programs last year for PGY-1. All had a PGY2 in my interest and were all big academic medical centers. In the end, I was probably over ambitious with some of the programs (they all have PGY2s in several specialties) and I only interviewed at 3 programs. Ironically, they were my top 3 going into the interview process anyways. I ended up not matching and had to scramble. This year, I applied to 6 programs (kind of geographically restricted this year).

 

[GoldfishPharmD]

I applied to 7 programs last year for PGY-1. All had a PGY2 in my interest and were all big academic medical centers. In the end, I was probably over ambitious with some of the programs (they all have PGY2s in several specialties) and I only interviewed at 3 programs. Ironically, they were my top 3 going into the interview process anyways. I ended up not matching and had to scramble. This year, I applied to 6 programs (kind of geographically restricted this year).

This is what happened to me last year. I got lucky and found a spot in the scramble. I got lucky. I love my program and had the rotations I really wanted. If I had to do it again, I would apply to a range of programs. Not just top tier programs that can get anyone they want.

 

[dftpnk]

I applied to 7 programs last year for PGY-1. All had a PGY2 in my interest and were all big academic medical centers. In the end, I was probably over ambitious with some of the programs (they all have PGY2s in several specialties) and I only interviewed at 3 programs. Ironically, they were my top 3 going into the interview process anyways. I ended up not matching and had to scramble. This year, I applied to 6 programs (kind of geographically restricted this year).

Ugh, I am terrified that this will happen to me. Applied to 7 programs with 5 of them being top tier programs and got interviews at 4. Hoping the pharmacy gods are on my side for this.

 

[kmoogs]

Ugh, I am terrified that this will happen to me. Applied to 7 programs with 5 of them being top tier programs and got interviews at 4. Hoping the pharmacy gods are on my side for this.

What exactly are top tier programs? Its not like there are any rankings and a top tier hospital reputation doesn't necessarily translate to a good pharmacy residency experience. I don't really see residency programs in tiers but rather as community hospitals vs academic/school associated teaching hospitals vs teaching hospitals (vs Kaiser vs VA vs etc).

Is this more student perception and word of mouth than anything else?

 

[dftpnk]

What exactly are top tier programs? Its not like there are any rankings and a top tier hospital reputation doesn't necessarily translate to a good pharmacy residency experience. I don't really see residency programs in tiers but rather as community hospitals vs academic/school associated teaching hospitals vs teaching hospitals (vs Kaiser vs VA vs etc).

Is this more student perception and word of mouth than anything else?

there are certainly programs (MUSC, UK, UNC, UCSF, Hopkins, etc) that have a well documented, lengthy, track record for training exceptional practitioners. Also, many websites will list where their previous residents have gone... I think this speaks for itself. I agree with you though, just because you are at a prestigious hospital/institution doesn't mean the pharmacy training will be exceptional.

 

[Chillz87]

I applied to 7 programs last year for PGY-1. All had a PGY2 in my interest and were all big academic medical centers. In the end, I was probably over ambitious with some of the programs (they all have PGY2s in several specialties) and I only interviewed at 3 programs. Ironically, they were my top 3 going into the interview process anyways. I ended up not matching and had to scramble. This year, I applied to 6 programs (kind of geographically restricted this year).

Same stats for me. Applied to 7 well-known academic medical centers, received 3 interviews and ended up scrambling in the end. I was fortunate to match with a program in the scramble. This year I applied to 7 PGY-2 programs.

 

[kmoogs]

This thread is making me nervous ... several (nearly all) of my interviews are at well-known "brand name" academic teaching hospitals and non-profit teaching hospitals in each of their regions. All these stories about not matching and having to scramble ... ahhhhh!

 

[GoldfishPharmD]

Same stats for me. Applied to 7 well-known academic medical centers, received 3 interviews and ended up scrambling in the end. I was fortunate to match with a program in the scramble. This year I applied to 7 PGY-2 programs.

How are you doing with your PGY2 interviews? Sometimes, I get worried there will be a repeat of last year. I applied to 8 places, and I got 4 interviews, 2 rejections, 2 unknowns. So, I'm 50/50 thus far.

 

[constantvariabl]

How are you doing with your PGY2 interviews? Sometimes, I get worried there will be a repeat of last year. I applied to 8 places, and I got 4 interviews, 2 rejections, 2 unknowns. So, I'm 50/50 thus far.

Same here! I applied to 6 pgy2s and have 3 interviews, 1 rejection (which I just got yesterday... Makes me think I was high on the next to interview list if someone drops out) and 2 unknowns. I really wish I would hear something from those 2 so I know where I stand. I actually tried to diversify ny application pool this year and apply to some less well known institutions but all the ones I considered early committed
First interview is Monday!

 

[dftpnk]

This thread is making me nervous ... several (nearly all) of my interviews are at well-known "brand name" academic teaching hospitals and non-profit teaching hospitals in each of their regions. All these stories about not matching and having to scramble ... ahhhhh!

it's a tough situation. theoretically you could interview at 15 places even and if you aren't ranked high enough by any of them you still won't match

 

[Tink14]

I hear this a lot - small hospitals are back up programs (not saying that is what you think). I work in a large community hospital (400+ beds) but surrrounded by large well know "brand name" teaching institutions - many of our applicants apply to us and "them". We have always matched with residents (newer program - 4 years old) in our top 4. There are a LOT of qualified applicants out there - so thinking I will apply to a small hospital that is my back up can backfire on you unless you tailor your letter of intent to make us think you want a community hospital and not say that you want to teach in a large academic institution because it will be very evident that you are not interested in us other than a backup - you won't get the job, likely won't get an interview

I actually would not mind being at a smaller institution. I don't have any paid hospital experience, so I believe I might fit better in a more "intimate" setting. My goals aren't to teach in a large academic setting. I believe I can reach my goals with the experience I would get caring for patients in a smaller setting as well. Yes, it might be nice to precept students, and participate in a lot of different educational programs, but I think I can get the experiences I want from any of the programs I applied to. That is why I chose them. I may have chosen a little too carefully. Maybe if I had broadened my horizons I would've received more invites, but perhaps not. I think I would rather not match, versus matching somewhere that I am not very interested in. I can always re-apply. I have seen more "non-traditional" applicants than I had expected there to be.

 

[Silvermist]

it's a tough situation. theoretically you could interview at 15 places even and if you aren't ranked high enough by any of them you still won't match

This happened to someone I know... and they were interviewed by more than 15 programs =X

 

[Silvermist]

What exactly are top tier programs? Its not like there are any rankings and a top tier hospital reputation doesn't necessarily translate to a good pharmacy residency experience. I don't really see residency programs in tiers but rather as community hospitals vs academic/school associated teaching hospitals vs teaching hospitals (vs Kaiser vs VA vs etc).

Is this more student perception and word of mouth than anything else?

It's also important to see where these folks get hired on afterwards. There is a very large medical center near me that is quite open about their desire to poach residents (after they've finished residency of course) from another nearby program because they are so well trained in certain areas that are important to that hospital. So it's word of mouth and reputation in that regard.

 

[kmoogs]

This happened to someone I know... and they were interviewed by more than 15 programs =X

Bad luck?

 

[PharmBeanz]

If someone interviewed at 15 places and still didn't match I'd say the issue is with the individual...

 

[Chillz87]

How are you doing with your PGY2 interviews? Sometimes, I get worried there will be a repeat of last year. I applied to 8 places, and I got 4 interviews, 2 rejections, 2 unknowns. So, I'm 50/50 thus far.

I think I have been extremely lucky so far. I applied 7, received 7 interviews, and declined 1. I think PPS was a huge contributing factor and of course, lots of luck. However, I keep replaying the morning I received the email of "You have not matched". :/ My first interview is this friday. Have you started yours already?

 

[Silvermist]

Bad luck?

I'm assuming they're a bad interviewer? But I don't really know honestly. I got the sense these were all top places as well so that could have contributed too.

 

[GoldfishPharmD]

I think I have been extremely lucky so far. I applied 7, received 7 interviews, and declined 1. I think PPS was a huge contributing factor and of course, lots of luck. However, I keep replaying the morning I received the email of "You have not matched". :/ My first interview is this friday. Have you started yours already?

Wow congrats! What PGY2 are you applying to (if it's not secret ). I remember that moment too. I was extremely heart broken. I was on vacation on the time with my friend, and I get the email at like 6AM (I couldn't sleep). It was very rough. I had my first interview early this week. I don't think it went to well. I have 3 more pretty much one right after the other. Hopefully, those go a lot better.