Minimum MCAT requirements

[darkandtwisty]

I know that OCPM has a minimum MCAT requirement of a 22. Do any of the other schools have a cut off like OCPM?

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[dtrack22]

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[darkandtwisty]

OCPM has no minimum MCAT cutoff. Just because their website says they have a minimum (and I believe it just says to be a competitive applicant) doesn't mean you should believe it.

If the average MCAT at OCPM is 22, doesn't someone have to have below a 22? Of course. Even the mighty DMU let's in one or two sub 20's every year.

I was thinking the same thing, if there's an average of 22 there must be lower. But then I kept reading and it said you must meet their minimum requirement of a 22. Kind of confusing...

 

[bchsde]

You can get into some schools with a 17, 18, or 19 if everything else is there (GPA, shadowing experiences, volunteer, work experience, and other things) and you rock your interview!!! Don't get discouraged by numbers. If you are confident this is what you want to do and know you can make it happen, apply and see what happens! If you don't make it, it's just a set back, and you can always try again!

 

[RATM2010]

You can get into some schools with a 17, 18, or 19 if everything else is there (GPA, shadowing experiences, volunteer, work experience, and other things) and you rock your interview!!! Don't get discouraged by numbers. If you are confident this is what you want to do and know you can make it happen, apply and see what happens! If you don't make it, it's just a set back, and you can always try again!

True but anything <21 will limit where you can apply. For example, TEmple's mcat average last year was 24 acording to Mr. Martin. If the +/-2 rule is in effect, puts you at a min 22 to be competitive. Also, Temple won't accept a score less than 5 or 6. Pretty sure it is 5, but in reality 6 on any singlem section. I'm confused on the ocpm thing too. I know someone interviewing there with a 16. That's pretty far from their "21-22" min. Also, it is rare that you get rejected post interview. So that means this guy has >70% chance of getting into that school.

 

[dtrack22]

I'm confused on the ocpm thing too. I know someone interviewing there with a 16. That's pretty far from their "21-22" min.

I see the wheels turning!

All anyone has to understand is that with the current applicant pool, admissions is an arms race. There aren't enough "quality" applicants to go around. If some of the schools were to be honest, they risk turning off a number of applicants. Does anyone really believe that Ohio has placed 100% of their students into residency programs for the last 22 years? That's what their website claims...

What they don't understand is that most of the pre-pods don't care about a program's credentials. They might as well just be honest with all of us.

 

[footlove123]

what are your chances of getting into a school once you get an interview?

 

[hightower]

what are your chances of getting into a school once you get an interview?

I believe you have a good shot if your interview goes well. If they give you an interview they are interested in you. Prepare well for the interview. I went in a little too relaxed and they started asking me several complex questions and I really had to think on my feet. I had heard most pod interviews were laid back but I went out of mine feeling a little nervous even though I thought I interviewed fairly well. Not much small talk or chit chat from my interviewers. With that said, don't freak out and melt down if they ask you something difficult or something you have not thought of. Stop, take a breath, think about it, then come up with your best answer.

 

[DrGonz]

High tower,
what kind of complicated questions were asked? Did they talk to you about the new health bill and topics like that or was it more broad based questions?(why you want to be a pod, what made you choose this school, why are you better over other people..etc)

 

[tinabina]

That is the average MCAT score. The only school that I do know that has a minimum requirement for MCAT is CSPM and that is a 16!!!

 

[dyk343]

That is the average MCAT score. The only school that I do know that has a minimum requirement for MCAT is CSPM and that is a 16!!!

If you cant get a 21 on the mcat (which is a terrible score) your chances of passing the boards are slim to none. A 16 is a joke. The national average for the MCAT is something like a 24. I'm curious how many students CSPM would let in with a 16. Maybe if you had a high gpa... maybe.

 

[tinabina]

If you cant get a 21 on the mcat (which is a terrible score) your chances of passing the boards are slim to none. A 16 is a joke. The national average for the MCAT is something like a 24. I'm curious how many students CSPM would let in with a 16. Maybe if you had a high gpa... maybe.

I don't mean to be rude but how do you know someone who gets a 16 (which I agree isn't very impressive) won't pass his/her boards. There could be a million excuses for that score and that's what the interview is for. I don't think the MCAT is very indicative of how you will do on your boards.

 

[dyk343]

I don't mean to be rude but how do you know someone who gets a 16 (which I agree isn't very impressive) won't pass his/her boards. There could be a million excuses for that score and that's what the interview is for. I don't think the MCAT is very indicative of how you will do on your boards.

A standardized test is a standardized test. Sure, some may pull through but if you can not summate all the information that you have learned over 2 years of basic science courses and pass the MCAT (I consider a 16 an ultimate fail) then you will likely fail the boards as well as it is the same idea, only different information.

Again, maybe some will pull thru but a 16 is atrocious.

 

[tinabina]

A standardized test is a standardized test. Sure, some may pull through but if you can not summate all the information that you have learned over 2 years of basic science courses and pass the MCAT (I consider a 16 an ultimate fail) then you will likely fail the boards as well as it is the same idea, only different information.

Again, maybe some will pull thru but a 16 is atrocious.

I respect that you feel that way. Atrocious as it may be, its still what they have as their minimum score to get in (to that school). As I said, there could be a million reasons for that score. What if that person got nervous and had diarrhea while taking it and scored that? Seriously. I would never judge someone because they got a 16 on a standardized score and say they don't have a chance at passing boards. It's absurd.

 

[dyk343]

I respect that you feel that way. Atrocious as it may be, its still what they have as their minimum score to get in (to that school). As I said, there could be a million reasons for that score. What if that person got nervous and had diarrhea while taking it and scored that? Seriously. I would never judge someone because they got a 16 on a standardized score and say they don't have a chance at passing boards. It's absurd.

That is when you re-take the MCAT. I'm pretty sure I could crap my pants mid test and still score at least 16 or more.

Im not budging on my opinion. But thats what online message boards are for. Opinions. If I got a 16 I would not matriculate until I knew I could handle the material and or pass boards.

 

[dyk343]

The MCAT really has no bearing on how you will do on your boards. Sure it is a standardized test but the real boards aren't going to have a verbal section and it will be strictly science. A lot of students are able to cash in on the points via the verbal section. If anything, your science scores on the MCAT might be more indicative of your potential to handle the basic science years in podiatry school.

IMO, doing well in your first two years of school will show if you can pass boards or not.

I agree with this. However a 16 is too low and students should not be accepted with that score. It does not give our profession a good name.

 

[tinabina]

That is when you re-take the MCAT. I'm pretty sure I could crap my pants mid test and still score at least 16 or more.

Im not budging on my opinion. But thats what online message boards are for. Opinions. If I got a 16 I would not matriculate until I knew I could handle the material and or pass boards.

Ok, well that is YOUR opinion and I respect it but I won't budge on mine either.

 

[Xforward22]

OCPM has no minimum MCAT cutoff. Just because their website says they have a minimum (and I believe it just says to be a competitive applicant) doesn't mean you should believe it.

If the average MCAT at OCPM is 22, doesn't someone have to have below a 22? Of course. Even the mighty DMU let's in one or two sub 20's every year.

I was wondering what you meant by the might DMU? Does it have the best reputation or something? Is it known to enter the brightest applicants? Just curious b/c I still have no idea what school I want to go to and want to get a feel for which are the most/least competitive and why.

 

[dtrack22]

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[dtrack22]

I've actually done a two year post-bacc program where I took medical school level courses.

Do you want a cookie?

Wether you like it or not, the admin at your school LOVE to talk about CLEAR and the HPL. Is it a great program/facility/opportunity? Absolutely. But it isn't light years ahead of many other programs...which is what Scholl would like you to believe.

All I said was that the adcom at Scholl tends to exaggerate the amount/benefits of research at their program, but there are still more opportunities at Scholl than other programs. What about that isn't true?

 

[dtrack22]

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[bonvivant07]

In my opinion, a 16 is way too low. That is just like don't even go there. how can u have gone through 4 years of undergrad and don't know how to take a test and get above a 16? Then no, don't use that stupid " i'm not a test kind of person" as an excuse!!!!!!!!!!

MCAT isn't a trick like the math questions on the SAT or the logic in LSAT! It is straight forward. Bio- exposure and recall facts

Physics-know the theory and formulas

Gen chem- know theories and basic ideas and conversions

orgo- know the synthesis.

So tell me, if you cant get above a 16, how can u pass Pod school classes? Or memorize and know all the Pod anatomy facts if you can't memorize gen chem theories?

 

[tinabina]

In my opinion, a 16 is way too low. That is just like don't even go there. how can u have gone through 4 years of undergrad and don't know how to take a test and get above a 16? Then no, don't use that stupid " i'm not a test kind of person" as an excuse!!!!!!!!!!

MCAT isn't a trick like the math questions on the SAT or the logic in LSAT! It is straight forward. Bio- exposure and recall facts

Physics-know the theory and formulas

Gen chem- know theories and basic ideas and conversions

orgo- know the synthesis.

So tell me, if you cant get above a 16, how can u pass Pod school classes? Or memorize and know all the Pod anatomy facts if you can't memorize gen chem theories?

Uh, have you even taken the MCAT? Bio is one section and Chem/Physics are another section. Do you forget there is a VERBAL section as well that is not based on memorization! ALSO, it's a TIMED test! Do not be so quick to judge! This is why people take the exam more than once! It's a lot more than just memorization. Now, don't get me wrong, a 16 is an awful score but I would not be so quick to judge and I'm only stating the FACTS! 16 is their minimum, this is fact...it's not like I made this up.

 

[dyk343]

ALSO, it's a TIMED test!

So are NBPME.

The other poster, as well as myself, are not arguing with you that the 16 is the minimum for that school. We are unhappy that they even look at that score for a possibility of acceptance, or minimum requirement. If someone got a 16 because they had a bad day... fine. But they should have to retake that exam. If someone were to apply to an MD/DO school with a 16 they would get laughed at. I highly doubt they would ask if you just had a bad test day. In fact, they wouldnt get that far. The application would already be in the shredder.

I (as already stated) truthfully believe that if someone took 4 years of undergraduate courses (or at least the 90 required for admissions) and can only score a 16... Their chances of passing the boards are against them. But if someone did get a 16 because they did had a bad test day for what ever reason, retook the exam at a later time, and got a 25+ then this argument is over.

 

[darkandtwisty]

So I've spoken to the schools and here is the feedback I got from them:

OCPM = Minimum 22 Mcat
Temple = Minimum is 18 with a verbal score of at least 5
Scholl = Does not have a minimum but prefers to see at least a 19
NYCPM = Minimum is a 19
CSPM = Minimum is 16
Barry = Minimum is 15, average is 18
DMU = No cut off

I am not sure about AZPod or Western

 

[bonvivant07]

Thanks for the research Darkandtwisty!

"Uh, have you even taken the MCAT? Bio is one section and Chem/Physics are another section. Do you forget there is a VERBAL section as well that is not based on memorization! ALSO, it's a TIMED test! Do not be so quick to judge! This is why people take the exam more than once! It's a lot more than just memorization. Now, don't get me wrong, a 16 is an awful score but I would not be so quick to judge and I'm only stating the FACTS! 16 is their minimum, this is fact...it's not like I made this up."

No, I have not taken it yet. But my boyfriend has, so I have been exposed to all the material and I know what all the sections are. The verbal section is pretty much like the verbal section of the SAT or ACT. as long as you read regularly, I don't see how you won't do at least average.

And I completely agree with dyk343, if you have done all the pre-req, then you should be able to ace a 16 as long as you prepare for the mcat. Come on, we have all experienced prepping for standardized tests before (SAT, ACT, AP) If you have A's or B's on your science pre-req but can't muster at least a 16? Then I would strongly suspect what kind of college you went to.

 

[emericana]

Thanks for the research Darkandtwisty!

"Uh, have you even taken the MCAT? Bio is one section and Chem/Physics are another section. Do you forget there is a VERBAL section as well that is not based on memorization! ALSO, it's a TIMED test! Do not be so quick to judge! This is why people take the exam more than once! It's a lot more than just memorization. Now, don't get me wrong, a 16 is an awful score but I would not be so quick to judge and I'm only stating the FACTS! 16 is their minimum, this is fact...it's not like I made this up."

No, I have not taken it yet. But my boyfriend has, so I have been exposed to all the material and I know what all the sections are. The verbal section is pretty much like the verbal section of the SAT or ACT. as long as you read regularly, I don't see how you won't do at least average.

And I completely agree with dyk343, if you have done all the pre-req, then you should be able to ace a 16 as long as you prepare for the mcat. Come on, we have all experienced prepping for standardized tests before (SAT, ACT, AP) If you have A's or B's on your science pre-req but can't muster at least a 16? Then I would strongly suspect what kind of college you went to.

I agree that there should be a minimum, and that the MCAT should be required because if you are going to be operating on people (which you will be doing as a pod resident) you need to be smart.

however some people are just not good at standardized tests... myself being one of them. i am taking the MCAT on Jan 29th and am scared ****less.... studying a lot too (full time).

Got a 3.1 GPA and 3.1 Sci so I was pretty much a "B" student in college with a Mol Bio degree.

I think what is hardest for me is that I have been out of school working for two years so I have not looked at the materials in ages.

 

[bobdolerson]

Aren't the boards standardized?

I'm not saying a 16 on the MCAT means you can't hack it in school, but if a 16 on the MCAT is representative of how much you know, it would seem pretty likely that performance would suffer, especially considering the mcat-content-heavy courses during the first 2 years.

If the 16 is mostly due to nerves it would seem wise to retake it, and find something to do to calm yourself the day of the exam.

 

[tinabina]

darkandtwisty- you are so awesome for posting that. I was very curious.

 

[darkandtwisty]

darkandtwisty- you are so awesome for posting that. I was very curious.

Thanks! I figured it was some valuable information that others would want to know too!

 

[FuturePharm21]

so what is the MCAT avg for podiatry schools? some websites said 21-22, but the higher ranking schools said 25-26...

basically its for premed students that can't get into medical school...sorry its the truth, like it or not.

 

[RATM2010]

so what is the MCAT avg for podiatry schools? some websites said 21-22, but the higher ranking schools said 25-26...

basically its for premed students that can't get into medical school...sorry its the truth, like it or not.

I got into Ross school of medicine and chose podiatry school over it. You are going to get flamed for your comments. Personally, I think you are trolling.

 

[DrGonz]

so what is the MCAT avg for podiatry schools? some websites said 21-22, but the higher ranking schools said 25-26...

basically its for premed students that can't get into medical school...sorry its the truth, like it or not.

ha ha ... I applied to 4 pods and 2 DO' schools. I got interviews at everyone of them. Got acceptance at a DO, but chose pod. Choose your words wisely before bashing a profession.

 

[TheFootDoc]

I got into Ross school of medicine and chose podiatry school over it. You are going to get flamed for your comments. Personally, I think you are trolling.

haha flame on!

He's definitely a troll lol. Apparently the kid knows nothing.

 

[SuperFeisty]

In my opinion, a 16 is way too low. That is just like don't even go there. how can u have gone through 4 years of undergrad and don't know how to take a test and get above a 16? Then no, don't use that stupid " i'm not a test kind of person" as an excuse!!!!!!!!!!

MCAT isn't a trick like the math questions on the SAT or the logic in LSAT! It is straight forward. Bio- exposure and recall facts

Physics-know the theory and formulas

Gen chem- know theories and basic ideas and conversions

orgo- know the synthesis.

So tell me, if you cant get above a 16, how can u pass Pod school classes? Or memorize and know all the Pod anatomy facts if you can't memorize gen chem theories?

Errr... The MCAT is hands down the most difficult pre-professional test available in the US... If you think SAT math is tricky, you need to go back to Algebra 1 and start retaking your fundamentals. Bio has almost nothing to do with recalling facts... The MCAT is designed to see if you can APPLY the coursework you take at college... I could memorize every single synthesis for orgo and still completely whiff on the sections... Frankly, if you know your fundamentals pat, you should be able to BS ur way through most of the orgo and come out with a respectable score on bio. You really should take a practice MCAT. Then you will understand.

 

[MaxillofacialMN]

I don't think the MCAT is very indicative of how you will do on your boards.

Eh, I know this thread was bumped by a troll, but I just wanted to say that regardless of you "think," the MCAT actually does significantly correlate to board pass rates.....

 

[Iamyourfaja]

so what is the MCAT avg for podiatry schools? some websites said 21-22, but the higher ranking schools said 25-26...

basically its for premed students that can't get into medical school...sorry its the truth, like it or not.

Sweet post FuturePharm21 - Enjoy filling prescriptions at CVS all day. Sounds like fun.

Some podiatry students couldn't get into allopathic or osteopathic medical school based on their scores, some could and chose podiatric medicine. I personally don't think it is a good idea to arrange your life based upon what the average applicant statistics are.

 

[FuturePharm21]

I'm not trying to say podiatry isn't a great profession...I'm stating the reality of it: people with lower stats end up choosing other professions besides medicine and THIS INLCLUDES ME...granted some people say I want to be a DPM from high school, but I haven't heard of 13 year olds saying they want to be podiatrists...

in the end, I'm just frustrated with my own stats and no disrespect to any particular career....healthcare is a team of professionals working to help people and I get that, but honestly, medicine is insanely difficult to get accepted to while it's significantly easier to get into a podiatry school

 

[TheFootDoc]

I'm not trying to say podiatry isn't a great profession...I'm stating the reality of it: people with lower stats end up choosing other professions besides medicine and THIS INLCLUDES ME...granted some people say I want to be a DPM from high school, but I haven't heard of 13 year olds saying they want to be podiatrists...

in the end, I'm just frustrated with my own stats and no disrespect to any particular career....healthcare is a team of professionals working to help people and I get that, but honestly, medicine is insanely difficult to get accepted to while it's significantly easier to get into a podiatry school

Cheer up. Please tell us something we don't already know.

Stop drawing attention to yourself and go work on fixing your frustrating stats. Good luck

 

[Iamyourfaja]

I'm not trying to say podiatry isn't a great profession...I'm stating the reality of it: people with lower stats end up choosing other professions besides medicine and THIS INLCLUDES ME...granted some people say I want to be a DPM from high school, but I haven't heard of 13 year olds saying they want to be podiatrists...

in the end, I'm just frustrated with my own stats and no disrespect to any particular career....healthcare is a team of professionals working to help people and I get that, but honestly, medicine is insanely difficult to get accepted to while it's significantly easier to get into a podiatry school

Who cares if entrance stats are lower? Do you honestly think the percentage of crappy podiatrists is greater than the percentage of crappy DO/MD's? Do you really think podiatry school is easier than MD/DO school?

Other people's scores should be totally irrelevant to your chosen profession! The actual training, opportunities in the profession, and your personal desires and goals should be reasons to apply or not to apply to podiatry school.

 

[fivescrew]

Looking at entrance stats to judge the quality of a school or profession is about the worst way anyone could judge them. Why? Because schools have to fill those seats to make money. End of story. Just because someone with cruddy grades and stats gets into any type of professional school doesn't mean they will make it through and in the mean time the school gets all that money.

It's funny to listen to people complain about such things. You think tuition is hard now? Imagine if medical schools, any, let in only the cream of the crop without paying attention to class numbers and the overall big picture.

The DO community is facing something similar in the near future. I've heard they are opening about a dozen new schools. What do you think that will do to their overall stats? They can't fill all those seats with geniuses....

 

[robopod97]

So I've spoken to the schools and here is the feedback I got from them:

OCPM = Minimum 22 Mcat
Temple = Minimum is 18 with a verbal score of at least 5
Scholl = Does not have a minimum but prefers to see at least a 19
NYCPM = Minimum is a 19
CSPM = Minimum is 16
Barry = Minimum is 15, average is 18
DMU = No cut off

I am not sure about AZPod or Western

So much for podiatric schools granting the MD or DO degree. This data answers the question to all of those posts discussing that nonsense.

 

[hematosis]

So much for podiatric schools granting the MD or DO degree. This data answers the question to all of those posts discussing that nonsense.

I don't think the minimum score means much. Most MD schools require a minimum GPA of 2.4, but they wont even look at your apps if its below a 3.0.

 

[RATM2010]

I don't think the minimum score means much. Most MD schools require a minimum GPA of 2.4, but they wont even look at your apps if its below a 3.0.

MD and POD admissions work totally different. Min mcats are legit for pod school. min GPA may flutter for pod, but I doubt it.

 

[hematosis]

MD and POD admissions work totally different. Min mcats are legit for pod school. min GPA may flutter for pod, but I doubt it.

these "minimum" statistics does not mean much as far as application is concerned. A more informative statistics would be that of an AVERAGE.
I would not judge a school based on their minimum GPA or MCAT. If you know anything about how adcoms work, you would know that most schools set their minimum low so that they can attract a lot of applicants (this equals $$).

Now on a side note, i do agree that pod average mcat is probably more closer to the minimum than say DO or MD.

 

[FuturePharm21]

ok so the mcat is LOWER than mostly all the MD and DO schools and similar to caribbean schools, not saying that they don't take people with higher stats, just saying the numbers reflect the common theme: lower mcat average at podiatry schools.

just stating the obvious...don't go crazy on me

 

[MEDCandy]

Looking at entrance stats to judge the quality of a school or profession is about the worst way anyone could judge them. Why? Because schools have to fill those seats to make money. End of story. Just because someone with cruddy grades and stats gets into any type of professional school doesn't mean they will make it through and in the mean time the school gets all that money.

It's funny to listen to people complain about such things. You think tuition is hard now? Imagine if medical schools, any, let in only the cream of the crop without paying attention to class numbers and the overall big picture.

The DO community is facing something similar in the near future. I've heard they are opening about a dozen new schools. What do you think that will do to their overall stats? They can't fill all those seats with geniuses....

OMG great post =) ... It all comes down to money and FuturePharm21 don't be discouraged you can still be a physician (bar you didn't put a time limit on yourself), lots of people repair stats and make it through =)

 

[FiveOVicryl]

Who cares if entrance stats are lower? Do you honestly think the percentage of crappy podiatrists is greater than the percentage of crappy DO/MD's? Do you really think podiatry school is easier than MD/DO school?

Other people's scores should be totally irrelevant to your chosen profession! The actual training, opportunities in the profession, and your personal desires and goals should be reasons to apply or not to apply to podiatry school.

Ask any current Podiatry student and/or MD/DO students and you will find the obvious answer is YES. The only students who will tell you the level of difficulty is the same as DO/MD will be students from Western.

Fact: Pass/fail boards vs scored USMLE/COMLEX, lower entrance stats -> decreased competition

Its time we stop making excuses. We need change in our profession, starting with increasing our admission standards.

 

[BioPod]

Its time we stop making excuses. We need change in our profession, starting with increasing our admission standards.

No one is arguing that. The problem, though, is that there are simply not enough applicants to be that picky.

 

[FiveOVicryl]

No one is arguing that. The problem, though, is that there are simply not enough applicants to be that picky.

The biggest reason why our applicant pool is so small is because the majority of students with strong grades/MCAT are repelled by our LOW admission standards. APMA's attempt to reach out to pre med students is a waste of time and resources. Sure, a few strong students may be swayed towards our field but the vast majority will not think twice due to our abysmally low standards. If anyone with a heart beat and ability to take out loans can get accepted to some of our schools, where is the prestige and the respect that comes with attending Podiatry school?

Solution: We take in less students starting with an immediate 10% reduction at most schools and our admission stats would go up (this may never happen due to stand alone institutions and their financial reasons). If we kept our standards up for 5-10 years, the whole "MD/DO reject" will not be an issue. Once this stigma is removed, our applicant pool will definitely increase and we can then start to increase the number of students we accept again.

This will not be an overnight fix, we will need to make sacrifices now for the overall benefit of the profession.