“Military discount” state License = Restricted License

[John1513]

FYI

Any state medical license that is waived of registration fees/GME requirements as a ‘military appreciation’ is considered a “Restricted” medical license by the Medical Corps.

The military requires at least one Unrestricted state medical license to be valid and good-to-go at all times

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[Cooperd0g]

This is a pretty broad statement that isn’t exactly true. I know plenty of people with Nebraska and Indiana licenses.

 

[John1513]

This is a pretty broad statement that isn’t exactly true. I know plenty of people with Nebraska and Indiana licenses.

@Cooperd0g : please tell me more - do you mean that the Medical Licenses in Nebraska and Indiana are cheap/discounted for military *and* is valid to work as a military doc?

 

[HighPriest]

Also, Texas recently started waiving fees for military, and I know that the Army has accepted those. Echo the Nebraska thing, I know a lot of guys who have Nebraska specifically because they don't have to pay.

 

[John1513]

@HighPriest

Check this out:

A friend of mine was talking about the Texas license.

You pay 800 bucks full price, and apply for a waiver later to be refunded full price after military is verified.

But!

This physician was told by credentialing office: if you get th refund, then that doesn’t count as a “unrestricted” license.

This is in fact, the regular license!

Very confusing.

I’ll check out Nebraska!!! Thank you SDN Fam.

 

[colbgw02]

I don't understand how the DoD gets to decide what is and isn't an unrestricted license. If the state says it's unrestricted, then it is.

 

[Cooperd0g]

That credentials office doesn’t know what they are doing. The state determines if it is an unrestricted license or not. Nebraska waives fees for military, but it is the same license. Indiana waives CME requirements, but it is still the same license.

 

[John1513]

Thank you guys so much!!!!! @Cooperd0g @HighPriest

 

[John1513]

Nebraska and Indiana it is

 

[HighPriest]

Yeah, bro, you gotta learn that you can’t trust people like the credentials office staff. Every military credentials office worker I ever interacted with was lazy as hell, and did half the work of any comparable civilian with the same job. And I promise they made up that regulation, either on the spot or it’s something they made up a long time ago and are just sticking with. Any time a DoD civilian tells you something like that - that doesn’t seem to make any sense at all - you have two choices: let it slide or ask to see the regulation and plan on them getting pissy and fighting you. You just have to decide if it’s a hill you want to fight for.

The state medical licensing website will clearly indicate what licenses are restricted and which are not.

 

[Crabbygas]

Don't know if it's still the case but back when I was military I had a Colorado license. Colorado required proof of malpractice insurance which I didn't need in the military......So the credentials people just had us fill out an extra form saying the only limitation was that we were waived from the insurance requirement. It was no big deal. Seems like this should be a similar thing.

 

[John1513]

Sometimes the most assertive employees can be the most incorrect! Another lesson in us Docs to always “trust but verify”

 

[HighPriest]

Sometimes the most assertive employees can be the most incorrect! Another lesson in us Docs to always “trust but verify”

No. Not at all. Don't trust any civilian employee in the DoD unless and until they've proven that they can be trusted.

 

[TheEarDoc]

I don't understand how the DoD gets to decide what is and isn't an unrestricted license. If the state says it's unrestricted, then it is.

They can't each state licensure board makes their own requirements and rules. The DOD cannot say such a thing because it would be a violation of states' rights and the federal government does not give out license to practice any form of medicine hence why any state licensure will do from any state for employment in the DOD or VA.

 

[pgg]

I don't get it. Why does the military need to know how much money you paid for your license? You'll get a license certificate from the state med board. Either it will say restricted on it or not. You give that to the credentialing people. How is that not the end of the process?

 

[John1513]

I don't get it. Why does the military need to know how much money you paid for your license? You'll get a license certificate from the state med board. Either it will say restricted on it or not. You give that to the credentialing people. How is that not the end of the process?

Hello @pgg I’m not sure but it sure is odd. Somehow a very robust credentialing employee can check to see if we are on any military discounted/fee waived state medical license and somehow that violates some BUMED instruction. I’ve been told that we need at least one fully paid-for state license, and the rest of the other state licenses that we might have may be fee & CME waived type.

 

[Cooperd0g]

Hello @pgg I’m not sure but it sure is odd. Somehow a very robust credentialing employee can check to see if we are on any military discounted/fee waived state medical license and somehow that violates some BUMED instruction. I’ve been told that we need at least one fully paid-for state license, and the rest of the other state licenses that we might have may be fee & CME waived type.

As I said before, they have told you wrong. Ask for the actual instruction.

 

[John1513]

As I said before, they have told you wrong. Ask for the actual instruction.

@Cooperd0g roger, thank you!

 

[d2305]

a. Possession of an active, valid, unrestricted license from a U.S. State, territory, or district. Licensure must be primary source verified (PSV) upon granting of initial appointment/privileges, reappointment/renewal of privileges, revision of privileges, and expiration. A current, valid, unrestricted license or certification is one which is not expired or been suspended or revoked, one in which the issuing authority accepts and considers quality assurance (quality management) information, and is not subject to restriction pertaining to that scope, location, and type of practice ordinarily granted all other applicants for similar licensure or certification in the granting jurisdiction. If the practitioner does not possess a license or certification exemption, or is not otherwise specifically authorized to practice independently without a license or certification, the practitioner must be placed under a POS to participate in patient care activities From BUMEDINST6010.30

 

[HighPriest]

the practitioner must be placed under a POS to participate in patient care activities

That explains a lot. I had POSs in charge basically the whole time I was in the Army.

 

[Cooperd0g]

Well, I guess @d2305 gave you the instruction. Don't let them bully you around. I, just yesterday, challenged something everyone else was doing. No one could show me the instruction. I found it myself and everyone has been doing it wrong. But it isn't going to be fun pointing that out ...

 

[HighPriest]

That happened not infrequently to me too. It's almost always a fight. Usually, they've been doing it the way they're doing it because it's easier for them, and so pointing out that they have to do a little bit more work, even if it's better for the system and the patients, is a declaration of war. In one or two cases, it was decided to just keep doing things incorrectly simply because it was easier than rocking the boat. That was one of the dichotomies I hated most about the Army. If you have a regulation, follow it. If you don't follow it, get rid of the regulation. If you just don't like a regulation, change it. Just don't have a regulation but not follow it. That's idiotic.

 

[SDN]

The state is the licensing body and each state has different rules — although it is true that some ‘military discount licenses’ are restricted to DoD practice only, that is not necessarily true across the board.

FYSA: The credentials department verifies credentials and then provides hospital privileges if granted by the credentials committee (a peer group of providers chaired by the DCCS).

So, if a credentials department gives you a hard time, talk with the DCCS. They oversee all provider privileging and can help bring some sanity when necessary.

 

[John1513]

Gold from 2011 :

Medical License for Military

 

[Crabbygas]

From "The House of God" as applied to military bureaucrats, "They can always hurt you more." And they will. As much as they might be supportive of the military and it's mission they are more supportive of themselves and their own well being.

 

[MirrorTodd]

Quite literally JUST got an email from my program director stating that military won’t accept these type of fee reduced licenses anymore. Nebraska is still pretty cheap, but kinda pointless now unless one plans to live there.

 

[Cooperd0g]

Quite literally JUST got an email from my program director stating that military won’t accept these type of fee reduced licenses anymore. Nebraska is still pretty cheap, but kinda pointless now unless one plans to live there.

And I replied in that post as well that your PD is inaccurate in his assessment. It has to do with CME requirements, not reduced fees. They tend to go hand in hand, but can be different.

 

[John1513]

I think folks in the admin world reads these SDN threads. Not to improve milmed or to improve retention rates for physicians, but ....

 

[HighPriest]

I think folks in the admin world reads these SDN threads. Not to improve milmed or to improve retention rates for physicians, but ....

The people in the admin world don’t read.

 

[pgg]

I think folks in the admin world reads these SDN threads. Not to improve milmed or to improve retention rates for physicians, but ....

Possibly. Not likely, but possibly.

In any case, just don't post anything here you won't say to the face of anyone you work with, up to and including your CO. The Navy's social media policy explicitly encourages AD servicemembers to post personal experiences in factual, respectful, polite manner. No one's doing anything wrong here.

The kind of people getting in trouble for their internet behavior are typically running afoul of really basic things like harassment of other servicemembers, posting pictures documenting misconduct, stupid alcohol related social misadventures, OPSEC breaches, and so on.

 

[HighPriest]

"Also, don't send pictures of your junk to interns, secretaries, or students." (Does not apply to elected officials)

-some DoD regulation, probably.

 

[orbitsurgMD]

FYI

Any state medical license that is waived of registration fees/GME requirements as a ‘military appreciation’ is considered a “Restricted” medical license by the Medical Corps.

The military requires at least one Unrestricted state medical license to be valid and good-to-go at all times

They evidently don't understand the term "restricted" as concerns a state license. The fee-discounted and fee-waived licenses are not restricted as concerns scope of practice. That is all that should be relevant to the military. (Training licenses are restricted, for example.)
Fee discounts require eligibility, only working for a state institution and, in this case, only working for the military. The scope of those licenses is not constrained, so the licenses are not restricted.

FWIW, the overzealous credentialers are unknowingly heading their service branches toward a slippery slope: licenses from states beside the state where the facility they are credentialing for is situated are restricted in those locations--they aren't valid at all. In fact, given the services' proclivities to task post-internship-only trainees to GMO duty, there are only a limited number of states that allow licensure of doctors with less than two years of GME completed.

 

[HighPriest]

They evidently don't understand the term "restricted" as concerns a state license. The fee-discounted and fee-waived licenses are not restricted as concerns scope of practice. That is all that should be relevant to the military. (Training licenses are restricted, for example.)
Fee discounts require eligibility, only working for a state institution and, in this case, only working for the military. The scope of those licenses is not constrained, so the licenses are not restricted.

FWIW, the overzealous credentialers are unknowingly heading their service branches toward a slippery slope: licenses from states beside the state where the facility they are credentialing for is situated are restricted in those locations--they aren't valid at all. In fact, given the services' proclivities to task post-internship-only trainees to GMO duty, there are only a limited number of states that allow licensure of doctors with less than two years of GME completed.

You and your details! Go back to Russia!

 

[Slevin]

They evidently don't understand the term "restricted" as concerns a state license. The fee-discounted and fee-waived licenses are not restricted as concerns scope of practice. That is all that should be relevant to the military. (Training licenses are restricted, for example.)
Fee discounts require eligibility, only working for a state institution and, in this case, only working for the military. The scope of those licenses is not constrained, so the licenses are not restricted.

FWIW, the overzealous credentialers are unknowingly heading their service branches toward a slippery slope: licenses from states beside the state where the facility they are credentialing for is situated are restricted in those locations--they aren't valid at all. In fact, given the services' proclivities to task post-internship-only trainees to GMO duty, there are only a limited number of states that allow licensure of doctors with less than two years of GME completed.

As per the FSMB > 25 states only require 1 year of GME training. Unless I’m reading this chart wrong

FSMB | State-Specific Requirements For Initial Medical Licensure

FSMB | State-Specific Requirements For Initial Medical Licensure