Military Dentists: If you could go back and do loans would you?

[OBL1V1ON]

For any military dentist out there. if you could go back in time how would you have paid for dental school? with loans or through the military?

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[BuckeyMcGee]

You should ask this question to those having finished dental school on loans, I'm sure many would go the military route..

 

[OBL1V1ON]

good point. but i do want to know from the army dentists if they wake up everyday and think, "i should have never done this / i wish i would have taken the loans and stayed home"

i know that with everyone it will be different because eveyone's experience is different, but i was hoping to glean some info on things that, perhaps they dont like about army dentistry / army life. ive heard pretty much ALL the strong points from the army's "propaganda pamphlets" and the recruiters.

 

[Kabek]

good point. but i do want to know from the army dentists if they wake up everyday and think, "i should have never done this / i wish i would have taken the loans and stayed home"

Obl1vion,

It is a privilege and honor to serve your country. Yes, if you join the Army you will get jerked around and things are almost GUARANTEED to not work out the way you would have hoped BUT you get to work with/on soldiers. After practicing for a while you come realize it is the people that you are able to help that makes it worthwhile. For some people their idea of happiness is helping the country club brats, others community clinics, but I bet you would be hard pressed to find somebody who doesn't find honor in helping soldiers.

It is a personal choice that only you can decide.

 

[Midoc]

This is a good question to ask, it is also a hard question to answer.

There is a lot of BS to deal with in the military. There is a whole lot of BS to deal with. As an example, I'm a Brigade Dentist (4 BCT, 4 ID) and at my insistence, my clinic has agreed to do about 1000 exams this week and next week (only 8 working days due to a 4 day weekend for Presidents Day). Knowing the effort this took, my unit still tells me, I have to do my complete inventory today, predeployment screenings tomorrow and a command changeover one day next week. So out of the 8 days, I'll only be there helping 5 of them. Its not that is a big deal, its just that you and your job really means nothing to the warfighters up until the dental readiness is impacting the readiness numbers and then its a big concern, for about a week at most.

If you come into the military expecting to deal with situations like this, if you come in knowing you're doing it to serve your country then it isn't as big a deal. I use "serving" here as in being a servant of sorts, not just providing a service. There is a distinct difference.

On these boards its a very cliched saying but if you join to serve your country, do your four years and get out, you'll do ok. If join for the money only, you'll hate your job and life for four years.

So final answer, yes I would do it again.

 

[KDBuff]

I've been living across the country from my fiancee for the past 9 months, and will be deployed on a ship for probably half of the next two years...and yep, I'd do it again

 

[OBL1V1ON]

thanks for the insight guys. ive been in the army reserve for 7 years. im a staff sergeant so ive seen how the military can be. i know that i would be treated better as a cpt/dr, not that im treated badly at all now. so im just trying to figure out if my previous experiences in the military are having unfair bad or good influence on the prospect of me being a military dentist. i guess its a little of both. and yes the more i talk to the recruiters and look at the data the money becomes less and less of a motivating factor. i honestly believe the money is nearly equal when its all said and done civ vs military for the first 4 yrs if everything is average. so it all comes down to do i want the military to maintain its grasp on me for 8 more years. in the beginning i was 100% for going military because i though that i would have a far better chance of specializing in the military, but the more i look at it the less im convinced, especially since i know how fast things in the military can change. it just seems like it might be a better idea to work hard during dental school and see how i come out at the end. if i do well then i should have too hard of a time getting a specialty that i enjoy. but if i do poorly then the military may be the way to go at that point.

 

[MaximusD]

Obl1v1on,

First of all, I am under the influence of a little alcohol right now, so this might not sound as fluent as it would had I not just left happy hour!

If you have spent any time here on SDN visiting the military medicine and the military dental forums, you will see a drastic difference. In any job in the military, you are going to experience time were life doesn't go as you'd like, but life as a dentist is overall better than a physician. There are a lot less dentists who are disgruntled or dread their life when compared to physicians. But then again, in any job, there are going to be times where you aren't going to be happy with the way things are going. The main difference between life in the civilian sector vs. life in the military is that in the military you have less say in how things go. You have to make more sacrifices. But as kabec said, you have the honor of helping out our nations soldiers, marines, airmen and sailors. If you have any sense of patriotism, this will mean a lot to you when you get out (whether it be in 4 years or 20 years.)

Honestly, there might not be that much of a difference. There might just be more bitchy whiners on SDN from the physician camp than from the dental camp. Take everything you read here with a grain of NaCl.

 

[dheav005]

roger that navy dds 2010...on both counts. physicians bitch more than we do and the perspective given on our little corner of the message board is usually spot-on. (and if it isnt initially, that is soon corrected)

 

[jb54ram]

I am graduating in 3 months, and I realize the financial side of things is not and should not be a determining factor. Having received a stipend 2x a month for the last 4 years sure has been nice. Without it, I would have had some real tough times. Plus add in all the other patriotic stuff, and I am pretty happy that I have chosen to go Green! HOOAHH!

 

[HawkeyeDDS]

For any military dentist out there. if you could go back in time how would you have paid for dental school? with loans or through the military?

I wouldn't say I wouldn't have done it, but I sure wish I knew what I was signing up for. I signed up pre 9/11 when it was just a good way to pay for school. Now I'm off to Iraq for 15 months. (Stay away from my wife). There's a ton of benefits to the military, but for every benefit there's a drawback. ie. free medical coverage....if you can get an appointment. etc. it's not all bad, but there are alot of drawbacks. Another thing is that might very well happen is getting stuck on the Amalgam Express.

 

[Smills91]

The key statement is highlighted in red here. People - you have to remember that the military is the military. If wars, disputes, conflicts, etc. occur, it is our job to go where our Commander-In-Chief send us (whether we agree with him/her or not). You should NEVER JOIN the military because it is a good way to pay for something if you don't like the thought of having to leave your family for extended periods of time. Even in times of peace, you have to do 6 months deployments. In times of peace, the Navy deploys or is on its work-ups more than the AF or Army when you are stationed on a ship. We make sacrifices when we are in the military. Being away from your family is just a part of the life. It sucks, but is a part of life!

Never join anything, sign a contract, open a busines, etc. without being knowledgable about the subject. Ignorance is not a legitimate excuse if life doesn't go your way.

Amen.

 

[HawkeyeDDS]

The key statement is highlighted in red here. People - you have to remember that the military is the military. If wars, disputes, conflicts, etc. occur, it is our job to go where our Commander-In-Chief send us (whether we agree with him/her or not). You should NEVER JOIN the military because it is a good way to pay for something if you don't like the thought of having to leave your family for extended periods of time. Even in times of peace, you have to do 6 months deployments. In times of peace, the Navy deploys or is on its work-ups more than the AF or Army when you are stationed on a ship. We make sacrifices when we are in the military. Being away from your family is just a part of the life. It sucks, but is a part of life!

Never join anything, sign a contract, open a busines, etc. without being knowledgable about the subject. Ignorance is not a legitimate excuse if life doesn't go your way.

i agree, but that's how it was presented to us by the recruiters at the time. Look if someone wants to join the military...great. I think it's admirable. And it is a good way to pay for school.....just be aware that there is a price that may have to be paid. As far as contracts go, they are only one sided. Your side is the only one that has to be held up. Anything you sign with the Military can be changed with a stroke of a pen. There are great things about the military setting. All I'm saying is that it is not as rosy as people would like you to think. But in the end, I will be glad that I did it, and glad it's over, and I will happily move into the private sector.

 

[BuckeyMcGee]

Hawkeye, did you do an AEGD by any chance? Which branch did you serve? Some people say if you do the AEGD in the military then you have more options...thus, more happier.

 

[OBL1V1ON]

hawkeye,

Thanks for your honest opinion. having been in the military for some time now i know how they can jerk you around on contracts/deployments/relationships/your entire life. i figured that would be the way it is as a dentist as well, but i wanted to hear if from the horses mouth...no offense i still havent ruled out the military. i could be indirectly forced to join. i still have 2 yrs left on my reserve(army) obligation. if they try to send me to afg/iraq ill basically be forced to join as an hpsp or go on deployment and get 1-2 yrs behind on my dental education. honestly i really dont want to do the military thing, but the fact that they could just jerk me outa school anytime in the next few years is kinda...well, sux. puts a twist/gamble on the whole decision making process...

 

[HawkeyeDDS]

Hawkeye, did you do an AEGD by any chance? Which branch did you serve? Some people say if you do the AEGD in the military then you have more options...thus, more happier.

To answer you questions, I am in the Army. I'm coming up on my 3 year mark. I did do the 1 year agd at Fort Sill OK. It was a great experience. It sucked, but I wouldn't trade it for anything. They treat you worse than a dental student, but it's worth it. I was doing full bony impactions, perio surg. etc by the time I left. If you are going to do the military thing, definately take advantage of it otherwise you will get stuck in the Amalgam line. As far as making you life any better, it is what you make out of it. I have fought the Amalgam line ever since I left the AGD. I schedule most of my own patients, so I end up doing alot of Pros that no one else wants to do because there is some lab work involved. But of the 5 general Dentist I'm really the only one that hasn't gotten into the Amalgam trap. As far as opportunities for assignment, the AGD makes you ripe pickings for the Brigade slots, (see my other thread for that experience). But don't let that sway your decision. Luckily for me it counted as a year for payback, but I would still recommend it even if it didn't.

 

[BuckeyMcGee]

I am on the Navy HPSP and have heard that the AEGD was a neutral year, doesn't count towards payback but your four years starts immediately after. How competitive are the military AEGDs? I think I'd definitely do one because I would dread doing amalgams day in and day out.

 

[HawkeyeDDS]

I am on the Navy HPSP and have heard that the AEGD was a neutral year, doesn't count towards payback but your four years starts immediately after. How competitive are the military AEGDs? I think I'd definitely do one because I would dread doing amalgams day in and day out.

Ever since they switched back to a neutral year, I know the Army has unfilled slots. Navy probably similar.

 

[m-dmd]

If you would have asked me this question 3 or 4 years ago, I would have said HE** yeah I wish I would have done loans, but now I am looking at my ETS date fast approaching and I would say that although there are many, MANY things that I do not like about the Army, but there are many things I do. I AM a better dentist than I was 4 years ago. I have been able to work with dentists with 30+ years experience and learn from them. It has come with a price, like having to bite my tonque and say "yes, sir" when I didnt want to (like when when a colonel criticized my signature). I have had the very best patients in the world, and I truly believe that. Most are very thankful for what I do for them.

Also, my CV looks awesome. The things that I can list on it, I really believe, helped me get into the specialty that I wanted. The recommendations from the DENTAC commander and a couple of other colonel's look much much better than some random dentist saying how great of a dentist I am. I truly believe that I would not have made it into my chosen speciatly had I not had this service on my CV. I was truly able to prove myself as a dentist and a military leader.

Perhaps my experience has been different than most, I don't know, but I am happy I did it. It has been the most difficult thing I have done for my family though, and that one thing I wish I had known. My husband got hurt recently, and I was not there for him. I had to first ask for emergency leave and then drive to where he was (12 hours away). At that moment, I wish I had never joined the Army, but when we get the bills, that are paid in full, I am soooo glad (military insurance for family members is for the most part FREE!!!).

I am now standing here looking back and proud of my service to my country. I can always say that I am a soldier. That means something to me. I was able see a life I never ever would have understood had I not done it.

 

[UNR.Grad]

m-dmd,
Great post. The military experience, among other things, is a big draw for me to take the HPSP. My grandpa and dad were both in the military; my dad was not by choice, he was drafted and served in Vietnam, although he says that serving his country and experiencing the camaraderie within the military was one of the best experiences of his life. Thanks for the insight; by the way did you do a residency with the army or civilian.

 

[KDBuff]

Whether you are placed on an amalgam line or not varies greatly by command and who the director of a program is. I chose not to do a residency, and I've gotten pretty good experience in different phases of dentistry, and I expect that to continue in the future when I move on. I also know people in AEGD's who have done far less dentistry in the last year than I have, and I know some in other programs that have done TONS of great work.

 

[m-dmd]

m-dmd,
Great post. The military experience, among other things, is a big draw for me to take the HPSP. My grandpa and dad were both in the military; my dad was not by choice, he was drafted and served in Vietnam, although he says that serving his country and experiencing the camaraderie within the military was one of the best experiences of his life. Thanks for the insight; by the way did you do a residency with the army or civilian.

I am getting ready to go back to school and make NO money (except the GI Bill - which I just found out we, HPSP'ers can do) so I am not doing an Army residency. That would have extended my time with them, and the army is just not me. They would have been very happy for me to stay in and do the Army residency, but I just don't want that life.

 

[stdmufin27]

I am getting ready to go back to school and make NO money (except the GI Bill - which I just found out we, HPSP'ers can do) so I am not doing an Army residency. That would have extended my time with them, and the army is just not me. They would have been very happy for me to stay in and do the Army residency, but I just don't want that life.

Hey. Just a quick question for ya m-dmd. I know its way ahead of the game for me but I was curious about the GI Bill benefits available for HPSP'ers after the active duty. I say now that I am interested in specializing (??? in 8 years!) and would take the route you have. What kind of monies are you expecting? I looked on the web and found a whole bunch of different numbers. BTW, thanks for your posts in this thread. They have helped me fill more comfortable about my decision.

 

[dheav005]

also, the post-grad training program has to be VA approved to be a part of the MGIB payout. from recent tangential experience, not every residency program allows their residents to make use of MGIB benefits. (lots of question marks behind this statement. i am exquisitely confused by some aspects of the program.) however, we have an LT getting out of the Navy at our clinic who will be getting $1250/month for 36 months during his OMFS residency up in Delaware. so if it works out, it could be a sweet deal.

 

[m-dmd]

Hey. Just a quick question for ya m-dmd. I know its way ahead of the game for me but I was curious about the GI Bill benefits available for HPSP'ers after the active duty. I say now that I am interested in specializing (??? in 8 years!) and would take the route you have. What kind of monies are you expecting? I looked on the web and found a whole bunch of different numbers. BTW, thanks for your posts in this thread. They have helped me fill more comfortable about my decision.

I just paid the $1800 all at once. I was not made aware that this situation was available to me until late in the game, so I just paid it all at once. The amounts that the others have listed are right on. It will total about 1250 a month for the entirity of my residency. Good luck to you. Just remember that the time that you are in the military will eventually come to an end and it is only a short 4 years, although during the time, it may seem like a lifetime. Like I said, I had difficult family issues to deal with during school (dh lived in another state, therefore I was a geographical single parent - and that and the Army don't always get along so well...like trying to find someone to watch your infant when you are called in for a surprise pee pee test at 430am - haha!!!). I am almost done now, and like I said, I can say I am a soldier, I will be a United States Veteran, and to me, that counts for something. I did my little part for the country. You cannot, IMHO, understand that until you have done it.

 

[stdmufin27]

also, the post-grad training program has to be VA approved to be a part of the MGIB payout. from recent tangential experience, not every residency program allows their residents to make use of MGIB benefits.

So, the money goes directly to the school as tuition payment? And not every school is willing to take monies from GI Bill?

 

[dheav005]

So, the money goes directly to the school as tuition payment? And not every school is willing to take monies from GI Bill?

see, this would be where im fuzzy on the whole thing. i think it is more like the VA approves that the program is a vaild one (in terms of education, hours scheduled, etc.) and then the former service member directly receives the stipend. i would imagine that undergrad and trade schools that qualify for MGIB are greater in number than dental post-doc masters/certificate programs. i can find out more, but please dont make me...the VA scares me...

 

[m-dmd]

So, the money goes directly to the school as tuition payment? And not every school is willing to take monies from GI Bill?

Nope money is paid to you directly. You have to verify enrollment every month. This is not money that is included in your financial aid, that is separate. Your program has to be approved which you would have to find out from the VA office.

 

[desert rat]

I did the military 2 year scholarship. I already had 8 years active duty before college. I thought it would be fun going back in as an officer/dentist.

I hated every day I was in the military. I had to get up every day and run 2 miles and do 1/2 hour of exercise. That sucked. I had to train as a line officer leading troops etc. It sucked.

Later I was dissabled out of the military and that sucked. As a dentist in the military accidents can happen like bombs or being shot. You have to only do this if you understand the risks and what you are getting into. You are an officer first dentist second.

I would have rather borrowed the money. I could have paid it off in just a few years of time.

 

[Dan3223]

I did the military 2 year scholarship. I already had 8 years active duty before college. I thought it would be fun going back in as an officer/dentist.

I hated every day I was in the military. I had to get up every day and run 2 miles and do 1/2 hour of exercise. That sucked. I had to train as a line officer leading troops etc. It sucked.

Later I was dissabled out of the military and that sucked. As a dentist in the military accidents can happen like bombs or being shot. You have to only do this if you understand the risks and what you are getting into. You are an officer first dentist second.

I would have rather borrowed the money. I could have paid it off in just a few years of time.

Which branch were you in?

 

[desert rat]

Army

 

[UOP_Dentist]

You should ask this question to those having finished dental school on loans, I'm sure many would go the military route..

Every day i serve my country makes me wish i did HPSP

 

[shamrock2006]

Might be slightly random..but I know I saw something in here about "Amalgam lines". I've seen that around before, but it seems it's always in reference to the Army...is that where you'll only see something like that? Is that something w/ the AF/Navy too? Just wanted to get that cleared up. Also, I "briefly" heard something about the AEGD going back to a counted year..but this, more than likely, is false..but I just wanted to see if anyone else heard that or if it's just a load of crap.

 

[HawkeyeDDS]

Might be slightly random..but I know I saw something in here about "Amalgam lines". I've seen that around before, but it seems it's always in reference to the Army...is that where you'll only see something like that? Is that something w/ the AF/Navy too? Just wanted to get that cleared up. Also, I "briefly" heard something about the AEGD going back to a counted year..but this, more than likely, is false..but I just wanted to see if anyone else heard that or if it's just a load of crap.

AGD, counting for payback probably a load of crap. Apparently when it counted, luckily for me it did, it was a mistake. They read the regulations wrong, but they had to honor it for a certain time period. Unless they are going to rewrite regulations, good luck, that probably won't happen any time soon.

Amalgam lines. It's definately true in the Army, but I'm sure it exists everywhere. The key to avoiding it is to try and schedule your pts. If you let the front desk fill your books, you'd be doing operative forever. But if you see someone that needs crown and bridge etc, just book it and do it. I've done more than my fair share of C&B on pt's with less than Ideal hygeine simply becuase I was tired of doing WMFT (whole mother F%$^#$g tooth) fillings. (It's easier than saying MODFL. ) It's all about being proactive no matter what situation you may find yourself. I am my clinics mini Surgeon and Pros guy. I let the others do the Amalgam line, but they do it mostly by choice, dumb a$$es.

 

[desert rat]

Hey Hakeye, when did you go to Iowa? How long have you been in the ARmy?

 

[shamrock2006]

AGD, counting for payback probably a load of crap. Apparently when it counted, luckily for me it did, it was a mistake. They read the regulations wrong, but they had to honor it for a certain time period. Unless they are going to rewrite regulations, good luck, that probably won't happen any time soon.

Amalgam lines. It's definately true in the Army, but I'm sure it exists everywhere. The key to avoiding it is to try and schedule your pts. If you let the front desk fill your books, you'd be doing operative forever. But if you see someone that needs crown and bridge etc, just book it and do it. I've done more than my fair share of C&B on pt's with less than Ideal hygeine simply becuase I was tired of doing WMFT (whole mother F%$^#$g tooth) fillings. (It's easier than saying MODFL. ) It's all about being proactive no matter what situation you may find yourself. I am my clinics mini Surgeon and Pros guy. I let the others do the Amalgam line, but they do it mostly by choice, dumb a$$es.

The whole scheduling your patients makes sense....but doesnt the ultimate decision depend on whether or not the military wants to pay for whatever treatment you decide is appropriate? If you think someone needs some C&B work, can't the military flat out say "No, we are not going to pay for that". I have heard that's how it tends to work. Is that true?

 

[HawkeyeDDS]

The whole scheduling your patients makes sense....but doesnt the ultimate decision depend on whether or not the military wants to pay for whatever treatment you decide is appropriate? If you think someone needs some C&B work, can't the military flat out say "No, we are not going to pay for that". I have heard that's how it tends to work. Is that true?

As long as it's in the patients best intrest you're good to go. now if you are doing "cosmetic makover" then you might find your practice limited. For example I took a gold crown off a guy's front tooth. It was cool, it had a spade in porcelain on it. He said that a dentist at Ft Bragg did it for a bunch of their guys in their unit, until they caught on. He then was banned from doing c/b. i think he ended up doing ortho anyway, long story short...the only way you will be limited is if it's mission driven. For example, a brigade is deploying and they have a bunch of soldiers with massive holes in their teeth...the clinics can say that until they are on their way to the desert you are only doing exams and fillings. But once they leave it's business as usual. The army doesn't care about the cost of C/B. The Army dental lab does all the work, (that's a topic for a differnt thread), so your immediate dental command bears no responsibility for the cost. The only cost they bear is for buying implants. That might be limited based on if the command is a prosthodontist or not. Hope that helps. I'm inserting 4 anterior crowns this afternoon.

 

[beijingdds]

as a cpt in the army. i respect those of you who are patriotic about US and serving soldiers. however, i think everyone has his/her own opinion about this war. From financial stand point, i don't think it is a great deal considering you can make 2x as much in the civilian world. over time, that pay difference will catch up with the loan which making it less significant. i admit that paying off 200k in 3 years seem to be a short cut,but you are paying numerous prices for it being in the uniform.

Also, i think the army value is bull**** since i have seen too many jackass colonels and dishonest cpts. i mean, i once thought the military is a holly land.

Just one thing, i want to see those cpts who are so pro army will stay in for 20 years and retire.

 

[HawkeyeDDS]

i once thought the military is a "holly land."


Just one thing, i want to see those cpts who are so pro army will stay in for 20 years and retire.

Is the "Holly land" the north pole?

I am ETS'ing as soon as I get back from Iraq and out from Stoploss, and I have a crap load of issues with the Army, but there are good things too. Talk to your buddies who are paying back 2,000 a month for the next 20-30 years.

 

[beijingdds]

Is the "Holly land" the north pole?

I am ETS'ing as soon as I get back from Iraq and out from Stoploss, and I have a crap load of issues with the Army, but there are good things too. Talk to your buddies who are paying back 2,000 a month for the next 20-30 years.

HawkeyeDDS
I wish you well in Iraq, and I think it is BS they stop loss you. I hate it when they do that to our CPT's. Like I said, I thought I was the only one compaining until I get to meet some people in the short courses and talked to them. Everyone seemed to be pissed off. I mean, I am not saying it is a bad deal fianically.I consider it is a 3 years of jail time to pay off my loans. The worst part is, most people I talked to feel they lose skills big time because of the "needs" of the army. Essentially, if you just know how to do exams every day, you can make your pay check! People getting out will have heck of time to get used to the civilian practice.

Again, everyone's experience in the army is different. I happen to be one of the unlucky guys. Well, I have one year to go and I guess i can stop bitching. 200k loans is no fun for 30 years payment. Hey, I always say, tiger or lion, make your pick. This profession takes a heck of investment. Sometimes that makes me wonder if it is worth it or not.

 

[KOM]

HawkeyeDDS
The worst part is, most people I talked to feel they lose skills big time because of the "needs" of the army. Essentially, if you just know how to do exams every day, you can make your pay check! People getting out will have heck of time to get used to the civilian practice.

That's too bad about your experience. Army definitely sounds like the worst of the branches. Financially, for most private school's or out of state tuition prices it is a FANTASTIC deal and unless you net 200K each year straight out of school and put a huge percentage of that income into your loans you will not come out ahead.

I also don't believe you would "lose skills" in the military considering you're just starting out. Will you be performing a less diverse number of procedures in the military compared to private practice? Quite possibly...but the first few years out of dental school you're going to be slow and won't be able to produce much anyways. They say dentists hit their prime production rates in their 15-20th year of practice.

I also disagree that dentists will have a harder time adapting to civilian practice following their committment.

But I'm with you...following my 3 year committment I have no plans for staying any longer. I also don't believe I will do the AEGD. Regadless of the experience, I'm not about to tack on another year to my committment.

 

[AFDDS]

I didn't participate in the HPSP. I did participate in the HPLRP. The answer should be a resounding NO. Graduating from dental school debt free or as close to it as possible is a lifting of a big burden you won't need to worry about.

I made good money when I was in private practice before the AF, but student loans aren't your only bill.

 

[beijingdds]

That's too bad about your experience. Army definitely sounds like the worst of the branches. Financially, for most private school's or out of state tuition prices it is a FANTASTIC deal and unless you net 200K each year straight out of school and put a huge percentage of that income into your loans you will not come out ahead.

I also don't believe you would "lose skills" in the military considering you're just starting out. Will you be performing a less diverse number of procedures in the military compared to private practice? Quite possibly...but the first few years out of dental school you're going to be slow and won't be able to produce much anyways. They say dentists hit their prime production rates in their 15-20th year of practice.

I also disagree that dentists will have a harder time adapting to civilian practice following their committment.

But I'm with you...following my 3 year committment I have no plans for staying any longer. I also don't believe I will do the AEGD. Regadless of the experience, I'm not about to tack on another year to my committment.

Well, things are getting worse in the army because everyone is getting out. Guess what? You guys(the dental students) will pick up the slack. You will be more than likely to sent to places like FT BRAGG, FT HOOD, FT REILY where there are tons of soldiers need care. I mean, exams after exams....every day!!

As for the financial part, since I am from california and the market there is Fxxked up with 5 dentals schools(6th is opening) and out-of-state and foreign dentists. Everyone is killing each other. So, 200k is not possbile out of dental school. In fact, 100k is about what most new graduates will make. Most of my classmates are going out of state to make their money to pay for loans. If i did not join the army, i would probably end up somewhere in arizona anyways. So, I just figure short pain for the long term benefits. Hoever, army dentistry is not as laid back as you would think anymore with shortage of dentists. I just hated the FXXKING recruiter telling me the lies he had no clues about.

Well, since graduation, I did not do any dentures, molar endos, and even anterior crowns in the army. I spend most my time doing exams, amalgams, signing paperwork and stuff like that. At the same time, my classmate was telling me that he is doing well with surgery, crown preps, and endos. Bottom line, practice makes perfection. If you don't do it, you will suck it at it!!! So, i think army dentistry is just crazy that someone will need time to get adjusted to the cilvillian world.

Again, people sweet talking about the army are just trying to get a easier life in the army. Most people i met who are pro army eventually got out like a mother!! Isn't that lame? Why don't you stay for 20 and tell me about how much you "love" it.

So, if you don't believe, just wait until you get in the army and then you can tell me. Just heads up, things are getting worse.....In the future, i think military dentists will be deployed 100% and they will hire civilians working in the states. Since there are nobody will join!!!

 

[blankguy]

My take on this is that as school gets more expensive the more people may take a good hard look at the military route. I think the military is a relatively cushy place to be in peace time but also harder to get in since retention rates are higher. It may suck a bit especially for army guys now but I think when people look back at this and see how much more expensive schools have gotten in the future they may have a certain level of satisfaction in having done this. Also if people are thinking of specializing, I consider that to be a bonus. Consider at the very least you get good experience which can be help you later on when you specialize through a civilian program after your time is up in the military.

 

[KOM]

So, if you don't believe, just wait until you get in the army and then you can tell me. Just heads up, things are getting worse.....In the future, i think military dentists will be deployed 100% and they will hire civilians working in the states. Since there are nobody will join!!!

I'm glad I didn't choose the army. I don't mind being deployed though...I enjoy seeing new places and I'm from a small town in bumf*** Alaska so most military posts would probably fail to phase me in the least.

 

[beijingdds]

My take on this is that as school gets more expensive the more people may take a good hard look at the military route. I think the military is a relatively cushy place to be in peace time but also harder to get in since retention rates are higher. It may suck a bit especially for army guys now but I think when people look back at this and see how much more expensive schools have gotten in the future they may have a certain level of satisfaction in having done this. Also if people are thinking of specializing, I consider that to be a bonus. Consider at the very least you get good experience which can be help you later on when you specialize through a civilian program after your time is up in the military.

Well, you are right. The government will not spend money on you for nothing. You they they will pay for you school if you have enough dentists just sit back and relax during peace time? Hell no! right now I think the HPSP is less than 40% filled last year or less. I went to an very expensive school which cost about over 250k for 4 years(2 years ag0) and I still wondered if that is worth or not. I mean, it is up to person to person. SOmeone can not stand losing your freedom and get locked up like a prisoner. However, it feels good after you get not when you still suffering it.....

 

[krmower]

Ever since they switched back to a neutral year, I know the Army has unfilled slots. Navy probably similar.

Starting in 2008 they did not have any unfilled 12 month AEGD slots like in years past.

 

[beijingdds]

Are you sure? This conflicts with information that's been posted here.

Yes, I have read the statistics from the DENCOM. It is less thatn 50% filled for the class of 2007. I don't know about 2008 though.

 

[beijingdds]

Starting in 2008 they did not have any unfilled 12 month AEGD slots like in years past.

Really? I wonder why. They may go back to count that year concurrently with the payback. Or, people just want to have more experiences. Surprising to me.

 

[HawkeyeDDS]

Really? I wonder why. They may go back to count that year concurrently with the payback. Or, people just want to have more experiences. Surprising to me.

20K sign on bonus to a poor college kid sounds pretty good. Also 1900 a month. It's really not a bad way to do it. I'm not saying I could go back and redo everything, but they've had to sweeten the pot.