Licensing question

[meow1985]

Hi, it's me again.

I swear, this license application is making me cry for the 5th time now.

I need input on how to answer the following question:

"Have you ever been notified of any investigation by any state medical board, medical society, or any hospital of any complaints against you relative to the practice of medicine, or have you been reprimanded or censured by any medical society or licensing board? If so, give particulars."

I know the board and medical society never investigated me, but do hospital HR complaints count? I did get an HR complaint once as a PGY3. In psychiatry in our institution at least, I'm told it's a rite of passage and we joke that HR has our department's number on speed-dial. The patient was mad at everyone in the ER that day - my attending, me, the other psych resident who took over for the night shift, the ED resident, and the system as a whole. But HR did ask my PD to talk to me (and the other resident and attending) about what happened, which he did, and we concluded that I did nothing wrong. Then the matter just kind of dropped - I never heard about it again.

Thank you for your help.

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[TexasPhysician]

A patient complaint is not the same as the hospital launching an investigation.

 

[meow1985]

A patient complaint is not the same as the hospital launching an investigation.

What is the difference? I am not sure I understand.

 

[downwithDTB]

What is the difference? I am not sure I understand.

I would love to meet a doctor that didn't get at least one complaint from a patient or nurse during residency with a good firm talkin' ta.

The board cares about an active, formal investigation into your ability to practice medicine. You would know if this happened and would have things in writing.

 

[splik]

Hi, it's me again.

I swear, this license application is making me cry for the 5th time now.

I need input on how to answer the following question:

"Have you ever been notified of any investigation by any state medical board, medical society, or any hospital of any complaints against you relative to the practice of medicine, or have you been reprimanded or censured by any medical society or licensing board? If so, give particulars."

I know the board and medical society never investigated me, but do hospital HR complaints count? I did get an HR complaint once as a PGY3. In psychiatry in our institution at least, I'm told it's a rite of passage and we joke that HR has our department's number on speed-dial. The patient was mad at everyone in the ER that day - my attending, me, the other psych resident who took over for the night shift, the ED resident, and the system as a whole. But HR did ask my PD to talk to me (and the other resident and attending) about what happened, which he did, and we concluded that I did nothing wrong. Then the matter just kind of dropped - I never heard about it again.

I don't even know what an "HR complaint" is but no it does not count. Here they are talking about investigations by the medical staff, the medical board, or a professional society. As a resident, this question is probably irrelevant. there is probably a separate question about whether you've been on academic probation or formally disciplined during residency training.

 

[meow1985]

I don't even know what an "HR complaint" is but no it does not count. Here they are talking about investigations by the medical staff, the medical board, or a professional society. As a resident, this question is probably irrelevant. there is probably a separate question about whether you've been on academic probation or formally disciplined during residency training.

I guess what I meant is when a patient contacts HR and airs their grievances.

 

[TexasPhysician]

What is the difference? I am not sure I understand.

Everyone will receive a complaint at some time or another. Many will be thrown in the trash. Some will result in a brief chat either because you could do things better or because admin needs something to do.

Few will ever become a formal investigation, especially without evidence. If a patient takes a photo of you drunk at a club and sends it to admin, they may initially look at the date and determine that you can do what you please on your holiday off. If that is followed up by another staff taking a photo of you holding a beer on a night you were allegedly on-call, expect an investigation into your alcohol use and endangering a patient. You’ll receive notice of a formal investigation. They will check time stamps on the photo, evaluate the phone (gps features), ask you to provide proof of where you were, request peers testify as to why you held the beer (drinking it or assisting your friend tie his/her shoe), how did you act that night/others, and gather whatever else they can. You could end up taking a leave for rehab or be terminated or nothing depending on the evidence. It’ll be pretty clear that an investigation has begun and how serious the matter has become.

 

[WisNeuro]

Patient advocate complaints are just par for the course. If you work in mental health in any capacity, I'd imagine you get one every year or so on average. These are nothing, usually you have to talk to the PA/HR and your immediate supervisor. Vast majority of the time it's just a disgruntled patient who is mad about something (you won't give them unlimited benzos, they are malingering, etc) and PA/HR does its due diligence and then closes the complaint with no action.

Small percentage of the time, someone ****ed up and a larger investigation gets opened. Like, when a psychiatrist is caught selling controlled substance scripts to patients. Ah, that was a fun few months in the clinic.

 

[Mass Effect]

I would love to meet a doctor that didn't get at least one complaint from a patient or nurse during residency with a good firm talkin' ta.

Right here. Let me polish off my halo and then we can talk.

OP, were you investigated for falsifying records? Were you investigated for writing bogus scripts to non-patients or to family members or yourself for controlled substances? Were you selling drugs? Were you sleeping with patients? If no, you were not investigated. Answer no.

I really think you're causing yourself a bigger mental health crisis by being so concrete about this application. I understand you're worried about answering wrong, but the medical board understands that you're human and that you're answering to the best of your ability/knowledge. No one expects that you're perfect. The expectation is that you haven't done something egregious that makes you a danger to patients or colleagues.

 

[meow1985]

Right here. Let me polish off my halo and then we can talk.

OP, were you investigated for falsifying records? Were you investigated for writing bogus scripts to non-patients or to family members or yourself for controlled substances? Were you selling drugs? Were you sleeping with patients? If no, you were not investigated. Answer no.

I really think you're causing yourself a bigger mental health crisis by being so concrete about this application. I understand you're worried about answering wrong, but the medical board understands that you're human and that you're answering to the best of your ability/knowledge. No one expects that you're perfect. The expectation is that you haven't done something egregious that makes you a danger to patients or colleagues.

No, I was doing none of those things. I met standard of care. I just didn't meet the patient's expectations. There was nothing sent in writing to me, and no formal process that I know of. My PD talking to all parties involved in an info-gathering and "do you think anything could've been done differently?" sort of way was as far as it went.

Also, yes, you're right. I guess I'm partly agonizing over this thing because people are like "tell the truth! The board hates when people lie!" But how do you tell the truth if you don't understand what the question is asking.

 

[NickNaylor]

No, I was doing none of those things. I met standard of care. I just didn't meet the patient's expectations. There was nothing sent in writing to me, and no formal process that I know of. My PD talking to all parties involved in an info-gathering and "do you think anything could've been done differently?" sort of way was as far as it went.

Also, yes, you're right. I guess I'm partly agonizing over this thing because people are like "tell the truth! The board hates when people lie!" But how do you tell the truth if you don't understand what the question is asking.

As others have mentioned, you would very well aware of the types of things the medical board is asking about in this question, and it doesn't sound like you have been involved with those things.

 

[Merely]

No, I was doing none of those things. I met standard of care. I just didn't meet the patient's expectations. There was nothing sent in writing to me, and no formal process that I know of. My PD talking to all parties involved in an info-gathering and "do you think anything could've been done differently?" sort of way was as far as it went.

Also, yes, you're right. I guess I'm partly agonizing over this thing because people are like "tell the truth! The board hates when people lie!" But how do you tell the truth if you don't understand what the question is asking.

dude stop approaching this from a desperation perspective, the board doesn’t care about this type of ****, it took them years to stop that neurosurgeon from literally killing people. Use common sense..and move on

 

[meow1985]

dude stop approaching this from a desperation perspective, the board doesn’t care about this type of ****, it took them years to stop that neurosurgeon from literally killing people. Use common sense..and move on

Point taken, but just to clarify, Dr. D was not stopped because hospitals did not want to report him to the NPDB or to the board for various reasons, not because the board did not act when they learned what was going on. Here I’m forget to report to the board anything that was ever not perfect in my life and career just because I happen to want to move across state lines.

 

[meow1985]

Never

dude stop approaching this from a desperation perspective, the board doesn’t care about this type of ****, it took them years to stop that neurosurgeon from literally killing people. Use common sense..and move on

Never mind, they were investigating him for at least 10 months because they were like, "well, bad outcomes happen all the time," and "it's hard to believe someone right out of residency could actually be this bad." And then they only suspended his license, but only because a couple of other surgeons lobbied for it, and it was only revoked after he was criminally charged.

 

[clausewitz2]

Never

Never mind, they were investigating him for at least 10 months because they were like, "well, bad outcomes happen all the time," and "it's hard to believe someone right out of residency could actually be this bad." And then they only suspended his license, but only because a couple of other surgeons lobbied for it, and it was only revoked after he was criminally charged.

And remember the incidents being reported to them involved respected and established neurosurgeons saying "yes, I physically restrained him to prevent him continuing the operation." If your state doesn't let you read details of board disciplinary actions, go to the site of one that does (KY comes to mind) and read about what kinds of things actually lead to action.

 

[meow1985]

And remember the incidents being reported to them involved respected and established neurosurgeons saying "yes, I physically restrained him to prevent him continuing the operation." If your state doesn't let you read details of board disciplinary actions, go to the site of one that does (KY comes to mind) and read about what kinds of things actually lead to action.

I did find a way to read specifics in my destination state. They do more than reprimand you only if something went wrong and you showed no evidence whether in word or deed of having learned from it. And even then it's mostly just "do this coursework." So that's good.