Its Official, WAGS has begun laying off!!!

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Pharmpills said:
The problem is that Americans don't want the Government to interfere in the bussiness sector bc it would reflect communism in a way but when the system fails they are quick to blame the Government (although Bush is a big cause). The problem is that companies like FORD, Circuit City, etc did make HUGE profits but the CEO's took millions or god knows how much for just their salaries but now they cry out bc they never saved aton of money for the company.

With walgreens the entire company has always had major issues bc even when they sell a massive amount of prescriptions at a store they would still short staff bc they love saving money through any means. In my view as a tech for Walgreens for 3 years they are a pathetic company who pays their techs horrible, CUT THEIR CHRISTMAS BENEFIT TO ZERO yes zero unless u work their for like 5 year or what not. They do appear to treat their pharmacist well but the power system will change that. The Government needs to start opening bussinesses of it's own such as retail, car manufactures and use the profit to fund charities and other causes rather than let some greedy execs take millions or give stock holders the profit who end up dumping shares when things get bad. Secondly if PharmD's fall and the whole economy then so will MD's bc if ppl don't have money then certainly they can't afford to pay hospitals and insurace will go bancrupt as well. Sure MD's are one of the safest but do remember that not all make 300k but rather 150 - 200k so their pays would come down as well.
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Holy ****.........
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Pharmpills said:
The problem is that Americans don't want the Government to interfere in the bussiness sector bc it would reflect communism in a way but when the system fails they are quick to blame the Government (although Bush is a big cause). The problem is that companies like FORD, Circuit City, etc did make HUGE profits but the CEO's took millions or god knows how much for just their salaries but now they cry out bc they never saved aton of money for the company.

With walgreens the entire company has always had major issues bc even when they sell a massive amount of prescriptions at a store they would still short staff bc they love saving money through any means. In my view as a tech for Walgreens for 3 years they are a pathetic company who pays their techs horrible, CUT THEIR CHRISTMAS BENEFIT TO ZERO yes zero unless u work their for like 5 year or what not. They do appear to treat their pharmacist well but the power system will change that. The Government needs to start opening bussinesses of it's own such as retail, car manufactures and use the profit to fund charities and other causes rather than let some greedy execs take millions or give stock holders the profit who end up dumping shares when things get bad. Secondly if PharmD's fall and the whole economy then so will MD's bc if ppl don't have money then certainly they can't afford to pay hospitals and insurace will go bancrupt as well. Sure MD's are one of the safest but do remember that not all make 300k but rather 150 - 200k so their pays would come down as well.
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these types of posts give pre-pharm peeps such a bad rap...
 
Pharmpills said:
The Government needs to start opening bussinesses of it's own such as retail, car manufactures and use the profit to fund charities and other causes rather than let some greedy execs take millions or give stock holders the profit who end up dumping shares when things get bad. Secondly if PharmD's fall and the whole economy then so will MD's bc if ppl don't have money then certainly they can't afford to pay hospitals and insurace will go bancrupt as well. Sure MD's are one of the safest but do remember that not all make 300k but rather 150 - 200k so their pays would come down as well.
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i know right, what's up with the stupidity of the pre-pharmers these days? i think all the smart ones just stay off SDN, haha.

this is the most epic ******* post i've read in a while!!! i pity the school that accepts someone who writes stupid **** like this! hahahah :laugh::laugh::laugh:
 
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Ross434 said:
Is it really the end of pharmacy if this isnt the case?? Last time i checked, in almost every other profession, a graduate actually had to look for a job based on their qualifications. I dont think the end of the world is here if jobs are no longer being handed out like candy in major cities. There are at least a couple people here who have gotten jobs in OC recently, or knew a friend who did. Which leads me to suspect hiring in "tough" markets is more based on connections, skills, and experience. Maybe the relative surplus will be good for the quality of pharmacists?

And on one hand, as you look at corporations like walgreens screwing over pharmacists and complain about how corporations have ruined everything ... think for a minute about the drug companies, who are basically paying our salary at this point. Big drug companies are what has allowed pharmacies to be so profitable and increased the prescription volume so much in the past decades. One thing to think about in the coming days is that pharma has the most powerful lobby out of any industry, vastly dwarfing other healthcare players, and that overall, they're never going to lose, even in a nationalized healthcare situation (they would lose the least) Which means there is still going to be an ever increasing prescription volume and the high prices and margins to sustain pharmacy growth. In 10 years, the wags thing is going to be but a blip on the radar, so to speak, in pharmacy history, because for all we know prescriptions could be in line to double or triple as baby boomers retire and pharma keeps churning out all these new biotech and lifestyle drugs.
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Stop being so naive. If you have to look for a job with a six figure debt, your life will be ruined. Refer to JDunderground.com for more information. A lot of lawyers graduating dont have jobs but they still have 120k in debt to pay. Besides the fact that most pharmacies dont magically hire somebody unless somebody leaves, a surplus means longer unemployment time or jobs with low ball offers like 30-40k. Hard to make a living when you have to pay 2k in student loans every month.

Prescriptions have been doubling or tripling for a while. Yet for most stores, script counts dont go up. The reason for this is a lot of it is taken up by mail orders that are filled via multi million dollar robots.

I really dont see how biotech or new lifestyle drugs will increase the need for pharmacists. Biotech stocks are decades away and if anything, would be used mostly in hospitals. Lifestyle drugs. . . well, lets say that the pipeline has been dead for a few years now and a lot of potential ones turned out to be busts. Any new drugs that makes it into the market at best will replace old ones leaving.

I say instead of being an optimistic person, lets start preventing new pharmacy schools from opening up and add another year to 6 year programs. We should also start requiring residencies. Also, enough with foreign pharmacists.
 
Ross434 said:
Is it really the end of pharmacy if this isnt the case?? Last time i checked, in almost every other profession, a graduate actually had to look for a job based on their qualifications. I dont think the end of the world is here if jobs are no longer being handed out like candy in major cities.
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I don't think people are saying the end is near. But listen to what you just said. Pharmacy grads are now having to look for a job. The expectation for the past 10 years was for the jobs to come look for pharmacists with a huge sign on bonus. We're saying those days are over. So curve our enthusiasm and become more competitive is what we're saying.

There are at least a couple people here who have gotten jobs in OC recently, or knew a friend who did. Which leads me to suspect hiring in "tough" markets is more based on connections, skills, and experience. Maybe the relative surplus will be good for the quality of pharmacists?
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Considering OC probably has more people than RI or Dakotas combined, a couple of people getting jobs is hardly impressive.

think for a minute about the drug companies, who are basically paying our salary at this point. Big drug companies are what has allowed pharmacies to be so profitable and increased the prescription volume so much in the past decades.
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The cuase and effect of this argument isn't entirely accurate. It's not the pharma causing the increase in prescription volume. It's the demographic of the US, the boomers. If it wasn't for the sheer size of boomer population, the pharma churning out new durgs would not have impacted prescription volume.



One thing to think about in the coming days is that pharma has the most powerful lobby out of any industry, vastly dwarfing other healthcare players,
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Have you heard of AMA?

and that overall, they're never going to lose, even in a nationalized healthcare situation (they would lose the least) Which means there is still going to be an ever increasing prescription volume and the high prices and margins to sustain pharmacy growth.
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Pharma is never going to lose? Everytime one of the block buster drug goes generic, they lose. Are you saying because their lobby is strong, they'll sustain the prescription volume and high margins? FYI, when a drug loses patent, it's unlikely they'll maintain the margin. Again, the prescription volume isn't determined by the manufacturer. It's determined by the demand, the patients.


In 10 years, the wags thing is going to be but a blip on the radar, so to speak, in pharmacy history, because for all we know prescriptions could be in line to double or triple as baby boomers retire and pharma keeps churning out all these new biotech and lifestyle drugs.
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The largest segment of the Boomer generation is in their sixties now. Will their prescription volume double or triple in the next 10 years? I doubt it. I believe they've driven up the volume for the past 10 years. It may increase some. The tail end of the boomer generation (not as many of them) are entering the pill popping age yet it will be offset by the current population dying off. Still, yes we will see a rise in prescription volume for the next 10 to 20 years but the technology will meet the demand of the volume more likely than their human counterparts, pharmacists.

New biotech drugs are usually administered at hospital settings and most likely won't impact the retail operation.

Here is the issue and how our profession got played by WAGS (generic term for chains and mass merchandisers). 15 years ago, WAGS realized the pending Boomers entering the pill popping phase. The propaganda started. Opening of 1 WAGS per day...the Pharmacist Shortage... Baby Boomers. And yes, for the past 15 years, the rapid expansion of WAGS created a shortage of pharmacist never seen before in our history. Sign on bonus and courting of 25 year old PharmD were as fashionable as bell bottom pants in the Disco Era.

To meet ever increasing demands for pharamcists, ACPE allowed indescriminate openings of pharmacy schools. Pharamcy, the recession proof profession. But WAGS knew that the expansion plan had an end date. Once every corner in the US had a free standing WAGS, they knew a time will come when they will turn lean and mean. Well, that day came. WAGS are tailing off thier expansion because they're now set to meet the demands of Boomer scripts.

And WAGS now tip their hats to ACPE.. thank you very much for churning out PharmDs. We now have what we need.

WAGS are scaling back on the expansion yet improving efficiency through technology to meet the foreseeable increase in volume. Yet, those enterprising educators who own PharmD programs aren't ready to shut down, are they. They'll keep cranking out same amount or more PharmDs at the rate needed to meet the demand of the WAGS expansion which now has waned.

That my friends is the real issue today.

Excuse the typos...I don't have ispell check on this puter and I haven't had my coffee yet.
 
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Well said Zyvox....now what are we gonna do about it, or better yet what CAN we do about it...<br />
I will admit I have said enough, but now I want to do something about it, any ideas people???<br />
Unionizing sounds good but there might be negative consequences, we need to get a national attention on this subject or at least get the legislators aware of this...or maybe we can just wait, take a seat and enjoy the ride...<br />
If I could do something about it ,I would, I just don't know where to start
 
qwead said:
Well said Zyvox....now what are we gonna do about it, or better yet what CAN we do about it...<br />
I will admit I have said enough, but now I want to do something about it, any ideas people???<br />
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By making the licensure examination difficult to pass.
 
BMBiology said:
By making the licensure examination difficult to pass.
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But then you get people with PharmDs with no license. I think the proper thing to do would be to just make acceptance into pharmacy school more difficult, that way you know that almost everyone graduating can do the work.
 
meister said:
But then you get people with PharmDs with no license. I think the proper thing to do would be to just make acceptance into pharmacy school more difficult, that way you know that almost everyone graduating can do the work.
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They can practice in a state that has a shortage of pharmacists :smuggrin:
 
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qwead said:
Well said Zyvox....now what are we gonna do about it, or better yet what CAN we do about it...<br />
I will admit I have said enough, but now I want to do something about it, any ideas people???<br />
Unionizing sounds good but there might be negative consequences, we need to get a national attention on this subject or at least get the legislators aware of this...or maybe we can just wait, take a seat and enjoy the ride...<br />
If I could do something about it ,I would, I just don't know where to start
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qwead,

Not to worry. There are opprtunities for bright and hard working pharmacists in clinical and health systems pharmacy setting. I don't disrespect my collegues in retail. But I have been saying to new students to stay away from retail and get into health system pharmacy.
 
Posting on SDN is extremely difficult with a cell phone, I've only done it once on my iPhone and it was an emoticon only response.
 
BMBiology said:
In California, it made a huge difference (when compaing to other states).
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Maybe so...since CA has all those 3rd tier law schools...yet it didn't prevent the salary discrepencies and the notion of "dang..too many lawyers."
 
ItsOverZyvox said:
Maybe so...since CA has all those 3rd tier law schools...yet it didn't prevent the salary discrepencies and the notion of "dang..too many lawyers."
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In terms of salary discrepencies, that really depends on the type of law. Business law tends to do pretty well in California and New York.

There is always too many lawyers. Too bad we can't get rid of them.
 
There are too many pharmacy schools now.
 
ItsOverZyvox said:
There are too many pharmacy schools now.
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Too bad we can't get rid of them as well. I am fine with the new pharmacy schools but I just wish they come from universities like Stanford or Yale. Instead they are just stand alone pharmacy school with no hospital affiliation
 
MountainPharmD said:
Yes "Dude" I have heard of a laptop... I am typing on one as I watch my twin daughters sleep in thier bouncy chairs.

I figured you were one of those guys glued to your blackberry.
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Only when I'm traveling and only from 8 to 5.
 
No because then the state will take them all over and force them to upgrade and increase entrance requirements.

But you're right, it'll never happen.
 
Economy is driven by demographics and technology. In pharmacoeconomics, we can define the major contributing demographics to the Baby Boomers. Computer, IT, and Automation define technology.

Unfortunately, pharmacists as a group don't dictate where our profession is headed. Physicians have done a better job protecting their profession yet healthcare practitioners as a whole have lost the battle against big money.

Woudn't it be wonderful to go back to 1940's lifestyle with modern technology?

Ok..I really don't know how it was in the 40's...I'm not that old. But it sounds good. Simpler life.
 
Glycerin said:
*curtseys* Thank you, thank you.

I've been working on cleaning my computer all night and day. Got something on it and I have to get rid of it stat. Gotta finish two presentations this weekend and I can't do that if the blue screen of death keeps happening sporadically. :(
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You have HP/Compaq don't you..

I knew you sucked at computers...
 
ItsOverZyvox said:
Definitely the user then...
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I'm running 3 different anti-virus programs and one of them (Avast) found something on a powerpoint from my P2 year (I have every lecture from pharmacy school saved on my computer and on a back up drive), which I thought was odd.

McAfee OAS (came with the computer) blocked over 200 actions yesterday, but I don't know how to know what they were.

I deleted Spybot since I think it was corrupted, and I'm about to rerun Adaware.
 
Glycerin said:
I'm running 3 different anti-virus programs and one of them (Avast) found something on a powerpoint from my P2 year (I have every lecture from pharmacy school saved on my computer and on a back up drive), which I thought was odd.

McAfee OAS (came with the computer) blocked over 200 actions yesterday, but I don't know how to know what they were.

I deleted Spybot since I think it was corrupted, and I'm about to rerun Adaware.
Click to expand...

From my experience, running those programs help a little. Sometimes it requires you to manually find those files and delete it yourself. The virus you have probably isn't unique...so google the symptoms and someone somewhere will have the solution.

I run AVG, Adaware, Spybot, CCleaner, & Malwarebytes weekly.. and it's kept all my computers clean. All free programs.
 
ItsOverZyvox said:
From my experience, running those programs help a little. Sometimes it requires you to manually find those files and delete it yourself. The virus you have probably isn't unique...so google the symptoms and someone somewhere will have the solution.

I run AVG, Adaware, Spybot, CCleaner, & Malwarebytes weekly.. and it's kept all my computers clean. All free programs.
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or you can just get a mac...
 
ItsOverZyvox said:
From my experience, running those programs help a little. Sometimes it requires you to manually find those files and delete it yourself. The virus you have probably isn't unique...so google the symptoms and someone somewhere will have the solution.

I run AVG, Adaware, Spybot, CCleaner, & Malwarebytes weekly.. and it's kept all my computers clean. All free programs.
Click to expand...

I tried installing AVG yesterday and each time the installation fails. I e-mailed their tech support.
 
Glycerin said:
I'm running 3 different anti-virus programs and one of them (Avast) found something on a powerpoint from my P2 year (I have every lecture from pharmacy school saved on my computer and on a back up drive), which I thought was odd.

McAfee OAS (came with the computer) blocked over 200 actions yesterday, but I don't know how to know what they were.

I deleted Spybot since I think it was corrupted, and I'm about to rerun Adaware.
Click to expand...

You have to run the anti-virus in safe mode because the viruses are intelligent enough to jump around on the computer. In safe mode, all of the drivers are disabled and the virus is contained. I only use Spybot on my computer, it's a great program when the definitions are kept up to date and you immunize your computer at least once a week.

P.S. Also disable the system restore feature before you do the scan because the virus will just come right back!

HTH
 
Try using ThreatFire Antivirus, it's free and pretty good. It does a good job on fighting malware, spyware and so forth...

http://www.threatfire.com/download/


On a side note, regarding this whole thread of "job death", let us all not forget that as a country we are embarking on uncharted waters financially. Yes, the Great Depression is comparable, but we are at a point that if things do get worst...the Great Depression will be a picnic compared to what we might all have to face.

Our government has committed $7.76 trillion dollars into wall street and the entire financial system, the link to how this money is broken down per "Bloomberg" is here:

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/data?pid=avimage&iid=i0YrUuvkygWs


Now, let's put that in perspective in regards to important historically events that we are all familiar with:

• Marshall Plan: Cost: $12.7 billion, Inflation Adjusted: $115.3 billion
• Louisiana Purchase: Cost: $15 million, Inflation Adjusted: $217 billion
• Race to the Moon: Cost: $36.4 billion, Inflation Adjusted: $237 billion
• S&L Crisis: Cost: $153 billion, Inflation Adjusted Cost: $256 billion
• Korean War: Cost: $54 billion, Inflation Adjusted Cost: $454 billion
• The New Deal: Cost: $32 billion (Est), Inflation Adjusted: $500 billion
• Invasion of Iraq: Cost: $551billion, Inflation Adjusted: $597 billion
• Vietnam War: Cost: $111 billion, Inflation Adjusted: $698 billion
• NASA: Cost: $416.7 billion, Inflation Adjusted: $851.2 billion
• WWII: Cost: $288 billion, Inflation Adjusted: $3.5 trillion

TOTAL: $7.42 Trillion​


Our current GDP is roughly $14.2 trillion dollars, but we currently have an overall federal deficit of nearly $10 trillion dollars. This $10 trillion does not include the $7.76 trillion that has been infused over the past year. So, we are basically living in a house of cards (financially), and the Federal Reserve is merely printing cash with no end in site. The sheer fact that rapid hyperinflation hasn't already occurred is remarkable.

God only knows how this story will end, and we can only hope that things will work out in the end (it usually does).

So, quit worrying about "the death of pharmacy/pharmacists", and just keep your heads up and work hard. If things go south, being a pharmacist will be the last thing on your mind. At that point, owning a gun, generator, food, water, protecting your family and fighting for your life will be the only things that matter.
 
TonyRx said:
The sheer fact that rapid hyperinflation hasn't already occurred is remarkable.
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Well....the world demands dollars in high volume to purchase commodities, in which the sale of is pegged to the dollar. Like oil. And because everyone else's fiat currency sucks, too, none will replace it as the international de facto fiat and the US enjoys an economic hegemony.
 
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WVUPharm2007 said:
Well....the world demands dollars in high volume to purchase commodities, in which the sale of is pegged to the dollar. Like oil. And because everyone else's fiat currency sucks, too, none will replace it as the international de facta fiat and the US enjoys an economic hegemony.
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And this is why saddam was hung. He tried to mess with dollar hegemony.
 
ItsOverZyvox said:
From my experience, running those programs help a little. Sometimes it requires you to manually find those files and delete it yourself. The virus you have probably isn't unique...so google the symptoms and someone somewhere will have the solution.

I run AVG, Adaware, Spybot, CCleaner, & Malwarebytes weekly.. and it's kept all my computers clean. All free programs.
Click to expand...

Stick to what you know, Adaware is yesterday's news. If you are smart you will uninstall that resource wasting hog. MBAM (Malywarebytes) is great. Spybot is mediocre, though the Tea Timer feature is OK. CCleaner (AKA Crap Cleaner) is dangerous if used improperly. DO NOT use the registry functions unless you really know what you are doing. The Temp file cleaner features work nicely....
 
WVUPharm2007 said:
Meh, if that was the case, the US would have invaded Venezuela yeeeears ago.
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Didn't need to. Chavez was a copy cat and we only needed to make an example of one hunged scapegoat.
 
TonyRx said:
Try using ThreatFire Antivirus, it's free and pretty good. It does a good job on fighting malware, spyware and so forth...

http://www.threatfire.com/download/


On a side note, regarding this whole thread of "job death", let us all not forget that as a country we are embarking on uncharted waters financially. Yes, the Great Depression is comparable, but we are at a point that if things do get worst...the Great Depression will be a picnic compared to what we might all have to face.

Our government has committed $7.76 trillion dollars into wall street and the entire financial system, the link to how this money is broken down per "Bloomberg" is here:

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/data?pid=avimage&iid=i0YrUuvkygWs


Now, let's put that in perspective in regards to important historically events that we are all familiar with:

• Marshall Plan: Cost: $12.7 billion, Inflation Adjusted: $115.3 billion
• Louisiana Purchase: Cost: $15 million, Inflation Adjusted: $217 billion
• Race to the Moon: Cost: $36.4 billion, Inflation Adjusted: $237 billion
• S&L Crisis: Cost: $153 billion, Inflation Adjusted Cost: $256 billion
• Korean War: Cost: $54 billion, Inflation Adjusted Cost: $454 billion
• The New Deal: Cost: $32 billion (Est), Inflation Adjusted: $500 billion
• Invasion of Iraq: Cost: $551billion, Inflation Adjusted: $597 billion
• Vietnam War: Cost: $111 billion, Inflation Adjusted: $698 billion
• NASA: Cost: $416.7 billion, Inflation Adjusted: $851.2 billion
• WWII: Cost: $288 billion, Inflation Adjusted: $3.5 trillion

TOTAL: $7.42 Trillion​


Our current GDP is roughly $14.2 trillion dollars, but we currently have an overall federal deficit of nearly $10 trillion dollars. This $10 trillion does not include the $7.76 trillion that has been infused over the past year. So, we are basically living in a house of cards (financially), and the Federal Reserve is merely printing cash with no end in site. The sheer fact that rapid hyperinflation hasn't already occurred is remarkable.

God only knows how this story will end, and we can only hope that things will work out in the end (it usually does).

So, quit worrying about "the death of pharmacy/pharmacists", and just keep your heads up and work hard. If things go south, being a pharmacist will be the last thing on your mind. At that point, owning a gun, generator, food, water, protecting your family and fighting for your life will be the only things that matter.
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So genius, how did we pay for WWII? We printed money then as well. It's just economic growth after the war knocked it out. Look at what happened when Clinton left office. The annual budget was in surplus and we would have been able to pay off our debt. But we did not account for 9/11 and the two wars that resulted as well as small recession.

It's also wise to note that we bailed out the S&L's in the 80's and it was the same % of GDP as the current bank bail out.

If you think you know enough about economics to predict what's going to happen 10 years from now, you will need to submit the results of your last random drug test. Did you predict the housing bubble? Did you predict the effect that the PC had on massively increasing productivity during the 90's that drove economic growth during that period?

Put 5 economists in a room and you get 7 opinions. Reminds of a scene from the West Wing a few years ago:

Chief of Staff: Ok, where are we on the economy? Where will the DOW be in a year?

Economist One: Bad, down a 1000.

Economist Two: Great, up a 1000.

Chief of Staff: In a year one of you is going to look really silly.
 
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