I am a Canadian considering both Ireland and Australia. Has anyone some comparative information on these two options - especially in regard to how each would be viewed on trying to obtain a Canadian residency which I understand is difficult for all IMG's returning to Canada.
Ireland vs. Australia
- Thread starter Squint
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I considered both... thought Ireland might be easier for going back to North America but now I'd almost say Ireland is. Just because they're off schedule. Problem is for the US is us FMG's have to write step 2. If we write it in our final year we won't have covered half a year's worth of stuff on it.
Go where you think there's a chance you could live. I wouldn't put all my eggs in the getting back to Canada basket. Unless you know you want to do family practice. Then, go to either - coming back into FP is not a problem if you're not too picky about location. Even ontario takes loads of FMG FP's as soon as you're an hour away from Toronto.
Go where you think there's a chance you could live. I wouldn't put all my eggs in the getting back to Canada basket. Unless you know you want to do family practice. Then, go to either - coming back into FP is not a problem if you're not too picky about location. Even ontario takes loads of FMG FP's as soon as you're an hour away from Toronto.
M
Mike MacKinnon
I looked into both quite extensively but let me preface this by saying im still pre med and not an authority on the matter.
I would think that Ireland would be the easier route to come back to canada. Really, only for 3 reasons:
1) Alot of canadian students attend irish medical schools because of the intensely competitive nature of canadian medical schools. This being the case, Canada knows what they are getting as they already have alot of them comming back (i know 3 myself though all FP's).
2) For some reason the UK/EU schools are seen as more prestigious than AU schools. In reality there is no truth to that. However, Irish schools such as Trinity, UCD and UCC have a known reputation in Canada. I had even heard of Trinity and UCD before i ever considered medical school.
3) There is a disconnect in the school years in North america and AU. This could be problematic during your match times (you might end up with a bunch of time waiting for the match to start again) as well exam writing times. Not something that couldnt be overcome but something to consider.
Anyway, this is by no means the bible. I would suggest you apply to both and then consider based on where you get in, finiancial issues and personal preferance.
I would think that Ireland would be the easier route to come back to canada. Really, only for 3 reasons:
1) Alot of canadian students attend irish medical schools because of the intensely competitive nature of canadian medical schools. This being the case, Canada knows what they are getting as they already have alot of them comming back (i know 3 myself though all FP's).
2) For some reason the UK/EU schools are seen as more prestigious than AU schools. In reality there is no truth to that. However, Irish schools such as Trinity, UCD and UCC have a known reputation in Canada. I had even heard of Trinity and UCD before i ever considered medical school.
3) There is a disconnect in the school years in North america and AU. This could be problematic during your match times (you might end up with a bunch of time waiting for the match to start again) as well exam writing times. Not something that couldnt be overcome but something to consider.
Anyway, this is by no means the bible. I would suggest you apply to both and then consider based on where you get in, finiancial issues and personal preferance.
Mike MacKinnon said:
Thanks. That was really helpful. Just one other thing....since I note you are from Arizona, how is the comparison of Ireland / Aus in the U.S.? If you show up before a director of residency in the U.S. is he going to have a preference for Ireland over Australia ??
M
Mike MacKinnon
Hey Squint.
Again, remember i am not authority on the matter.
I am a Canadian working in the US. Im a permanent resident here. I believe the Irish schools might have a bot of an edge over the AU ones simply because of name recognition. The director of cardiology where I work is a UCD grad, for instance. Again, i do not believe either is a better school, just that there are some prejudices against the AU schools. The big thing is the timeline for USMLE's and MATCH as well.
Again, remember i am not authority on the matter.
I am a Canadian working in the US. Im a permanent resident here. I believe the Irish schools might have a bot of an edge over the AU ones simply because of name recognition. The director of cardiology where I work is a UCD grad, for instance. Again, i do not believe either is a better school, just that there are some prejudices against the AU schools. The big thing is the timeline for USMLE's and MATCH as well.
Squint said:
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I just re-read what I wrote and realized I wrote it backwards. Australia is off-schedule to the US but that actually helps you. I thought it would hurt you when I was applying.
If you go to an Irish school and want to go to back to the US after, you'll need to write USMLE Step-2. A lot of people do an intern year here since you have to write it in december to apply for the match the year you graduate. That means you'll be missing out on everything that's covered in the second half of your last year and step-2 covers that info.
If you go to Australia, you finish in something like August and then can study and write step-2 in December and apply for the match the same year.
Some people in Irish schools have studied the final year stuff in advance to write step-2 but I don't think that's as easy as it sounds.
Also, I've NEVER ran into any kind of negative attitude to the Australian schools in the states or Canada. Maybe it exists but I haven't seen it. Don't get too comfortable with the idea that some foreign school or another is looked at more favorably for residency spots. I really think if there is an effect, it's so small it's minimal. I like going to school in Ireland but Australia seems like an interesting choice as well. Go wherever you'd like - just study hard and you'll be fine.
If you go to an Irish school and want to go to back to the US after, you'll need to write USMLE Step-2. A lot of people do an intern year here since you have to write it in december to apply for the match the year you graduate. That means you'll be missing out on everything that's covered in the second half of your last year and step-2 covers that info.
If you go to Australia, you finish in something like August and then can study and write step-2 in December and apply for the match the same year.
Some people in Irish schools have studied the final year stuff in advance to write step-2 but I don't think that's as easy as it sounds.
Also, I've NEVER ran into any kind of negative attitude to the Australian schools in the states or Canada. Maybe it exists but I haven't seen it. Don't get too comfortable with the idea that some foreign school or another is looked at more favorably for residency spots. I really think if there is an effect, it's so small it's minimal. I like going to school in Ireland but Australia seems like an interesting choice as well. Go wherever you'd like - just study hard and you'll be fine.
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Hmm? hang on. I'm not sure what UCC's curriculum is like . But for those at Trinity, our last year is an exam year. You have one set of finals (Paeds, Obs/Gyn) in November, and one set of exams (Medicine/Surgery) in April. In between that time, you're just kind of let loose in the hospitals, going to tutorials or setting up tutorials yourself. There is no formal teaching, and you should have learned everything by then (realistically that wouldn't happen), but that time is spent boning up and making sure you know everything solid. We have no teaching the second-half of our last year. It is possible to take the USMLE Step 2 in the summer before your last year, and definitely by December.
This however, also does depend on which rotations you are scheduled for. For instance, I got lucky and am doing all my cores this year, so for final year I only have GP left to do in September/October. So, I can essentially do my USMLE-2 this summer if I wanted to. Others who have like paeds/obs-gyn might want to sit their USMLE-2 in mid-late October or November after the first group of finals. It may involve having to teach yourself some things in order to be able to sit it in a timely fashion for the Match, but it can definitely be done without too much problem.
This however, also does depend on which rotations you are scheduled for. For instance, I got lucky and am doing all my cores this year, so for final year I only have GP left to do in September/October. So, I can essentially do my USMLE-2 this summer if I wanted to. Others who have like paeds/obs-gyn might want to sit their USMLE-2 in mid-late October or November after the first group of finals. It may involve having to teach yourself some things in order to be able to sit it in a timely fashion for the Match, but it can definitely be done without too much problem.
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As regards to Ireland vs. Oz - neither would confer an advantage over the other, all schools in both countries (TCD, UCD, UCC, RCSI, NUIG) vs. (USyd, UMelbourne, Flinders, etc.) have a good reputation. I applied to both Ireland and Oz (TCD and Univ. melbourne), and chose TCD mainly because at that time, UniMelb's graduate entry program into medicine seemed quite new, and I wasn't quite confident that they'd worked all the bugs out, as communication with their administration went around in circles a little. I'm certain it's sorted now that the program has been running for awhile. Another thing was the timing of the school year in Oz, but that was a lesser concern of mine.
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When do Ireland students graduate? Step 3 is written after graduation? For non-Americans without green cards, Step 3 is needed for an H1-b visa so will you have to take Step 3 before your interviews?
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Hi im a 1st year RCSI student in the 5 year program. I can tell you either way(ireland or Aust) the road back to Canada is going to be hard. About 1/4 of my class is canadian and i can tell u they are pissed with the amount of hoop jumping that is required. However i ive been informed that RCSI has close to 100percent matching in the US for those students that pass the USMLEs well. Furthermore RCSI has a v good international reputation.
I believe you need to go through the US to return to canada but isnt there some change coming soon? Im Australian so im not really up to speed on Canadian IMGs returning home.
Carnt comment on Aussie med schools becuase i couldnt get in.
I believe you need to go through the US to return to canada but isnt there some change coming soon? Im Australian so im not really up to speed on Canadian IMGs returning home.
Carnt comment on Aussie med schools becuase i couldnt get in.
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I'm an American who went to Flinders Uni in Australia. I loved the program, loved the people, and loved the country. I stayed and worked for several years after graduation before coming back to the US. I don't think there is any distinction between schools in the UK or Aus. However, I believe they are looked upon more favorably than schools in Mexico, eastern Europe, and the caribbean.
Things to consider.
1) Australian school year differes by 6 months....big bonus!
2) Tuition in Australia is much cheaper.
3) Australia has graduate entry (4 year) programs. I think most places in the UK/Ireland are still 5 or 6 years.
4) Cost of living in Ireland is massive.
5) Cost of living in Australia is quite good.
I had only good experiences when apply for residency in the US. All interviewers seemed to be fascinated by my experience in Aus. (Makes you more memorable in such a large pool of people). The key though....Do very well on USMLE step 1 and step 2.
Also, I had two US students in my class who transfered from Trinity to Flinders because they could not afford to live in Ireland.
Things to consider.
1) Australian school year differes by 6 months....big bonus!
2) Tuition in Australia is much cheaper.
3) Australia has graduate entry (4 year) programs. I think most places in the UK/Ireland are still 5 or 6 years.
4) Cost of living in Ireland is massive.
5) Cost of living in Australia is quite good.
I had only good experiences when apply for residency in the US. All interviewers seemed to be fascinated by my experience in Aus. (Makes you more memorable in such a large pool of people). The key though....Do very well on USMLE step 1 and step 2.
Also, I had two US students in my class who transfered from Trinity to Flinders because they could not afford to live in Ireland.
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Isn't it like damn hard to transfer from med to med? Maybe u could give me some advice here...I've been offered an interview with monash malaysia...1st yr of the course will b in melbourne...subsequent yrs in Malaysia. I'm pretty sure i'll get an offer...but i dun know whether to accept it or not, coz i DO NOT want to do clinicals in malaysia. I plan to transfer after the 1st year. How possible is that? thanks!
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I'm sorry! I should clarify what I meant by that statement. Two students in my year one class came from Trinity College in Dublin. As you know TCD is a 5 or 6 year program. After their first year in Dublin they left because they could no longer afford to stay there. They then applied to Flinders and were accepted. So in essence, they left Trinity and started over at Flinders. Sorry for the confusion.
