I'm so tierd of SCRUB nurses

[ocean11]

Funny... I actually havn't had a problems with regular nurses on the wards yet... but SCRUB nurses... thats a WHOLE different story... not only are some rude to medical students... they are also rude to residents... rolling their eyes, making comments about how slow they are etc etc.... telling them that they are pronouncing the instrument wrongly.... I'm serious.... they also guard their tray with their life "Don't touch its sterile..." I feel like saying "NO $hait Biatch.... I am a meter away and wouldn't come closer anyways...." after my experiences with them Surgery is DEFINETLY out of the question... they make the 'mean' attendings look like angels TRUST ME!

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[Farbar]

no kidding. there is nothing like being across the room from some sterile piece of equipment and the scrub loudly tells you to be sure and not tuch it. you want to say "thanks, i did not really realize what an idiot i was because i was about to go and spit on that". scrubs suck.

 

[njbmd]

Hey Guys,
First rule of surgery: Don't touch anything on the Mayo or table without permission from the scrub nurse/tech. When I ask for an instrument, it goes in my hand. Other than that, they can roll eyes, make comments etc. I am laughing all the way to the bank.

njbmd

 

[Dunce]

no kidding. there is nothing like being across the room from some sterile piece of equipment and the scrub loudly tells you to be sure and not tuch it. you want to say "thanks, i did not really realize what an idiot i was because i was about to go and spit on that". scrubs suck.

ah, yes. The sterile field nazis.
It cracks me up when they watch you like a hawk as you move across the room.

 

[tkim]

There is a heirarchy in the OR that I did not know about when I did my first surgery rotation. It is always good manners to introduce yourself to the nurse and tech, write your name and year on the board, and help out before and after the surgery. If you are not needed by your attending or your resident, you should not excuse yourself from the OR or break scrub until the scrub nurse no longer needs your help.

There are some nurses who will never like you, but if you show them these courtesies, you'd be amazed at how fast some of them turn around.

 

[The_Sensei]

Scrub nurses......ahhhhhhh......the joy of the OR. Just ignore those *******...I've had to destroy a few of them in my post-residency life, believe me.

 

[igcgnerd]

It sounds like theres a lot of surgical ego in here

 

[tupac_don]

Scrub nurses......ahhhhhhh......the joy of the OR. Just ignore those*******.....I've had to destroy a few of them in my post-residency life, believe me.

Go get em Kurt.

 

[Dr. Will]

You're going to find nice ones and mean ones wherever you go. It's all person dependent. Some people just like to power trip on the only thing that they have control of.

 

[ocean11]

Scrub nurses......ahhhhhhh......the joy of the OR. Just ignore those *******.......I've had to destroy a few of them in my post-residency life, believe me.

You're awsome Sensei! 3 kudos to this post congrats on finishing residency have a great weekend

 

[Dr JPH]

Unfortunately you are going to find attitudes in every profession and at every level. If this sort of thing gets to you then I suggest you learn some ways of coping when you deal with some really nasty personalities.

And if you think the way some people act to your face is bad, just imagine what is said behind your back.

Its always good to make friends with some of the nicer nurses...a good way to avoid unecessary 3am pages and to get the scoop on what the real opinions are...more for entertainment purposes than anything!

Check out some nursing message boards if you want a real laugh. Everything said here about them is said there about us. Just let it roll of your back.

 

[doctorlauren]

I saw this thread and immediately thought, how strange - can't be! I didn't have this experience on my surg rotation, but know plenty of people who have. I figured I was lucky that I just wasn't at a certain hospital, btu it seems like this is much more widespread than I thought.

 

[Doc Ivy]

What I've realized is that the sterile field is what they care about--- that is their first priority, not your feelings. It sucks but I've noticed that as I get more comfortable in the OR, learn what I can and can't do, when/how to help, learn when to get out of the way, they start to give you a little respect. Little things go a long way, like pull your own gloves. As someone else mentioned write your name on the board. Put your own outer gloves on if you see he/she is busy trying to get the field prepped.

And realize that no matter how long you've been standing there with your wet hands in the air, she will NEVER gown and glove you before the attending

 

[Blue Frog]

They're not all bad. In fact some are quite nice, helpful, and understanding of medical students...and I can understand the older ones have had to deal with us for years...every day some new idiot student who walks into something and then they have to take care of it..and then if the Dr. is a yeller...the next thing is "where's my Debakey!" ...or something...
...but yes, I think i've been working with one of the worst at my hospital...the minute I walked in the room behind the reident and he introduced me she just started yelling at me, and I hadn't done anything wrong! And then I've got the Dr. yellinging stand here...then she yells don't stand there, then he yells stand there...and for like a minute I was just a pinball back and fourth. then...It was my first time scrubbing in and everything was going smoothly until I didn't detach the little card from the left side strap before attempting to hand it to her, and she just threw up her hands and said...I can't deal with this! and walked away. I do have to say...dealing with being yelled at and told you're an idot is for some reason much easier to take when you have a mask on...adds a little annonymity I guess.

 

[igcgnerd]

There are a$$holes in every profession nurses, lawyers, professional athletes, and despite popular belief, even some surgeons
Just remember with any jerk you have to deal with, kill them with kindness.

 

[nabeya]

There are a$$holes in every profession nurses, lawyers, professional athletes, and despite popular belief, even some surgeons
Just remember with any jerk you have to deal with, kill them with kindness.

Uh, if you have spent some time in the OR, then you'll probably know that "killing them with kindness" wont really get you anywhere. The only way is to just familiarize yourself with what to and what not do in the OR and then nobody has a reason to yell at you.

 

[ForbiddenComma]

Uh, if you have spent some time in the OR, then you'll probably know that "killing them with kindness" wont really get you anywhere. The only way is to just familiarize yourself with what to and what not do in the OR and then nobody has a reason to yell at you.

Too true. And some of them will ride you even if you are doing absolutely nothing wrong. I could be five feet from the nearest table and there's always a nurse yelling at me, "DON'T DRIP ON THE TABLE!"

CRNA's can be a piece of work too. One time the CRNA was letting the pt brady down to 40-something pulse and BP 70/25ish while she just sat there and did paperwork. So when I finally said something, she used the Evil Eye on me for a good couple of minutes while she got around to pushing eppy.

Disclaimer: There are a lot of nice scrub nurses too. But human nature being what it is, we only talk about the bad ones

 

[Mr. McDuck]

I've only had a problem with one scrub nurse, and that was because she told the OR supervisor that I yelled at her and made her feel bad. I was shocked when I was pulled aside and asked to explain. I couldn't even recollect saying anything to her. Apparently, she misunderstood something I said to someone else about a completely different subject.

Anyway, some of them need to relax a little when it comes to work, but for the most part, they are pretty nice.

 

[beansandchips]

There is a heirarchy in the OR that I did not know about when I did my first surgery rotation. It is always good manners to introduce yourself to the nurse and tech, write your name and year on the board, and help out before and after the surgery. If you are not needed by your attending or your resident, you should not excuse yourself from the OR or break scrub until the scrub nurse no longer needs your help.

There are some nurses who will never like you, but if you show them these courtesies, you'd be amazed at how fast some of them turn around.

Yeah. I really never had a problem with the scrub nurses like a lot of my colleagues (supposedly) had. I would always introduce myself, played up a lot of self-depreciation ("Just a dumb 3rd year medical student, just trying to make it through the day without looking stupid" etc) and deferred all authority to them as well as offering to help if they ever needed anything. Which they never did, but it was out there anyway. Sucked up, basically, and tried to be as friendly as possible.

I also found that whenever a scrub nurse would say something even remotely authoritative, such as telling a student to be careful or that they had broken scrub, the story would morph into a stereotypical evil scrub nurse story, almost for traditions sake.

And no, I'm not married to a scrub nurse. I just don't believe the hype...or maybe I was just extremely lucky.

 

[AmoryBlaine]

What I've realized is that the sterile field is what they care about--- that is their first priority, not your feelings. It sucks but I've noticed that as I get more comfortable in the OR, learn what I can and can't do, when/how to help, learn when to get out of the way, they start to give you a little respect. Little things go a long way, like pull your own gloves. As someone else mentioned write your name on the board. Put your own outer gloves on if you see he/she is busy trying to get the field prepped.

And realize that no matter how long you've been standing there with your wet hands in the air, she will NEVER gown and glove you before the attending

Maybe I will sound like a huge idiot here, but why can STERILE assistants not touch the Mayo under any circumstances? I do it when I have to and I've never gotten yelled at. When the scrub nurse is over at another table and the surgeon wants an army-navy I just grab it and slap it into his hand. Is the scrub nurse somehow "more sterile" than me? I think not...

I only got chastised once by a scrub nurse/circulator combo for something I didn't do and so I yelled right back. The surgeons didn't seem to care and she chilled out after the incident.

 

[Mr. McDuck]

I think it's because they have to count everything (if you're entering a body cavity), and they want to know where everything is. Of course, if she's standing there watching you take it, I don't see what the problem is. Maybe they are just territorial and don't want to feel like they aren't needed.

 

[Chronic Student]

Some scrub techs have scalpels and needles on the mayo and they don't want you to touch it because they are trying to protect you. Then again, some are just being turds.

Some also have everything arranged on the mayo where they can just grab it without thinking and when you grab something off or put something on, then you've messed up their system.

Sometimes its because the instruments are counted and they want to keep track of each and every one.

-Mike

 

[albaniandoc]

Ok, as a scrub nurse that is applying to med school I can tell you why we are pissed off at times.
I work in open heart surgery and the other day, in a case that I didn't scrub, I heard that a third year medical student was holding the heart with one hand and with the other scratching their nose and fixing their mask. Helloo.
Another one wanted the "bogie" to burn some tissue, while others like to have some "plungers" instead of pledgets.
The other day this medical student was right in my way while we were trying to canulate the heart to go on by-pass on a patient that had no vital signs. I tried to be nice but they were right up my ass. So needless to say I was pissed off. And, it's not like the heart surgeon cares that the medical student was in my way either.
So, it is not that we are idiots but we have to be alert as to what goes on. There is a lot of traffic in and out of the OR and the chance for contamination is higher in such cases. Besides that it is hard to know who is a ***** and who is a good student with OR "knowledge".
Imagine that third year student lowering their hand from their nose and back into the heart of the patient.
Furthermore, I have my Mayo set up a certain way. This way when the surgeon needs something I don't look I just reach. There is a only a fraction of a second to pick up an instrument in heart surgery. If you miss that window you get yelled at and scoulded like a child. You pick up something and don't put it back when I reach my hand will grasp thin air. That does not make heart surgeons happy. I tell them that as long as you put it back or say that you took the coronary scissors or needleholders we are ok because I know where to look for it.
Finally, before bitching and moaning make sure you learn what the etiquete is in the OR and abide by it. Everbody will respect you and be nicer if you play by the rules.

 

[albaniandoc]

Scrub nurses......ahhhhhhh......the joy of the OR. Just ignore those *******....I've had to destroy a few of them in my post-residency life, believe me.

Wow, you want a Nobel prize of peace for your contribution.

 

[SLUser11]

Wow, you want a Nobel prize of peace for your contribution.

I just assumed you were a girl before I looked at your profile......anyway, while your "you won't believe what this stupid med student did today" stories are abundant, alot of the lack of OR knowledge comes from OR staff hostility, where insults are much more common than teaching and instruction.

You work at a teaching hospital....if you don't like "Stupid med students" around, you should quit....otherwise participate in the teaching process instead of being a jerk.

If you go to med school as planned, you'll understand what it feels like to be the MS3 in the OR, and you'll be a little more sympathetic....they're very, very scared....

It's not just the really dumb med students that are subject to a hostile OR staff, it's most of them.....and it's beyond what is necessary for patient safety. Mostly the animosity is of the same breed seen on the wards, but amplified by the intense nature of the OR......I could explain it in detail, but it is a broken record and discussed in length quite often on this board....jealousy, projection, conformity to a hostile framework, etc.

 

[Mr. McDuck]

Something tells me she won't be uncomfortable in the OR, being as she's been working in one for a while. But, I do agree. If you don't like med students in your way, you shouldn't be working at a teaching hospital. If you do, you should be willing to be part of the teaching process. Plenty of people on this board have written about helpful scrubs and circulators. That's how it should be.

And, on the flip side, if you see the scrub has to count a bagillion things, and you know how to load suture, offering to load the suture they use to close while she counts wouldn't kill you.

 

[The_Sensei]

Wow, you want a Nobel prize of peace for your contribution.

Nope, just the satisfaction of destroying one of those slobs when they need it.

 

[albaniandoc]

If you go to med school as planned, you'll understand what it feels like to be the MS3 in the OR, and you'll be a little more sympathetic....they're very, very scared....

I understand that students are scared, and I sympathize with the. That is one reason for them not to be cocky but try to learn.
Like I mention when we were trying to cannulate in the example above the med student just froze and was in my way. I could not pass stuff and the surgeon started yelling at me. That made for everything that much worse. Common sense thing to do - Step back. It does not require med school education, just common sense. That's all.

 

[The_Sensei]

("Just a dumb 3rd year medical student, just trying to make it through the day without looking stupid" etc) and deferred all authority to them as well as offering to help if they ever needed anything.

Pathetic. Dude, grow some [testicles and act like a mature male adult]

 

[FowlersGap]

theyre all really nice to me; some even know my name when i walk into the room; i think they've been pretty cool so far!

 

[Dr JPH]

CRNA's can be a piece of work too. One time the CRNA was letting the pt brady down to 40-something pulse and BP 70/25ish while she just sat there and did paperwork. So when I finally said something, she used the Evil Eye on me for a good couple of minutes while she got around to pushing eppy.

Next time tell the resident or attending.

 

[Dr JPH]

Just a friendly word of warning to avoid foul language and personal attacks.

Thanks

 

[Mr. McDuck]

I like when they let the SRNAs have their own rooms--gotta love when they put the patient under general without an airway.

Note: I think CRNAs are great. I just don't think any student, of any medical profession, should be left alone. That just asks for trouble.

 

[anamarylee]

So far I haven't had any problems in this area (knock on wood). I always got to the OR before the attending, helped set up the patient, if I wasn't sterile and they needed sutures from the closet I would carefully open it and drop it on their mayo stand, when I was sterile and in the field I would ask permission (either verbally or non-verbally) to take instruments from their stands. The best crash course in scrubbing I've gotten came from a scrub nurse who was just standing by the sinks, waiting for the next patient. I asked him to talk me through the scrubbing procedure with a smile and he did, step by step. I've had a few be grateful to me for holding a retractor for them while they reached for the next instrument. It's all a matter of attitude, and remembering that the OR is their territory. What the scrub nurse and the circulating nurse say it's the law of their land.

 

[SLUser11]

So far I haven't had any problems in this area (knock on wood). I always got to the OR before the attending, helped set up the patient, if I wasn't sterile and they needed sutures from the closet I would carefully open it and drop it on their mayo stand, when I was sterile and in the field I would ask permission (either verbally or non-verbally) to take instruments from their stands. The best crash course in scrubbing I've gotten came from a scrub nurse who was just standing by the sinks, waiting for the next patient. I asked him to talk me through the scrubbing procedure with a smile and he did, step by step. I've had a few be grateful to me for holding a retractor for them while they reached for the next instrument. It's all a matter of attitude, and remembering that the OR is their territory. What the scrub nurse and the circulating nurse say it's the law of their land.

You've most likely worked in an OR that is a healthy learning environment:
1. The students show respect and are not cocky
2. The scrub techs and nurses communicate with the students and are eager to teach without animosity.
3. Everybody wins.

Too bad most big old-school academic centers don't have this. Instead, the OR staff is programmed to resent and despise the student, and talk sh@t constantly behind the student/resident/attending's back....this is a LEARNED trait, passed down from previous staff (fostered antagonism).

The response from us is to resent them, occasionally talking back to them/appearing cocky, usually in response to some insult/putdown/unnecessary rudeness....everybody gets mad, and the cycle continues......that way, nothing ever gets better.

 

[DOAnestMan]

As an OR Tech for 6 years and a current 3rd year medical student, the SINGLE best piece of advice is NEVER EVER touch their mayo. While I didn't necessarily care, it certainly does bother most techs/nurses. In addition, it increases the likelihood of needlesticks, and no one wants to deal with all that paperwork. Be respectful and polite and it will always serve you well.

 

[albaniandoc]

So far I haven't had any problems in this area (knock on wood). I always got to the OR before the attending, helped set up the patient, if I wasn't sterile and they needed sutures from the closet I would carefully open it and drop it on their mayo stand, when I was sterile and in the field I would ask permission (either verbally or non-verbally) to take instruments from their stands. The best crash course in scrubbing I've gotten came from a scrub nurse who was just standing by the sinks, waiting for the next patient. I asked him to talk me through the scrubbing procedure with a smile and he did, step by step. I've had a few be grateful to me for holding a retractor for them while they reached for the next instrument. It's all a matter of attitude, and remembering that the OR is their territory. What the scrub nurse and the circulating nurse say it's the law of their land.

I think this pretty much sums it up. I can certainly appreaciate a hand once in a while and someone who respects the rules of the OR. As you can see that students that respect us will get respect back. It is mutual.
With your great personality and attitude you will go far and your patients will thank you for it.
God bless.

 

[ocean11]

I think this pretty much sums it up. I can certainly appreaciate a hand once in a while and someone who respects the rules of the OR. As you can see that students that respect us will get respect back. It is mutual.
With your great personality and attitude you will go far and your patients will thank you for it.
God bless.

but here's the deal, I AM so nice to the scrub nurses, and one in particular still rolls her eyes when I forget to 'piroet' and hand her the card on my gown. She still yells when I'm not scrubbed in and 3-4 metres away from the mayo and sterile tray.... it is VERY annoying... in addition, she treats the residents like shait and makes snippy comments all the time. THey can't stand her either..... the only person she 'respects' is the attending.....

I have NOT had a problem with anyone else... exept the odd scrub nurse at this hospital... if you go into surgery DO NOT GO HERE!!!!!!!!!

In addition, MAYBE the scrub nurses should lay the rules down to the 3rd year med student BEFORE the surgery WHILE they are helping them gown, then afterwards during the 'open heart surgery'. DOsn't that make sense... and to the guy who said if you don't like med students go to a diff hospital YOU ARE 100% RIGHT ON BROTHER

 

[lady bug]

What is the mayo?

 

[Doc Ivy]

What is the mayo?

It's the stand where the scrub nurse places all of their instruments

 

[Mr. McDuck]

One of the attendings here tells all the scrub nurses that go into his room that the mayo and the instruments are his--he's just letting the scrub nurse touch them to make his job easier. Haha, apparently one of the nurses a while back didn't like this too much and kept telling him to stop grabbing things off the mayo. I wasn't there, but he (and others with no reason to exaggerate) said he tipped the mayo stand over and told her to pick up "her instruments".

Now that I write that, it seems kind of mean, but it still makes me laugh.

 

[Dunce]

One of the attendings here tells all the scrub nurses that go into his room that the mayo and the instruments are his--he's just letting the scrub nurse touch them to make his job easier. Haha, apparently one of the nurses a while back didn't like this too much and kept telling him to stop grabbing things off the mayo. I wasn't there, but he (and others with no reason to exaggerate) said he tipped the mayo stand over and told her to pick up "her instruments".

Now that I write that, it seems kind of mean, but it still makes me laugh.

hot damn!

 

[albaniandoc]

One of the attendings here tells all the scrub nurses that go into his room that the mayo and the instruments are his--he's just letting the scrub nurse touch them to make his job easier. Haha, apparently one of the nurses a while back didn't like this too much and kept telling him to stop grabbing things off the mayo. I wasn't there, but he (and others with no reason to exaggerate) said he tipped the mayo stand over and told her to pick up "her instruments".

Now that I write that, it seems kind of mean, but it still makes me laugh.

That does sound funny. I think a lot of us develop thick skin eventually, wether you are a nurse, PA, surgeon or anesthesia. And it's not that we are rude or jerks, but the OR enviroment demands that you become thick skinned in order to survive. Apart from that when you meet most people for parties or just lunches most of them are very nice. I had the anesthesia and the surgeon group write LORs and they wrote some of the nicest stuff. I did not imagine that they respected us (nurses) so much. And to think that during our daily routine they are always yelling and with a demeaning attitude. I guess it's just business, nothing personal right?
When I read this thread I started reflecting back and thought how rude everyone was in the OR. I caught myself today doing that. It's not that I was rude but short and direct requests, instead of: excuse me, can I have the 7-0 Prolene please.
On a side note we have a surgeon that used to work at a VA hospital and apparently nurses there just don't care too much so they would start counting before the surgery was over and the surgeons would have to get his own instruments. After a while they coined the term "smorgasbord surgery"
I thought that was hilarious.

 

[raptor5]

Where I did surgery scrub nurses were great. Self service Mayo trays. It was the CRNA's and the Anesthesiologists that were the problem. LVH.org.

 

[Mr. McDuck]

Yeah, most of the scrubs that I work with have the self-serve mayo. They just put everything up there that they think you'll need, and if it's not there you just ask and they give it to you--and then, they leave it up there so you don't have to ask again.

 

[Dunce]

What is the mayo?

nothing fancy
It's basically just a sterile version of this

 

[MossPoh]

Maybe it has something to do with medical students..because while I was in the OR with surgeons shadowing they were nothing but nice to me...but then I also think certain hospitals and regions are probably more prone to it than others. I got yelled at but I never really take it to heart...compared to what I encountered during my drumline days where I got called a worthless ****** and had to do pushups because I moved my eyes from set other stuff doesn't seem too bad. I do appreciate the point where the nurses don't see you as a doctor yet and talk to you like you are a regular person... I think, so far at least, I have learned more from the nurses and physician assistants than doctors because of this. Not so much the medical perspective but the social atmosphere in the hospital and how to act around nurses, xray techs, etc. I also hammered it into me since my mom was an xray tech (dad is a radiologist) and constantly thanking and being as kind as possible are almost requirements for me. You'll meet that person that is a douche..but so what that is everywhere. I was amazed at how much stuff some of the nurses had going in their heads and still handled the situation cooly and calmly. A person has been charged with a job and they are serious about it...I can't be mad at them about them. While it may be a teaching hospital, the first priority should always be the patient.. it is never fun to be yelled at...sometimes it seems like stupid stuff but there is bound to be one person in the history of mankind that didn't know they were doing something wrong....does that account for being an ass? Of course not..but I can defintley understanding snapping at someone when they are impeding you from your job in some way... I've done it before, even when I know they simply didn't mean harm. I feel bad afterwards but oh well..life goes on. Until the scrub nurse stabs you in the face with a scalpel I think you'll survive!

 

[DOAnestMan]

One of the attendings here tells all the scrub nurses that go into his room that the mayo and the instruments are his--he's just letting the scrub nurse touch them to make his job easier. Haha, apparently one of the nurses a while back didn't like this too much and kept telling him to stop grabbing things off the mayo. I wasn't there, but he (and others with no reason to exaggerate) said he tipped the mayo stand over and told her to pick up "her instruments".

Now that I write that, it seems kind of mean, but it still makes me laugh.

That surgeon sounds like a real jerk. The instruments most likely belong to the hospital, not him. He sounds like an egotistical pr*ck. I can guarantee that if he really acted like that, he would not get very good help from the staff. Surgeons who are polite and fun to work with often notice that their cases run smoother and get done faster than some surgeon who acts like they are the second coming. I cannot overemphasize being polite and respectful. There will always be nurses, techs, or doctors who don't appreciate it, but if you start letting them ruin you day or rotation, your entire career will be miserable.

 

[Mr. McDuck]

He didn't mean it literally. He was taking stuff off the mayo and she kept slapping his hand away, so he wanted her to understand that he was allowed to touch the instruments. I probably should have included that part.

Also, he's one of the few surgeons at this institution that everyone loves working with. It's probably because he's calmed down a LOT. Now, he's very nice, very willing to teach, and often buys the whole room lunch.

He's an incredible surgeon too. And no, I don't work for him, I'm not related to him, and I don't have stock in his practice or anything, lol. He's just good. I'll admit, he is a bit arrogant in relation to other surgeons, but he is good.

 

[albaniandoc]

We had a surgeon that several times expressed the opinion that he could train a monkey to scrub and pass instruments. One day the patient's heart fell apart and he needed all the help he could get and the nurse replied: Why don't you get your monkey to help you? Needless to say he didn't mention that again.