how much did you have in savings before starting med school in Australia?

[jaketheory]

really guys, i was just looking for advice on how much i should have in the bank before starting med school.

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[JanikeyDoc]

really guys, i was just looking for advice on how much i should have in the bank before starting med school.

Back to the topic, it really depends on your lifestyle. I would say for a modest lifestyle in Sydney at least $2000-$2500AUD a month, you will pay at least $1000AUD a month for place near campus if you don't want to share that is for a studio, 1 bedrooms average about $1500AUD a month near USyd, the rents are climbing even though the Aussie economy is going to the toilet like the rest of the world. Probably it will be less in other places. I think Melbourne is just as pricey as Sydney. You will probably spend a lot less in Brisbane or in Adelaide.

 

[shan564]

If you're surviving on student loans, you really don't need any money. The more money you have, the less interest you'll end up paying... so more is better, but there's no real minimum that you should have.

 

[jaketheory]

If you're surviving on student loans, you really don't need any money. The more money you have, the less interest you'll end up paying... so more is better, but there's no real minimum that you should have.

i realize that when i posted my original message i had forgotten that grad plus loans were now available to make up the difference between cost of attendance and stafford loans. but i'm also concerned that i may end up at a school that does not particpate at all in the US federal loan program meaning i have to deal solely with private loans. given private loans have higher rates, variable rates, and are much harder to secure than US loans in this economy, i'm worried about having enough.

my visa stipulates i live in NSW and the only school offering US loans in NSW is USyd. The local quotas are generally considerably more competitive than the international quotas, USyd is among the most competitive schools for local applicants (with ANU and Melbourne) and i think it is likely that USyd will start ranking applicant based on GPA for the class for which I would be applying. I have a weighted gpa of 3.20/4 and Flinders (a school which ranks based on GPA) told me that is a little below the average succesful local applicants. Thus, I may end with private loans as my only option.

 

[shan564]

FYI, it seems like USyd might not be changing their admission policy (contrary to what we were expecting) - but I'm not sure about that.

I live comfortably in Sydney for about $1500 AUD/month, and I'm not exactly frugal. If you get a CSP, then your Stafford loans will come close to covering everything you need; another $5-6k per year should be more than enough (and if you don't have that in your savings, it shouldn't be too hard to get $5-6k from a private bank).

 

[jaketheory]

FYI, it seems like USyd might not be changing their admission policy (contrary to what we were expecting) - but I'm not sure about that.

shan, can you elaborate? what makes you think this? according to an article in the Australian published in 2008 they were supposed to change it for this year's admissions cycle but they did not. but i think it may still happen next year. it would be great if they did not but i hate not knowing.

I live comfortably in Sydney for about $1500 AUD/month, and I'm not exactly frugal. If you get a CSP, then your Stafford loans will come close to covering everything you need; another $5-6k per year should be more than enough (and if you don't have that in your savings, it shouldn't be too hard to get $5-6k from a private bank).

but i'm worried i'll end up at a school that doesnt offer US loans. for those schools i'm not worried because the gradplus would cover what the stafford doesnt. only UQ, USyd, and Flinders offer US loans . if i end up at a school that doesnt offer US loans i'd have to cover the CSP student contribution plus all my living expenses and i'm under the impression that getting private student loans is much different in Aus than in the US, that it isnt done much, not that much can be taken out, and they expect it paid back within a couple years of taking them out. if thats true, it obviously wouldnt work.

 

[shan564]

There was talk about them changing their admissions process for the 2010 class, but they ended up deciding against it. I haven't heard anything to indicate that they might change it for the 2011 class, but you might want to call them to ask.

 

[JanikeyDoc]

FYI, it seems like USyd might not be changing their admission policy (contrary to what we were expecting) - but I'm not sure about that.

I live comfortably in Sydney for about $1500 AUD/month, and I'm not exactly frugal. If you get a CSP, then your Stafford loans will come close to covering everything you need; another $5-6k per year should be more than enough (and if you don't have that in your savings, it shouldn't be too hard to get $5-6k from a private bank).

You must be in some kind of share accommodation, there is no way you could live within the city area and only spend about 1500 AUD a month. Bare minimum to get your own place is at least 220 to 250 AUD a week around USyd, that does include utilities like gas, water, and electricity.

 

[shan564]

I rent a room in a 6-bedroom house; I don't feel the need to spend the money for anything more than that.

 

[JanikeyDoc]

I rent a room in a 6-bedroom house; I don't feel the need to spend the money for anything more than that.

Well many students in the Grad Entry program tend to be older people. I personally would feel foolish rooming at my ripe age with 20 somethings. You are probably able to survive on 1500 AUD a month with share housing, many people I know prefer to have their own place for a number of issues.

 

[redshifteffect]

Then they aren't exactly students are they? How many students in New York live in their own apartments, unless they have wealthy parents?

If you're a student and you don't have an unlimited bank account I guess you have to tough it out.

 

[JanikeyDoc]

I am not sure about New York but in most parts of the US with the exception of the biggest coastal cities like LA and SF, its not that hard to find reasonably priced housing. When people talk about expensive and America, its the exceptions like NYC, San Francisco, LA, and the like that come out to be overpriced. I normally live in Miami, and the housing there is generally much better than what I see in Sydney. I could live on South Beach for the same amount that I spend to live in a so so area of the CBD, my Sydney apartment has million dollar views of porno shops and pawn outlets. Rents in Sydney are climbing yet again even though Aussie real estate is beginning to crash. A lot of it is ridiculously overpriced, even the so called posh Sydney suburb of Bondi did not impress me at all, if that is the most fashionable beach in Australia, that would mean South Beach is the best beach on the Earth.
America beats Australia on so many levels, you always read about Aussies going to the USA and not coming back but rarely do you hear about it the other way. Living here for a while I figured it out.
I am in my 30s, I am not going to live with a bunch of kids younger than me, that would be odd.

 

[redshifteffect]

I see plenty of Americans at the hospital everyday that have settled here. Two of my neurosurg bosses were American's that settled here (had to repeat all of their training but they did it). I also had a boss in Gynae (ironically he got sued) and quite a few in General practice. BTW this was in a small town, not in a large city. So though you may not like it, that doesn't mean no one else will.

I'm sure there are plenty of Australians who wouldn't like living in the US.

America is a much bigger market and in some fields has many more opportunities. However in medicine, particularily with the HMOs running the show it may not be the best place to work...particularily if you like socialised medicine.

 

[JanikeyDoc]

I see plenty of Americans at the hospital everyday that have settled here. Two of my neurosurg bosses were American's that settled here (had to repeat all of their training but they did it). I also had a boss in Gynae (ironically he got sued) and quite a few in General practice. BTW this was in a small town, not in a large city. So though you may not like it, that doesn't mean no one else will.

I'm sure there are plenty of Australians who wouldn't like living in the US.

America is a much bigger market and in some fields has many more opportunities. However in medicine, particularily with the HMOs running the show it may not be the best place to work...particularily if you like socialised medicine.

Canadians heavily outnumber Americans here among the general population and in the universities. There are some Americans living here but there are Americans living all over the world.

I have actually met quite a few Aussies in the US, many seem to like America more, I believe nearly 2 million Aussies live overseas, that is one in 10 people.

Australia is a nice place believe it or not, but I have no family here, and life alone is not easy. I think that would be the issue for anyone who goes overseas especially to a far away place. Many of the people who come here for work or uni usually go home when they are done. I rarely even see the same person ever again in Sydney.

 

[redshifteffect]

It's funny though but I've had several patients who were Canadians who had spouses from here...they gave the US/Canada 5 years and still ended up coming back. Number 1 complaint from 99% was the weather in Canada and the lack of social security in the US.

But I gree..it's hard living somewhere without family.

 

[shan564]

Canadians heavily outnumber Americans here among the general population and in the universities. There are some Americans living here but there are Americans living all over the world.

I have actually met quite a few Aussies in the US, many seem to like America more, I believe nearly 2 million Aussies live overseas, that is one in 10 people.

Based on a quick wikipedia search, there are about 89,000 Australians in America. At the time of the 1999 census, there were over 100,000 Americans in Australia (55k in Sydney, 38k in Melbourne, 7k in Perth, 2.5k in Canberra, not including government employees)

I couldn't find any data on the number of Canadians in Australia, but Canada didn't appear on the top-20 list (the US did).

There are about 1 million Australian-born people living overseas (half the number you said). 400,000 of them (2% of the Australian population) are living in the UK. Meanwhile, over a million people from the UK (2% of the population) are living in Australia. It seems like they essentially just exchanged 2% of their population, probably for a variety of reasons.

(correct me if I'm wrong) You're from a west-coast American city, right? I'd expect there to be more Australians on the West Coast than elsewhere... maybe that's why your experience is skewed.

We can all use our personal experience to say "Australians like America better" or anything else that we believe to be true. The fact, however, is that people will often give you a distorted version of their own preferences. An Australian in America will want to justify his/her decision to go to America by saying that America is better. Most Americans in Australia (not including Janikey, of course) would say the same about Australia.

I have seen a few objective studies that measure the quality of life in various countries:

On The Economist's Quality of Life Index, Australia is #6, the US is #13, and Canada is #14.

On the Human Development Index, Australia is #3, Canada is #4, and the US is #12.

On the Legatum Prosperity Index, Australia is #1, the US is #6, and Canada is #14.

On The Economist's "Most Livable Cities" list, Melbourne, Perth, Adelaide, and Sydney rank #2, 4, 7, and 9, respectively (Sydney is lower b/c of the cost of living). Vancouver is #1 and Calgary is tied with Adelaide for 7. No American cities were in the top 25.

On Mercer's "Quality of Living" survey, Sydney ranked #10 and Vancouver ranked #4. The highest American cities were Honolulu and San Francisco at 27 and 29.


Those are just the first few things that I found. There are several variables that they don't consider, including the weather (Aus > USA > Canada), the wildlife (hard to rank), and the availability of opportunities for travel/work within the same country (USA > Canada > Aus).

Still, we're really nitpicking little details here. For the most part, Australia and the US are fairly similar. When I compare them to a place like Pakistan (where I was born), it's really not even much of a question.

 

[JanikeyDoc]

Based on a quick wikipedia search, there are about 89,000 Australians in America. At the time of the 1999 census, there were over 100,000 Americans in Australia (55k in Sydney, 38k in Melbourne, 7k in Perth, 2.5k in Canberra, not including government employees)

I couldn't find any data on the number of Canadians in Australia, but Canada didn't appear on the top-20 list (the US did).

There are about 1 million Australian-born people living overseas (half the number you said). 400,000 of them (2% of the Australian population) are living in the UK. Meanwhile, over a million people from the UK (2% of the population) are living in Australia. It seems like they essentially just exchanged 2% of their population, probably for a variety of reasons.

(correct me if I'm wrong) You're from a west-coast American city, right? I'd expect there to be more Australians on the West Coast than elsewhere... maybe that's why your experience is skewed.

We can all use our personal experience to say "Australians like America better" or anything else that we believe to be true. The fact, however, is that people will often give you a distorted version of their own preferences. An Australian in America will want to justify his/her decision to go to America by saying that America is better. Most Americans in Australia (not including Janikey, of course) would say the same about Australia.

I have seen a few objective studies that measure the quality of life in various countries:

On The Economist's Quality of Life Index, Australia is #6, the US is #13, and Canada is #14.

On the Human Development Index, Australia is #3, Canada is #4, and the US is #12.

On the Legatum Prosperity Index, Australia is #1, the US is #6, and Canada is #14.

On The Economist's "Most Livable Cities" list, Melbourne, Perth, Adelaide, and Sydney rank #2, 4, 7, and 9, respectively (Sydney is lower b/c of the cost of living). Vancouver is #1 and Calgary is tied with Adelaide for 7. No American cities were in the top 25.

On Mercer's "Quality of Living" survey, Sydney ranked #10 and Vancouver ranked #4. The highest American cities were Honolulu and San Francisco at 27 and 29.


Those are just the first few things that I found. There are several variables that they don't consider, including the weather (Aus > USA > Canada), the wildlife (hard to rank), and the availability of opportunities for travel/work within the same country (USA > Canada > Aus).

Still, we're really nitpicking little details here. For the most part, Australia and the US are fairly similar. When I compare them to a place like Pakistan (where I was born), it's really not even much of a question.

Those surveys are bullcrap, everyone has a different experience. Honestly I find Australia to be BORING. I like traveling, and like going to places like South America and Europe, two destinations which are too expensive to go to from Australia. A bargain roundtrip to Europe is around $1500AUD, I could get bargain tickets to Europe from the US as low as $300AUD.

I am from Miami, I have spent a lot of time on the West Coast, and yes I have seen quite a few Aussies in both Miami and in Cali, and no I did not mistake them for being British. There are tons of famous examples of Aussies who have moved to the USA. Even the Crocodile Dundee actor won't set foot in Australia again, how ironic.

The Mercer surveys are nonsense, they pick the most boring places in the world as the best places to live. Life is really what you make of it. Frankly speaking I saw another survey, a survey of cities with the world's best looking women, cities like Copenhagen, Montreal, Barcelona, Moscow, Prague, and Stockholm ranked very high. That is a survey I respect. I have been to Moscow, I have to say wawaweeewa!!!

Sydney was way down on the bottom of that list, its not surprising since so many Aussie guys go overseas for fun, if you know what I mean, and the fact that every other guy here has a mail order bride or girlfriend.

 

[Excanuk]

Those surveys are bullcrap, everyone has a different experience. Honestly I find Australia to be BORING. I like traveling, and like going to places like South America and Europe, two destinations which are too expensive to go to from Australia. A bargain roundtrip to Europe is around $1500AUD, I could get bargain tickets to Europe for the US as low as $300AUD.

I am from Miami, I have spent a lot of time on the West Coast, and yes I have seen quite a few Aussies in both Miami and in Cali, and no I did not mistake them for being British. There are tons of famous examples of Aussies who have moved to the USA. Even the Crocodile Dundee actor won't set foot in Australia again, how ironic.

The Mercer surveys are nonsense, they pick the most boring places in the world as the best places to live. Life is really what you make of it. Frankly speaking I saw another survey, a survey of cities with the world's best looking women, cities like Copenhagen, Montreal, Barcelona, Montreal, and Stockholm ranked very high. That is a survey I respect.

So now anything that doesn't fit in with your view on life is bogus? Well good luck on enjoying all your bargain basement trips when you are 300k in debt and are working 100 hours a week (if you even get into medicine) during your glorious two weeks of annual leave, on 30k a year. I have a feeling you won't be posting during work hours (if at all) at that point.

Maybe life in Australia is so "boring" for you because you barely work, if you weren't lazy or arrogant maybe you could get a "real" job in the US of A.

 

[jaketheory]

could be off, but is that JoeNama i smell?

 

[Excanuk]

Just had a quick look for JoeNama...and guess what same story:

- Black guy
- White girl
- Supposed to be in Sydney this year for "internship"

You may have a point there.

 

[AcerExtensa]

The amount of trolling in this thread is alarming. :troll:

 

[jaketheory]

Just had a quick look for JoeNama...and guess what same story:

- Black guy
- White girl
- Supposed to be in Sydney this year for "internship"

You may have a point there.

you left out that he spins a lot of **** about Australia despite being there. if it so bad why doesnt he leave?

 

[Excanuk]

I guess he can't get a "real" job in the US of A?