How much are you paying?

[himerenee]

Will begin M1 this august so I've started to think about how much loans i'm taking out. My question is how much of your tuition is covered by loans? How else are you paying for school? I'm basically taking out ~67K for total cost of attendance (tuition, living, etc).

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[ZagDoc]

Last year took out $42k, this year $51k. My budget for rent and utilities ($8300) isn't too bad though, taking about $13k above tuition for expenses. All government loans, Stafford and stuff.

 

[docrw]

How great it is to be a resident in Texas with 12k per year tuition. I couldnt imagine having to take out that much!

 

[DoctorPardi]

I am getting 38k this year and it should be similar for the other three years as well. This includes tuition, fees, books and living expenses. Also I got a $1,000 scholarship which is nice, and totally unexpected considering my MCAT score. Of course I wish there was an extra zero there but every bit helps and I am very appreciate of it.

 

[DocPsychosis]

~$33k; ~$11K tuition and the rest for living expenses and emergencies. Plus I have a little fun sometimes too.

 

[WoodyInvincible]

60k with a little over half that covering tuition. i can't even fathom how I'm going to pay back 4 years of loans.

 

[himerenee]

60k with a little over half that covering tuition. i can't even fathom how I'm going to pay back 4 years of loans.

i was beginning to think i was the only one seeing above 50k here =( some of my friends jokingly said since we'd all be in debt might as well take more out to go on vacation...i don't think i'm gonna do that =(

 

[Dirt]

i was beginning to think i was the only one seeing above 50k here =( some of my friends jokingly said since we'd all be in debt might as well take more out to go on vacation...i don't think i'm gonna do that =(

You always hear the excuse "what's that compared to 200K in loans." Dumb!

You will have to pay back every single dollar you borrow plus more. The difference between 200K and 201K is $1000. Imagine what it would be like if you found $1000 between 2nd year and 3rd year, or on the street tomorrow. Don't fall into the trap of letting your loans destroy your sense of value!

 

[Dedikated2liftn]

How great it is to be a resident in Texas with 12k per year tuition. I couldnt imagine having to take out that much!

Thanks for smearing our faces in it .

In regards to the OP's question, I'll be taking out 60K (go private schools!).

 

[ninjapenguin]

I use about about $25K a year for living expenses and insurance (only $10K comes from loans, other $15K is from parents). I don't regret picking a full-ride over a higher ranked school one bit.

 

[Gabujabu]

Look on the bright side, given how high inflation is nowadays and the rate at which the Fed is printing money, these debts will be a little less daunting to pay off.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/business/7509729.stm

 

[Bushido416]

64k here woohoo private funded schools. Oh well as for paying it off....I'm not lookin to retire ever so I figure I'll pass it onto my kids....as payback for dirty diapers and driving them to the mall.

 

[lilnoelle]

I took out $83K this year, around $70 for first two years. (M3, so living expenses/daycare cover 12 months instead of 10, plus there are more expenses for us in third year)

I'm an out of stater, so pay a huge amount for tuition, plus I have two kids and need to borrow the max plus daycare expenses.

Its a lot, and yes, I do freak out about it quite often.

 

[Dedikated2liftn]

I took out $83K this year, around $70 for first two years. (M3, so living expenses/daycare cover 12 months instead of 10, plus there are more expenses for us in third year)

I'm an out of stater, so pay a huge amount for tuition, plus I have two kids and need to borrow the max plus daycare expenses.

Its a lot, and yes, I do freak out about it quite often.

Wow, someone is getting screwed more hardcore than I am. Just out of curiousity, why did you choose KU if you're OOS??

 

[sirus_virus]

My eyes are burning just reading this thread. Medschools are raping innocent students big time. Funny they do this while preaching their "don’t think about money" sermon.

 

[VCU07]

I took out $83K this year, around $70 for first two years. (M3, so living expenses/daycare cover 12 months instead of 10, plus there are more expenses for us in third year)

I'm an out of stater, so pay a huge amount for tuition, plus I have two kids and need to borrow the max plus daycare expenses.

Its a lot, and yes, I do freak out about it quite often.

That is an insane amount of loans. What are you looking at when your done?

 

[coldweatherblue]

Look on the bright side, given how high inflation is nowadays and the rate at which the Fed is printing money, these debts will be a little less daunting to pay off.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/business/7509729.stm

assuming salary increases match or exceed inflation.... otherwise...

 

[EyeMD116]

Took out 59K in loans last year for M1 (parents helped a little bit).

This year: taking out 68K (economy is pretty bad so parents aren't in a great position to help).

God help us. I'm looking at close to 300K debt if this continues.

 

[Dedikated2liftn]

My eyes are burning just reading this thread. Medschools are raping innocent students big time. Funny they do this while preaching their "don’t think about money" sermon.

Ironic part is you've actually got people waiting in line for this financial raping. As long as that's the case, the school's will be allowed to get away with this type of horse ****.

 

[Slide]

Last year I took out 8.5K in loans. My parents offered to help with living expenses and I share the apartment with my brother, who pays the rent. Sometimes living in a poor state isn't as bad as its cracked to be.

 

[SomeDoc]

Ironic part is you've actually got people waiting in line for this financial raping. As long as that's the case, the school's will be allowed to get away with this type of horse ****.

The truth is financially and professionally, a medical education is a sound investment. While it may not be perfect, it is uncommon for other professions to boast of the strong job security and relatively high remuneration physicians enjoy.

 

[bambi]

I know it's a lot of money but count yourselves lucky that you can borrow the money you need.

In the UK, if your parents earn pretty much anything you are only eligible for £3000 ish a year. If it is your first degree you get another £3000 for tuition (that's what tuition here costs) but if it is your 2nd degree you only get the first £3000 and have to get tuition money from somewhere else, and there isn't really anywhere else. So, basically unless your parents pay you can't go to uni at all really. If your parents have a very low income you get a bit more but still not enough.

Point of the post is that yes it's annoying that you have such huge debts but at least you can do what you want, lots of people just can't afford it. Maybe that will make you feel a bit better about all your loans!

 

[Dedikated2liftn]

The truth is financially and professionally, a medical education is a sound investment. While it may not be perfect, it is uncommon for other professions to boast of the strong job security and relatively high remuneration physicians enjoy.

The increase in medical tuition is far outpacing market inflation. Additionally, physician reimbursment is slightly declining; consequently, it doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out that the financial aspects of becoming a physician are becoming far less appealing. If the aforementioned trait continues, that far less appealing may even turn into risky (~20-30 years down the line).

 

[WellWornLad]

it doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out that the financial aspects of becoming a physician are becoming far less appealing. If the aforementioned trait continues, that far less appealing may even turn into risky (~20-30 years down the line).

Far less appealing than the 1970's perhaps, but still head and shoulders above most jobs for the foreseeable future. Every time I read another story about the economy tanking, I appreciate med school a little more. Every time I get depressed about my loans, I pretend to go job hunting on the Internet and check out compensation packages for new physicians in various specialties. That cheers me up pretty quick.

That said, it doesn't mean that med schools are justified in asking us to take on so much financial risk simply because we're an easy target. There are steps you can try to take:

http://www.amsa.org/meded/tuitionguide.cfm

 

[Bushido416]

I actually agree with dedicated2liftin for once ( I know i spelled your name wrong). Anyway as he said the cost is outpacing inflation by leaps and bounds. Main reason for this is unlike the UK as previously mentioned above we are allowed to borrow outside of our current ability to pay. Same thing with the undergrad education cost rising up. Back about 30 yrs ago school was in line with the market due to the fact that schools knew students couldn't pay more and they adjusted enough to make money and still stay afloat on what most people could make on a part time job. When federal govt stepped in and provided sky high loan amounts colleges said hey....we should get in on this and so they raised prices because the demand for education remained the same but the amount people were willing to pay went up due to students' new found source of money. This kind of thing is causing problems in the college loan market which will probably suffer similarly as the housing market in the near future (2-3yrs). But anyway loans are extended to med students because we have the highest rate of repayment....meaning we actually get jobs and make money unlike that art history major who thought he was extremely enlightened. History and culture majors (who aren't licensed to teach) may find themselves unable to get loans or just to settle paying debt back with the famous phrase "would you like fries with that."

Oh that thing about UK paying much for school but not getting loans for much doesn't make me feel better as the public schooling systems are quite cheap in comparison to this side of the pond due to the socialistic tax system. Long live capitalism and the market will fix itself when it no longer becomes feasible to afford to pay these loans back.

 

[Dedikated2liftn]

I actually agree with dedicated2liftin for once ( I know i spelled your name wrong). Anyway as he said the cost is outpacing inflation by leaps and bounds. Main reason for this is unlike the UK as previously mentioned above we are allowed to borrow outside of our current ability to pay. Same thing with the undergrad education cost rising up. Back about 30 yrs ago school was in line with the market due to the fact that schools knew students couldn't pay more and they adjusted enough to make money and still stay afloat on what most people could make on a part time job. When federal govt stepped in and provided sky high loan amounts colleges said hey....we should get in on this and so they raised prices because the demand for education remained the same but the amount people were willing to pay went up due to students' new found source of money. This kind of thing is causing problems in the college loan market which will probably suffer similarly as the housing market in the near future (2-3yrs). But anyway loans are extended to med students because we have the highest rate of repayment....meaning we actually get jobs and make money unlike that art history major who thought he was extremely enlightened. History and culture majors (who aren't licensed to teach) may find themselves unable to get loans or just to settle paying debt back with the famous phrase "would you like fries with that."

Oh that thing about UK paying much for school but not getting loans for much doesn't make me feel better as the public schooling systems are quite cheap in comparison to this side of the pond due to the socialistic tax system. Long live capitalism and the market will fix itself when it no longer becomes feasible to afford to pay these loans back.

Yes, but what kind of attrition is this going to entail (hell, you and I both might be on the front lines...so to speak)? In regards to your statment, the million dollar question is how.

 

[FenixTx]

a

 

[nogolfinsnow]

I'm paying too much. I've already picked a few faculty members to fire to save the school several hundred thousand in operating costs each year. I also think about 38% of my tuition goes to buy crappy pizza for club meetings I'll never attend as well.

Just met a doc today who practices in the US but went to school in Canada. His loans have in effect become harder to pay off now that the US dollar no longer is head and shoulders above the Canadian dollar in value. I have no idea how the cost of a Canadian school compares to the average US, but it still sucks.

 

[meister]

Wow, someone is getting screwed more hardcore than I am. Just out of curiousity, why did you choose KU if you're OOS??

HAH it's not so much choosing as it is having nowhere else to go. Thanks California!

I'm taking out 70k a year.

 

[NonTradMed]

I've been lucky. My parents are helping out and I live at home. My total debt from Uncle Sam will be about ~$80 if my parents continue to help me with tuition. I go to a relatively expensive public medical school othewise I could have gotten out with almost no debt from Uncle Sam. My parents are only loaning me the money (with interest) but parents are slightly more leanient than the gov't. I guess I pull down the debt mean, but I still owe the same amount as everyone else, it's just hidden.

I guess I'll be living on a student budget for a few more years!

 

[Dedikated2liftn]

Ok, after seeing the majority of the numbers posted on this thread, I think it's time to officially change it to "How much are you getting screwed?". See you all in the food stamp line in about 4 years .

 

[sirus_virus]

The increase in medical tuition is far outpacing market inflation. Additionally, physician reimbursment is slightly declining; consequently, it doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out that the financial aspects of becoming a physician are becoming far less appealing. If the aforementioned trait continues, that far less appealing may even turn into risky (~20-30 years down the line).

Honestly, I think it is already risky as we speak. What blows is that about a third of medschools are planning on hiking tuition by about 10% in the next 5 years, and it looks like physicians' income is scheduled to drop by the same percentage.

The question I have for any medschool administrator out there is, why the hell is medschool tuition rising faster than any economic metric? and why are they now so obsessed with the concept of jacking medstudents for all they will ever be worth and more?

 

[psipsina]

I'm taking out 30k/year. Tuition is about 14k/year, 6k of which is covered by a scholarship. Yay state school!!

 

[meister]

Perhaps ringing us for all we're worth because they feel the inevitable specter of "socialized medicine" is around the corner? As if that would mean limitations on tuition or something.

Regardless of if you support UHC or not, I don't think anyone's doubting physician salaries are going to continue to decline for the foreseeable future though. I think they realize they can't continue this trend forever.

 

[Dedikated2liftn]

Honestly, I think it is already risky as we speak. What blows is that about a third of medschools are planning on hiking tuition by about 10% in the next 5 years, and it looks like physicians' income is scheduled to drop by the same percentage.

The question I have for any medschool administrator out there is, why the hell is medschool tuition rising faster than any economic metric? and why are they now so obsessed with the concept of jacking medstudents for all they will ever be worth and more?

Haven't you heard bro, gotta line the campus with new research buildings, a new gym, perhaps a new student center, an art museum, and state-of-the-art dorm for the incoming freshmen.

 

[Dedikated2liftn]

Perhaps ringing us for all we're worth because they feel the inevitable specter of "socialized medicine" is around the corner? As if that would mean limitations on tuition or something.

Regardless of if you support UHC or not, I don't think anyone's doubting physician salaries are going to continue to decline for the foreseeable future though. I think they realize they can't continue this trend forever.

I agree...and guess who's getting exploited (this is where we all raise our hands ). Quite honestly, I'd like to see what happens to medical education a generation from now; it could be quite interesting. Additionally, as someone said earlier, I believe that this is going to be the next big economic crisis we face as a country (student debt). At least with the current housing market, you can absolve your debt; the only thing that gets you out of student loans are death and permenant disability (anyone wanna take a road trip to LAX and lay down on the runway with me? "There's something on the wing....There's something on the wing...oh wait, it's just another med student").

 

[DickyV]

I also think about 38% of my tuition goes to buy crappy pizza for club meetings I'll never attend as well.

It's so true!

I used to feel guilty about going to lunch meetings I wasn't interested in (or, worse, taking lunch and not going to said meetings), then I realized that I will have about $350,000 in loans when I start my residency. The guilt melted away after that.

 

[bcat85]

~55 a year... and holy crap dickyv

 

[DredPiratRobrts]

Paying $0 for my $65,000/yr med school price tag.

 

[Dedikated2liftn]

Paying $0 for my $65,000/yr med school price tag.

It'll be interesting to see how the whole Armed Forces scholarship thing will change as tuition costs keep getting more and more absurd. My guess is that these scholarships are going to become increasingly more competitive. The important subsequent question is, what will the government do if this happens? From my current perspective though, I'd still rather take on the debt (yes, "The King of Cheap Bastards" actually said that); at the very least, I'll have at least some degree of freedom when it comes to specialty, living location, and not having my ass shot off over in Iraq. Additionally, in the civilian sector you'll most likely make substantially more (well, if things don't continue the way they're currently going). Who knows though Dred, you and your military peers may come out of this looking really good, while us in the civilian sector may be putting our eggs in the wrong basket (especially those of us going to private schools)...

 

[abcxyz0123]

Who knows though Dred, you and your military peers may come out of this looking really good, while us in the civilian sector may be putting our eggs in the wrong basket (especially those of us going to private schools)...

Yeah right. Unless you would have been interested in joining the military anyway, that deal does NOT pay off...

 

[njbmd]

Moved to Financial Aid which is the forum for discussion of educational costs.

 

[DredPiratRobrts]

Yeah right. Unless you would have been interested in joining the military anyway, that deal does NOT pay off...

True. I want to be in the military anyway. I'm not doing it for the money and anyone who does it just for the $ will probably be dissapointed. To be honest, it was the $ that first attracted me to military medicine but once you do enough research to find out what its all about you find that the money is only one component.

Does the financial part of the deal pay off though? Well it does for some people and might not for others. If you go to a place like Albany Med or GW and are paying $65k+ for all costs and you're NOT going to be a derm or ortho in private practice (how the hell can you predict that before MS1 anyway?) then it probably does pay off.

I calculated my debt at approx $360k when I am done with a 4 year residency. If I pay this back over 30 years I will have paid $875k for my medical school tuition (and I will be 65 years old by then). Im not trying to restart that dead horse of an argument over how much $ we will all make in the future, etc but how can someone pay off that kind of debt if they go into family med, peds or one of the other lower paying specialties*.

*(Contrary to popular SDN belief we're not all going to be super wealthy specialty surgeons in private practice)

Bottom line, I love being an officer in the military, and I'm really excited to be a physician in a few years. I love my future patient population and I'm excited to be able to serve the men and women who serve this great country and their families...as well as getting to do really awesome and rewarding humanitarian work around the world. HPSP is awesome if you're like me. No paperwork for financial aid, no worries about debt and a decent paycheck 2x a month while in school.

 

[Dedikated2liftn]

True. I want to be in the military anyway. I'm not doing it for the money and anyone who does it just for the $ will probably be dissapointed. To be honest, it was the $ that first attracted me to military medicine but once you do enough research to find out what its all about you find that the money is only one component.

Does the financial part of the deal pay off though? Well it does for some people and might not for others. If you go to a place like Albany Med or GW and are paying $65k+ for all costs and you're NOT going to be a derm or ortho in private practice (how the hell can you predict that before MS1 anyway?) then it probably does pay off.

I calculated my debt at approx $360k when I am done with a 4 year residency. If I pay this back over 30 years I will have paid $875k for my medical school tuition (and I will be 65 years old by then). Im not trying to restart that dead horse of an argument over how much $ we will all make in the future, etc but how can someone pay off that kind of debt if they go into family med, peds or one of the other lower paying specialties*.

*(Contrary to popular SDN belief we're not all going to be super wealthy specialty surgeons in private practice)

Bottom line, I love being an officer in the military, and I'm really excited to be a physician in a few years. I love my future patient population and I'm excited to be able to serve the men and women who serve this great country and their families...as well as getting to do really awesome and rewarding humanitarian work around the world. HPSP is awesome if you're like me. No paperwork for financial aid, no worries about debt and a decent paycheck 2x a month while in school.

Dred, do you know if the armed forces will retro pay your debt if you enroll after medical school?? If so, it could provide a safety net for the bolded situation.

 

[DredPiratRobrts]

Dred, do you know if the armed forces will retro pay your debt if you enroll after medical school?? If so, it could provide a safety net for the bolded situation.

Yes, they will. However its not as good from a $ standpoint as doing HPSP.

 

[Dedikated2liftn]

Yes, they will. However its not as good from a $ standpoint as doing HPSP.

How so? They don't match dollar for dollar after?

 

[rgerwin]

I'm paying about $65K a year. I think for those of us in private school we should should plan on not doing the 30-yr. deal. I'm not, at least. Maybe I"m not part of the norm, but with that much debt, I don't really care about saving to buy a house to obtain more debt.At a certain point the financial gains, unless you get a super deal, from owning will be overtaken by med school debt interest. I ran some numbers and by paying it off ASAP, it does takes some of the edge off the price tag by doing damage control with interest. Plus, we will probably have to specialize. But, for the future med students, I don't know. If the system doesn't change at all I would say move to a state with a good in-state acceptance rate or marry rich.

 

[thebeatgoeson]

How so? They don't match dollar for dollar after?

"Navy Health Professions Loan Repayment Program — Receive up to $114,900 to repay your medical school loans by applying to receive $38,300 each year for up to three years.
To be eligible, you must serve as an Active Duty Medical Corps Officer for each year you receive the loan payment. A minimum three-year service obligation is required." -Link

However, residents can get a good deal as well:
"Navy Financial Assistance Program (FAP) — Offers potentially over $270,000 during your medical residency. That consists of:
* An annual grant of $45,000 for up to four years (on top of normal resident pay)
* A monthly stipend of $1,907 to help cover living expenses for up to 48 months"

All that being said with the understanding that you join the military because you want to serve, not solely to repay your debt.

 

[lilnoelle]

Wow, someone is getting screwed more hardcore than I am. Just out of curiousity, why did you choose KU if you're OOS??

not everyone gets into their state school.

Honestly, I should be ok, I've basically decided to go into primary care in underserved Kansas, and my school offers a repayment plan for a limited number of individuals which will lower my debt to less than $100K.

 

[Dedikated2liftn]

not everyone gets into their state school.

Honestly, I should be ok, I've basically decided to go into primary care in underserved Kansas, and my school offers a repayment plan for a limited number of individuals which will lower my debt to less than $100K.

You don't have to tell me; however, for you to get into a public school OOS, and not get accepted IS, suggests that something's messed up (any chance you from California, heh?).