How Much Are YOU Actually Worth?

This forum made possible through the generous support of SDN members, donors, and sponsors. Thank you.
They're using helicopters to fly people into Houston because it's cheaper than paying the people who live there to work at some of the sites.
None of the sites needs an helicopter. They're just using it.
Well, I guess, I still don't get it. Is it their "firefighter" people? Or, is it just using suckers that will take the piss-ball rates? Or, roadways are passable, but they choose to, anyways, air them out?

And, just as a sidenote, I, personally, find their use of the term "firefighter" to be offensive, as I was a literal firefighter for 9 years.

Members don't see this ad.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 users
bump / updates?
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 user
Members don't see this ad :)
Took a travel job with a CMG. Don't know what is meant by this aforementioned end of "income guarantee," period nor is there any language referring to anything sounding like this in my contract. I am paid straight hourly - maybe this is relevant to people who are on an RVU system? I would say it seems like typical CMG staffing - I see between 1.8-2.2 pts/hr on average, which is relatively high I think.

I would say I'm paid relatively well ($250+/hr, expenses paid of course, IC...on wife's super cheap health insurance which is nice...would definitely caution single people about taking an IC job with respect to health insurance), 120 hrs/mo. I like my co-attendings, the nurses, the consultants (for the most part). When volume surges, it can get stressful. The support for credentialing and licensing has been pretty good. Because of the travel part, I get to work basically when I want to (have to a portion of nights/weekends/holidays though). I work about 1/3 of the month.

It's definitely not a perfect job, but it's far from the worst in terms of pay/scheduling. There is higher money out there. Will probably try something else like a true locums arrangement in the future, but as a new attending it's nice to have guaranteed hours through this.
 
To begin, there is really only one number that you need to know. $150. That's right, $150. This is the average amount of money COLLECTED per patient across the board, across the country. Not billed, not in accounts receivable, not cash only, ACROSS THE BOARD for ALL PATIENTS. Remember this number. This is after 1/3 of your patients (self pay) don't ever pay you, 1/3 of your medicare and medicaid patients pay you at reduced rates, and 1/3 of those with private insurance pay you what they decide to pay you. Payor mix (the ratio of these three components) may vary from place to place, but $150 averaged per patient is fairly reliable.

It is interesting that you suggest that we should all be comparing $$$/patient evaluated.

This is the first thing I did when I began comparing jobs with very different volumes. Where did the $150 / patient come from. Is that number just for demonstration?
 
It is interesting that you suggest that we should all be comparing $$$/patient evaluated.

This is the first thing I did when I began comparing jobs with very different volumes. Where did the $150 / patient come from. Is that number just for demonstration?
He’s saying it’s the national average and reiterates the point several times. He may be wrong (it actually sounds about right) but he’s not using $150/pt as a dummy variable.
 
Apparently we've been working on the cheap...

Blackstone Chief Schwarzman Reaped $800 Million in 2017 - The sum is one of the largest paydays ever at a publicly traded company.

It’s likely that Mr. Schwarzman, 71 years old, took home significantly more than the $800 million disclosed by the firm. Over the past five years, his position has yielded him more than $3.2 billion, largely in dividends and fund payouts.

Not sure how I feel about my colleagues in the trenches busting their assess in understaffed, under equipped, and dangerous EDs, all laboring to "help someone" while taking on liability and getting stiffed with unexplained RVU calculation changes, unpaid bonuses, and expense reports...

My favorite comment on WSJ.

No employee of any company is worth that much money. The system for establishing executive compensation at public companies is broken. Is any competitor saying: "Gee lets offer Schwarzman a billion a year to lure him away from Blackstone - he's worth it."? I think not.​
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 users
We need to look at the big picture and figure out how to get away from the crushing of our profession. With the influx of CMGs, Kaisers, etc, there are few SDG's left. I personally have chosen to pursue financial independence as a way to avoid these groups and the general implosion of medicine. Within a decade of leaving training I have a paid off house in one of the ten most expensive counties in the US and no longer need to save for retirement, although I do have to support my ongoing expenses. I would suggest other physicians do the same. I currently have a great (but declining) job where I earn $220 an hour plus benefits (including a pension). I also see 1.5 pts per hour and don't have to sign PA charts. This will end in the not too distant future, I am sure. But I'm riding it as long as I can.

These CMGs are crooks, as are the hospital systems and the nursing unions. But the only way to vote is with our feet. I see so many docs with a fancy doctor house, new cars etc. It's not worth it. Now, despite the, implosion in medicine, I have complete freedom. I can quit. I can cherry pick locums. I can work for a VC company inventing widgets.

Pursue financial freedom, folks. It's the only way to be FREE, even if you continue to work.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 4 users
We need to look at the big picture and figure out how to get away from the crushing of our profession. With the influx of CMGs, Kaisers, etc, there are few SDG's left. I personally have chosen to pursue financial independence as a way to avoid these groups and the general implosion of medicine. Within a decade of leaving training I have a paid off house in one of the ten most expensive counties in the US and no longer need to save for retirement, although I do have to support my ongoing expenses. I would suggest other physicians do the same. I currently have a great (but declining) job where I earn $220 an hour plus benefits (including a pension). I also see 1.5 pts per hour and don't have to sign PA charts. This will end in the not too distant future, I am sure. But I'm riding it as long as I can.

These CMGs are crooks, as are the hospital systems and the nursing unions. But the only way to vote is with our feet. I see so many docs with a fancy doctor house, new cars etc. It's not worth it. Now, despite the, implosion in medicine, I have complete freedom. I can quit. I can cherry pick locums. I can work for a VC company inventing widgets.

Pursue financial freedom, folks. It's the only way to be FREE, even if you continue to work.

Totally agree. I'm only a year out but this is my plan as well.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 user
I am so glad to hear that, Mbewkweni. It seems like this is more common among you younger docs- do you agree? My generation and older would call you lazy, but I disagree deeply; I think your generation is responding logically to the destruction of EM (and other fields as well- you should hear my gen surg pals). I o dnly hope others follow us and vote with their feet.

Assume you are familiar with all the FIRE blogs and with the WCI. Best of luck on your journey. I can say all I regret is not having saved even more. Max that 401(k), don't get sucked in by pensions that won't be there, ask for money up front and spend money on what matters, not crap.

Good. Luck.
 
I am so glad to hear that, Mbewkweni. It seems like this is more common among you younger docs- do you agree? My generation and older would call you lazy, but I disagree deeply; I think your generation is responding logically to the destruction of EM (and other fields as well- you should hear my gen surg pals). I o dnly hope others follow us and vote with their feet.

Assume you are familiar with all the FIRE blogs and with the WCI. Best of luck on your journey. I can say all I regret is not having saved even more. Max that 401(k), don't get sucked in by pensions that won't be there, ask for money up front and spend money on what matters, not crap.

Good. Luck.

I was in the doc lounge at my small community hospital and a hospitalist, anesthesiologist and the CMO and I were all talking about WCI. He's gotten pretty popular and the lessons are getting out there across specialties and age groups. Putting it into practice is harder than just reading up on the subject material but so far I'm off to a good start.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 users
Keep at it. When you realize you are out of debt and have tons in the bank, you'll be happier than you could imagine.
 
Niner - hope you're synthesizing some of the feedback into the next chapter of this saga. Next crop of new attendings are sitting on contracts waiting to pull down that first real paycheck in July/Aug. Hope everyone is reading this one from stem to stern and really internalizing some of the lessons.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 users
Members don't see this ad :)
Niner - hope you're synthesizing some of the feedback into the next chapter of this saga. Next crop of new attendings are sitting on contracts waiting to pull down that first real paycheck in July/Aug. Hope everyone is reading this one from stem to stern and really internalizing some of the lessons.

Heading into partnership with my own SDG with decades behind it and came back to read this thread again as a cautionary tale of sorts. Think we'd all love a next chapter / epilogue.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 2 users
Been a long time since I’ve been on here. Seems SDN lost my account.

Proud as f**k to bump this thread as first post with new account.

TPM
 
Looks like he hasn't posted since Dec 2017.

This should be made into a Broadway Play or a 2 hr movie. I want to see trauma surgeons arguing with CEO's and Orthopedic and ER doctors.

Think there would be any action in the movie? How about romantic relationships? The CMG's VP hooks up with the secretary of EMGA, divulging secrets about the negotiation process via ear whispering.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 user
Niner is now in the C suite at a major Hospital Corp and signed a Nondislosure thus can not give everyone the lowdown that most already know.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 user
That seems so contradictory to everything I thought he stood for... Didn't strike me as the C-suite type of person. I hope this opportunity is used to improve some of the issues with emergency medicine exposed in prior posts.
 
Top