esposo said:
Hey smart guy, not all medical schools in the United States are public. Private medical schools are not subsidized by the government just like caribbean schools. Granted, private medical schools survive on an array of other factors like alumni donations, affiliated hospitals and research grants. But their goal is not to profit.
That's the point you are missing genius. Medical schools in the United States are non-profit. The Caribbean schools are for-profit schools and are seeking to maximize profit after paying expenses. It's in their best interest to minimize their expenses(resources) and maximize their revenue(admit a ton of students) They are not concerned with your well-being or education. U.S. schools both public and private are non-profit organizations. Their purpose is to eduate students not to generate profit. Caribbean schools can afford better resources and are capable of providing more but since they are for-profit, it's not in their interest to solely meet expenses. And like with any for-profit business, the goal is to maximize profits. You really think Ross wouldn't profit if they hired better professors? They would still profit but they wouldn't profit as much as hiring a cheaper professor.
Don't you mean high attrition rates. A tiny attrition rate would mean the school is losing students. Please look up words before attempting to appear intelligent. The attrition rate is high at U.S. schools because they do a better job of screening candidates in addition to providing better resources (teaching, facilities etc.) If caribbean schools provided better resources, more of their students wouldn't flunk out. Federal and state reserves have nothing to do with this.
Before you continue to rant about nothing, please remember that
1. The top 4 weed out a significant portion of their entering class so that only the most competent students are allowed to sit for the USMLE. And even the ones who are still enrolled at the school must usually pass a school-imposed exam before being granted the opportunity to sit for the exam.
2. U.S. graduates have only 4-6 weeks outside of class to prepare for the USMLE. IMG's spend anywhere from 3-6 months preparing for the USMLE since they go all year round. It's not fair to comare two groups in regards to a pass rate if one group is given far more time to prepare. I'm sure all those failed U.S. students would have loved to spend 6 months at Kaplan studying for Step I.
Having amenities would make you a better student. In the U.S., your instructors are usually American M.D.'s/D.O.'s or people who graduated from American graduate schools teaching. They test you on relevant material and prepare you for what's most likely going to be on the boards. In the caribbean, they will hire foreign instructors who are unfamiliar with the board exams. They will teach you the material as it was taught to them with no forethought as to what is covered on the board exams. They likely won't offer organized lectures and notes as its offerred in U.S. schools. This is why caribbean students need so much more time to prepare for the boards than U.S. students because your teaching is unorganized to begin with. I would much rather be well taught and well informed prior to entering clinicals than having to scrounge and figure out everything on my own because the teaching was substandard.
I am criticizng the lack of resources provided by your schools not my future colleagues.
I know U.S. schools are non-profit. You are wrong in assuming that I missed this point. Really the whole point of my post was to point out the differences in the Not-for-profit vs. for profit models of educating physicians. I find it admirable that the top institutions can still provide it's students great resources including great faculty and staff and still make a profit without the aid of outside fundraising. The entire premise of the offshore school actually puts money into the U.S economy as well as the economy of the schools host nations while providing a formidable education to qualified students who might otherwise not have had the opportunity. Further to this, health care in the U.S. improves by having a group of graduates who in the majority will fill the role of primary care physicians. Wouldn't you agree that this is a great thing? Of course provided that the offshore school is capable of providing an education of comparable quality to LCME accredited institutions.
There are a small handfull of schools offshore who are of comparable quality and this is evident by having state medical boards in key states like NY, NJ, FL, CA and in the case of Ross, TX attest to this.
So as far as myself and all states in the union are concerned this is a great thing.
I don't think we were ever of a different opinion that U.S schools provide more resources than caribbean schools (in the first two years of course. Remember our last two years are in ACGME accredited teaching hospitals in the U.S therefore we do have the same resources). By virtue of the diametrically opposite business models this theoretically and practically couldn't be the case. My opinion is that the resources caribbean students have, meet the needs the students have, and I'm only speaking of state approved institutions not all of them. There are so many international schools that are not of the ilk that I'm talking about. All else beyond meeting the needs of the students is superfluous, economically taxing and largely unnecessary. Whether we're talking about a private or state school, additional funds are needed on top of tuition to educate an American student. I think you'll agree with this statement. For-profit institutions cannot offer some of the luxuries that U.S. schools can in the first two years. I.e. very small class sizes, remedial programs, decelerative programs and the ability to ensure a student doesn't fail out. These institutions are trying to make an honest dollar after all and God bless anyone who can. Beyond the point of need I don't think having more necessarily makes for a better student. Self-reliance and resiliency will no matter where these traits are nurtured. I acknoledge that those who get into U.S medical schools display this ability to begin with as they were able to achieve the feat of gaining acceptance to a U.S school. FMGs who make it through the program definitely do have these traits as well.
On the flip side, let's talk about a big limitation of all U.S. medical colleges, and in my opinion the reason caribbean schools exist to begin with. At present U.S medical colleges cannot cost effectively educate a medical student. Therefore seating is drastically limited and many qualified students are turned away. This is the crux of my argument.
Here are some other points I'd like to address.
St. George's and Saba do not subscribe to the weeding out system. They have higher admissions screening processes. You can't generalize the top 4 as they are all different institutions.
Ross has the highest attrition rate and I can't comment on AUC's off the top of my head.
SGU is the only school with the "school imposed exam prior to USMLE".
It is fair to compare two groups with respect to pass rates for the USMLE because caribbean students do not have summers in which they have the opportunity to the study for the USMLE. Although SGU's breaks are a little longer than other schools.
No I meant small attrition rates. Caribbean schools have higher attrition rates than U.S. schools. This means that Caribbean schools generally have a higher rate in the reduction of the number of students who enter the program. What I said is entirely correct.
In summary, I'm glad you have respect for your future colleagues and you should. You should have respect for anyone who is devoted to the betterment of humanity no matter where they studied. I hope that in this long unedited rant I have opened your eyes to the good that the recognized offshore, for profit medical institutions are doing for the U.S health care system and all the associated benefactors.
Peace Esposo.
PS: I don't pretend to be smart I just am. Thanks.
or family practice MD if you go to a CI school?
