Hopkins IM

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IMvrach said:
They've finally updated it. Strange that they write "All applicants will be reviewed the week of October 8th." yet application deadline is October 31. :confused:

Thank you for your interest in our program. Our application deadline is October 31, 2012. Dean's Letters will be transmitted to us on October 1, 2012. In addition to Dean's Letters, we require four letters of recommendation, one of which preferably will be written by your department chairperson. All applicants will be reviewed the week of October 8th. All applicants will be notified via e-mail on approximately October 11, 2012
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Hm. No word from them yet and it's almost the end of the day. They did say "approximately" in all fairness
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jdh71 said:
Dude, isn't it clear that if you cannot channel the spirit of Awesomeness, you shouldn't go to Hopkins.

You open your mind to the universe and Osler himself as a channeled entity comes into your penis and you CURE DISEASE AND SAVE LIVES MOTHER****ER!!!

If you're not able to do that or ready for that you need to go someplace else
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Was Osler the first to identify Chlamydia?
 
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I fully expect to receive a letter from Hopkins offering me a position today. Probably it will be in Facilities Maintenance. Maybe even Nutritional Services.
 
ArcGurren said:
Hm. No word from them yet and it's almost the end of the day. They did say "approximately" in all fairness
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I'm guessing it's a typo and they mean November 11th? It would make more sense i.e. deadline Oct 31, then a week to review all the apps, then send out invitations.

edit: actually, i take that back, it's probably not a typo since their first interview date is Nov 12th.
 
jessikator said:
To be fair to the JHop, they did pilot a night float system. While I was on my basic my firm was trying it out. I really think what it came down to is that Hopkins medicine is a very traditional program and they just didn't like night float. They didn't feel like it was the "old way" and they felt they lost more patient continuity during NF than the short night call system. I'm sure not all night float systems are equal, either, I just know that the one they piloted didn't really sit well with residents.
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"Continuity" is really a non-issue in IM. It's not like IM is a specialty where you lose out on a 9 hour case in the OR. We mostly put in orders and are off to something else. The work-up moves along in a predictable fashion. There is nothing about an IM patient that just absolutely requires you to be at the bedside for 30 to 36 hours. It's nonsense. You don't miss out on work-ups. You get essentially the same amount of night time in training whether you cover float at night or run a traditional system. At my old shop we were hybrid, but we were also still on 30 hour stints - night float during the week and traditional call on the weekends.

IM in the hospital as it's practiced EVERYWHERE outside of teaching hospitals with residents is SHIFT work. Hand offs and check-out sheets, and starting work up and allowing your colleagues to finish is what people do the REAL world.
 
jdh71 said:
"Continuity" is really a non-issue in IM. It's not like IM is a specialty where you lose out on a 9 hour case in the OR. We mostly put in orders and are off to something else. The work-up moves along in a predictable fashion. There is nothing about an IM patient that just absolutely requires you to be at the bedside for 30 to 36 hours. It's nonsense. You don't miss out on work-ups. You get essentially the same amount of night time in training whether you cover float at night or run a traditional system. At my old shop we were hybrid, but we were also still on 30 hour stints - night float during the week and traditional call on the weekends.

IM in the hospital as it's practiced EVERYWHERE outside of teaching hospitals with residents is SHIFT work. Hand offs and check-out sheets, and starting work up and allowing your colleagues to finish is what people do the REAL world.
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Please, relax. I didn't say it was totally awesome, I didn't say it was better....I said, Hopkins tried it and didn't like it. Hopkins would prefer, of course, not to think of it as shift work, no matter how delusional that might be. Furthermore, I think while you're *training*, and not quite in the real world yet, there might be some value in following the same patient from start to finish as much as possible. But maybe I've been brainwashed. Regardless, it DOESN'T MATTER, because you learn the same medicine everywhere. I was simply making the point that they DID try a night float system, and they ARE like an old man who wants kids off their lawn. That's just they way it is here.
 
jdh71 said:
"Continuity" is really a non-issue in IM. It's not like IM is a specialty where you lose out on a 9 hour case in the OR. We mostly put in orders and are off to something else. The work-up moves along in a predictable fashion. There is nothing about an IM patient that just absolutely requires you to be at the bedside for 30 to 36 hours. It's nonsense. You don't miss out on work-ups. You get essentially the same amount of night time in training whether you cover float at night or run a traditional system. At my old shop we were hybrid, but we were also still on 30 hour stints - night float during the week and traditional call on the weekends.

IM in the hospital as it's practiced EVERYWHERE outside of teaching hospitals with residents is SHIFT work. Hand offs and check-out sheets, and starting work up and allowing your colleagues to finish is what people do the REAL world.
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I think you've been a fellow long enough not to have seen the advent of the hour restrictions... it's your 2nd year?

The way the hours work nowadays, interns have so many handoffs these days that there is some loss in continuity. Either you work with a night float system and someone else admits most of your patients or you admit them and have to leave before a lot of the plan is implemented (or changed by the senior & attending). We tend to have to fill the interns in. There is a lot more following along rather than taking command of the patient. It isn't the interns fault, it is the type of system.

Having seen how some of the outside hospitals and how our hospitalists work, there is a ton of continuity lost with the shift work in the REAL world. With shift work you never really know the patients well because it is an inefficient system. You would be basically doing the job someone else did, yet again. This is blindingly obvious when you are the MICU resident coming down to the hospitalist unit to bring up one of their crashing patients.

You damn kids... get off my lawn
/rant
 
jessikator said:
Please, relax. I didn't say it was totally awesome, I didn't say it was better....I said, Hopkins tried it and didn't like it. Hopkins would prefer, of course, not to think of it as shift work, no matter how delusional that might be. Furthermore, I think while you're *training*, and not quite in the real world yet, there might be some value in following the same patient from start to finish as much as possible. But maybe I've been brainwashed. Regardless, it DOESN'T MATTER, because you learn the same medicine everywhere. I was simply making the point that they DID try a night float system, and they ARE like an old man who wants kids off their lawn. That's just they way it is here.
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What made you think I wasn't relaxed? :eyebrow:

Anyway, I don't really give a couple of flying rat's assess how they do it at Hopkins with regards to their call system. My point was that the whole "continuity" idea is overblown on the IM side of things. The surgeons do have a legitimate complaint.

One of the things that I do find irritating is how Hopkins has this odd machismo about it. Like someone who eats glass or something . . .

The awesome thing about the Hopkins experience though is the autonomy. You get your hand held too much in residency now at too many places. Much of this is because many Universities don't even own their own GME anymore and the hospital operation is controlled by what amounts to a healthcare group, and it's the lawyers getting all bent about it. Being the ONLY resident in the hospital covering all medicine services and doing the admissions is a good thing for your training. My first year it would be me and the surgery intern on at the VA - only two MDs covering all the beds in the entire building. There was a moonlighter in the ED who could theoretically back you up, but for the most part it was just you. It was good for my soul.
 
Instatewaiter said:
I think you've been a fellow long enough not to have seen the advent of the hour restrictions... it's your 2nd year?

The way the hours work nowadays, interns have so many handoffs these days that there is some loss in continuity. Either you work with a night float system and someone else admits most of your patients or you admit them and have to leave before a lot of the plan is implemented (or changed by the senior & attending). We tend to have to fill the interns in. There is a lot more following along rather than taking command of the patient. It isn't the interns fault, it is the type of system.

Having seen how some of the outside hospitals and how our hospitalists work, there is a ton of continuity lost with the shift work in the REAL world. With shift work you never really know the patients well because it is an inefficient system. You would be basically doing the job someone else did, yet again. This is blindingly obvious when you are the MICU resident coming down to the hospitalist unit to bring up one of their crashing patients.

You damn kids... get off my lawn
/rant
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We admitted every day. Teams took turns taking hits. We had a night float who admitted at night and portioned out patients to the day teams in the AM in a formal presentation before leaving. At some point along the way you take part in the care of patients are varying stages. Intelligent people should be able to learn and pick this up.

The problem with hand-offs is communication, not the hand-off itself. Like it or don't but shift work is the way medicine is practiced because no one just sits around the hospital for an entire week. I wouldn't, and wouldn't expect anyone else to either.
 
james87 said:
I'm guessing it's a typo and they mean November 11th? It would make more sense i.e. deadline Oct 31, then a week to review all the apps, then send out invitations.

edit: actually, i take that back, it's probably not a typo since their first interview date is Nov 12th.
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Yeah, I haven't a clue what to make of it
 
I think the problem with having only one medicine resident on at night is that there is just too much work to do for one person without seriously compromising patient safety. I just don't think there is any way to have one person cross-covering the whole medicine service, doing admits, and running RRTs/codes. At my hospital that would involve covering approx. 150 patients, doing 12 admits, + RRT/codes if they happen. To me it sounds like a recipe for disaster, and I'm not sure how much learning would take place since all your doing is running around trying to keep your head above water and make sure no one dies.
 
mrpankration said:
I think the problem with having only one medicine resident on at night is that there is just too much work to do for one person without seriously compromising patient safety. I just don't think there is any way to have one person cross-covering the whole medicine service, doing admits, and running RRTs/codes. At my hospital that would involve covering approx. 150 patients, doing 12 admits, + RRT/codes if they happen. To me it sounds like a recipe for disaster, and I'm not sure how much learning would take place since all your doing is running around trying to keep your head above water and make sure no one dies.
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Wtf?
 
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Well, it wouldn't be 150 patients at Hopkins, since we divide all of our patients into 4 separate groups and there would be one resident on call per group. And even then I don't think we have 150 medicine patients between the 4 firms (there are other medicine services that would have other residents on call).

Just for those who are interested, Hopkins has released its internal invites. So I'm sure external ones will be happening soonish.
 
jessikator said:
Well, it wouldn't be 150 patients at Hopkins, since we divide all of our patients into 4 separate groups and there would be one resident on call per group. And even then I don't think we have 150 medicine patients between the 4 firms (there are other medicine services that would have other residents on call).

Just for those who are interested, Hopkins has released its internal invites. So I'm sure external ones will be happening soonish.
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Here (not Hopkins), at most, I think an overnight intern would have 40 patients to cover and with an upper level on site for backup if necessary. That's why that 150 number seemed extreme to me.
 
Chemist0157 said:
Here (not Hopkins), at most, I think an overnight intern would have 40 patients to cover and with an upper level on site for backup if necessary. That's why that 150 number seemed extreme to me.
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At the program where I was a resident, at the "U" there were 5 teams, up to 12 patients each, one intern covering (with resident backup). At the VA, there were also 5 teams, up to 16 patients each, one intern doing cross-cover at night (also with resident backup...sometimes with actual resident help, but rarely). So 60-70 patients for 1 intern to to cross-cover was not unusual.
 
mrpankration said:
I think the problem with having only one medicine resident on at night is that there is just too much work to do for one person without seriously compromising patient safety. I just don't think there is any way to have one person cross-covering the whole medicine service, doing admits, and running RRTs/codes. At my hospital that would involve covering approx. 150 patients, doing 12 admits, + RRT/codes if they happen. To me it sounds like a recipe for disaster, and I'm not sure how much learning would take place since all your doing is running around trying to keep your head above water and make sure no one dies.
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Yeah, with that many patients, I think almost any program would have at least 2 interns on at night.
 
Either way . . . Hopkins is right about their judicious use of autonomy.

How this does seem to too often create a chest-thumped, meat-headed tool of a trainee isn't entirely clear tome . . . must be something else about who they recruit.
 
SEC Guy said:
Website says that all applicants will be notified on October 11th. I received no such notification. If that's how things are done up there, I may just withdraw my application right now.

http://www.hopkinsmedicine.org/Medicine/hstrainingprogram/applicants/
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"All applicants will be notified via e-mail on approximately October 11, 2012."

Hope that clears things up.

Also, check http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=950974&page=9.
No one has gotten an interview at JHU yet, and I am sure many of the posters are more than qualified.

PS- what's up with all the neurotic gunner types that flood the board during interview season? are these the people that flood the top? no offense. i would drink my own pee for a week to up my board scores and be in a position to make it into to these places.
 
SEC Guy said:
Website says that all applicants will be notified on October 11th. I received no such notification. If that's how things are done up there, I may just withdraw my application right now.

http://www.hopkinsmedicine.org/Medicine/hstrainingprogram/applicants/
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dismissive_wanking.gif
 
At our shop we have 8 medicine teams which can have up to 20 patients each, plus there is a day float team which may have 5-10 pts. Granted, 150 would be at the upper end, but the setup is such that the night float intern is covering all these patients, with resident backup should they need it. There are also admissions going on at night and we'll routinely admit 12 patients between 2 residents (6 apiece). With that setup the workload is definitely manageable, though if it were 1 person I just don't think it would be possible, even with 2 people things would get awful hairy.
 
SEC Guy said:
Website says that all applicants will be notified on October 11th. I received no such notification. If that's how things are done up there, I may just withdraw my application right now.

http://www.hopkinsmedicine.org/Medicine/hstrainingprogram/applicants/
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This is the second time someone has created one of these, "Hopkins is off by a day/their website looks old threads. I imagine it is the same borderline applicant who is trying to weasel his way into hopkins by trying to scare off other applicants.

OP you sound like an incredible douchenozzle. If this is going to be a game changer then perhaps you should withdraw you app.
 
I don't think I would ever consider withdrawing an application because the program didn't respond within a few days of their supposed notification day...You think an awful lot of yourself, apparently.
 
Any word from Johnny? I've got nothing
 
SilverMoon said:
For what it's worth, stalking last year's IM Invites thread shows Hopkins didn't come out until Nov 3 or so. (I know this year the timetable may move up, but that's all I got...)
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Ha I didn't even think of that - thanks
 
SilverMoon said:
Someone just got an invite for the Urban Health track there, so perhaps they are starting early this year?
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I think the Urban Health track is Med-Peds, so my guess is that would be separate evaluation/invitation process?
 
IMapplicant said:
Scratch that. Just got categorical invite.
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Nice! Still nothing yet for me :( maybe they're starting to send em out now

EDIT: anyone know if they send out rejections? I haven't heard of any yet but I'm curious (though I really hope I get an invite...)
 
Last edited:
People have reported rejections in the past years.
But I couldn't find if they do batch invites in one day or they are rolled out? Any hopkins folks have insight?
 
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MediKate said:
People have reported rejections in the past years.
But I couldn't find if they do batch invites in one day or they are rolled out? Any hopkins folks have insight?
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Would love to know as well if anyone has any insight. Keeping my fingers crossed for another batch.
 
"Osler medicine at Johns Hopkins is W I T H O U T question T H E medicine residency to train at in this nation for a certain type of medical student. I'll continue by saying it is not for everyone, nor should it be. Applicants need to find their fit.

......................"



Thank you very much for the insight into the Osler program. I am very excited about it. Do you know how many they invite for interview and how many positions are available for the Osler Categorical and Osler Urban Health Primary Care Track ? Thanks
 
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the boondock saints
 
harate09 said:
"Osler medicine at Johns Hopkins is W I T H O U T question T H E medicine residency to train at in this nation for a certain type of medical student. I'll continue by saying it is not for everyone, nor should it be. Applicants need to find their fit.

......................"



Thank you very much for the insight into the Osler program. I am very excited about it. Do you know how many they invite for interview and how many positions are available for the Osler Categorical and Osler Urban Health Primary Care Track ? Thanks
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I think it's 38 categorical and 2 prelim spots. Hopkins also has 4 urban health and 4 med peds. It has changed in the last few years though so it may be different this year.

jdh71 said:
Is there anyway to set this thread on fire and burn it to the ground?

*goes looking for kerosine*
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No. there's not.

Scean said:
the boondock saints
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Good call.
 
Any idea if they have any more interviews to send out?
 
Its obvious a few people here have drank...drunk...I'm not an English/Grammar major...anyways, they've drank the CoolAid, which is actually the body and blood of our lord and savior of medicine, Sir Billy O.

Hopkins: makes great doctors, doesn't necessarily care about how.
 
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