- Joined
- Jun 4, 2007
- Messages
- 11,612
- Reaction score
- 836
Well......got the call today......Air Force beat out Army........so......I'll be joining you boys!
yay! (i'm not a boy)
Well......got the call today......Air Force beat out Army........so......I'll be joining you boys!
Hey, Max, my recruiter says that COT is something that we schedule through AFIT, but he doubts that there is going to be space available... Either way, when AFIT becomes our POC, I guess we contact them about it.
LauraDO said:Well......got the call today......Air Force beat out Army........so......I'll be joining you boys!
Mine seemed to think there would be because they'd make space for the 3-yrs first. Suspense.. I'd rather get paid to sit on my ass and sip pina coladas... damn it
Much sadness. I have to turn down 20k USD. Not cool. 20k isn't worth 365 days though.
Why? I'm confused?
Dude, Max, that is not fair, you can't just post something like that with no explaination and then sign off.....get yourself back on here and explain, you are killing us (or me specifically)
The 20k scholarship has a 4-yr service obligation. I am doing a 3 yr scholarship with a 3-yr active service obligation. taking the bonus would effectively increase my active duty requirement by one year.
Not so. I just prefer to take safer bets. I will absolutely love serving my country and helping those who serve it. I have military throughout my family, I know what I'd be committing to.
Good job trying to justify their decision though. It ain't gonna work on me.
Let me make this clear. I am not WORRIED about deployments. I want to deploy. I want to serve my country and do something for our servicemen and women. However, I am guilty as charged on wanting to minimize my future obligation should I have a family to take care of. This is good, sound reasoning and this is not part of the logic that is subject to legitimate criticism. Sorry.
It would be ridiculous to say that by choosing the military I am choosing to not have a family. Saying that is easy, but the reality that they are not mutually exclusive. Do I have a family now? No. Seven years down the road I'll be 30. My life will be vastly different.
I know that the reality is that somewhere down the line during the next 7 yrs, I will probably find someone and ten years from now I'll probably be starting a family of some sort. That is just reality. To ignore that is childish and ill-advised.
You're very wise.
Is it too late for private scholarships/financial aid? What is the total first year package looking like these days at PCOM, and what is the total debt you can assume to have? Add up all four years of financial estimates from the school for this year, and add 20%.
Yeah, I knew that taking the bonus effectively adds one more year to my AD obligation. I considered it carefully and decided that it was okay with me.
Interesting. I hope you have a smooth transition, Jolie, despite the time crunch.
I just emailed my recruiter asking about COT. I would prefer to delay it until later, actually, but if I absolutely have to do it this summer, then I guess I have my last summer cut out for me. In any case, it would be good to know whether I am going to be required to go this summer, or not, so I can plan the rest of it.
Maybe I'll see you there?
This year, I took out 59k in debt... because I have to pay for my medical insurance (2600/yr), rent (800/mo... cant do roommates anymore), utilities (~120-200/mo), food/toiletries/paper products/etc (~80-90/wk)... the costs rack up pretty fast. Seemed like I'd be rolling in the money with that much overage, but I've consitently run out just in time for the next disbursement. Do I go out sometimes, yes... but not often.
So 60*4 = 240 * 120% = $ 288,000. I think that's an extremely low estimate over the life of a student loan.
I bet the less-than-satisfied docs that often post here are just looking at us and laughing... but I know I always make the best of everything (and i've had some pretty situations in my life) and I think it's a great opportunity to do some good. Is that your take as well LDO...Spiced? I guess I'm wondering how everyone else got past the critiques of milmed in their own way.
I know that's a crap load of money, but there is DEFINITELY one part that you need to factor in: the pay discrepancy later. I'm not trying to dissuade you, just give the facts. You say that there's a good chance you'll do a longer residency. I'm going to take that to mean that you mean some sort of surgery or EM or Rads.
You start out $300K ahead (from having no loans).
When you finish residency you make 150-175K/year - that's around the max of any military specialty. Many surgical subspecialties start out at or around 300K/year (some even more). So you make ~150K less per year.
$150Kx3=$450 less that you would make during your payback than you would as a civilian. $450K-$300K (your loan amount)=$150K ahead if you went the civilian route.
Again, there are lots of reasons besides money, but let's not kid ourselves. If you have 3 posts about money in this thread alone, then it's a factor.
I was speaking to some staff about this and they told me that the pay discrepancy is so great, that they benefit financially from getting out after 14yrs instead of waiting that extra 6yrs for lifetime benefits. The pay difference is so great that it makes up for lack of military pension.
It's worth noting that if you go into primary care (i.e. peds, FP, general IM) then there is a much smaller pay discrepancy and you'd basically come out the same either way.
Yep, that is pretty much my thought on it, and as you know I have been all over the place with this decision. But everytime I let it go and told myself, 'no the negatives FAR outweight so positives, I won't do this" a big part of me felt disappointed (both in myself and in the decision). I decided I wanted to be a Doctor, not to save the world, find a cure for cancer, etc. But only with the goal of trying to help improve the existance of at least one person (although more would be nice).
I also feel like I tend to make the best out of every situation I am in and I live by the philosophy that everything happens for a reason, good or bad. I feel like I am going in to this decision, eyes wide open, thanks to this board, things might suck, but at least I chose that suckiness with knowledge in hand and all I can do is try to make the best out it and be the best Doctor possible under the circumstances.
In the end, I am more proud to be milmed than to be a doctor alone. Perhaps I can't fix the system but at least I can help one or two patients. I refuse to let those that selflessly serve our country be stuck with crappy care just because I don't want to be uncomfortable
Anyway that was a bit speechy.....on another not, Spice/Max I wish you would wait and go to COT next year---it will be so much more fun if I am there too
I bet the less-than-satisfied docs that often post here are just looking at us and laughing... but I know I always make the best of everything (and i've had some pretty situations in my life) and I think it's a great opportunity to do some good. Is that your take as well LDO...Spiced? I guess I'm wondering how everyone else got past the critiques of milmed in their own way.
It wasn't an easy decision for me either, and I had initially decided against the scholarship because I wasn't sure I was willing to ask my husband to make that much of a sacrifice. Then, some crazy events happened in our personal lives and he encouraged me to take it. I'm not expecting my payback to be easy, but it's still an experience that I'd like to have. I actually am a big believer in "service", so that's my main motivation.
I'm also thinking about going into IM and then doing ID, so I don't think I stand to lose as much financially from this decision.
PM me when it gets closer to COT. I'm actually driving there, so I'll have a car for the weekends we're free.
I bet the less-than-satisfied docs that often post here are just looking at us and laughing...
Question: Does the AF defer for dual-residencies like med-peds? Can someone also explain cashing in the GI bill during residency?
You are 100% correct. I thought I was soooooo smart back when I sought out the HPSP, just like you think you are now.
no, I don't think I am smart at all, quite the opposite, which is why I tried to talk myself out of it so many times. I think I am slightly crazy for doing it (and being excited about doing it) after all I know, but like I said, there is something that kept me wanting to do it, against all odds. I blame it on military upbreeding, some sort of brain washing
Spice was your friend army or AF (I would guess army based on deployment time) What made you choose AF, just out of curiosity
You are 100% correct. I thought I was soooooo smart back when I sought out the HPSP, just like you think you are now.
2) You can't use the GI bill if you do a military residency. It only pays off if you GTFO and do a civilian residency. Deferment won't work either unless you have 36 months of active duty before getting deferred for civ residency. This is possible if you do GMO/FS for 3 years, then make the enormous mistake to still apply for military GME.
the lifestyle is better for USAF physicians, which pretty much everyone acknowledges.
I am curious.
From a pre-med/med stud point of view, how do you think the USAF lifestyle in better than Army or Navy?
Please do not use length of deployment as an example because that will most likely change by the time you start active duty.
I am curious.
From a pre-med/med stud point of view, how do you think the USAF lifestyle in better than Army or Navy?
Please do not use length of deployment as an example because that will most likely change by the time you start active duty.
I asked people in both branches and that was what the majority told me. Even people on the Army side said that, too.
I asked people in both branches and that was what the majority told me. Even people on the Army side said that, too. Obviously, I cannot have direct experience with this yet, so all I could do is ask, listen, and read. I can't know if it's true, but that is the perception, anyway.
I don't agree with this at all. EVERYBODY THAT IS ELIGIBLE to fund the GI Bill should do so. Even if you do a military residency/fellowship. There are so many other uses for this. In addition, in the future you may be able to pass it on to your dependents and it is only going to be more valuable in the future. If you used your benefits today, you would be looking at a $1800 investment with over a $45,000 return spread out over 3 years. This does not take into account new legislation that they are currently fighting over on the hill.
I do wish that the AF had a much larger GME, but I also think that you're more likely to get deferred in AF as opposed to other branches.
I am actually not laughing at all. I am shaking my head in complete disbelief that so many intelligent individuals are making the same mistakes we did dispite the majority's advice. But hey, I understand. If I went back in time and talked to myself before I signed the HPSP contract, I would probably would have a difficult time convincing myself not to sign.
ditto... I come from a military family (both dad and grandfather are West Point grads) I talked with people in all three branches and everyone, EVERYONE, told me to go AF (other than this board), everyone I talked to in the military had great things say about the AF
ditto... I come from a military family (both dad and grandfather are West Point grads) I talked with people in all three branches and everyone, EVERYONE, told me to go AF (other than this board), everyone I talked to in the military had great things say about the AF
ditto... I come from a military family (both dad and grandfather are West Point grads) I talked with people in all three branches and everyone, EVERYONE, told me to go AF (other than this board), everyone I talked to in the military had great things say about the AF
Yes, the USAF treats pilots well, and their enlisted well but treats their physicians very poorly. This is common knowledge in the medical community. The mistake you and your family are making is in assuming that Army physicians (not GMO's) are closer to Infantry, and USAF physicians are closer to pilots in the way they are treated.
USAF airmen deserved great care so I'm not trying to undermine their recruitment, but there is something to be said for addressing misconceptions.
You have a much higher change of doing a GMO in the USAF, you will be doing longer deployments than the current 4 months, and you will move more frequently as the USAF still persists in the mindset that you need to be moving every 3-4 years. You also will work in a facility grossly undermanned. The Army has figured out that you don't retain docs, especially if they have working spouses if you arbitrarily move them.
I still think you can have a positive experience even in the USAF and if you feel that is a calling you Should serve, but it cracks me up when people persist in this fallacy that the USAF is somehow more conducive to family life, quality of life etc.
Ask yourself if the Army is so much larger than the USAF, why are is there such a disproportionate number of the bitter USAF posters on this site?
First welcome to military.
Just be sure that those everyone includes sufficient number of active military physicians (rather difficult unless you put out some effort). Talking to retired or current military members (non-physicians) may help but talking to current military physicians will shed light on what to expect (*though your career and experience may different*)
From reading your posts in the forum (and other posted here) it looks like you all made decision to join HPSP and just need some reason to feel better on your decision to obtain HPSP.
Congrats and good luck and keep open mind as your enter the military medicine.;)
I think alot of the bitterness that comes from some of the AF docs comes from the fact that they went in thinking that the AF wasn't really as 'military' as the other forces, they were given some bull from their recruiter about how it was the softer, friendlier service and then when all the sudden they were sent to war they felt screwed (and with good reason) I go in, under no false pretenses, if things suck for me, then it is only my fault and so I will make the best of them, bitterness comes from feelings of being decieved in someway, I know what might be in store for me, do I hope I am one of the lucky ones, Hell Yeah, but I am prepared for the worse case scenario
WAIT, so you're telling me that there isn't a 97% first-choice match-rate and that the phase-out of GMOs is smoke and mirrors? Blasphemy!
...required bi-yearly paid vacation in Hawaii was a lie too?
damn! I guess that means the complimentary weekly massages and required bi-yearly paid vacation in Hawaii was a lie too? I knew something was fishy, but I mean....no massages....that is just cruel, I can't be expected to work under those conditions
I mean....no massages....that is just cruel, I can't be expected to work under those conditions
Well I'm off to sign my contract... Army HPSP here I come.
Congrats!
Contract is signed and delivered... had my dad (former Army) swear me in now I'm just waiting for my orders to come on down (as they say on the price is right.
Thanks BTW