DO ignorance sucks

[D4C]

Seems to have gone pretty well, considering.......

lol

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[Chubbs Peterson]

.

 

[el_duderino]

Considering what?

Everything is becoming clear now.

 

[DoctorSynthesis]

Everything is becoming clear now.

Things are starting to shake out for me. Bunch of IIs one acceptance.

I didn't apply to very many schools though.

 

[AlteredScale]

Whoah this thread is still hopping!

 

[deleted407021]

So.....How bout that DO ignorance? So annoying lol.

 

[DoctorSynthesis]

So.....How bout that DO ignorance? So annoying lol.

I think this thread proves ignorance is beyond DOs

 

[JPickos9989]

I think this thread proves ignorance is beyond DOs

I think we ventured well past the point of ignorance a while ago....

 

[DoctorSynthesis]

I think we ventured well past the point of ignorance a while ago....

Yep

 

[Seth Joo]

I hate dealing with DO ignorance now that I'm probably going to a DO school. It's especially worse because I work at Duke, which is a huge academic institution. My other co workers who are also in the pre med stage (but have been accepted to MD schools), refer to DO schools as "DO programs", not just medical school. Some of them even think that there is a hierarchy in hospitals that goes MD>DO>PA>NP>the rest

How pervasive is this mentality? I keep hearing that it's confined to the "old MD residency directors" but these are my contemporaries and potentially colleagues that old these ill and nasty views.

I went to an Ivy League school, there definitely is a mentality at elite universities that DOs are some kind of second tier physician.

There is a blog by Kevin MD where he basically refers to Osteopathic Medicine as a "fake Rolex".
http://www.kevinmd.com/blog/2007/06/dos-fake-rolex-of-medical-profession.html

There is another Allopathic doctor who wrote derogatory comments about the profession in Forbes magazine. A couple of days later, the author wrote another article saying he had second thoughts. Regardless the damage was done by that author.

The author was Steven Salzberg who is a professor at Johns Hopkins, considered by most to be the best medical school in the US.

Still I think if you are the elitist type you will be unhappy at a DO school.

 

[100111]

If you want prestige, go to Harvard or Hopkins. If you want to be a physician, be happy with the best school you get accepted to.

 

[Seth Joo]

If you want prestige, go to Harvard or Hopkins. If you want to be a physician, be happy with the best school you get accepted to.

That is what I said, people in "prestigious" institutions like Harvard and Hopkins tend to have big egos.

 

[100111]

That is what I said, people in "prestigious" institutions like Harvard and Hopkins tend to have big egos.

I agree with you. I think there's much more to life than work or prestige and if one wants to let their life be defined by that, they're free to do so.

At the end of the day, I would invite the fun-loving nurses, PAs, and techs to my dinner party over the "brilliant Ivy physician" that acts smug. I would be miserable around all the egos at ivy or academic institutions.

I <3 D.O.

 

[Seth Joo]

I agree with you. I think there's much more to life than work or prestige and if one wants to let their life be defined by that, they're free to do so.

At the end of the day, I would invite the fun-loving nurses, PAs, and techs to my dinner party over the "brilliant Ivy physician" that acts smug. I would be miserable around all the egos at ivy or academic institutions.

I <3 D.O.

One thing I can say about DO schools, at least my DO school, is that the professors and staff are very approachable and pleasant. I went to a pretty famous undergraduate school and everyone there had an attitude, it was hard to approach professors and you had to make an appointment with their assistant to see them.

You will also see a lot of very rich people at Ivy League schools, my roommate's dad I recall bought him a Ferrari for his 21st birthday.

 

[hallowmann]

...There is another Allopathic doctor who wrote derogatory comments about the profession in Forbes magazine. A couple of days later, the author wrote another article saying he had second thoughts. Regardless the damage was done by that author.

The author was Steven Salzberg who is a professor at Johns Hopkins, considered by most to be the best medical school in the US.

Still I think if you are the elitist type you will be unhappy at a DO school.

Actually, Steven Salzberg is not an MD, he is a PhD (in computer science no less). He got the degree from Harvard in the 80s. He's involved in bioinformatics and based on his initial article and "apology" among other equally irrelevant articles, he sounds like a tool.

But yeah, no, he's not a physician, not even close (I guess he's as close as a computer scientist could be, but honestly that's not very close), and he began his job at JHU a year or so after the Forbes article and was at the University of Maryland before that.

 

[costales]

So he's a medical expert because he studied FORTRAN.

 

[Seth Joo]

Actually, Steven Salzberg is not an MD, he is a PhD (in computer science no less). He got the degree from Harvard in the 80s. He's involved in bioinformatics and based on his initial article and "apology" among other equally irrelevant articles, he sounds like a tool.

But yeah, no, he's not a physician, not even close (I guess he's as close as a computer scientist could be, but honestly that's not very close), and he began his job at JHU a year or so after the Forbes article and was at the University of Maryland before that.

PhDs are even more intelligent than MDs and DOs. Steven Salzberg is an academic at one of the most prestigious medical schools in the United States.

There is another MD from North Carolina, a retired physician who has also criticized OMM and the profession of Osteopathic Medicine. Dr. Stephen Barrett MD is his name, he has also been highly critical of Osteopathic Manipulation.

Yes there is indeed ignorance, and in many cases fully aware prejudice against DOs at certain institutions.

 

[JimmyB123]

PhDs are even more intelligent than MDs and DOs. Steven Salzberg is an academic at one of the most prestigious medical schools in the United States.

There is another MD from North Carolina, a retired physician who has also criticized OMM and the profession of Osteopathic Medicine. Dr. Stephen Barrett MD is his name, he has also been highly critical of Osteopathic Manipulation.

Yes there is indeed ignorance, and in many cases fully aware prejudice against DOs at certain institutions.

Yeah, I mean you're right. I think for the most part if you're a DO, just stay away from the big academic powerhouses and the "Ivy tower." Not worth it in my opinion to have to deal with that ish.

Practicing in a county hospital or a more community based area will be an easier life choice, and you can probably get a lot of the similar satisfaction

 

[HappyFeet14]

PhDs are even more intelligent than MDs and DOs. Steven Salzberg is an academic at one of the most prestigious medical schools in the United States.

There is another MD from North Carolina, a retired physician who has also criticized OMM and the profession of Osteopathic Medicine. Dr. Stephen Barrett MD is his name, he has also been highly critical of Osteopathic Manipulation.

Yes there is indeed ignorance, and in many cases fully aware prejudice against DOs at certain institutions.

Yeah, I mean you're right. I think for the most part if you're a DO, just stay away from the big academic powerhouses and the "Ivy tower." Not worth it in my opinion to have to deal with that ish.

Practicing in a county hospital or a more community based area will be an easier life choice, and you can probably get a lot of the similar satisfaction

what, I don't even......

 

[Roxas]

PhDs are even more intelligent than MDs and DOs. Steven Salzberg is an academic at one of the most prestigious medical schools in the United States.

There is another MD from North Carolina, a retired physician who has also criticized OMM and the profession of Osteopathic Medicine. Dr. Stephen Barrett MD is his name, he has also been highly critical of Osteopathic Manipulation.

Yes there is indeed ignorance, and in many cases fully aware prejudice against DOs at certain institutions.

Ummm.... no. They just hold a different skill set. I'm sure there are specific cases where this may be true, but blanket statements like this are just idiotic.

 

[hallowmann]

Yeah, I mean you're right. I think for the most part if you're a DO, just stay away from the big academic powerhouses and the "Ivy tower." Not worth it in my opinion to have to deal with that ish.

Practicing in a county hospital or a more community based area will be an easier life choice, and you can probably get a lot of the similar satisfaction

The thing is many DOs want it and are successful in academic centers. It may not be a majority or even a sizeable number, but I don't think they really regret it. People who are sensitive about that sort of thing might rather limit themselves to a specific setting, but it's better just not to worry about it and do what you want to do. You will always be looked down upon by somebody.

 

[costales]

I went to an Ivy League school, there definitely is a mentality at elite universities that DOs are some kind of second tier physician.

Can you make a post without mentioning the Ivy League or your Ivy League degree?

Your obsession with prestige borders on unhealthy.

 

[DrEnderW]

Really?

I think in general PhDs have a higher intelligence level than MD/DOs respective of the impact they can make. Personally, I love the basic sciences and have a strong interest in research, but you have to be a special brand of gifted to make a legitimate contribution to science. In contrast, pursuing a career in medicine allows you to impact individual patients daily on a smaller scale. The scope at which basic scientists work is on a scale so much larger than what physicians contribute and our future, especially now, hinges on their advances.

Medicine is built upon people toiling in the laboratory and running trials. There's such a colossal difference between publishing research your PI tells you to write or running even a majoR DBPCS compared to creating novel basic science research. It's not on the scale of what you learn in med school. Med school is memorization of what someone else figured out, with limited thinking compared to designing meaningful experiments. You think of exactly 0% new information to earn a doctorate. Modern medicine is built on PhDs making advances and we, as future physicians, should recognize that. We owe everything to basic scientists. Every drug prescribed, every advance in genetics, every insight into a biochemical pathway is made in a laboratory. That's why pre-med had the prereqs it has and why med school has basic sciences - to select people on an above avg md/do level that operate on a level capable of advancing medicine. The ratio of physicians to PhDs that make novel intellectual breakthroughs wouldn't be flattering.

 

[deleted407021]

I think it's important to note the social influence physicians have over scientists.

 

[Seth Joo]

Can you make a post without mentioning the Ivy League or your Ivy League degree?

Your obsession with prestige borders on unhealthy.

I did mention I had a roommate in college whose dad bought him a brand new Ferrari for his 21st birthday, that was a while back though, but still. I never again saw such a collection of over privileged people in my life and definitely not in DO school, although some of my classmates might agree, most people though I know are paying for DO school with loans not with Daddy's trust funds.

 

[TactFR44]

I did mention I had a roommate in college whose dad bought him a brand new Ferrari for his 21st birthday, that was a while back though, but still. I never again saw such a collection of over privileged people in my life and definitely not in DO school, although some of my classmates might agree, most people though I know are paying for DO school with loans not with Daddy's trust funds.

Damn your roommate got a car? My parents got me a card. It was a sweet card tho! Not one of those dollar tree knock off cards. Hallmark brand and all! <3

 

[Seth Joo]

Damn your roommate got a car? My parents got me a card. It was a sweet card tho! Not one of those dollar tree knock off cards. Hallmark brand and all! <3

I got a car from my parents too, it was a 5 year old Honda Civic. My roommate got a Ferrari, do you have any idea how much those cars cost? You could pay for your entire four years of medical school for the price of one Ferrari.

There are quite a few models of Ferraris that have become collector's vehicles and are worth a lot of money.

A 52 year old model was sold for nearly 35 million dollars:
http://www.cnbc.com/id/101914056#.

Oh well at least the Civic got me from point A to point B when I was in school. Despite being a cheap car, its a lot more reliable than a Ferrari but you won't wow anyone.

 

[NontradCA]

Good u?

Lol @touchpause13

 

[TactFR44]

I got a car from my parents too, it was a 5 year old Honda Civic. My roommate got a Ferrari, do you have any idea how much those cars cost? You could pay for your entire four years of medical school for the price of one Ferrari.

There are quite a few models of Ferraris that have become collector's vehicles and are worth a lot of money.

A 52 year old model was sold for nearly 35 million dollars:
http://www.cnbc.com/id/101914056#.

Oh well at least the Civic got me from point A to point B when I was in school. Despite being a cheap car, its a lot more reliable than a Ferrari but you won't wow anyone.

Yes man, I know how much Ferarris cost. My point was it's insane that people like your roommate actually exist. So far out of touch with reality. Reminds me of those snot nose kids MTV used to glamorize on those Sweet 16 shows.

 

[Seth Joo]

Yes man, I know how much Ferarris cost. My point was it's insane that people like your roommate actually exist. So far out of touch with reality. Reminds me of those snot nose kids MTV used to glamorize on those Sweet 16 shows.

If you attend an elite school you will see a lot of people from privileged backgrounds, children of wealthy billionaires, politicians, celebrities.

I honestly thought a good amount of my classmates in undergrad got into my school because their parents donated money or they went to a well connected prep school.

It was quite stressful being surrounded by those egos, the professors were also some of the most unapproachable and arrogant people I have met.

I find it ironic that my professors in medical school are a lot more approachable, and I can easily have more than a 20 minute conversation with them without getting an appointment. During undergraduate college, professors had "office hours" where you could speak to them, otherwise you needed to make an appointment. Where I go now, all I have to do is knock the door politely.

 

[TactFR44]

If you attend an elite school you will see a lot of people from privileged backgrounds, children of wealthy billionaires, politicians, celebrities.

I honestly thought a good amount of my classmates in undergrad got into my school because their parents donated money or they went to a well connected prep school.

It was quite stressful being surrounded by those egos, the professors were also some of the most unapproachable and arrogant people I have met.

I find it ironic that my professors in medical school are a lot more approachable, and I can easily have more than a 20 minute conversation with them without getting an appointment. During undergraduate college, professors had "office hours" where you could speak to them, otherwise you needed to make an appointment. Where I go now, all I have to do is knock the door politely.

Yeah I can see that. I didn't go to an iy league but I can see what you are saying. Do you guys refer to yourselves as elitists on the daily? I think that's what bolsters that mentality. Because I think what they fail to realize is the only people who care about that "status" are themselves.

 

[Seth Joo]

Yeah I can see that. I didn't go to an iy league but I can see what you are saying. Do you guys refer to yourselves as elitists on the daily? I think that's what bolsters that mentality. Because I think what they fail to realize is the only people who care about that "status" are themselves.

I went to my school because I got accepted and my parents and teachers thought it was a great idea at the time. I wound up in a lot of debt as I did not have a trust fund to pay for my undergraduate degree.

I was premed and postponed medical school a few years because I wanted to work and pay down my debt.

I think to anyone who is looking for an "elite" school, they should aim for a good state school rather than a snooty private elite college unless you or your folks have deep pockets.

I think of education the same way I think of automobiles, it will get you from one point to another, sure some may have extra features and will wow others, but really whatever college you go to you get an education and a degree. But that is my view after I got a taste of the real world and real life. No one really cares what school you attended.

I have classmates in med school who went to regular colleges who I think are some of the smartest people I have met.

 

[TactFR44]

I went to my school because I got accepted and my parents and teachers thought it was a great idea at the time. I wound up in a lot of debt as I did not have a trust fund to pay for my undergraduate degree.

I was premed and postponed medical school a few years because I wanted to work and pay down my debt.

I think to anyone who is looking for an "elite" school, they should aim for a good state school rather than a snooty private elite college unless you or your folks have deep pockets.

I think of education the same way I think of automobiles, it will get you from one point to another, sure some may have extra features and will wow others, but really whatever college you go to you get an education and a degree. But that is my view after I got a taste of the real world and real life. No one really cares what school you attended.

I have classmates in med school who went to regular colleges who I think are some of the smartest people I have met.

Well yeah. I mean I'm not here to personally attack you or anything so don't take what I'm saying the wrong way but it sounds like you are (were?) under the impression that most state schools don't have a high volume of brilliant students? Because they didn't dish out a crap ton of money to go to a shool with a name attached to it? Incredibly incorrect if this is how you feel.

 

[galloway27]

Yeah, I mean you're right. I think for the most part if you're a DO, just stay away from the big academic powerhouses and the "Ivy tower." Not worth it in my opinion to have to deal with that ish.

Practicing in a county hospital or a more community based area will be an easier life choice, and you can probably get a lot of the similar satisfaction

I always have considered Ohio State to be somewhat of an academic powerhouse and they have plenty of D.O.'s. The director of their cardiology fellowship is a D.O. So there are some big Institutions that don really have a bias.

 

[TactFR44]

If you attend an elite school you will see a lot of people from privileged backgrounds, children of wealthy billionaires, politicians, celebrities.

I honestly thought a good amount of my classmates in undergrad got into my school because their parents donated money or they went to a well connected prep school.

It was quite stressful being surrounded by those egos, the professors were also some of the most unapproachable and arrogant people I have met.

I find it ironic that my professors in medical school are a lot more approachable, and I can easily have more than a 20 minute conversation with them without getting an appointment. During undergraduate college, professors had "office hours" where you could speak to them, otherwise you needed to make an appointment. Where I go now, all I have to do is knock the door politely.

BTW. At my state school our professors also had designated office hours to help students. Or you could request a time to meet with them via appointment. I didn't assume they were being arrogant but just busy people. Also, pre-med at a large state university = hundreds of students to deal with. Gotta maintain structure.

 

[AlbinoHawk DO]

Really?

I think in general PhDs have a higher intelligence level than MD/DOs respective of the impact they can make. Personally, I love the basic sciences and have a strong interest in research, but you have to be a special brand of gifted to make a legitimate contribution to science. In contrast, pursuing a career in medicine allows you to impact individual patients daily on a smaller scale. The scope at which basic scientists work is on a scale so much larger than what physicians contribute and our future, especially now, hinges on their advances.

Medicine is built upon people toiling in the laboratory and running trials. There's such a colossal difference between publishing research your PI tells you to write or running even a majoR DBPCS compared to creating novel basic science research. It's not on the scale of what you learn in med school. Med school is memorization of what someone else figured out, with limited thinking compared to designing meaningful experiments. You think of exactly 0% new information to earn a doctorate. Modern medicine is built on PhDs making advances and we, as future physicians, should recognize that. We owe everything to basic scientists. Every drug prescribed, every advance in genetics, every insight into a biochemical pathway is made in a laboratory. That's why pre-med had the prereqs it has and why med school has basic sciences - to select people on an above avg md/do level that operate on a level capable of advancing medicine. The ratio of physicians to PhDs that make novel intellectual breakthroughs wouldn't be flattering.

There are studies based on average IQ between professions and physicians are always on top. I know it's not a perfect metric, but it is something to ponder over that is more objective than concluding from subjective experiences.

I think you're suffering from hasty generalization. You're looking at a few PIs and the contributions to science from people that dedicate all their life to science research vs a group that is trained and spends most of its time on patients.

 

[Seth Joo]

I always have considered Ohio State to be somewhat of an academic powerhouse and they have plenty of D.O.'s. The director of their cardiology fellowship is a D.O. So there are some big Institutions that don really have a bias.

The Midwest seems to be more DO friendly than the coasts.

 

[hallowmann]

Really?

I think in general PhDs have a higher intelligence level than MD/DOs respective of the impact they can make. Personally, I love the basic sciences and have a strong interest in research, but you have to be a special brand of gifted to make a legitimate contribution to science. In contrast, pursuing a career in medicine allows you to impact individual patients daily on a smaller scale. The scope at which basic scientists work is on a scale so much larger than what physicians contribute and our future, especially now, hinges on their advances.

Medicine is built upon people toiling in the laboratory and running trials. There's such a colossal difference between publishing research your PI tells you to write or running even a majoR DBPCS compared to creating novel basic science research. It's not on the scale of what you learn in med school. Med school is memorization of what someone else figured out, with limited thinking compared to designing meaningful experiments. You think of exactly 0% new information to earn a doctorate. Modern medicine is built on PhDs making advances and we, as future physicians, should recognize that. We owe everything to basic scientists. Every drug prescribed, every advance in genetics, every insight into a biochemical pathway is made in a laboratory. That's why pre-med had the prereqs it has and why med school has basic sciences - to select people on an above avg md/do level that operate on a level capable of advancing medicine. The ratio of physicians to PhDs that make novel intellectual breakthroughs wouldn't be flattering.

To be fair, there are tons of very different types of PhDs and they all have varying degrees of difficulty, competitiveness, and levels of contribution to their fields (sure everyone writes a thesis, but the requirements for that thesis are VERY different from one field to another and even one school to another).

This conversation was started when we were talking about a guy who got a PhD in computer science in the 80s. To be honest, I'm not sure how competitive CS was back then, but something tells me a PhD in CS from Harvard, MIT, or CMU right now is more competitive than a PhD in CS from Harvard was back in the 80s. I may be wrong, but I suspect that's the case.

I have a lot of friends that are PhDs and candidates (and I even married one), and the programs are definitely tough, and are really only worth it if you like the field (kind of like medical school), and there certainly are very stressful moments (like defending and thesis-writing), but to be honest on a day-to-day basis the type of time they spent on their work isn't really comparable to (i.e. is usually much less than) the time med students spend (speaking strictly of time commitment here - difficulty is variable, but I think its comparable in both degrees).

Also, you have to admit its a little ridiculous to compare the breakthroughs PhDs make with physicians, because its essentially the job of (some) PhDs to make breakthroughs. If all physicians had to do was do research all day, I'm sure results would be comparable. In addition not all PhDs are making major breakthroughs in the field, some are, but certainly not all.

 

[Sweetpotatoguy]

It only matters to pre-meds. Senseless, arrogant, lacking in life experience pre-meds.

Amen

 

[W19]

A little bit of both? Just being honest. I don't have the idealistic pre med mentality that I'm there to "help people" and "save the world." I want to have an effect on people's lives but I'm equally there for the reknown and prestige that comes with this profession

 

[sylvanthus]

Really?

I think in general PhDs have a higher intelligence level than MD/DOs respective of the impact they can make. Personally, I love the basic sciences and have a strong interest in research, but you have to be a special brand of gifted to make a legitimate contribution to science. In contrast, pursuing a career in medicine allows you to impact individual patients daily on a smaller scale. The scope at which basic scientists work is on a scale so much larger than what physicians contribute and our future, especially now, hinges on their advances.

Medicine is built upon people toiling in the laboratory and running trials. There's such a colossal difference between publishing research your PI tells you to write or running even a majoR DBPCS compared to creating novel basic science research. It's not on the scale of what you learn in med school. Med school is memorization of what someone else figured out, with limited thinking compared to designing meaningful experiments. You think of exactly 0% new information to earn a doctorate. Modern medicine is built on PhDs making advances and we, as future physicians, should recognize that. We owe everything to basic scientists. Every drug prescribed, every advance in genetics, every insight into a biochemical pathway is made in a laboratory. That's why pre-med had the prereqs it has and why med school has basic sciences - to select people on an above avg md/do level that operate on a level capable of advancing medicine. The ratio of physicians to PhDs that make novel intellectual breakthroughs wouldn't be flattering.

 

[sylvanthus]

I agree with you. I think there's much more to life than work or prestige and if one wants to let their life be defined by that, they're free to do so.

At the end of the day, I would invite the fun-loving nurses, PAs, and techs to my dinner party over the "brilliant Ivy physician" that acts smug. I would be miserable around all the egos at ivy or academic institutions.

I <3 D.O.

'
Fyi,

You are being just as elite and smug by overgeneralizing these "ivy" types and essentially labeling them all as smug and egotistical.

 

[Seth Joo]

'
Fyi,

You are being just as elite and smug by overgeneralizing these "ivy" types and essentially labeling them all as smug and egotistical.

I went to an Ivy League school, a lot of people were indeed smug and egotistical while I was there. They still have the same kind of attitude but I think its changed a little.

 

[dreday710]

My biochem professor last year overheard me say that I was only applying to D.O. schools and he said, "WHY DO YOU DO THAT. YOU ARE SETTING YOURSELF UP FOR FAILURE. I WOULD NEVER GO TO A D.O." Then I asked him if he had ever been to a D.O. He said no. I asked him if he knew what they were. He said no. So I explained to him the curriculum, and the fact that they have equal practicing rights, but of course, he continued to demean me in disbelief.

 

[IslandStyle808]

My biochem professor last year overheard me say that I was only applying to D.O. schools and he said, "WHY DO YOU DO THAT. YOU ARE SETTING YOURSELF UP FOR FAILURE. I WOULD NEVER GO TO A D.O." Then I asked him if he had ever been to a D.O. He said no. I asked him if he knew what they were. He said no. So I explained to him the curriculum, and the fact that they have equal practicing rights, but of course, he continued to demean me in disbelief.

...or he might have been treated by a D.O. and didn't realize it.

 

[Milotic]

I honestly believe the DO bias definitely exists outside of the pre-med world, depending on the region.

I will chime in a bit.

I am from Los Angeles. First off, the ratio of family physician DOs to Specialist DOs was like 100:1 in most of Southern California. I am obviously exaggerating here but I was using every "Find a DO" database out there to try to find surgeon DO's in SoCal back when I was trying to shadow a DO and it was very scarce.

Also, I have numerous health problems so I see many different doctors in LA for my various issues (all MD with only MD's in their groups/practices). Their ages range from 30s to 50s. When I told them I was accepted to a DO school, they had no idea about any other DO school ever except some knew about WesternU which was in the area. They seemed relatively happy for me. When I got my MD acceptance, their reactions were very different. It included a lot of MD>DO bias and much more praise and it felt like they were taking me in as one of their own. It was surprising to say the least because I thought MDs and DOs really didn't care at that point.

It could just be that Southern California has a lot of stuck up people that care about the name brands and such, but this was just my experience.

I was cool with having to go to a DO school at first because no one showed me any bias. Once I got the MD acceptance, it was like they started spilling out their thoughts about it. I have mixed feelings about it.

 

[j4pac]

About half my medical field friends are MD and the other are DOs. The mass majority of real physicians DO NOT CARE. The mass majority of MDs and DOs have either colleagues or friends of the other field. When you practice long enough you get to see that there are great DOs and MDs and horrible DOs and MDs. In the real world respect is earned by your ability and not the initials behind your name.

 

[j4pac]

I honestly believe the DO bias definitely exists outside of the pre-med world, depending on the region.

I will chime in a bit.

I am from Los Angeles. First off, the ratio of family physician DOs to Specialist DOs was like 100:1 in most of Southern California. I am obviously exaggerating here but I was using every "Find a DO" database out there to try to find surgeon DO's in SoCal back when I was trying to shadow a DO and it was very scarce.

Also, I have numerous health problems so I see many different doctors in LA for my various issues (all MD with only MD's in their groups/practices). Their ages range from 30s to 50s. When I told them I was accepted to a DO school, they had no idea about any other DO school ever except some knew about WesternU which was in the area. They seemed relatively happy for me. When I got my MD acceptance, their reactions were very different. It included a lot of MD>DO bias and much more praise and it felt like they were taking me in as one of their own. It was surprising to say the least because I thought MDs and DOs really didn't care at that point.

It could just be that Southern California has a lot of stuck up people that care about the name brands and such, but this was just my experience.

I was cool with having to go to a DO school at first because no one showed me any bias. Once I got the MD acceptance, it was like they started spilling out their thoughts about it. I have mixed feelings about it.

California may be the exception. Californians are very proud people. That is why it is so incredibly difficult to get into a California undergrad or graduate school not being from California. They usually take their own. That same mentality likely tracks to some MDs.

That has not really been my experience from another other place. Sure there are some anti-DO MDs all over...but after medical school they tend to dissipate.

MDs and DOs need to realize that they need to work together to maintain their interests. IMGs and PAs are the biggest threat to US-trained physicians and it isn't even close.

 

[JimmyB123]

California may be the exception. Californians are very proud people. That is why it is so incredibly difficult to get into a California undergrad or graduate school not being from California. They usually take their own. That same mentality likely tracks to some MDs.

That has not really been my experience from another other place. Sure there are some anti-DO MDs all over...but after medical school they tend to dissipate.

MDs and DOs need to realize that they need to work together to maintain their interests. IMGs and PAs are the biggest threat to US-trained physicians and it isn't even close.

Way to put down IMGs and PAs after saying that MD = DO.

 

[polylux]

I just read through this entire thread and I'm not really sure why I did.

It starts as an MD vs DO argument (really? we don't have enough of these threads?). Then half of it is just a PA vs NP argument, which is kind of silly. Then there is somehow a PhD vs MD/DO argument, which is also silly. Why are we spending so much time trying to prove how much better certain groups are than others? I'm just happy to be going to med school next year. I'm grateful to everyone I've met along the way - DOs, MDs, PhDs, NPs, PAs, RNs, techs, admin people, janitors, cafeteria staff... I don't think of myself as better than my friend who is going to PA school and works really hard to learn all the material and I definitely don't think I'm smarter than my Chemical Engineering PhD SO or his lab mates who will frequently work from 8am to 12 am conducting research. And I sure am thankful for the custodians who clean up the rooms after the code in the ER makes a mess of it. There are a lot of sick people and we need everyone to play their part competently and effectively to take care of all of them.

Maybe instead of always worrying about who's better than you or who you're better than, you should just focus on working hard for your patients.