Dilemma: no time for clinical experience

[closertofine]

OK, so I have this one year before I (hopefully) start med school. And I've gotten two jobs...first a part-time one teaching an MCAT course, and then a full-time one as a research assistant in a lab at my school. I've decided to do both because I think I'd be bored out of my mind just working in a lab all day, and I do want to teach the class...but the teaching job doesn't pay enough for me to survive on it alone.

But the problem is (well, besides the fact that I will be so busy, and I still have to write all the essays for secondaries!), that I have very little clinical experience. I was going to do a volunteer program at a hospital an hour or so away from me (just on the weekends, though), but once I got these two jobs, I knew I wouldn't have time...so I didn't even go to the orientation.

I know I "should" have gotten more clinical experience before this...and you might ask "well, how do you know you want to be a doctor?" but I've had some medical problems and haven't been able to do much outside of the things absolutely required of me at the time (like schoolwork). But now, I do really worry that med schools will ask that question, or say I don't have the experience I need to get in (though I know my grades and scores will help).

That brings up another issue in my mind...on Yale's secondary, and on others I'm sure, they ask you to list in chronological order what you've been doing since you graduated. I graduated in August, but wasn't enrolled after May (long story, but I had to finish up some incompletes)...so I guess I have to account for all the time after May. But I did literally nothing this summer because I felt so bad physically...though I don't plan to discuss my medical problems with the admissions committe...so I don't know how to answer their question, without seeming like a complete bum who hangs out on the couch all day.

Wow, I guess I wrote more than I had planned to! But besides that problem I just mentioned, my main question is just if you all know of anything I could do about getting clinical experience. I've thought about volunteering on the weekends, but I'll be teaching then, and I think I'll be too exhausted from the week of working to do it...any ideas?

Thanks!

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[matthew45]

Drop the teaching of the MCAT course. Clinical experience is waaaaaaaaay more important. I'd say unless you are a 32+/3.8+ you're going to have a hard road ahead of you w/o significant clinical experience. AdComms like to know that you've seen medicine in action and are familiar with the lifestyle and privations involved. MCAT courses are fairly worthless anyway, in my humble opinion.

 

[closertofine]

Yes, you're probably right...though I do have higher stats than those you mentioned...I wish I hadn't missed that volunteer orientation! And all the orientations at local hospitals have passed, too...and from past experience, I know they're very picky about not letting you start volunteering if you've missed the orientation (this was the reason I didn't volunteer one semester!).

And I did already write my MCAT teaching down on my AMCAS application as my "current" activity...so I wonder if that would be a problem. Also, I will feel so bad quitting that job since I just finished the long training...and I did really enjoy at least the "practice" teaching sessions...I thought that would help me with my interviews since I'm normally a pretty shy person, but as a teacher I have to speak up and act more outgoing, etc...

Although I do have good scores and grades, I also doubt that will be enough to get me in...if I don't have the clinical experience to match. I did do a medical volunteer program abroad for 3 weeks, and did some very minimal volunteering with the Red Cross, but that's about it...I'm in trouble, I guess! Yikes! Wish I knew for sure what to do...

 

[KS123]

Maybe you could shadow a doctor for a couple hours once a week? Would not take a lot of time and would give you some current experience with the medical field. I think it is important, definitely more important than teaching the MCAT class if you absolutely can't do both. I don't think it would be a big deal to drop the class even though it is on your AMCAS. Just explain to them if it comes up you really wanted to use that time to get clinical exposure.

Are you sure you don't want to explain your situation on the secondary? I ask because I'm pretty sure the school will see all the incompletes, even though they are made up. I had a bunch of incompletes one semester and they are all on my transcript with the grade to the side. So I think you will have to explain it eventually. I worked it in to my personal statement.

Also, I don't think missing the orientation will be to big a deal. Lots of hospitals have multiple orientations or will work with you. They are always happy to get volunteers.

 

[zinjanthropus]

in addition, you do not have to concentrate your volunteer efforts at a large hospital that may have a number of beauracratic rings to jump through....instead try a free-clinic where your help is probably more needed anyway

 

[koma]

Originally posted by karen44


Although I do have good scores and grades, I also doubt that will be enough to get me in...if I don't have the clinical experience to match. I did do a medical volunteer program abroad for 3 weeks, and did some very minimal volunteering with the Red Cross, but that's about it...I'm in trouble, I guess! Yikes! Wish I knew for sure what to do...

If everything else in your application is good, lack of significant clinical experience won't hurt you - what you have to do is REALLY emphasize the clinical experience you did have. Honestly, the adcoms see you from the way you present yourself on paper. If you channel your secondaries into explaining how your medical experiences abroad inspired you, the adcoms won't even notice that you didn't have any longterm experience. Esp in # of hours - 3 weeks abroad is like volunteering 12 hrs a day times 21 - which ends up being quite a lot of time, hours wise. I think you had plenty of medical experiences as it is - I shadowed a doc for 3 months (20 hrs a month) and although that's pretty insignificant, it hasn't stopped me from getting interviews.

As to the "what did you do after graduation" - 3 months is really insignificant period to justify. They usually mean this as in "what did you do if you graduated years ago". So in three months you could have been busy doing any number of things - from renovating your house to moving to taking a vacation. I don't think they really care.

 

[spinestudent]

karen, I know a little about the schools you want to go to, and I don't think lack of clinical experience will be a huge negative there as long as you can impress them with other insteresting things about you.

Schools like Yale aren't very big on the typical doctor shadowing routine clinical experience stuff anyways. MCG and mercer are, but I think you mentioned in another thread that you aren't interested in mcg or mercer. I know both of these schools strongly suggest(basically require) you have a physician lor. If you were really set on mercer or mcg, you may be in a little bit of trouble. I know a guy with a 3.8/34 from emory who got rejected from MCG and wanted to go there as his first choice. He just didn't have enough clinical exposure. OTOH, I also know a guy with a 3.3/28 who got in because he had a lot of great letters and clinical exposure. At some schools it means a lot, at others it doesn't.

But you have much better numbers than a 3.8/34, and I don't know if that would have made a difference in this case or not. Seeing as how you are more interested in top 20 type schools anyway, I wouldn't be worried...you are in great shape.

 

[AlternateSome1]

If i remember correctly, Karen has a 39 or higher on her mcat, so she probably won't have much of a problem.

Karen,
This seems like something you've worked very hard for, so I would think you'd want to try to get just a little bit more clinical experience if at all possible. Is there any way you can shadow a Dr for a little while? I think that is a lot more useful than volunteering at a hospital where you end up doing a lot of paperwork. Just my two cents...good luck.

~AS1~

 

[cather]

Karen, why don't you just volunteer for one hour to two hours a week at a nursing home or senior center? That's health-related experience, I think. I volunteered at a senior center and loved it. People at nursing homes and senior centers love to have volunteers come help out.

Volunteering in a hospital can be a pain because you have to go through the bureaucratic paperwork and training, then when you get to your shift, you really might not be doing much of anything. It sounds like the nearest hospital is an hour away, which would be a pain to get to.

Really, what you may want to consider is volunteering in a doctor's office or just helping at a nursing home. Just simplify. You don't have to volunteer in the hospital.

 

[Amy B]

Free health clinic is the way to go. I know of a number of people who had 35+ on their MCAT and 4.0 GPA and were turned down due to no health care experiances.

I would really try to find the time. It is REALLY, REALLY important!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[calcrew14]

I am not sure if it is appropriate to require or give too much credits for clinical experiences. Any clinical experience without preceding exposure to adequate preclinical subjects (basic sicenes such as Anatomy, Physiology, Pathollogy ....etc) should only qualify someone as a layman or a quack. If it was that important, why do not medical schools just start the first one or two months with a prelude interval of some intensive clinical exposure.

So is my opinion in researches. Those research schools may want to take advantage of some of those experiences. (I do not see anything wrong with that.)

Clinical experieces that count are the ones that come in the last two years of the medical schools and I do not need any preadmitting research experiences to become a family practice back in my home town or another place that need me, do I?

Only a few of those research and clinical experiences make someone more unigue, I think. (I do not have any opinion about volunteering and other EC's though.)

 

[zinjanthropus]

what?

 

[canadagirl]

calcrew, the point of premed clinical experience is not to teach you how to be a doctor! It's so that you have the opportunity to see what it's like to be in the clinic, and see if you enjoy it. If you've never spent any time in a clinical situation, then how can you possible know that you want to spend the rest of your life in clinical situations?

That said, I think (personally) that you should be able to substitute any experience that teaches you the things above. E.g. I bet someone who has dealt with any kind of chronic illness personally or in a family member would know as much or more about what doctors really do than someone who has folded sheets, filed, made coffee, etc, at a hospital... You just need to convince the adcoms that you know why you want to be a doctor!

 

[spinestudent]

I pretty much agree with all the advice here, but just want to remind everyone that some allopathic schools do say it is strongly preferred that one of your lor's be from a physician. Without any clinical experience or shadowing this would be hard to get. Some schools(including most top 20 schools) either don't care or prefer that you only send the required academic letters. It all depends on the school......

 

[28129]

Clinical experience is there for a reason.

It's there because the general American public has an extremely warped perception of what health careers are like, largely one based on crap they see on TV.

Even extremely educated people are quite ignorant about what a doctor's work and life are like.

That's why clinical experience is important, because if you do have misconceptions about medicine, they will show through easily in your essays and during your interviews. There's nothing worse than somebody who doesn't know what they're getting into.

 

[calcrew14]

canadagirl, that's exactly the reason I mentioned in the ps. I knew that I had to go with the flow. I have some volunteer hours in a hospital and doctor's office but no research experience at all.

I forgot to mention that Harvard and UCSF even offered an inteview to someone (not me) who had no research in experience at all. Why? Probably diversification? (That person had very good clinical experiences, though.) Anyway, Stanford rejected that person presecondarily only to matriculate another sub 30 applicant with extensive research experiences.

When 50% of the applicants are matriculated, may be they should apply this sophisticated application procedure only to those who desire a custom service and let those not too unique applicants take turn spinning the wheel of fortune. There is no need to make it more 50/50 than reality.

And having said that, I am going to refrain from making any thing more complicated than what it is from now on.

Everyone loves to go to a medical school. There are lot of choices after graduation. You don't even have to deal with any patient if you don't want too. Don't forget to mention that in the interview!

 

[luckyzero]

^^^ Huh?!?!?

 

[CaMD]

I agree that clinical experience is very very important. You need to prove that you know what you're getting in to.
Obviously one can debate how much volunteering a few hours a week as a this or as a that really tells you about the profession, but I think it's helpful and that its a wise requirement for med schools to have.

I'm curious to know how much clinical experience everyone has.
And how do you define light vs moderate vs lots when deciding how strong a candidate you are?

 

[DD214_DOC]

All of us have busy lives and we still managed to do it, so stop bitching and go get some clinical experience.