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[Pharmd_rxrx]

i LOL when i see older pharmacists complaining. You have been working over a decade and you still are struggling financially? You mean you came out of school with 150k offers and minimal debt and youre still struggling & blaming new grads? All the money you could have invested? You could have started your own indy pharmacy and made bank just filling scripts & your lazy behind sat behind a counter in retail until it dried up? Its hard not to laugh in their face when they complain. That is YOUR fault. I dont feel bad for them at all.
- these pharmacists are usually 15 years out!
Just something i thought id admit.

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[JustFillIt]

Oh snap! Today is heavy on the drama!

 

[Pharmd_rxrx]

Oh snap! Today is heavy on the drama!

Im TIRED of them fixing their lips to complain lol

 

[JustFillIt]

Im TIRED of them fixing their lips to complain lol

I know dude. Those turkeys!

 

[BMBiology]

When I worked as an intern, I met a lot of pharmacists with a broken soul. I told myself then I would never work in retails.

Pharmacists complain because it is like a stress reliever...just like what you are doing right now. Retail sucks and sooner or later, it will crush you.

I certainly don’t feel bad for pharmacists who have worked for the last 15 years and still need to go full speed ahead. I also don’t feel bad for new graduates. At least these older pharmacists need to work extra hard to get accepted. Admission was competitive back then. Now it is a big joke.

 

[BMBiology]

You have been working over a decade and you still are struggling financially? You mean you came out of school with 150k offers and minimal debt and youre still struggling & blaming new grads?.

Let’s be clear here. Tuition back then wasn’t cheap. Everyone and their mom wanted to go to pharmacy school. It was extremely competitive, not like today. I know plenty of pharmacists who graduated with more than $200 k. New pharmacists back then were not being paid $150 k...more like $120 k. You also forgot the housing crisis and the Great Recession. Many pharmacists also got caught in the housing bubble and are still paying for it.

Did pharmacist back then have it better? Sure but many of the new graduates today wouldn’t have gotten accepted back then. They would still be washing test tubes for a living.

 

[Pharmd_rxrx]

When I worked as an intern, I met a lot of pharmacists with a broken soul. I told myself then I would never work in retails.

Pharmacists complain because it is like a stress reliever...just like what you are doing right now. Retail sucks and sooner or later, it will crush you.

I certainly don’t feel bad for pharmacists who have worked for the last 15 years and still need to go full speed ahead. I also don’t feel bad for new graduates. At least these older pharmacists need to work extra hard to get accepted. Admission was competitive back then. Now it is a big joke.

I dont feel bad for anyone. I personally dont plan on being in retail long enough to allow it to “crush” me. Its seed money to get me to where i really want to be. They just always talk about how they had it so well and then complain like they havent had all the time in the world to get their stuff together. They should have been investing or being smart with their money, PERIOD. They complain all day as if its not their fault they allowed retail to crush them. But dont mind me. Just thought id get that off my chest.

 

[Older pharmacist]

Let’s be clear here. Tuition back then wasn’t cheap. Everyone and their mom wanted to go to pharmacy school. It was extremely competitive, not like today. I know plenty of pharmacists who graduated with more than $200 k. New pharmacists back then were not being paid $150 k...more like $120 k. You also forgot the housing crisis and the Great Recession. Many pharmacists also got caught in the housing bubble and are still paying for it.

Did pharmacist back then have it better? Sure but many of the new graduates today wouldn’t have gotten accepted back then. They would still be washing test tubes for a living.

Well,,,,many of us started at $40 k, which was about what an engineer made at the time. The salaries didn’t get “good” until late 1990’s.

 

[Pharmd_rxrx]

Well,,,,many of us started at $40 k, which was about what an engineer made at the time. The salaries didn’t get “good” until late 1990’s.

Late 1990s is still almost 2 decades ...

 

[Pharmd_rxrx]

This is specifically for the older pharmacists i encounter complaining ALL the time. Endlessly. Slowly filling scripts. Complaining. Opening SDN and Reddit everyday. Complaining. Wake up mad. Go to bed mad. Rinse. Repeat. Those are who this is aimed at.

 

[Thoughtfulsinner]

This is specifically for the older pharmacists i encounter complaining ALL the time. Endlessly. Slowly filling scripts. Complaining. Opening SDN and Reddit everyday. Complaining. Wake up mad. Go to bed mad. Rinse. Repeat. Those are who this is aimed at.

99.9% of pharmacists don't visit this message board every few hours and whine about their lives. This forum represents a needle in a haystack of pharms.

 

[projektreverb]

Well,,,,many of us started at $40 k, which was about what an engineer made at the time. The salaries didn’t get “good” until late 1990’s.

40k in 1995 equates to ~67k in 2019, adjusted for inflation. Let’s compare apples to apples.

 

[Xenophylia]

My complaining is mostly about the people who made my retail life more difficult- middle management. I can look back at that portion of my career and laugh now. Pharmacists were always resented by the company I worked for as we often times made more $$$ than the store manager. No one within the hierarchy of the store really understood what we did. It was a grocery store chain, and the probably wouldn't have had pharmacies at all were it not for the fact that their perceived competition had them. They attempted to imitate any ideas of their competitors. But they hated the idea of pharmacies and never really supported that part of the business...

 

[Xenophylia]

I am counting the years till I can ditch pharmacy all together and am more than ready to jump ship as soon as I'm able. But that being said, there are definitely more "tolerable" aspects of pharmacy than retail. The major chains have turned retail into a joke and I'm pretty certain there is no coming back from its current state. When I see people applying to pharmacy school and ignoring the advice the veterans here give them I just shake my head. If only they knew the reality of what they're doing with their lives.....

 

[debtfreee2019]

i LOL when i see older pharmacists complaining. You have been working over a decade and you still are struggling financially? You mean you came out of school with 150k offers and minimal debt and youre still struggling & blaming new grads? All the money you could have invested? You could have started your own indy pharmacy and made bank just filling scripts & your lazy behind sat behind a counter in retail until it dried up? Its hard not to laugh in their face when they complain. That is YOUR fault. I dont feel bad for them at all.
- these pharmacists are usually 15 years out!
Just something i thought id admit.

-rph has high tax bracket.
-live and travel luxuriously
-people assume we're millionaire so we have act generously
-saving money is an issue for some rphs
-mortgage, kid's tuitions, fancy clothes, board fines, family members to support, make bad investments
-rph dont make over 200k with regular work hours
-you will become one of these rphs one day.

 

[PharmDBro2017]

-rph has high tax bracket.
-live and travel luxuriously
-people assume we're millionaire so we have act generously
-saving money is an issue for some rphs
-mortgage, kid's tuitions, fancy clothes, board fines, family members to support, make bad investments
-rph dont make over 200k with regular work hours
-you will become one of these
rphs one day.

Weak excuses and poor planning is all that is.

Anyone with basic financial literacy & 10 years into their pharmd career should have a very good foundation built. There's no need to keep up with the Joneses, travelling luxuriously, etc. Spend below your means, max your tax-deferred retirement accounts 401k/403b, HSA, backdoor roth, attack your higher interest rate debts, then attack your mortgage. 10-15 years in, your net worth will be looking good.

 

[xupura]

This is specifically for the older pharmacists i encounter complaining ALL the time. Endlessly. Slowly filling scripts. Complaining. Opening SDN and Reddit everyday. Complaining. Wake up mad. Go to bed mad. Rinse. Repeat. Those are who this is aimed at.

How do you know that it's not just Modest_anteater pretending to be a cranky old pharmacist? haha
SDN/Reddit is a cesspool of miserable pharmacists (or people who actively pretend to be miserable pharmacists).

I pretend to be a miserable pharmacist at my workplace, because the techs are always complaining about some issue with their child's behavioral issues or being broke or having issues that stems from coasting through life.

When I get together with my pharmacist friends this talk never happens. We always discuss where we went on vacation, how the kids are doing in school, who started a business, etc. It's a better quality of conversation that you'll never get on an internet message board.

Moral of the story: find better friends.

 

[rxkrafted]

I work with a lot of older pharmacists (> 15 years experience) and they are satisfied with their finances. The much older pharmacists in their 60s that I know don't live a lavish lifestyle and they used their years to invest. Some have plans to retire as they have well over a million in retirement funds and multiple real estate properties. One thing I learned right after graduation is to payoff my loans ASAP before starting a family to free up my income and to be live below my means comfortably so I can build wealth. I still don't understand how my classmates were able to buy brand new cars and homes a year after graduation.

 

[WVUPharm2007]

No idea where OP got $150k for 2004. 15 years ago, they were only making like $85k.

 

[Pharmd_rxrx]

99.9% of pharmacists don't visit this message board every few hours and whine about their lives. This forum represents a needle in a haystack of pharms.

True. Just wish the morale would change.

How do you know that it's not just Modest_anteater pretending to be a cranky old pharmacist? haha
SDN/Reddit is a cesspool of miserable pharmacists (or people who actively pretend to be miserable pharmacists).

I pretend to be a miserable pharmacist at my workplace, because the techs are always complaining about some issue with their child's behavioral issues or being broke or having issues that stems from coasting through life.

When I get together with my pharmacist friends this talk never happens. We always discuss where we went on vacation, how the kids are doing in school, who started a business, etc. It's a better quality of conversation that you'll never get on an internet message board.

Moral of the story: find better friends.

lmao i have friends and im happy! It just sucks when i get on here and the same older pharmacists are complaining day in and out. (Post history tells you they are older) but like i said ... dont mind me.

 

[Pharmd_rxrx]

No idea where OP got $150k for 2004. 15 years ago, they were only making like $85k.

Still a lot of money and barely any school debt. They created the situation they are in today. Lmao but dont mind me.

 

[Pharmd_rxrx]

I work with a lot of older pharmacists (> 15 years experience) and they are satisfied with their finances. The much older pharmacists in their 60s that I know don't live a lavish lifestyle and they used their years to invest. Some have plans to retire as they have well over a million in retirement funds and multiple real estate properties. One thing I learned right after graduation is to payoff my loans ASAP before starting a family to free up my income and to be live below my means comfortably so I can build wealth. I still don't understand how my classmates were able to buy brand new cars and homes a year after graduation.

Those are my type. The ones i work with are always complaining! Can hardly get any financial advice from them :/

 

[wagrxm2000]

Hmm new account and modest anteater liked it.

As a 15+ pharmacist, we didn't come here for the money like all these new grads. We planned on this being a job until 65.

They complain because of what pharmacy has become and it wasn't what they had planned. We had no plans on becoming multimillionaires just doing the job and supporting our family.

We came here to be pharmacists. So while you don't hear me complaining, I have adapted, others have not.

 

[King2440]

I work with a lot of older pharmacists (> 15 years experience) and they are satisfied with their finances. The much older pharmacists in their 60s that I know don't live a lavish lifestyle and they used their years to invest. Some have plans to retire as they have well over a million in retirement funds and multiple real estate properties. One thing I learned right after graduation is to payoff my loans ASAP before starting a family to free up my income and to be live below my means comfortably so I can build wealth. I still don't understand how my classmates were able to buy brand new cars and homes a year after graduation.

Depends what you define as quality in life. Is it just a number next to your bank account or student loan account? Or is it investments In yourself, getting married, having kids, traveling the world and experiencing it?

My wife and I chose the latter; we may not have paid off our loans in 2-3 years but we are chipping away and checking the boxes while we are at it. It all depends on the individual. However, I do agree that a “brand” name car is a huge waste of money. What joy/good does that bring to you?

Also keep note of the real estate market. Specifically in a north Texas, the market is going up continuously with folks moving here.

 

[Pharmd_rxrx]

-rph has high tax bracket.
-live and travel luxuriously
-people assume we're millionaire so we have act generously
-saving money is an issue for some rphs
-mortgage, kid's tuitions, fancy clothes, board fines, family members to support, make bad investments
-rph dont make over 200k with regular work hours
-you will become one of these rphs one day.

LOL i dont plan on staying in pharmacy that long to allow it to make me that way. Im merely using the money i make as seed money. My friends that are already pharmacists in retail think the same way (seed money) & are happy. Some have already opened businesses and dont let the retail job get to them because it is just a source of funding. I refuse to stand behind a counter mad everyday because i have made that my only source of income.

 

[Pharmd_rxrx]

Hmm new account and modest anteater liked it.

As a 15+ pharmacist, we didn't come here for the money like all these new grads. We planned on this being a job until 65.

They complain because of what pharmacy has become and it wasn't what they had planned. We had no plans on becoming multimillionaires just doing the job and supporting our family.

We came here to be pharmacists. So while you don't hear me complaining, I have adapted, others have not.

Makes sense. I completely understand. I guess Ive always knew corporate was trash when i started but that wasnt long ago. It sucks indeed but if i was an RPh back then, i would have opened my own pharmacy. Indys still have the traditional laid back pharmacy environment to this day. But a lot of new grads dont plan on being in pharmacy long so thats prob why most of us have a different perspective.
I truly hope retail, community pharmacy changes for the better one day.

 

[WVUPharm2007]

Still a lot of money and barely any school debt. They created the situation they are in today. Lmao but dont mind me.

I graduated in 2008 and had $120k of debt. And I started at $42.88/hr. The people that graduated a few years before me aren't that much different than today.

Sure, it was easier to get a job. But let's not exaggerate here and pretend that they came out with no debt and $150k jobs, because they didn't.

 

[Old]

40k in 1995 equates to ~67k in 2019, adjusted for inflation. Let’s compare apples to apples.

I started at $7.50 per hour after being licensed for a small independent in a small town. Pharmacy didn't always pay the money it pays now. So The statements that older pharmacists didn't invest well and you are much smarter than they are because you are saving so much. Try recalculating and actually look at what the "older pharmacists" made per hour until recently.

My opinion is the new grads are getting a real slap in the face because their life and profession is not what the professors promised them. They don't understand the famous "White Coat Ceremony" means absolutely nothing in the real world. If someone is bitching its them. Take the money when you can as you will be replaced by cheaper younger pharms, remote verification or tech check tech. One pharmacy call, one doctor call, one drive up call.... Were the constant phone calls part of the clinical rotations of today?

 

[rxkrafted]

Depends what you define as quality in life. Is it just a number next to your bank account or student loan account? Or is it investments In yourself, getting married, having kids, traveling the world and experiencing it?

My wife and I chose the latter; we may not have paid off our loans in 2-3 years but we are chipping away and checking the boxes while we are at it. It all depends on the individual. However, I do agree that a “brand” name car is a huge waste of money. What joy/good does that bring to you?

Also keep note of the real estate market. Specifically in a north Texas, the market is going up continuously with folks moving here.

I am not saying you should sacrifice a lot where it would affect your quality of life in order to pay off loans but it is important to have a good balance and to be patient. I was trying to point out that a lot of new grads nowadays usually blow a lot of their money on materialistic things to "treat" themselves for graduating and forget about their loans. Then they go out and get a mortgage on a new home and stack loans on top of loans. I'm just saying you can always sacrifice a little now while enjoying life at the same time. Having extra money freed up earlier on will give you more opportunities to splurge on your family and also you would have more PTOs saved up to take those month long vacations with family.

 

[projektreverb]

I started at $7.50 per hour after being licensed for a small independent in a small town. Pharmacy didn't always pay the money it pays now. So The statements that older pharmacists didn't invest well and you are much smarter than they are because you are saving so much. Try recalculating and actually look at what the "older pharmacists" made per hour until recently.

My opinion is the new grads are getting a real slap in the face because their life and profession is not what the professors promised them. They don't understand the famous "White Coat Ceremony" means absolutely nothing in the real world. If someone is bitching its them. Take the money when you can as you will be replaced by cheaper younger pharms, remote verification or tech check tech. One pharmacy call, one doctor call, one drive up call.... Were the constant phone calls part of the clinical rotations of today?

I never said anything about old pharmacists not investing well or any of the other stuff you said. My sole objection was comparing 40k in 90s dollars to today’s numbers. But hey! Since were doing that, my great grandpa made 5$ a day working for Ford!! Would you look at that!!

 

[BMBiology]

Still a lot of money and barely any school debt. They created the situation they are in today. Lmao but dont mind me.

Why do you keep on saying they didn’t have much student loan?

Don’t worry too much about them. You will be in a much worse situation. Let’s see how bitter you will be then.

 

[BMBiology]

LOL i dont plan on staying in pharmacy that long to allow it to make me that way. Im merely using the money i make as seed money. My friends that are already pharmacists in retail think the same way (seed money) & are happy. Some have already opened businesses and dont let the retail job get to them because it is just a source of funding. I refuse to stand behind a counter mad everyday because i have made that my only source of income.

If you are that good at business, then why did you borrowed bags of money to go into an already saturated profession? Doesn’t seem like a good business decision to me.

 

[OmiPharmD]

Well,,,,many of us started at $40 k, which was about what an engineer made at the time. The salaries didn’t get “good” until late 1990’s.

As a new grad I started at $46k in the 90s - hospital position. My spouse made about 10k more in retail.

No complaints here. We had 100k in student loans between us and got massive raises early on in our careers thanks to the pharmacist shortage.

 

[Pharmd_rxrx]

Why do you keep on saying they didn’t have much student loan?

Don’t worry too much about them. You will be in a much worse situation. Let’s see how bitter you will be then.

LOL i have a low amt of debt compared to most grads. Not bitter at all. I actually worked in a pharmacy prior to going to pharmacy school so im not in for a surprise. The one that gradated almost 2 decades ago def did not have as much loans but go on. Dont mind me.

 

[Pharmd_rxrx]

As a new grad I started at $46k in the 90s - hospital position. My spouse made about 10k more in retail.

No complaints here. We had 100k in student loans between us and got massive raises early on in our careers thanks to the pharmacist shortage.

These are the situations im talking about. The last thing i would do is complain if i had this situation. This is great, Keep making your money!

 

[Pharmd_rxrx]

If you are that good at business, then why did you borrowed bags of money to go into an already saturated profession? Doesn’t seem like a good business decision to me.

... Never said i was good in business. Its all gonna be a learning curve. Gotta have money to make money. Not that much in debt - also not worried about it. Pharmacy definitely wont be my only bag (dont plan on staying in pharmacy long). But again. Dont mind me.

 

[stevephhs016]

Graduated in 2009, started at $50, 6 figures of debt, 10 years of retail. Now ready for FIRE. Just feel bad for yall new grads...

 

[BMBiology]

... Never said i was good in business. Its all gonna be a learning curve. Gotta have money to make money. Not that much in debt - also not worried about it. Pharmacy definitely wont be my only bag (dont plan on staying in pharmacy long). But again. Dont mind me.

I love how some people try to impress others by saying they are starting a “business”? You do know anyone can start a business nowadays right? It is easy and cheat but the problem is everyone can start a business nowadays. So, what makes you different? What are you offering that others are not?

 

[Pharmd_rxrx]

Graduated in 2009, started at $50, 6 figures of debt, 10 years of retail. Now ready for FIRE. Just feel bad for yall new grads...

I guess. Its all in how you handle your money. Most people that graduated in your time still arent ready for FIRE lol ... i feel bad for them.

 

[Pharmd_rxrx]

I love how some people try to impress others by saying they are starting a “business”? You do know anyone can start a business nowadays right? It is easy and cheat but the problem is everyone can start a business nowadays. So, what makes you different? What are you offering that others are not?

Yes i know anybody can start a business. You asked all this as if i didnt already know this info. As if you know what kind of entrepreneurship im getting into. But have your own opinions. Do you. Always. Dont mind me.

 

[Pharmd_rxrx]

Some of yall are so miserable. Man. Its sad.

 

[BMBiology]

I guess. Its all in how you handle your money. Most people that graduated in your time still arent ready for FIRE lol ... i feel bad for them.

You have not done anything yet. Why don’t you retire in 10 years then come back and tell us how you did it.

 

[mentos]

I guess. Its all in how you handle your money. Most people that graduated in your time still arent ready for FIRE lol ... i feel bad for them.

You should feel fortunate that you are young and healthy with no financial responsibility for your parents or relatives. I know it's hard to think of anyone besides yourself at your age, but some of us take care of our parents or have kids to raise.

 

[Dred Pirate]

Let’s be clear here. Tuition back then wasn’t cheap. Everyone and their mom wanted to go to pharmacy school. It was extremely competitive, not like today. I know plenty of pharmacists who graduated with more than $200 k. New pharmacists back then were not being paid $150 k...more like $120 k. You also forgot the housing crisis and the Great Recession. Many pharmacists also got caught in the housing bubble and are still paying for it.

Did pharmacist back then have it better? Sure but many of the new graduates today wouldn’t have gotten accepted back then. They would still be washing test tubes for a living.

data point - I graduated in 2003 - owed 115k, first job in BFE/hard to staff area = 85k, so ya, at least get your numbers right. I lost 30k on a house in the housing bubble, which is peanuts compared to what some of my friends in other areas lost.

As far as competitiveness? I had 3.9 undegrad GPA with a bio degree. Scored in the 99 percentile on PCATs. Applied to 4 schools, got into 3 - I mean I was denied to one school with those numbers - I don't see that happening much now days.

I am in no way complaining, but you have to have the facts man

 

[Pharmd_rxrx]

Last thing ill say ...
Things seemed to be misread.
I never said you had to retire after a decade in pharmacy. You making pharmacist money not medicine money. I said you should be financially stable after working for over a decade. You are in the top 8% of salaries and youre walking around complaining. Youve had over a decade to save for rainy days and should have been actively following the profession to prepare for the saturation you hate and complain about so much. Stop complaining every waking moment and find your way out.
Good luck.