Chances of getting an internship 5 yrs from now for different aussie schools

[wugui]

I'm a US citizen applying to aussie med schools this yr.
I'd love to to stay in oz if I get the chance.
Can you estimate the probability of getting internship 5 yrs from now for the following schools?
Feel free to add more schools.

UQ
UQ-oshner (does doing most of your rotations in the US diminish your aussie internship chances?)
USyd
Flinders

Thanks!

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[Phloston]

That's really a question that no one can answer for you because the figures are constantly changing. If you're from the USA and want to stay in Australia, plan to sit the USMLE regardless. In terms of schools you'd be applying to in Australia, you'd probably have the best shot at Aussie internship if you go to UMelbourne, since that's the highest ranked med school here in Australia. I'm currently at UQ. Melbourne had had a gap year during the year that I applied, but if I could go back in time, I would definitely have chosen to go to UMelbourne or USyd, not UQ.

 

[Transition]

ranking means nothing.

ignore phloston, he spews a lot of garbage information/personal attacks with little evidence behind it.

do the research yourself and you'll see that, firstly, there is no ranking in australia for medical schools (there are worldwide research rankings, but that has NOTHING to do with medical school teaching or perception). Secondly, internships are handed out in a non-merit basis, they are given in a random allocation based on preferences and residency/interstate status.

Read the "Warning" thread I just bumped for a realistic approach to the situation in making a decision for yourself. Trust only yourself and do the research on your own. After all, it's a $250K+ wager along with the possibility of having a medical career that's dead before it's had it's first breath. Big gamble, but again, your choice and your money. Just be wary of misinformation from people like phloston.

 

[Medstart108]

I can only comment on medical school rankings. Medicine is the opposite of Business in terms of reptuation vs licensing. In Business, its all about your business school rep. A top business school grad can potentially work anywhere in the world based on his school's rep rather than whether or not its been accredited by the world MBA bodies. Whereas a top medical school grad can work wherever he/she's licensed. Being a Cambridge medical grad won't entitle you to skip the USMLEs.

However, if you do go to a world famous school and realistically, this would probably only include Oxbridge and possibly some of the other top medical schools, this might help you slightly. It won't make a big difference and you certainly can't use it as a crutch.

Either way. If you go to Australia, make sure you are willing to put in the hard work and effort to apply back to the US. You might get to stay in Australia, but the chances are variable (your future is in the hands of politicians not yourself, do you want to bet on the whims of politicians?). Since you are a US citizen, it might make it easier to return and u don't have to believe all the hype about no residency spots.

They will continue to take very qualified high USMLE scoring IMGs in primary care fields. No you won't have a shot at Mass Gen, NY Pres or Cedars Sinai. You also probably won't have a shot at competitive specialties, but if you want something in primary care, don't mind hard work, then yes pursue medical education abroad.

 

[shan564]

To answer the OP's question - Flinders. South Australia is the only state last year that was able to provide internships for all of their students and still have some left over for students from other states in their regular allocation cycle. We don't know much about what will happen in 5 years, but based on what we do know, I'd think that Flinders would give you the best shot.

Also, I met a few Flinders students at a rotation in Alice Springs, and I have to say that their knowledge/skills were no different from an average USyd student.

ranking means nothing.

...

do the research yourself and you'll see that, firstly, there is no ranking in australia for medical schools (there are worldwide research rankings, but that has NOTHING to do with medical school teaching or perception).

I agree that medical school rankings are mostly meaningless, and that's no more/less true in Australia than anywhere else in the world.

That said, there is a benefit to "top research schools" aside from the obvious benefit to researchers. The top research institutions tend to attract top faculty members who are interested in academic medicine and are committed to teaching/research. Learning from these people can be an amazing experience.

Still, I'm sure that Flinders probably has plenty of top faculty. Not sure if I can say the same about some of the newer private med schools in Australia. Some of those students seem to be way less impressive than the people I've met from Flinders or UNSW or other top public schools. Of course, I'm sure there are plenty of exceptions.

I can only comment on medical school rankings. Medicine is the opposite of Business in terms of reptuation vs licensing. In Business, its all about your business school rep. A top business school grad can potentially work anywhere in the world based on his school's rep rather than whether or not its been accredited by the world MBA bodies. Whereas a top medical school grad can work wherever he/she's licensed. Being a Cambridge medical grad won't entitle you to skip the USMLEs.

However, if you do go to a world famous school and realistically, this would probably only include Oxbridge and possibly some of the other top medical schools, this might help you slightly. It won't make a big difference and you certainly can't use it as a crutch.

Either way. If you go to Australia, make sure you are willing to put in the hard work and effort to apply back to the US. You might get to stay in Australia, but the chances are variable (your future is in the hands of politicians not yourself, do you want to bet on the whims of politicians?). Since you are a US citizen, it might make it easier to return and u don't have to believe all the hype about no residency spots.

They will continue to take very qualified high USMLE scoring IMGs in primary care fields. No you won't have a shot at Mass Gen, NY Pres or Cedars Sinai. You also probably won't have a shot at competitive specialties, but if you want something in primary care, don't mind hard work, then yes pursue medical education abroad.

I agree with your post in principle, but after going through the residency interview trail in the US, it was pretty clear that they generally considered my background to be comparable to any American grad. I don't know if that's because I came from Australia or because I came from USyd (even though it's not Oxford, it still has name recognition just because of the word "Sydney") or both. Although I did have one interviewer (department chair at Mayo) specifically tell me that he made time to talk to me because I came from USyd, since he is very familiar with many of the researchers there (including the department head at my hospital).

 

[rayjay]

Although I did have one interviewer (department chair at Mayo) specifically tell me that he made time to talk to me because I came from USyd, since he is very familiar with many of the researchers there (including the department head at my hospital).

Well that's good to hear! Makes me kind of regret my Flinders decision
Nah I chose Flinders for the reasons to mentioned above. That being said, those reasons could become a moot point in the coming years, so keep that in mind.

Also some food for thought is a recent article by the MJA that is worth reading and definitely food for thought for any international that is optimistic about internship positions because of states like Victoria. It was only a matter of time before someone brought this to light.

https://www.mja.com.au/journal/2013/198/5/emerging-inequality-and-potential-unconstitutionality-case-reform-intern-priority

 

[DoccoDoc]

There is no way to predict your chances of getting an internship if you go to an Australian medical school. A good number of medical schools have opened up in the last several years, and currently open medical schools have increased the number of student spaces, but internship spaces have remained relatively static.

Also if you want to return to North America, matching as an IMG has become an uphill battle. There is no way to predict what will happen in the next five years.

 

[pitman]

A good number of medical schools have opened up in the last several years, and currently open medical schools have increased the number of student spaces, but internship spaces have remained relatively static.

I wouldn't agree that internship spaces here have been static. They have essentially kept up to pace with the growth in graduates here, which numbers are now stabilizing (see graph).

I think this coming year will help determine the ultimate outcome of whether there will be spots -- if the political will is there to maintain last year's funding levels, then virtually all will have an internship spot for the foreseeable future.