Chances of getting an appeal for academic dismissal

[staying with faith]

Hello,
I was recently academically dismissed from a psy d program due to getting two C's in one semester. Prior to that I had one additional C and no D or F. The reason behind me getting the two C's in one semester is due to a recent death in my family and I was sick was sick with sinnitus and hives, which according to doctors lead time to have brain fog. I also was placed on four different medication for the sinnitus and hives which I had allergic reaction and nervous side effects such as confusion, blurred vision and added anxiety. I I have hired an eduction attorney to write me an appeal letter in regards to the dismissal in order to be reinstated in school. What are the chances of me getting back reinstated? I only have one semester left of school and I have already done 4 years of graduate school up to this point. I am so scared and worried and advice would help thanks .

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[erg923]

Hello,
I was recently academically dismissed from a psy d program due to getting two C's in one semester. Prior to that I had one additional C and no D or F. The reason behind me getting the two C's in one semester is due to a recent death in my family and I was sick was sick with sinnitus and hives, which according to doctors lead time to have brain fog. I also was placed on four different medication for the sinnitus and hives which I had allergic reaction and nervous side effects such as confusion, blurred vision and added anxiety. I I have hired an eduction attorney to write me an appeal letter in regards to the dismissal in order to be reinstated in school. What are the chances of me getting back reinstated? I only have one semester left of school and I have already done 4 years of graduate school up to this point. I am so scared and worried and advice would help thanks .

What does your graduate school program manual say in term of student rights/appeals, etc? Start there. The only thing you could possibly get here would anecdotal examples that may not apply to your specific situation.

 

[staying with faith]

What does your graduate school program manual say in term of student rights/appeals, etc? Start there. The only thing you could possibly get here would anecdotal examples that may not apply to your specific situation.

Thank you for your reply, it states to go up the chamber of command. Sadly the school is closed for holiday break.

 

[foreverbull]

Did you speak to your advisor or the training director in person in your program when you knew your grades would suffer or have you tried that route at all? In my grad program, when folks struggled with family deaths, divorce, and/or illness and they knew their academic performance would suffer significantly, they talked to their advisor first and usually things were resolved more informally (withdrawal from class, taking a semester off, etc.). I'm not as familiar with psyd programs and whether your program has that kind of open door policy, though.

If you've reached the dismissal phase, it sounds like informal attempts didn't work?

 

[staying with faith]

Did you speak to your advisor or the training director in person in your program when you knew your grades would suffer or have you tried that route at all? In my grad program, when folks struggled with family deaths, divorce, and/or illness and they knew their academic performance would suffer significantly, they talked to their advisor first and usually things were resolved more informally (withdrawal from class, taking a semester off, etc.). I'm not as familiar with psyd programs and whether your program has that kind of open door policy, though.

If you've reached the dismissal phase, it sounds like informal attempts didn't work?

Thanks for reply, I mentioned to my advisor that I was having anxiety and that I was having family issues. I was not aware though at the time that the condition was so debilitating because I was on medication. I have not been able to speak to the dean of students because after I got the dismissal letter, the school had closed for holiday break. Do you think the medical issue is enough to win an appeal?

 

[DynamicDidactic]

good luck. A lot of this will be decided on your program's rules/regulations and whether all the procedures were followed. Were you on academic probation with a jointly agreed upon plan to increase your grades? Were you below a certain GPA that the program requires students to maintain? What type of university are (were) you in? Those are the types of questions that will likely decide the issue.

 

[G Costanza]

I’d be surprised if you are dismissed because of a temporary medical concern. If you can back it up with documentation and are still dismissed, the school may be in violation of the Americans with Disabilities Act. See if you can do a medical withdrawal for the semester. Talk to the ombuds office if you don’t get anywhere with your advisor.

 

[staying with faith]

good luck. A lot of this will be decided on your program's rules/regulations and whether all the procedures were followed. Were you on academic probation with a jointly agreed upon plan to increase your grades? Were you below a certain GPA that the program requires students to maintain? What type of university are (were) you in? Those are the types of questions that will likely decide the issue.

Thanks for the reply, no I was not on academic probation prior. I am in a private university. Nope I was not below a certain GPA I just earned two C in one semester.

 

[staying with faith]

I’d be surprised if you are dismissed because of a temporary medical concern. If you can back it up with documentation and are still dismissed, the school may be in violation of the Americans with Disabilities Act. See if you can do a medical withdrawal for the semester. Talk to the ombuds office if you don’t get anywhere with your advisor.

Well the problem is I want to get a retroactive medical withdrawal meaning to change the grades on classes that I failed during my sick time. I do have documents were I've been to the gastrologist, allergist, hollestic and primary care doctor all for the allergys and brain fog issue. How would like get in trouble with the American with disabilities act? So your saying that it can be a possibility with my doctors letter and medical records I can be reinstated?

 

[staying with faith]

Well the problem is I want to get a retroactive medical withdrawal meaning to change the grades on classes that I failed during my sick time. I do have documents were I've been to the gastrologist, allergist, hollestic and primary care doctor all for the allergys and brain fog issue. How would like get in trouble with the American with disabilities act? So your saying that it can be a possibility with my doctors letter and medical records I can be reinstated?

Also how are allergist apart of the American with disabilities act? I'm just curious

 

[singasongofjoy]

I would work up the chain of command with the advisor, head of the department, ombuds office (or whatever the chain is in your department) before I start mentioning lawyers to the school. Be prepared with lots of documentation of your medical visits, letters documenting the effects of your difficulties, etc. I haven't got a clue how difficult it is to get a retroactive medical withdrawal for a semester, but maybe it is possible.

 

[PsyDr]

The ADA does not apply here.

1) because it’s an educational setting which is governed by different laws.

2) reasonable accommodations were not requested until after the fact.

 

[staying with faith]

I would work up the chain of command with the advisor, head of the department, ombuds office (or whatever the chain is in your department) before I start mentioning lawyers to the school. Be prepared with lots of documentation of your medical visits, letters documenting the effects of your difficulties, etc. I haven't got a clue how difficult it is to get a retroactive medical withdrawal for a semester, but maybe it is possible.

I agree I have not told the school about the lawyer, I am utilizing the chain of command and I suppose to send my appeal letter to the dean, I am using the lawyer to write the appeal letter because I need an effective one. Yes I will have my medical records along with evidence based research as well as a doctors note. Which I hope will work in my favor for getting reinstated in school.

 

[staying with faith]

The ADA does not apply here.

1) because it’s an educational setting which is governed by different laws.

2) reasonable accommodations were not requested until after the fact.

Yes that what I was asking because I was seeing how that would tie in together.

 

[G Costanza]

The ADA does not apply here.

1) because it’s an educational setting which is governed by different laws.

2) reasonable accommodations were not requested until after the fact.

1) That’s incorrect. Title II of ADA absolutely applies to universities regardless of federal funding. Why wouldn’t it?

2) I can think of several situations where someone may be incapable of requesting accommodations until it’s too late. Are you sure that’s true?

Here is a cite from our own APA on the issue:

Americans with Disabilities Act Basics

 

[G Costanza]

Also how are allergist apart of the American with disabilities act? I'm just curious

Because it applies to any medical condition that would reasonably impair one’s ability to function successfully as a student. If your allergist think it would, than you probably have a strong case. I mostly work with undergrads on this issue but I’m assuming the same expectations apply for grad students.

 

[str63]

When did you have the symptoms and over what period did it impact your ability in your coursework? What medication were you on? Did you talk with your professors or anyone at your school during this process/when you were struggling? Or is this going to be completely retroactive? You may struggle with an appeal if they knew nothing when this was occurring and/or you were performing poorly outside of time that was affected. However, if you made them aware of what was going on, requested reasonable accommodations and they did not give these to you, then I would suspect that you have a very strong case. Good luck!

 

[Justanothergrad]

This may be outside what OP is requesting information on, but earning C's in two different semesters in graduate school should also raise some flags suggesting a need for you to evaluate what you need to do differently. Unless your grading system is entirely different than graduate programs I have been associated with in various ways, repeatedly having failing grades suggests something problematic that is more than just transient and circumstantial.

 

[PsyDr]

1) That’s incorrect. Title II of ADA absolutely applies to universities regardless of federal funding. Why wouldn’t it?

2) I can think of several situations where someone may be incapable of requesting accommodations until it’s too late. Are you sure that’s true?

Here is a cite from our own APA on the issue:

Americans with Disabilities Act Basics

1) It’s a 504 issue.

2) Positive. In the educational setting both ada and 504 require a proactive identification as disabled and to provide documentation at their own expense. Hint: this didn’t happen here which makes the entire 504 vs ada thing not applicable.

 

[calimich]

anecdotal, however at the flagship R1 I worked at we (the counseling center) facilitated this kind if thing from time to time, in conjunction with the student disability office and the Dean of student affairs. I can remember at least two cases I was involved with where a retroactive withdrawal was granted without the disability being identified in advance. One was more physical (a serious car crash) the other more psychological (suicide of an immediate family member). In both cases we did not learn of the student's situation until after a few weeks had passed and they had already missed significant class time. While the U worked with the students, they would not allow classes to be selectively dropped (i.e., only drop the class with a C grade, keep the A class), rather the student had to withdraw (and retake) all that semester's courses.

At that U exceptions existed for these types of situations. I advise you to begin (if you haven't yet) collecting the appropriate documentation and sending emails asking for help and explaining the situation.

 

[G Costanza]

1) It’s a 504 issue.

2) Positive. In the educational setting both ada and 504 require a proactive identification as disabled and to provide documentation at their own expense. Hint: this didn’t happen here which makes the entire 504 vs ada thing not applicable.

1) I agree. Which falls under the ADA.

2) So if I acquired a TBI the day before a final exam (and failed the class), I wouldn’t be provided protection under the ADA? I also agree this is not the case with the OP but curious to hear people’s thoughts.

 

[staying with faith]

1) That’s incorrect. Title II of ADA absolutely applies to universities regardless of federal funding. Why wouldn’t it?

2) I can think of several situations where someone may be incapable of requesting accommodations until it’s too late. Are you sure that’s true?

Here is a cite from our own APA on the issue:

Americans with Disabilities Act Basics

Ok so help me understand so someone can be unable to report a disability because they are unable to. How?

 

[G Costanza]

anecdotal, however at the flagship R1 I worked at we (the counseling center) facilitated this kind if thing from time to time, in conjunction with the student disability office and the Dean of student affairs. I can remember at least two cases I was involved with where a retroactive withdrawal was granted without the disability being identified in advance. One was more physical (a serious car crash) the other more psychological (suicide of an immediate family member). In both cases we did not learn of the student's situation until after a few weeks had passed and they had already missed significant class time. While the U worked with the students, they would not allow classes to be selectively dropped (i.e., only drop the class with a C grade, keep the A class), rather the student had to withdraw (and retake) all that semester's courses.

At that U exceptions existed for these types of situations. I advise you to begin (if you haven't yet) collecting the appropriate documentation and sending emails asking for help and explaining the situation.

This has also been my experience and I’m probably working with these kinds of cases once a month or so. It has always been my understanding the university is required to offer this as an option for students because of the ADA. This was communicated to me through our legal team and our liaison for student disability services.

 

[staying with faith]

When did you have the symptoms and over what period did it impact your ability in your coursework? What medication were you on? Did you talk with your professors or anyone at your school during this process/when you were struggling? Or is this going to be completely retroactive? You may struggle with an appeal if they knew nothing when this was occurring and/or you were performing poorly outside of time that was affected. However, if you made them aware of what was going on, requested reasonable accommodations and they did not give these to you, then I would suspect that you have a very strong case. Good luck!

Well, I started having symptoms around the beginning of the semester when I had a family memeber pass away. My allergies got worse and I was on 4 different medication to help. Some of the profession were aware but I did not file a disability. I did not perform poorly prior to this.

 

[G Costanza]

Ok so help me understand so someone can be unable to report a disability because they are unable to. How?

Example: The day of a final exam you have a seizure and are hospitalized. It would be unreasonable that you had to report the disability before the course ended. A retroactive medical withdrawal (or incomplete) would have to be made available.

 

[G Costanza]

Well, I started having symptoms around the beginning of the semester when I had a family memeber pass away. My allergies got worse and I was on 4 different medication to help. Some of the profession were aware but I did not file a disability. I did not perform poorly prior to this.

Your best bet is to get documentation for all your visits to the doctor and perhaps a copy of the obituary (sorry for your loss). Meet with your advisor or dean and be ready to explain 1) What exactly happened that impacted your academics without being dramatic 2) What you tried to do to manage the problem 3) What your plan is so this never happens again going forward.

 

[calimich]

I'll also add at the U I mentioned above, students granted a retroactive withdrawal were required to take the subsequent semester off as well. The logic being since the medical issue was significant, and occurred late in the semester, the student likely needed significant time to recover. There was an appeal process to the "next semester off" rule, however it was rarely granted.

 

[PsyDr]

1) I agree. Which falls under the ADA.

2) So if I acquired a TBI the day before a final exam (and failed the class), I wouldn’t be provided protection under the ADA? I also agree this is not the case with the OP but curious to hear people’s thoughts.

1) Nope. 504 is part of the Rehabilitation Act, not the ADA. Predates the ada by a good amount.

2) Pretty much. You’d be f’ed under those laws. Your school or state would need to have some policy protecting against sudden illness. In educational settings both 504 and ada protect ACCESS to compete against other students, not the actual competition. The laws do not protect someone from retroactively saying their poor performance was due to an unknown illness or disability.

 

[MAClinician]

I'm slightly confused that the OP is saying there is only one semester left. What about internship? Was the OP applying this year to start for 2018-2019? If the OP is somehow successful in appealing the dismassal, how will he or she navigate the internship application process?

 

[staying with faith]

anecdotal, however at the flagship R1 I worked at we (the counseling center) facilitated this kind if thing from time to time, in conjunction with the student disability office and the Dean of student affairs. I can remember at least two cases I was involved with where a retroactive withdrawal was granted without the disability being identified in advance. One was more physical (a serious car crash) the other more psychological (suicide of an immediate family member). In both cases we did not learn of the student's situation until after a few weeks had passed and they had already missed significant class time. While the U worked with the students, they would not allow classes to be selectively dropped (i.e., only drop the class with a C grade, keep the A class), rather the student had to withdraw (and retake) all that semester's courses.

At that U exceptions existed for these types of situations. I advise you to begin (if you haven't yet) collecting the appropriate documentation and sending emails asking for help and explaining the situation.

Thank you for such a detail reply so I am still able to do this even though I have been dismissed for college? Yes I have been sending email but unfortunately the school is closed currently for holiday break. I have got the medical records, would a letter from the physician help as well?

 

[staying with faith]

Because it applies to any medical condition that would reasonably impair one’s ability to function successfully as a student. If your allergist think it would, than you probably have a strong case. I mostly work with undergrads on this issue but I’m assuming the same expectations apply for grad students.

So it would be a good idea to have my allergist write a letter as well

 

[PsyDr]

With no malice intended: if I were OP I would correct my spelling mistakes, get rid of the hollisitic provider stuff, and use a very conciliatory tone.

 

[staying with faith]

Example: The day of a final exam you have a seizure and are hospitalized. It would be unreasonable that you had to report the disability before the course ended. A retroactive medical withdrawal (or incomplete) would have to be made available.

Thank you for the example. I am just attempting to think how a retroactive withdrawal would work in my situation?

 

[staying with faith]

Your best bet is to get documentation for all your visits to the doctor and perhaps a copy of the obituary (sorry for your loss). Meet with your advisor or dean and be ready to explain 1) What exactly happened that impacted your academics without being dramatic 2) What you tried to do to manage the problem 3) What your plan is so this never happens again going forward.

Ok so this is still acceptable to do even after the academic dismissal? And if they ask why I didn't report it before grades?

 

[staying with faith]

I'll also add at the U I mentioned above, students granted a retroactive withdrawal were required to take the subsequent semester off as well. The logic being since the medical issue was significant, and occurred late in the semester, the student likely needed significant time to recover. There was an appeal process to the "next semester off" rule, however it was rarely granted.

Help me understand what you mean by an appeal process for the next semester off?

 

[staying with faith]

With no malice intended: if I were OP I would correct my spelling mistakes, get rid of the hollisitic provider stuff, and use a very conciliatory tone.

The spelling mistakes are the auto correct, why get rid of the holistic provider?

 

[staying with faith]

I'm slightly confused that the OP is saying there is only one semester left. What about internship? Was the OP applying this year to start for 2018-2019? If the OP is somehow successful in appealing the dismassal, how will he or she navigate the internship application process?

I only have one semester left of classes. Then off to internship in 2019. What do you mean by how will I navigate the internship application process?

 

[PsyDr]

The spelling mistakes are the auto correct, why get rid of the holistic provider?

Notice all the holistic physicians from Johnny Hopkins, Kennedy Krueger, Mayo, MGH, Yale, Cleveland, etc?

 

[G Costanza]

1) Nope. 504 is part of the Rehabilitation Act, not the ADA. Predates the ada by a good amount.

2) Pretty much. You’d be f’ed under those laws. Your school or state would need to have some policy protecting against sudden illness. In educational settings both 504 and ada protect ACCESS to compete against other students, not the actual competition. The laws do not protect someone from retroactively saying their poor performance was due to an unknown illness or disability.

Thank you for clarifying about the 504. So you’re saying that when students are granted a retroactive withdrawal without previously bringing up a concern, it’s a university policy (and perhaps not available at all universities) rather than a gov mandate?

 

[affectiveH3art]

I only have one semester left of classes. Then off to internship in 2019. What do you mean by how will I navigate the internship application process?

So did you apply for this cycle? This doesn’t make sense. So you have interviews? Will the department let you submit for the match if you aren’t currently enrolled?


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[staying with faith]

So did you apply for this cycle? This doesn’t make sense. So you have interviews? Will the department let you submit for the match if you aren’t currently enrolled?


Sent from my iPhone using SDN mobile app

I have not applied yet. I apply oct 2018 for 2019 internship. I can not do anything currently because I am dismissed from the program . I am attempting to get reinstated

 

[psych.meout]

I have not applied yet. I apply oct 2018 for 2019 internship. I can not do anything currently because I am dismissed from the program . I am attempting to get reinstated

I don't understand. If you only have one semester left (i.e., the upcoming spring 2018 semester), why would you apply for internship next fall? Why wouldn't you have already applied in the fall semester of your final year like everyone else does?

 

[staying with faith]

I don't understand. If you only have one semester left (i.e., the upcoming spring 2018 semester), why would you apply for internship next fall? Why wouldn't you have already applied in the fall semester of your final year like everyone else does?

I do not qualify to do internships this semester because according to school policy, I would need to purpose my doctoral project first

 

[psych.meout]

I do not qualify to do internships this semester because according to school policy, I would need to purpose my doctoral project first

It sounds like there is a lot more going on than your poor performance this semester when you were sick/grieving.

 

[str63]

As you are revealing more information, it does not sound like you'll have much of a case for an appeal. If your symptoms were around for the entire semester, the school could argue that you should have said something much earlier in the semester about needing accommodations. It sounds like you were not making adequate progress in the program on several separate occasions - a previous C in a course, not proposing a dissertation yet, and now 2 Cs in your courses. I think it may be difficult to argue that your performance was unusual given your academic history and that you didn't report anything for the semester.

I think you would've had a better case if the death and allergic reaction came at the end of the semester/during finals and you failed finals, which caused the C grades. I suppose you could try, but I don't think you'll have much on your side.

 

[staying with faith]

As you are revealing more information, it does not sound like you'll have much of a case for an appeal. If your symptoms were around for the entire semester, the school could argue that you should have said something much earlier in the semester about needing accommodations. It sounds like you were not making adequate progress in the program on several separate occasions - a previous C in a course, not proposing a dissertation yet, and now 2 Cs in your courses. I think it may be difficult to argue that your performance was unusual given your academic history and that you didn't report anything for the semester.

I think you would've had a better case if the death and allergic reaction came at the end of the semester/during finals and you failed finals, which caused the C grades. I suppose you could try, but I don't think you'll have much on your side.

Thank you for your reply, well hopefully with the 4 doctors note about how my cognition was a problem due to the sinus problem and the attorney handling the appeal letter will help me out.

 

[psych.meout]

As you are revealing more information, it does not sound like you'll have much of a case for an appeal. If your symptoms were around for the entire semester, the school could argue that you should have said something much earlier in the semester about needing accommodations. It sounds like you were not making adequate progress in the program on several separate occasions - a previous C in a course, not proposing a dissertation yet, and now 2 Cs in your courses. I think it may be difficult to argue that your performance was unusual given your academic history and that you didn't report anything for the semester.

I think you would've had a better case if the death and allergic reaction came at the end of the semester/during finals and you failed finals, which caused the C grades. I suppose you could try, but I don't think you'll have much on your side.

It sounds like from what other people have posted that it would not be impossible for OP to be given a retroactive medical withdrawal even if their problems began earlier in the semester and they did not notify anyone about before now. The caveat seems to be that they would have to withdraw from all classes this semester, even those in which they received As, and may even have to be on medical leave for all of next semester as well, so any forward progress in their program will be stymied until next fall.

Regardless, I'm in agreement with you that it sounds like their prior history of academic problems is going to at least complicate any dispensation they might receive. I don't know what the policies are in their program, but in mine, you automatically go on academic probation if you receive just one grade at or below B- and are dismissed from the program if you receive a second grade at these levels. It's kind of hard to imagine that OP wasn't already on probation for a previous C in a course before these medical and personal issues occurred.

 

[staying with faith]

Thank you for your reply, well hopefully with the 4 doctors note about how my cognition was a problem due to the sinus problem and the attorney handling the appeal letter will help me out.

Not to mention, doctor mentioned that it can occur at different times, which can make it unpredictable and the person would. It be aware of how it would affect them

 

[staying with faith]

It sounds like from what other people have posted that it would not be impossible for OP to be given a retroactive medical withdrawal even if their problems began earlier in the semester and they did not notify anyone about before now. The caveat seems to be that they would have to withdraw from all classes this semester, even those in which they received As, and may even have to be on medical leave for all of next semester as well, so any forward progress in their program will be stymied until next fall.

Regardless, I'm in agreement with you that it sounds like their prior history of academic problems is going to at least complicate any dispensation they might receive. I don't know what the policies are in their program, but in mine, you automatically go on academic probation if you receive just one grade at or below B- and are dismissed from the program if you receive a second grade at these levels. It's kind of hard to imagine that OP wasn't already on probation for a previous C in a course before these medical and personal issues occurred.

Nope I was not on academic probation because at my school you have to have below at 3.0 gpa. Even with my C I didn't have below a 3.0

 

[psych.meout]

Nope I was not on academic probation because at my school you have to have below at 3.0 gpa. Even with my C I didn't have below a 3.0

Wow, those are some high standards.

Is this a PsyD program?