Attrition rate

[canucker]

Hi,

Are there any stats on the attrition rate in Australian schools? I can't find any stats on the number of matriculants vs. the number of graduates 4 years later. Is it similar to the situation in N. American schools where it's quite difficult to fail out? Also, are repeat years (ie. holding students back) a common occurrence in Aus schools? Any info would be great.

Cheers, canucker

---

Members don't see this ad.

 

[FlindersGrad]

I don't know of any particular website for stats, however, from my experience the attrition rate in Australian med schools is fairly low. I went to Flinders Uni in SA and my class had about 80 students in it. The schools do not take more students than they can handle and then weed them out based on performace. If you make it into med school they expect that you will graduate. There is usually 1-2 people who will fail each year, but they are given supplemental exam (if they qualify) in order to try and pass. If they still fail...they just repeat the year. Sorry I don't have more precise info. I hope this helps.

 

[MD1088]

I just graduated from Flinders this past December and started residency here in the US a couple weeks ago (took an early offer). In my cohort there were a couple people who flunked out or quit in the first couple years (which are pretty light academically), one guy who was hauled out of lecture by the cops (ended up being South Australia's largest meth producer). The clinical years are the "barrier years", third year seeing the highest attrition. When I started third year there were 10 or 11 people repeating, nearly all were international students. A few of my cohort, maybe 2-3 failed our year three, again, mainly internationals. Very few fail fourth year. As flindersgrad said, people are given the opportunity to take exams a second and even rarely a third time. The attrition rate is higher than US schools but about half the internationals are folks that didnt gain admission to school in the US for whatever reason, maybe they dont take tests well. Or maybe Flinders likes getting another year of tuition out of them. Who knows. Also, there are no mulit-choice exams, they are either simulated patients, like an OSCE, or they are written exams. There was maybe an anatomy practicum but even in anatomy there was a written exam. You'd have twenty minutes to answer questions like "discuss the mechanics of ambulation", figuring out what precisely the question was asking was the hardest part and with written exams there is little transperancy. It was a good education with heaps of opportunity to do really well academically, do research, etc. The downside is there is alot of opportunity to drink beer and surf too! If you are going down with the intent of returning to the US, be disciplined. I have colleagues at some pretty prestigous places around the world but they worked for it.

 

[pitman]

UQ has about a 2-3% fail rate for years 1 and 2. A little less for years 3 and 4. About as many drop out for whatever reason.

 

[AusMeds]

FlindersGrad and MD1088,

It's great to have a couple of grads on SDN! Thanks for taking the time to post your wisdom here - it's much appreciated!!

As for surviving third year, do you have any advice to pass on to us internationals currently at Flinders to help ensure that we avoid having to repeat a year? Also, for those in your cohort that didn't make it through, do you have any insight as to what they did or didn't do that got them into trouble?

 

[MD1088]

Hey Ausmed - passing third year is the barrier. There are four full days of exams. You'll get a schedule of the format and recommended study materiel. Honestly, for the Intl's anyway, those who wrote Step 1 already and were studying for Step 2 did really well. I dont believe anyone who wrote either the US or Canadian exams had trouble. Step 2 prep books and the "OSCE for Undergrad" series was what I used. Third year is a study year at Flinders, the ward expectations are light so use your time wisely. The multippe choice was the terror, I suspect the average was about 35% so dont get freaked out if your guessing ALOT!

 

[canucker]

Thanks for the replys everyone.

MD1088, congrats on the residency match. You're American, I'm assuming? What specialty did you match to? Do you know of any Canadians in your cohort who were able to match (whether in the U.S. or Canada)?

FlindersGrad/MD1088/AusMeds, I'd like to hear more about your experiences at Flinders ... sorry I can't be more specific than that! In general, the positives, negatives, about Adelaide, about Australia, etc. Especially AusMeds, I understand you're in second year now (from your earlier posts)? How are you liking it so far?

Good to hear the UQ stats, pitman. Actually, the reason I asked this question was b/c I've been reading DocVeev's (Vman's) blog (BTW, a good read for those interested in going to UQ). If I recall correctly, in an earlier post he mentioned that the Dean made an intro speech when he first started out at UQ and the Dean said that out of the 310 students that started, 300 would graduate 4 years later. But in a later post, where he was writing about doing his final exam for the year, he said that 296 students would be writing it. Anyhow, I realize that it's impossible to predict exact numbers. I just wanted a general idea of the rate.

Thanks again everyone.

Cheers, canucker

 

[pitman]

V's class had 7 fails. Prob the rest would have been dropouts. I would have thought about 285-290 would graduate on time based on the past few years' stats.