Any caribbean med students/grads willing to share stories?

[IdoDrugs]

Hello. I am currently a junior in undergrad but will graduate as a fith year undergrad due to changing majors and some other issues. I really sucked my freshman and sophmore years but have the remainder of this plus two more acadmemic years to redeem myself. During my sophmore year I was also very depressed about many things and was even suicidal. I should have taken time off from school to fix my life. I will not apply to medical schools until I graduate, i will be just a little over 24! I am hoping for just only one gap year.

I will be taking the MCAT summer 2008, after which I will have completed the preqs in addition to courses such as microbiology, genetics, and a year of biochemistry. Hopefully those courses will indirectly prepare me for the MCAT.

Maybe this is a little superficial, but at this point I am not considering applying D.O....perhaps that will change...I know anyone can be a good doctor, US MD, Carib MD, MBBS, or US DO!

I am very interested in going to Cambodia to volunteer with MSF eventually. From what I understand, the MD degree is universally recognized.

I've heard many good things about some caribbean schools, esp SGU. I shadowed two MD's that graduated from there.Two of my friends are going there. They just did not get into any MD schools here in the states ....didn't want to reapply....just wanted to move on with their lives.

I am aware that schools like SGU are becoming more competitive and they just dont simply accept who have 2.5 GPAs and 15 MCAT scores. I am also aware that they accept many people and many of them dont make it to the board exams either.

I will do everything in my power to excell in my remaining undergrad and continue in my volunteering...which I am learning much from. I hoping to just apply to MD schools once...US and carib...and I know its still not even safe assume automatic acceptance into a school in SGU in a few years.

Anyhow, is anyone willing to share stories? Was it hard for you to leave the states a foreign school? What were some reactions from other people you experienced? Did any of you just not reapply and just wanted to go to move on with your life? Are you happy with your decision?

Thanks.

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[microphage]

I'll bite..

-took the plunge in Sept 2003 to be a part of AUC. Finished basic sciences in April 2005, Step 1 in May 2005-passed.
-Started Clinicals in July 2005 at Kern Medical Center in Bakersfield, CA.
Took Step2 CS during my Family Med rotation(studied one week while using clinic as practice), passed.
-Took 6 weeks inbetween to study for Step 2 CK, took it August 2006, passed.
-Finished all my rotations Jan 2007. Matched my first choice on my rank order list March 2007.
-Awaiting June 2007 to start my intern year in residency

It was tough to leave the US. I remember the first time I heard about the schools in undergrad, I had my doubts. I gave up hope of being a physician after MCAT scores of 25, 26. My undergrad counselor during my last semester asked what I planned to do. I told her I'd work in the research/biotech industry.

After a few years of that, a friend I was talking to wanted to goto Med school but her grades weren't all that great either. I told her to look into Caribbean schools. While helping her in the process, I saw a few people who I remember from before who had made it through Caribbean schools and were now in Residency. This kind of rekindled my dream of becoming a physician. I told my wife that I'd spend 20 months in the Caribbean and I was sure I'd make it. She agreed and we packed up our stuff and left for the AUC. Alot of drama and sacrifices were made on the journey but in the end, it all worked out.

IMHO, it honestly doesn't matter if u goto school x or y just as long as its one of the 4(AUC, SGU, Saba, Ross. I'm not here to debate schools so forget it). Goto one in which u think u will fit in and be happy at. For me and my wife, that was AUC.

The only person that kind of gave me a weird look was this pharm rep after I told her I went to school in the Carib. Funny thing was, she was try still trying to sell me on the drug afterwards. Nobody else has really cared.

It was tough, make no mistake but it was doable. Am I happy I did it? Yup. Would I do it over again? I don't know. Am I glad I'm where I'm at? Hell yeah.

U can msg me if u like, I'm not on SDN much... u can annoy me on valuemd.com if you like(same username).

Good luck.

 

[mellsworth21]

Anyone else? This could be a great thread.

 

[sumozmom]

great and encouraging story!

thnx

more of it would be great...

btw- ur residency is where?[



quote=microphage;4947618]I'll bite..

-took the plunge in Sept 2003 to be a part of AUC. Finished basic sciences in April 2005, Step 1 in May 2005-passed.
-Started Clinicals in July 2005 at Kern Medical Center in Bakersfield, CA.
Took Step2 CS during my Family Med rotation(studied one week while using clinic as practice), passed.
-Took 6 weeks inbetween to study for Step 2 CK, took it August 2006, passed.
-Finished all my rotations Jan 2007. Matched my first choice on my rank order list March 2007.
-Awaiting June 2007 to start my intern year in residency

It was tough to leave the US. I remember the first time I heard about the schools in undergrad, I had my doubts. I gave up hope of being a physician after MCAT scores of 25, 26. My undergrad counselor during my last semester asked what I planned to do. I told her I'd work in the research/biotech industry.

After a few years of that, a friend I was talking to wanted to goto Med school but her grades weren't all that great either. I told her to look into Caribbean schools. While helping her in the process, I saw a few people who I remember from before who had made it through Caribbean schools and were now in Residency. This kind of rekindled my dream of becoming a physician. I told my wife that I'd spend 20 months in the Caribbean and I was sure I'd make it. She agreed and we packed up our stuff and left for the AUC. Alot of drama and sacrifices were made on the journey but in the end, it all worked out.

IMHO, it honestly doesn't matter if u goto school x or y just as long as its one of the 4(AUC, SGU, Saba, Ross. I'm not here to debate schools so forget it). Goto one in which u think u will fit in and be happy at. For me and my wife, that was AUC.

The only person that kind of gave me a weird look was this pharm rep after I told her I went to school in the Carib. Funny thing was, she was try still trying to sell me on the drug afterwards. Nobody else has really cared.

It was tough, make no mistake but it was doable. Am I happy I did it? Yup. Would I do it over again? I don't know. Am I glad I'm where I'm at? Hell yeah.

U can msg me if u like, I'm not on SDN much... u can annoy me on valuemd.com if you like(same username).

Good luck.[/quote]

 

[fragilex]

I don't really post on studentdoctor.net, but since microphage replied, I figured I'd give my own experience:

(mirroring microphage's outline)

-Graduated Undergrad Dec 2002
-Got in to SGU/Ross/AUC, I simply chose AUC because a friend was going there
-Started May 2003
-Finished Basic Science Dec 12, 2004, Step 1 Passed Dec 16, 2004
-Started Clinicals April 2005 at Kern Medical Center, Bakersfield
-Step 2 CK Passed April 2006, Step 2 CS Passed June 2006
-Finished Rotations November 2006
-Graduated December 2006
-ECFMG Certificate dated February 2007
-Matched March 2007 for Preliminary Medicine (2007) and Radiology [Advanced] (2008)

[Currently studying for Step 3 and running around looking for a car and an apartment while trying not to think about my huge debt]

To be quite honest, I've always been the kind of person who likes to move forward. A friend of mine in undergrad with similar stats to me, waitlisted like me, who was not accepted into US Medical Schools (like me) took a different route. He did research for a year and then reapplied and got into Drexel. He's currently finishing his MPH. Would I have gotten in had I waited? Maybe. Is it guaranteed? No. Would it have made getting residency a lot easier? Definitely. Would it have guaranteed me a residency in what I wanted? No. There are no guarantees and life, except for Death and Taxes. Push for what you want and never let anyone say you can't.

I made a choice. Rather than stay stagnant and pray applications would be better the next year or that the applicant pool would be less competitive, I moved forward. I was ready to sacrifice what was necessary to get me to the next step. Was it the right decision? I don't know. Did it get me where I wanted? Yes.

Like microphage I'm not here to extol the virtues of my school or place it above any other. My school has its advantages and as well as its share of downsides. Do your research. The Caribbean Schools which have California approval are St. George, AUC, Ross, and Saba. I would recommend applying to these schools first before applying to any others. It does not matter if you've never been to California or never want to practice there. By not going to a California approved school you are limiting yourself. Trust me, as a Caribbean graduate you are already limited from that alone... why make it harder? In the coming years, other schools may generate California approval, I believe SMU is very close and their match list is getting better and better each year. However, I would advise you to not limit yourself from the get-go.

Medical school is medical school no matter where you go. It's not supposed to be easy, it's supposed to be a sacrifice. Sack up, put your head down and work hard everyday. Do well in school, learn the material and rock the boards. Step 1 is the closest thing to an equalizer a Caribbean student has. Then work your butt off in clinicals and get good letters of recommendation. Remember you've been given an opportunity. Being a doctor is a privilege, not a right. My father always tells me, "If being a doctor was easy, everyone would be a doctor."

One more thing. Please don't listen to or take advice from people who aren't in medical school. No one truly understands what medical school is like until they've been in it. The same goes for residency, which is why I don't offer my opinion on that (yet). Always use common sense and take any information you may hear with some degree skepticisim.

I don't frequent these boards much because there is usually a good amount of anti-Caribbean sentiment. However, I was hoping that by posting my experience more Caribbean students would post theirs as well. However, like microphage said, if you are truly interested in the Caribbean route, the valuemd boards has a wealth of information since it is composed of almost all Caribbean students/graduates. However, like any anonymous message board, take everything you read with a grain of salt, and there is no substitute for doing your own research and finding the facts yourself.

-fragilex

 

[sumozmom]

I don't really post on studentdoctor.net, but since microphage replied, I figured I'd give my own experience:

(mirroring microphage's outline)

-Graduated Undergrad Dec 2002
-Got in to SGU/Ross/AUC, I simply chose AUC because a friend was going there
-Started May 2003
-Finished Basic Science Dec 12, 2004, Step 1 Passed Dec 16, 2004
-Started Clinicals April 2005 at Kern Medical Center, Bakersfield
-Step 2 CK Passed April 2006, Step 2 CS Passed June 2006
-Finished Rotations November 2006
-Graduated December 2006
-ECFMG Certificate dated February 2007
-Matched March 2007 for Preliminary Medicine (2007) and Radiology [Advanced] (2008)

[Currently studying for Step 3 and running around looking for a car and an apartment while trying not to think about my huge debt]

To be quite honest, I've always been the kind of person who likes to move forward. A friend of mine in undergrad with similar stats to me, waitlisted like me, who was not accepted into US Medical Schools (like me) took a different route. He did research for a year and then reapplied and got into Drexel. He's currently finishing his MPH. Would I have gotten in had I waited? Maybe. Is it guaranteed? No. Would it have made getting residency a lot easier? Definitely. Would it have guaranteed me a residency in what I wanted? No. There are no guarantees and life, except for Death and Taxes. Push for what you want and never let anyone say you can't.

I made a choice. Rather than stay stagnant and pray applications would be better the next year or that the applicant pool would be less competitive, I moved forward. I was ready to sacrifice what was necessary to get me to the next step. Was it the right decision? I don't know. Did it get me where I wanted? Yes.

Like microphage I'm not here to extol the virtues of my school or place it above any other. My school has its advantages and as well as its share of downsides. Do your research. The Caribbean Schools which have California approval are St. George, AUC, Ross, and Saba. I would recommend applying to these schools first before applying to any others. It does not matter if you've never been to California or never want to practice there. By not going to a California approved school you are limiting yourself. Trust me, as a Caribbean graduate you are already limited from that alone... why make it harder? In the coming years, other schools may generate California approval, I believe SMU is very close and their match list is getting better and better each year. However, I would advise you to not limit yourself from the get-go.

Medical school is medical school no matter where you go. It's not supposed to be easy, it's supposed to be a sacrifice. Sack up, put your head down and work hard everyday. Do well in school, learn the material and rock the boards. Step 1 is the closest thing to an equalizer a Caribbean student has. Then work your butt off in clinicals and get good letters of recommendation. Remember you've been given an opportunity. Being a doctor is a privilege, not a right. My father always tells me, "If being a doctor was easy, everyone would be a doctor."

One more thing. Please don't listen to or take advice from people who aren't in medical school. No one truly understands what medical school is like until they've been in it. The same goes for residency, which is why I don't offer my opinion on that (yet). Always use common sense and take any information you may hear with some degree skepticisim.

I don't frequent these boards much because there is usually a good amount of anti-Caribbean sentiment. However, I was hoping that by posting my experience more Caribbean students would post theirs as well. However, like microphage said, if you are truly interested in the Caribbean route, the valuemd boards has a wealth of information since it is composed of almost all Caribbean students/graduates. However, like any anonymous message board, take everything you read with a grain of salt, and there is no substitute for doing your own research and finding the facts yourself.

-fragilex

thank you for the wonderful/ helpful post

 

[KBoogie311]

My story is a bit different than most in that I am a few years ahead of you guys, but the general premise is the same. However I will add a few things in at the end.

I grew up in Jersey and went to undergrad in Pa. (1994-1998) Scored 29 on the MCAT, with a GPA of 3.35 (my first year was terrible in undergrad, which killed my GPA). I wasn't good enough to get into medical school and repeatedly told so by my guidance counsler during undergrad. The mantra for the MCAT was "No 30 then No Go" I probably should have taken the exam again, but I began to believe my counsler - it didnt matter what I did there was no hope. He threw some caribbean pamphlets at me and said good luck with my life.

I decided to apply and got into the AUC, Ross and SGU. Decided on SGU cause they had the most history at that time. I did well there..studied my ass off and did little else ultimately leaving the islands in 12/2000. Step 1 went great as did Step 2. I finished all my rotations basically in Jersey and NYC. During my interviews I got several pre-match offers from the Internal Medicine programs I applied to (I didn't know that this option existed at the time). I knew what fellowship I wanted to do and geared my application process around the SGU graduate history. If an SGU graduate was a resident and or a fellow in the program - that place was definitely getting my application. I was fortunate enough to get into a University Program that had a positive history. I took it and ran.

I started internship in 2003. I was more diligent than I had ever been in my life. A year and a half later I was asked to stay on as a chief resident in the program after I graduated. Graduation came in 2006 and I am currently sitting in the chiefs office. Even better was that I got into Gastroenterology Fellowship that I so desperately wanted since being a 2nd year medical student.

I thank god and caribbean everyday for giving my the chance. Thats all I really needed.

That being said:

The climate for FMGs is just as malignant as in years past, please don't let the stats fool you. While i agree that the numbers (and matches)are getting better for the graduates from caribbean schools, all graduates will agree that they have to better in all aspects to their american counterparts just to be half as a competitive for things like residency and fellowships...no matter which field it is.

As a chief resident I have been intimately involved with residency application process for the class of 2010. I will say this. DOs were looked at as almost equal to American grads in our University Internal Medicine Program. MUCH MORE SUPERIOR than the caribbean grads. I hate to admit this, but I will. My program director didn't want me (or the other FMG chief) speaking to the American graduates that interviewed at the program -including the DOs. That job was left for the DO chief and AMG Chiefs.

The match class was "great" taking in AMGs in to 95% of spots this year. I will include the fact that the 3 DOs that matched into the program were looked at by the administration as AMGs.

This is a huuuuuuuuuuuuge change from several years ago. I will say this. I am not sure that DOs and FMGs are equal any longer. I think that the DOs are "considered better".

Again this more of "writings on the wall" point of view. Its impossible to gauge this in any real or statistical way. Perhaps the NRMP match results will be more revealing. I havent looked at them from a nationwide point of view only with respect to our program.

Forgive the editorial at the end.

 

[lobelsteve]

I graduated college in 1994. Started in SGU in January 1996. A little worried at first but got involved academically, socially, and culturally with Grenada.
Time flew. I got up at 6, studied for 3 hours, went for a hike or SCUBA diving, had lunch with Theresa (cooking lady from Grand Anse), then went to Taffy's and drank with Colin and Sue Folan, pirate Steve, and the Canadian expatriates until dinner. Went home, watched TV (cable TV), and studied for 2-3 more hours. I loved Grenada and even more so I loved St. Vincent's. I worked as a bartender and as a stand in doc for a local clinic in Stubb's Bay.
I became friends with Rhona and Mac, Ken DaSilva, and Copper. I rented the chief of police's Nissan Sunbird, and enjoyed crips in Ken's bar downtown.

Interned at Carilion in Roanoke (UVA IM prelim), residency in PM&R at EVMS (Chief resident as a senior), and fellowed in Pain Medicine at Emory in Atlanta.
Now I teach the fellows for them and run an interventional pain practice.
I am biased for SGU grads because I know what it takes.

I wish I had more time to get back to the islands and will hopefully get to lecture down there when they let me. I did get to give a lecture for Georgia PCOM and I do train the fellows for Emory. I cannot think of a better way to have gone through my training and I am very happy with where I am at today.

YMMV.

 

[oldpro]

WOW Positive threads like this with proof of success get little attention, I think the Caribbean forum is just a "Whipping Post" most of the time

Facts are that at least 60% of the students do get residencies from Caribbean and international schools..........so there are thousands of success stories every year.

 

[fragilex]

The climate for FMGs is just as malignant as in years past, please don't let the stats fool you. While i agree that the numbers (and matches)are getting better for the graduates from caribbean schools, all graduates will agree that they have to better in all aspects to their american counterparts just to be half as a competitive for things like residency and fellowships...no matter which field it is.

I believe this is worth reiterating. I think one of my fellow medical students put it best when he said "I think there is like a 30 point Step 1 Curve against us" in regards to getting radiology interviews. He's exaggerating to a certain extent, but that also means it's true to a certain extent.

In addition, can we get a sticky and may I humbly ask for more graduates to post their stories?

-fragilex

 

[glorytome]

I graduated college in 1994. Started in SGU in January 1996. A little worried at first but got involved academically, socially, and culturally with Grenada.
Time flew. I got up at 6, studied for 3 hours, went for a hike or SCUBA diving, had lunch with Theresa (cooking lady from Grand Anse), then went to Taffy's and drank with Colin and Sue Folan, pirate Steve, and the Canadian expatriates until dinner. Went home, watched TV (cable TV), and studied for 2-3 more hours. I loved Grenada and even more so I loved St. Vincent's. I worked as a bartender and as a stand in doc for a local clinic in Stubb's Bay.
I became friends with Rhona and Mac, Ken DaSilva, and Copper. I rented the chief of police's Nissan Sunbird, and enjoyed crips in Ken's bar downtown.

Interned at Carilion in Roanoke (UVA IM prelim), residency in PM&R at EVMS (Chief resident as a senior), and fellowed in Pain Medicine at Emory in Atlanta.
Now I teach the fellows for them and run an interventional pain practice.
I am biased for SGU grads because I know what it takes.

I wish I had more time to get back to the islands and will hopefully get to lecture down there when they let me. I did get to give a lecture for Georgia PCOM and I do train the fellows for Emory. I cannot think of a better way to have gone through my training and I am very happy with where I am at today.

YMMV.

So you're telling me that total study time was like six hours for the day...you had all the other time to do other things...nice...i thought going to the carib would take a huge chunk out of my recreational life...but i guess not...reading your story just gave me some confidence to keep my recreational life up to date (p.s. just started a new workout regiment)...thanks a million

 

[McGillGrad]

So you're telling me that total study time was like six hours for the day...you had all the other time to do other things...nice...i thought going to the carib would take a huge chunk out of my recreational life...but i guess not...reading your story just gave me some confidence to keep my recreational life up to date (p.s. just started a new workout regiment)...thanks a million

If you cannot succeed with studying 6 hours per day then you are doing it wrong...lol.

Considering that when you study, you:

1). Preview material before class
2). Learn material in class
3). Review material right after class
4). Retype your notes
5). Review your typed notes daily

There is no reason why you should be studying all day long unless you are trying to learn a new concept or doing extra studying beyond the scope of the course.

 

[lobelsteve]

If you cannot succeed with studying 6 hours per day then you are doing it wrong...lol.

Considering that when you study, you:

1). Preview material before class
2). Learn material in class
3). Review material right after class
4). Retype your notes
5). Review your typed notes daily

There is no reason why you should be studying all day long unless you are trying to learn a new concept or doing extra studying beyond the scope of the course.

I never mentioned anything about going to class...
Honestly, after first term, I really cut back on going to class unless I had a good reason for going. Most lectures are available online or via a note service (back when I was a med student...). I do better at my own pace.

 

[Peaches3]

Hi caribbean MS and grads,

I am just starting to research caribbean schools. I was under the impression that there was an exam that all foreign med school grads had to take in order to practice in the us. Is there any truth in this statement?

Please, I want responses directly from informed caribbean med students or grads only. Thanks.

 

[SabaMed]

Hi caribbean MS and grads,

I am just starting to research caribbean schools. I was under the impression that there was an exam that all foreign med school grads had to take in order to practice in the us. Is there any truth in this statement?

Please, I want responses directly from informed caribbean med students or grads only. Thanks.

Yes there is an exam that we all have to take! Its called the Step1 USMLE. In fact everyone has to take it.

 

[awdc]

Hi caribbean MS and grads,

I am just starting to research caribbean schools. I was under the impression that there was an exam that all foreign med school grads had to take in order to practice in the us. Is there any truth in this statement?

Please, I want responses directly from informed caribbean med students or grads only. Thanks.

In the past, there were licensure exams that foreign medical grads had to take that were different or in addition to the exams for American medical grads. Currently, both American and foreign medical graduates all take the same licensure exams. Nothing more or less for foreign medical graduates.

 

[IFNgamma]

1st of all, microphage and fragile x, PM me, i probably know you guys. Fragile X, I have a pretty good idea of who u are already.

following your format:

- graduated undergrad June 2000
- worked 2.5 years in a lab
- applied to med school, did not get in
- applied to SGU and got in, would've probably gone to AUC if I had known about it
- started in Grenada Jan 03, finished basic sciences Dec 05
- passed Step 1 March 05
- started clinicals at Kern, May 05
- passed step 2 august 06
- applied for the match Sep 06
- finished clincals Dec 06, graduated
- matched into Gen. Surgery, will start July 07

So I decided to go the caribbean route after not getting into med school, even though I got the magic MCAT = 30, my GPA sucked, it was ~3.0.

I'm glad I made that decision now, although right after I got off the plane in Grenada I was like, OMG, what the hell is this?? Believe me, spending 2 years on the island was tough, especially 1st term. I was just homesick and missed all the things I liked to do.

Grenada is not as bad as Ross, but it's still pretty bad in terms of having things that Americans are used to, such as supermarkets and fast food restuaraunts.

and one other thing is that there was this hurricane that hit Grenada in 05 that pretty much destroyed the whole island, important things to students such as the "mall" where the supermarket was got destroyed, I was not on the island when it happened and I have not been back since, so I don't know how much repair has happened since then.

I should really follow Fragile X's lead and take Step 3 also, but I'm kinda lazy right now, I don't know, I just can't study.

Any Qs, PM me.

 

[IFNgamma]

Hi caribbean MS and grads,

I am just starting to research caribbean schools. I was under the impression that there was an exam that all foreign med school grads had to take in order to practice in the us. Is there any truth in this statement?

Please, I want responses directly from informed caribbean med students or grads only. Thanks.

Well, to get a license to practice, everyone, not just FMGs but US grads have to pass 4 exams, USMLE step 1, step 2 CK, step 2 CS, step 3.

 

[sumozmom]

1st of all, microphage and fragile x, PM me, i probably know you guys. Fragile X, I have a pretty good idea of who u are already.

following your format:

- graduated undergrad June 2000
- worked 2.5 years in a lab
- applied to med school, did not get in
- applied to SGU and got in, would've probably gone to AUC if I had known about it
- started in Grenada Jan 03, finished basic sciences Dec 05
- passed Step 1 March 05
- started clinicals at Kern, May 05
- passed step 2 august 06
- applied for the match Sep 06
- finished clincals Dec 06, graduated
- matched into Gen. Surgery, will start July 07

So I decided to go the caribbean route after not getting into med school, even though I got the magic MCAT = 30, my GPA sucked, it was ~3.0.

I'm glad I made that decision now, although right after I got off the plane in Grenada I was like, OMG, what the hell is this?? Believe me, spending 2 years on the island was tough, especially 1st term. I was just homesick and missed all the things I liked to do.

Grenada is not as bad as Ross, but it's still pretty bad in terms of having things that Americans are used to, such as supermarkets and fast food restuaraunts.

and one other thing is that there was this hurricane that hit Grenada in 05 that pretty much destroyed the whole island, important things to students such as the "mall" where the supermarket was got destroyed, I was not on the island when it happened and I have not been back since, so I don't know how much repair has happened since then.

I should really follow Fragile X's lead and take Step 3 also, but I'm kinda lazy right now, I don't know, I just can't study.

Any Qs, PM me.

more grrrreeaaaatt info......the more evidance the better!

thnx

 

[Peaches3]

In the past, there were licensure exams that foreign medical grads had to take that were different or in addition to the exams for American medical grads. Currently, both American and foreign medical graduates all take the same licensure exams. Nothing more or less for foreign medical graduates.

Yes this is what I thought. So now there is no subsequent exam that only fmgs would take? I'd heard that this fmg licensure exam was far more difficult than the one for amgs (in order to give amgs priority in being able to practice), and it was keeping a lot of fmgs from being able to return to the US to practice. Good to know there's only one exam now, and it's the same for amg and fmg.

 

[lobelsteve]

Yes this is what I thought. So now there is no subsequent exam that only fmgs would take? I'd heard that this fmg licensure exam was far more difficult than the one for amgs (in order to give amgs priority in being able to practice), and it was keeping a lot of fmgs from being able to return to the US to practice. Good to know there's only one exam now, and it's the same for amg and fmg.

DO FMG's till haev to pass TOEFL?

Test of English as a Foreign Language...

It was pretty easy after having done my English lit coursework at Dartmouth.

 

[McGillGrad]

DO FMG's till haev to pass TOEFL?

Test of English as a Foreign Language...

It was pretty easy after having done my English lit coursework at Dartmouth.

No

 

[IFNgamma]

Yes this is what I thought. So now there is no subsequent exam that only fmgs would take? I'd heard that this fmg licensure exam was far more difficult than the one for amgs (in order to give amgs priority in being able to practice), and it was keeping a lot of fmgs from being able to return to the US to practice. Good to know there's only one exam now, and it's the same for amg and fmg.

I known of no such licensure exam.

 

[Peaches3]

Great thread...thank you for the information.

 

[smck27]

IMG's had to take TOFEL and CSA (clinical skills assessment) in addition to the USMLE's. The CSA turned into the USMLE 2CS (which everyone takes) and you no longer have to take the TOFEL.

I'm from Ross--and not finished like those who posted, but I'll mention where I am now...

Graduated Undergrad Dec 2002
Waitlisted US schools/did not get it Aug 2003
Applied/Accepted to Ross, SGU
Went to Ross Jan 2004
Finished Basic Sciences April 2005
Finished Miami semester July 2005
Passed Step 1 Oct 2005
Started Clinicals Oct 2005
Taking Step II May 2007 (pray for me people, freaking out)

My only regret so far is not applying for Ross's Sept class. The January 04 start date left me in a position to rush for 07 match--but not having my clinicals work out in a consecutive manner and now I have 10 months off to wait for July 08 to come around. Granted 20 people or so made it through, but the other 250 of us did not/could not/didn't even try.

 

[tkim]

I am very interested in going to Cambodia to volunteer with MSF eventually. From what I understand, the MD degree is universally recognized.

1) The MD is not recognized universally, though it is probably more recognized than the DO. But I have no idea where the Carib MD stand in regards to reciprocity internationally.

2) Medical missions like MSF accept USDOs. In fact, most relief missions will have their team member's licenses accepted during the duration of the mission. It's not an issue.

If those are two points you think make the Carib MD programs more attractive over DO, be assured it's a non-issue.

That being said, the well-established Carib schools have a proven track record of graduating physicians going into competitive fields. One friend of mine is graduating from Ross and going into radiology. Not too shabby.

 

[KBoogie311]

DO FMG's till haev to pass TOEFL?

Test of English as a Foreign Language...

It was pretty easy after having done my English lit coursework at Dartmouth.

I had to take it..Did this change???? I was freakin pissed. Insulting that I did 4 years of high school in Jersey and 4 years of college in Pa with a duel degree...and then had to drop more money for this nonsense!!! Straight up B.S.

-KBoogie

 

[KBoogie311]

IMG's had to take TOFEL and CSA (clinical skills assessment) in addition to the USMLE's. The CSA turned into the USMLE 2CS (which everyone takes) and you no longer have to take the TOFEL.

Got it...Nevermind . Good for all the current and future students.

 

[cpep]

:

The climate for FMGs is just as malignant as in years past, please don't let the stats fool you. While i agree that the numbers (and matches)are getting better for the graduates from caribbean schools, all graduates will agree that they have to better in all aspects to their american counterparts just to be half as a competitive for things like residency and fellowships...no matter which field it is.

As a chief resident I have been intimately involved with residency application process for the class of 2010. I will say this. DOs were looked at as almost equal to American grads in our University Internal Medicine Program. MUCH MORE SUPERIOR than the caribbean grads. I hate to admit this, but I will. My program director didn't want me (or the other FMG chief) speaking to the American graduates that interviewed at the program -including the DOs. That job was left for the DO chief and AMG Chiefs.


This is a huuuuuuuuuuuuge change from several years ago. I will say this. I am not sure that DOs and FMGs are equal any longer. I think that the DOs are "considered better".

I'm finishing my intern year now at a great program here in the NE. I saw our program's rank list and it broke down like this: Ivy League USMGs>>the rest USMGs(including Canadian and Puerto Ricco grads)>>>USIMGs and DOs>>>>>>>>FMGs from other country.

From my program's perspectives, DOs are equal to USIMGs in terms of desirablity. There's a pecking order for Carribbean grads too. My program coordinator told me they only invite Ross and SGU grads for interviews. The general conscensus is that weaker programs tend to have DOs. We only ranked 1 DO this year while we ranked 4-5 USIMGs but unfortunately we filled with USMGs MDs.

Of note, I wonder why why Canadians and Puerto Rican graduates are considered US grads? Maybe a better term to characterize these people are LCME accredited graduates? I think this US MDs vs. everybody else is very much of a p(*&((*J contest.

 

[nvrsumr]

One more "success" story...

Went to AUC for basic sciences but transfered to Sint Eustatius and did my clinicals in Colorado. Medicine internship. Residency in PMR. An now an ansethesia based fellowship in Pain medicine. And most importantly... a full medical license.

Best of luck.

 

[Bill Lumbergh]

well, i'm no longer a caribbean student, and i haven't graduated yet, but i like this thread and i'd hate to see it fade away, so i'll share my story.

so my story is pretty much a nightmare in terms of being a premed, and some people may end up going to the caribbean instead of trying to better their applications to get into a US school because of stories like mine. i was always a premed throughout college because it was sort of the thing to do, but didn't really know i wanted to be a doctor until senior year when i did some volunteering and shadowing. i messed around my first couple of years, ending up with an F and a bunch of Cs on my transcript, but got it together somewhat later on and ended up graduating with a 3.0 from a top 20 university. i took the mcat and got a 27. I knew those numbers weren't going to cut it, so i started the process of improving my application.

i retook the mcat, got a 33, double digits in all 3 sections. i enrolled in the georgetown smp and finished with a 3.3 there. i applied for the first time, no luck.

i took up a research job, kept up volunteering, and applied for a second time. nada.

the third time around, i applied to allo, DO, and sgu. i shadowed a DO to get the DO letter, kept volunteering, and kept up with the research. by this time i had two published abstracts, the papers for which were in the process of being published. i got into both DO schools and sgu and chose sgu.

so yeah, i did everything i could think of to better my app. i retook the mcat, did a master's program, did research, volunteered, shadowed, had meetings with the dean of admissions at my state school to talk about my application and get to know him, and still ended up at sgu, which i probably could have gotten into straight out of college. even having experienced all that, my advice to anyone thinking of just giving up and going to the caribbean is still to do everything you can to improve your application and reapply to US schools before going to the caribbean. i obviously feel it's worth it, otherwise i wouldn't have done it.

now on to my experiences at sgu. i feel like my few years off from school, working and living on my own, prepared me better for life on the island. i was used to taking care of myself and i wasn't sheltered like so many students at sgu are, especially those straight out of college. i had also been living away from my family and was seeing them only a few times a year for holidays, so it wasn't that big a deal to move away from them to grenada.

also, i feel i gained a little perspective in those two years off. i approached med school differently than i did college. i had a greater feeling of purpose, and i realized that sgu was providing a resource but it was up to me to take advantage of it and it was up to me to earn my degree and residency. and so i always went to class, tried to learn everything i could instead of "just what i need to know for the test," and pretty much went the extra mile. i still had fun and made a lot of good friends, played sports, and went out partying after exams, but studying became something i wanted to do rather than something i was trying to get out of doing.

so anyways, i got to sgu and first term i knew i just wanted to focus on studying and take care of business, so i didn't get into any extracurriculars. i ended up kicking butt, and began thinking about transferring. so second term, i took up some extracurriculars, took some extra classes/selectives, got to know some professors, and got some great letters of recommendation. in the meantime, my research got published, and i sent in my transfer applications and got accepted, and hence am no longer a caribbean student. now i'm finishing up my second year at a us school and getting ready for step 1.

sorry for all the text. i tried to cut it down a bit for you all

 

[iwilldlvr]

IMG's had to take TOFEL and CSA (clinical skills assessment) in addition to the USMLE's. The CSA turned into the USMLE 2CS (which everyone takes) and you no longer have to take the TOFEL.

I'm from Ross--and not finished like those who posted, but I'll mention where I am now...

Graduated Undergrad Dec 2002
Waitlisted US schools/did not get it Aug 2003
Applied/Accepted to Ross, SGU
Went to Ross Jan 2004
Finished Basic Sciences April 2005
Finished Miami semester July 2005
Passed Step 1 Oct 2005
Started Clinicals Oct 2005
Taking Step II May 2007 (pray for me people, freaking out)

My only regret so far is not applying for Ross's Sept class. The January 04 start date left me in a position to rush for 07 match--but not having my clinicals work out in a consecutive manner and now I have 10 months off to wait for July 08 to come around. Granted 20 people or so made it through, but the other 250 of us did not/could not/didn't even try.

So, if I started at a Caribbean school in January, would I have a hard time matching for a Family Practice residency in the same year or are those undesirable enough that there would be no need to scramble or wait until the next year?

 

[smck27]

So, if I started at a Caribbean school in January, would I have a hard time matching for a Family Practice residency in the same year or are those undesirable enough that there would be no need to scramble or wait until the next year?

The "hard part" isn't about what you want to match in..it is completeing your 87 weeks of clinical rotations before May 31 of the year you want to graduate. I had a one week gap in my schedule put me over by 1 week in the end--making me ineliglible for the match. Now could I have "pushed it" and tried to go for a prematch? Sure, but I wasn't willing to rush Step 2 etc. for that chance. Just get a calendar...you have to do all of your rotations pretty much back-to-back, no vacation for 87 weeks straight. I know plenty of people who did it--and even had time off because they took step 1 earlier than the window ended etc. It is very possible.

 

[IFNgamma]

Bill,

I commend you for your efforts and glad that you finally achieved your dream. However, the amount of sacrifice in terms of time and money spent applying to med school was not totally necessary. I have essentially the same undergrad credentials as you and I applied and failed to get into med school 1x. Getting rejected like that was pretty depressing for me so I didn not want to experience that disapointment again, let alone 3x like you did, so I just went to SGU.

Unless you want the super-competitive residencies such as orthopedics, urology, ENT, or dermatology, a Caribbean school will get you want you want. Yes, it sucks when someone ask you where you went to med school and you have to say SGU/Ross/AUC, and have to take like 5 mins to explain where the hell it is, but once you're in residency, it no longer matters!

I went to SGU and matched into a university program in surgery and I know 3 other people that did as well. Fragile X whom I know personally matched into Radiology. So some competitive and highly sought after residencies are possible and not out of the ordinary for a caribbean grad!

The bottom line is people could take the long route like Bill, which is to apply multiple times to US med schools, waste a lot of time and money, and still risk being ultimately rejected. Or you can suck it up and go to a Caribbean school and get med school over w/ and get on w/ your career. I chose the latter and I'm content w/ the result so far.

well, i'm no longer a caribbean student, and i haven't graduated yet, but i like this thread and i'd hate to see it fade away, so i'll share my story.

so my story is pretty much a nightmare in terms of being a premed, and some people may end up going to the caribbean instead of trying to better their applications to get into a US school because of stories like mine. i was always a premed throughout college because it was sort of the thing to do, but didn't really know i wanted to be a doctor until senior year when i did some volunteering and shadowing. i messed around my first couple of years, ending up with an F and a bunch of Cs on my transcript, but got it together somewhat later on and ended up graduating with a 3.0 from a top 20 university. i took the mcat and got a 27. I knew those numbers weren't going to cut it, so i started the process of improving my application.

i retook the mcat, got a 33, double digits in all 3 sections. i enrolled in the georgetown smp and finished with a 3.3 there. i applied for the first time, no luck.

i took up a research job, kept up volunteering, and applied for a second time. nada.

the third time around, i applied to allo, DO, and sgu. i shadowed a DO to get the DO letter, kept volunteering, and kept up with the research. by this time i had two published abstracts, the papers for which were in the process of being published. i got into both DO schools and sgu and chose sgu.

so yeah, i did everything i could think of to better my app. i retook the mcat, did a master's program, did research, volunteered, shadowed, had meetings with the dean of admissions at my state school to talk about my application and get to know him, and still ended up at sgu, which i probably could have gotten into straight out of college. even having experienced all that, my advice to anyone thinking of just giving up and going to the caribbean is still to do everything you can to improve your application and reapply to US schools before going to the caribbean. i obviously feel it's worth it, otherwise i wouldn't have done it.

now on to my experiences at sgu. i feel like my few years off from school, working and living on my own, prepared me better for life on the island. i was used to taking care of myself and i wasn't sheltered like so many students at sgu are, especially those straight out of college. i had also been living away from my family and was seeing them only a few times a year for holidays, so it wasn't that big a deal to move away from them to grenada.

also, i feel i gained a little perspective in those two years off. i approached med school differently than i did college. i had a greater feeling of purpose, and i realized that sgu was providing a resource but it was up to me to take advantage of it and it was up to me to earn my degree and residency. and so i always went to class, tried to learn everything i could instead of "just what i need to know for the test," and pretty much went the extra mile. i still had fun and made a lot of good friends, played sports, and went out partying after exams, but studying became something i wanted to do rather than something i was trying to get out of doing.

so anyways, i got to sgu and first term i knew i just wanted to focus on studying and take care of business, so i didn't get into any extracurriculars. i ended up kicking butt, and began thinking about transferring. so second term, i took up some extracurriculars, took some extra classes/selectives, got to know some professors, and got some great letters of recommendation. in the meantime, my research got published, and i sent in my transfer applications and got accepted, and hence am no longer a caribbean student. now i'm finishing up my second year at a us school and getting ready for step 1.

sorry for all the text. i tried to cut it down a bit for you all

 

[sumozmom]

Bill,

I commend you for your efforts and glad that you finally achieved your dream. However, the amount of sacrifice in terms of time and money spent applying to med school was not totally necessary. I have essentially the same undergrad credentials as you and I applied and failed to get into med school 1x. Getting rejected like that was pretty depressing for me so I didn not want to experience that disapointment again, let alone 3x like you did, so I just went to SGU.

Unless you want the super-competitive residencies such as orthopedics, urology, ENT, or dermatology, a Caribbean school will get you want you want. Yes, it sucks when someone ask you where you went to med school and you have to say SGU/Ross/AUC, and have to take like 5 mins to explain where the hell it is, but once you're in residency, it no longer matters!

I went to SGU and matched into a university program in surgery and I know 3 other people that did as well. Fragile X whom I know personally matched into Radiology. So some competitive and highly sought after residencies are possible and not out of the ordinary for a caribbean grad!

The bottom line is people could take the long route like Bill, which is to apply multiple times to US med schools, waste a lot of time and money, and still risk being ultimately rejected. Or you can suck it up and go to a Caribbean school and get med school over w/ and get on w/ your career. I chose the latter and I'm content w/ the result so far.

will you share your state...going in...coming out....boards?

 

[sus127]

I'll bite..

-took the plunge in Sept 2003 to be a part of AUC. Finished basic sciences in April 2005, Step 1 in May 2005-passed.
-Started Clinicals in July 2005 at Kern Medical Center in Bakersfield, CA.
Took Step2 CS during my Family Med rotation(studied one week while using clinic as practice), passed.
-Took 6 weeks inbetween to study for Step 2 CK, took it August 2006, passed.
-Finished all my rotations Jan 2007. Matched my first choice on my rank order list March 2007.
-Awaiting June 2007 to start my intern year in residency

It was tough to leave the US. I remember the first time I heard about the schools in undergrad, I had my doubts. I gave up hope of being a physician after MCAT scores of 25, 26. My undergrad counselor during my last semester asked what I planned to do. I told her I'd work in the research/biotech industry.

After a few years of that, a friend I was talking to wanted to goto Med school but her grades weren't all that great either. I told her to look into Caribbean schools. While helping her in the process, I saw a few people who I remember from before who had made it through Caribbean schools and were now in Residency. This kind of rekindled my dream of becoming a physician. I told my wife that I'd spend 20 months in the Caribbean and I was sure I'd make it. She agreed and we packed up our stuff and left for the AUC. Alot of drama and sacrifices were made on the journey but in the end, it all worked out.

IMHO, it honestly doesn't matter if u goto school x or y just as long as its one of the 4(AUC, SGU, Saba, Ross. I'm not here to debate schools so forget it). Goto one in which u think u will fit in and be happy at. For me and my wife, that was AUC.

The only person that kind of gave me a weird look was this pharm rep after I told her I went to school in the Carib. Funny thing was, she was try still trying to sell me on the drug afterwards. Nobody else has really cared.

It was tough, make no mistake but it was doable. Am I happy I did it? Yup. Would I do it over again? I don't know. Am I glad I'm where I'm at? Hell yeah.

U can msg me if u like, I'm not on SDN much... u can annoy me on valuemd.com if you like(same username).

Good luck.

Does anyone know anything about AUA?

 

[Bill Lumbergh]

The bottom line is people could take the long route like Bill, which is to apply multiple times to US med schools, waste a lot of time and money, and still risk being ultimately rejected. Or you can suck it up and go to a Caribbean school and get med school over w/ and get on w/ your career. I chose the latter and I'm content w/ the result so far.

aww, thanks. it's always nice to be told that you did a lot of hard work for nothing and that you wasted a lot of time and money. it's not mean at all. it makes me feel all warm and fuzzy inside.

obviously i do not feel as if i wasted any time or money. i was making a choice that would decide the path of my entire career, so why would i rush it and why would i want make a choice that would close future doors for me? i didn't know what field i wanted to go into. orthopedics and radiology were both interesting to me along with a bunch of others. and yes, you can get competitive residencies from the carib, but i would argue that it IS out of the norm, but i guess that depends on your definition of "the norm." about 80% of us allopathic seniors who ranked ortho first matched, compared to less than 30% for non-us grads. the numbers are about 90/50 for rads, and 98/65 for internal medicine. do i think a little extra time and effort is worth the 30-50% increase in chances that i match in what i want to do for the rest of my life? yes. but that's my decision, and it may not be right for everyone.

you shouldn't go to the caribbean (or any school really) unless you will be happy with graduating from that school. if i had gone before i tried everything to get into a us school, i would have continually questioned my decision and would never have been happy. only after i tried everything to get into a us school was i able to be grateful for the opportunity sgu gave me and would i have not only been satisfied with, but i would have been proud of the md that sgu granted me. it only took IFNgamma one application cycle to reach that point. it took me three. and guess what? i'll still be only 28 when i graduate, and since i transferred, i'm going to have all doors open to me just as if i had succeeded in one of those three years.

different people make different choices and have different pathways that are right for them. a big problem on these forums is that someone makes a choice that is appropriate for them, but then goes around behaving like it's the choice that everyone should make (see any MD vs DO thread). next time instead of saying "bill wasted his time and money," how bout just saying "it was different for me?" thanks

 

[berkeleyboy]

obviously i do not feel as if i wasted any time or money. i was making a choice that would decide the path of my entire career, so why would i rush it and why would i want make a choice that would close future doors for me? i didn't know what field i wanted to go into. orthopedics and radiology were both interesting to me along with a bunch of others. and yes, you can get competitive residencies from the carib, but i would argue that it IS out of the norm, but i guess that depends on your definition of "the norm." about 80% of us allopathic seniors who ranked ortho first matched, compared to less than 30% for non-us grads. the numbers are about 90/50 for rads, and 98/65 for internal medicine. do i think a little extra time and effort is worth the 30-50% increase in chances that i match in what i want to do for the rest of my life? yes. but that's my decision, and it may not be right for everyone.

you shouldn't go to the caribbean (or any school really) unless you will be happy with graduating from that school. if i had gone before i tried everything to get into a us school, i would have continually questioned my decision and would never have been happy. only after i tried everything to get into a us school was i able to be grateful for the opportunity sgu gave me and would i have not only been satisfied with, but i would have been proud of the md that sgu granted me. it only took IFNgamma one application cycle to reach that point. it took me three.

I agree with this wholeheartedly, if you want to do something extremely competitive it definitely makes a difference coming from an LCME school rather than DO or an off shore school. I know this because I just finished going through the match process and graduated from a US medical school.

This path of going offshore might be different for someone who lets say is from the Northeast and has life goals of primary care in the Northeast where most of carib grads are able to garner residency spots. Situations are different for different people.

Looking back on this whole process, I didn't even apply to US schools and decided to just make the plundge to SGU, lucky for me I was able to transfer and not lose any time or money. That being said, I was mentally prepared to graduate from SGU and perhaps not land that competitve specialty if it just so happenned that way.

In retrospect, I'm thankful for being so lucky but it could have easily been different.

Bottom line: If you think you might want to do a competitive specialty and you want to increase your chances of getting it, you should try your best to go to a US allo school. I'm not saying you can't get it from SGU...but it def. increases your chances if you want to do derm, plastics, opthal, ortho, rad onc, urology, neurosurg to have graduated from a LCME accredited school.

And we are taking about practicing your specialty for the rest of your freaking life, maybe anywhere from 30-50 years of practice!....if a couple years or in Bill's case 3 years extra is needed to get you that residency that will make you happy for the rest of your life, than its def. worth it, and all the time and money.

 

[jameslynton]

Does anyone know anything about AUA?

When Ross was sold to Devry - the dean and several profs formed AUA about a year or two later. They had a few Ross transfer students at the start. They just had their first students match in the 2007 match. They got NY approval and appear to be going about it the right way to grow.

 

[HippocratesX]

Do people really get residency spots out of carribean schools ( in competitive fields) through connections? For example, if they have family that's influential or relatives in residency director positions?? I've heard this happens, but I'm not sure if its just rumor, or if this actually takes place?!

 

[NewHope]

Do people really get residency spots out of carribean schools ( in competitive fields) through connections? For example, if they have family that's influential or relatives in residency director positions?? I've heard this happens, but I'm not sure if its just rumor, or if this actually takes place?!

Sure it happens, and not only out of Caribbean schools. This perhaps is even more important than all of your numbers, stats and LORs combined.

 

[microphage]

Sure it happens, and not only out of Caribbean schools. This perhaps is even more important than all of your numbers, stats and LORs combined.

Almost everybody I know who got into competitive fields from AUC/SGU/Ross did so on their own merit. There were a handful who had the connections but more power to them.

 

[cheezer]

bump. please continue to share success stories.

sincerely
premed

 

[cbass1350]

My experience in SGU is a tough thing to share. On one hand, I really want to speak out and say what's on my mind and what I have had to endure for the last few years. However, I also don't want to discourage other pre-meds by adding too much negativity to the equation (lot of which, frankly, are based on my personal experiences and don't necessarily represent the whole).

Hence, I will keep my pessimism to myself and will leave all prospective medical students who are thinking of applying to Caribbean schools with one advice: Make sure you do EVERYTHING in your powers to get into a US med school (even if it means applying a second time). Foreign medical schools should be the absolute LAST (and I do mean last) option on your lists.

Best of luck if you should decide to apply

edit: If you are thinking about IM, family practice, peds, or other non-competitive residencies, then I wouldn't worry too much about going to the Caribbeans.

 

[lobelsteve]

My experience in SGU is a tough thing to share. On one hand, I really want to speak out and say what's on my mind and what I have had to endure for the last few years. However, I also don't want to discourage other pre-meds by adding too much negativity to the equation (lot of which, frankly, are based on my personal experiences and don't necessarily represent the whole).

Hence, I will keep my pessimism to myself and will leave all prospective medical students who are thinking of applying to Caribbean schools with one advice: Make sure you do EVERYTHING in your powers to get into a US med school (even if it means applying a second time). Foreign medical schools should be the absolute LAST (and I do mean last) option on your lists.

Best of luck if you should decide to apply

edit: If you are thinking about IM, family practice, peds, or other non-competitive residencies, then I wouldn't worry too much about going to the Caribbeans.

There is a light at the end of your tunnel. And yes, I had a centipede crawling across my ear, I got the friendly F.U. whitey while on the East coast of Grenada, I had my share of run ins with the administration. And I graduated and went on to intership, residency, and fellowship. All the memories turn pleasant when things are going well.

 

[ronaldo23]

what is a USIMG? I know USMG and FMG, but am not familiar with the first term

 

[JoeNamaMD]

Hello. I am currently a junior in undergrad but will graduate as a fith year undergrad due to changing majors and some other issues. I really sucked my freshman and sophmore years but have the remainder of this plus two more acadmemic years to redeem myself. During my sophmore year I was also very depressed about many things and was even suicidal. I should have taken time off from school to fix my life. I will not apply to medical schools until I graduate, i will be just a little over 24! I am hoping for just only one gap year.

I will be taking the MCAT summer 2008, after which I will have completed the preqs in addition to courses such as microbiology, genetics, and a year of biochemistry. Hopefully those courses will indirectly prepare me for the MCAT.

Maybe this is a little superficial, but at this point I am not considering applying D.O....perhaps that will change...I know anyone can be a good doctor, US MD, Carib MD, MBBS, or US DO!

I am very interested in going to Cambodia to volunteer with MSF eventually. From what I understand, the MD degree is universally recognized.

I've heard many good things about some caribbean schools, esp SGU. I shadowed two MD's that graduated from there.Two of my friends are going there. They just did not get into any MD schools here in the states ....didn't want to reapply....just wanted to move on with their lives.

I am aware that schools like SGU are becoming more competitive and they just dont simply accept who have 2.5 GPAs and 15 MCAT scores. I am also aware that they accept many people and many of them dont make it to the board exams either.

I will do everything in my power to excell in my remaining undergrad and continue in my volunteering...which I am learning much from. I hoping to just apply to MD schools once...US and carib...and I know its still not even safe assume automatic acceptance into a school in SGU in a few years.

Anyhow, is anyone willing to share stories? Was it hard for you to leave the states a foreign school? What were some reactions from other people you experienced? Did any of you just not reapply and just wanted to go to move on with your life? Are you happy with your decision?

Thanks.

There are four non US schools in North America that will allow you to practice in all 50 States and generally have a good reputation when it comes to matching into a residency. They are Ross, AUC, SGU, and UAG(Mexico). These are the top four offshore programs in North America. There are programs in Ireland and Australia that take large numbers of US and Canadian students but they do not directly prepare you for the USMLE. I have friends who went to all three Caribbean schools, expect to work your butt off while there. Medical school is not a joke and you need to study hard to do well in school and on the USMLE. Ross is the most rigorous the four programs from what I know and lots of people graduate from there and go into residency. AUC and SGU are also both solid programs but not as competitive as Ross since they admit fewer students. UAG requires you to speak Spanish in later years, and judging by the ever increasing Spanish speaking population in the US, this may be an asset.

The thing about these schools is that if you are banking on getting into an ultracompetitive residency like Radiology, Orthopedics, ENT, Opthalmology, Neurosurgery, etc. don't count on it unless you rank in the top 5 percent of your class and have 230 or better on your USMLE.

 

[McGillGrad]

AUC and SGU are also both solid programs but not as competitive as Ross since they admit fewer students.

Where's the logic here?

 

[Meatwad]

Where's the logic here?

Wondering that myself, maybe he means it's not as competitive once you get into the school. So it might be less competitive to get in (more students admitted), but since you then have lots of classmates, there is more competition among students and they are looking to empty up some seats. That's the only way his statement could be somewhat coherent.

 

[bulletproof]

The thing about these schools is that if you are banking on getting into an ultracompetitive residency like Radiology, Orthopedics, ENT, Opthalmology, Neurosurgery, etc. don't count on it unless you rank in the top 5 percent of your class and have 230 or better on your USMLE.

If anyone is counting on getting into any of the specialties you mentioned they would be well advised to have a 230 or greater, even coming from a U.S. school. The average matched applicant from the 2007 match cycle had a 230 or thereabouts in the residencies you list, many AOA, more with research etc.

Understandably then, very few carib. grads match these spots. The ones that do work hard, apply widely, and interview well. A good step score helps get an interview.