Another WAMC...(what are my chances of getting into a good school?)

[ursaruna]

No, not one of those new pop-up schools. And no, I'm not aiming for top schools like USCF or something because I doubt I can go there. I'm looking for schools that don't take the PCAT, primarily Oregon State University and University of Washington since I live in the NW coast. And I am well aware of the loans, the loans is no problem to me at this point.

PharmCAS GPA: 2.83
Notable GPAs
- Math: 3.59
- Microbiology: 3.10
- Physics: 3.17
- Social/Behavioral Science: 4.00
~ the rest are between 2.3-3.0

I earned a scholarship that covered 2 years of my undergrad right out of high school for having a 3.5 GPA or higher. So I noted that.
Waitress: 10400+ hours and continuing (lots of customer experience)
Outpatient Pharmacy Volunteer: 35+ hours and continuing
Medical Scribe: 1400 hours
Specialty Compounding Pharmacy Tech: 408+ hours and continuing
Retail Pharmacy: 75+ hours and continuing
Volunteer at a clinic for patients with Multiple Sclerosis: 6 hours
Human Anatomy and Physiology Tutor for International/First-gen Students: 78 hours
Microbiology TA: 77 hours
2 letters: one from the doctor I scribed (very good), the other from the compounding pharmacist (decent)

I also have a bachelor's degree in biohealth sciences (basically just science). Took me almost 6 years to get my bachelor's while working in my family chinese restaurant nearly full time so I had to do school part time. But I believe the scholarship is proof of my academic skillset seeing that I wasn't working at the time in high school (I know I know college is different). Yes, I did retake classes and it hurt my pharmCAS GPA. Should I just study for the PCAT? A lot of the schools I want to go to don't take PCAT... Any suggestions for good schools besides the two I listed above?

I don't want to go to Pacific University because I don't align with their teaching formula (block system) and from what I read with another recent post on here. I was thinking of trying Washington State...but I'm afraid that they aren't as "prestigious" enough as the other two above to help me land a good job or have good connections out of college. I also show an upward trendline wtih GPA.

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[BC_89]

By not taking the PCAT, you limit yourself from casting a wider net in order to land potential interviews (especially with your low par GPA).

That said, some will compute a "prerequisite" GPA as well as other calculated cumulative scores put out by PharmCAS. I suggest to study and get as close to a 430 pt scale (90th percentile) on your PCAT to help alleviate a low GPA. Lastly, you don't have much room to bargain if you are limiting yourself from pop up schools but not top tier schools. In your case, no real difference of program you apply to since you don't plan on going to a top tier institute.

 

[Timbo]

Aside from your GPA your extracurriculars and work experience is pretty impressive. Why not aim for a profession with better prospects than pharmacy (eg PA, dentistry, MD/DO, or anything else really)? You will be doing yourself and disservice by entering a profession that is quickly declining and has the worst return on investment out of all other healthcare professions.

 

[Weirdy]

Aside from your GPA your extracurriculars and work experience is pretty impressive. Why not aim for a profession with better prospects than pharmacy (eg PA, dentistry, MD/DO, or anything else really)? You will be doing yourself and disservice by entering a profession that is quickly declining and has the worst return on investment out of all other healthcare professions.

With all due respect, ECs and work experience will not trump the below for any of the medical professions listed.

PharmCAS GPA: 2.83
Notable GPAs
- Math: 3.59
- Microbiology: 3.10
- Physics: 3.17
- Social/Behavioral Science: 4.00
~ the rest are between 2.3-3.0

Reluctance to take a standardized exam will also not do you any favors @ursaruna

GRE, DAT, MCAT all take time and discipline to prepare for.

 

[ursaruna]

By not taking the PCAT, you limit yourself from casting a wider net in order to land potential interviews (especially with your low par GPA).

That said, some will compute a "prerequisite" GPA as well as other calculated cumulative scores put out by PharmCAS. I suggest to study and get as close to a 430 pt scale (90th percentile) on your PCAT to help alleviate a low GPA. Lastly, you don't have much room to bargain if you are limiting yourself from pop up schools but not top tier schools. In your case, no real difference of program you apply to since you don't plan on going to a top tier institute.

I'm not looking for top tier schools, but somewhere in between. Like a decent and good school. Preferably not a pop up school. If I were to get a 90th percentile on the PCAT, what schools would you think would be interested in taking me as a candidate?

 

[ursaruna]

Aside from your GPA your extracurriculars and work experience is pretty impressive. Why not aim for a profession with better prospects than pharmacy (eg PA, dentistry, MD/DO, or anything else really)? You will be doing yourself and disservice by entering a profession that is quickly declining and has the worst return on investment out of all other healthcare professions.

I always wondered how dentists successfully make it in the world since most dental clinics around here have only...one dentist. Meaning they own the business. Meaning they must have collateral or financial resources even AFTER graduating from dental school with the student debt to further put in money to start their own business. That is something I don't have. And yes I know there are chain dental clinics too, but the prospect of getting a job there I heard is slim.

PA I was considering, but I didn't have very good first impressions with them. Sure they're knowledgeable and hard workers, but with the doctors I scribed and the amount of help they ask from their doctors...it's kinda...underwhelming. And it's not their fault because they didn't go through enough school to learn it! In fact it's because of constantly asking for advice or insight into possible diagnoses over and over from doctors (around 2/3 of her day's patients) that it makes me feel inadequate if I were a PA. Not to mention I also seen noncooperative doctors that just leave their PA in the dark after work hours to figure it out on her own is also not fun.

It is because I've medical scribed that I see just how little patient interaction there is as a MD and PA that it turns me away from the profession (also there's no way my grades will land me into a MD anyway). If I wasn't there, the MD would be literally staring at his tablet thumbing and poking away at the screen rather than have direct interaction with the patient. As much as direct interaction goes it usually is when the MD performs the physical exam and enters the room. For the PA it is even worse as they document like crazy. And I like to talk and face with people even if it's a few minutes of consultation, which is much more than the doctors and PAs I've worked with (and this is in family medicine as well where I would think they should have the most interaction). Probably went hand in hand with waitressing so long.

Regarding the investment, I have the pharmD financially covered which is why I stated loans are not a problem for me. Well, the wording was a bit weird on that one. I meant I would get out of a pharmD debt-free.

Also on a personal scale it's something I kinda have done with my mother since very young with chinese medicine and we still do it. Our kitchen closet looks like it would come out of an ancient chinese apothecary shop. Gingseng, mint, dried gogi berries, dried dandelions, cinnamon sticks, and the list goes on all sitting in glass jars. We make a lot of herbal infusions with them for different ailments. So I took a liking to naturopathic pharmacy and wanted to pursue it.

 

[Timbo]

I always wondered how dentists successfully make it in the world since most dental clinics around here have only...one dentist. Meaning they own the business. Meaning they must have collateral or financial resources even AFTER graduating from dental school with the student debt to further put in money to start their own business. That is something I don't have. And yes I know there are chain dental clinics too, but the prospect of getting a job there I heard is slim.

You may have to ask dental forum about this but if you look at statistics (current and projected), dental is much better off. Current dentist unemployment rate is lower than pharmacist. BLS projects dentist jobs to grow 20% over the next 10 years, meanwhile pharmacists will only grow 6%. Recent HRSA publication projects 14.1% oversupply of pharmacists by 2030. That's like 18k unemployed/underemployed pharmacists.

PA I was considering, but I didn't have very good first impressions with them. Sure they're knowledgeable and hard workers, but with the doctors I scribed and the amount of help they ask from their doctors...it's kinda...underwhelming. And it's not their fault because they didn't go through enough school to learn it! In fact it's because of constantly asking for advice or insight into possible diagnoses over and over from doctors (around 2/3 of her day's patients) that it makes me feel inadequate if I were a PA. Not to mention I also seen noncooperative doctors that just leave their PA in the dark after work hours to figure it out on her own is also not fun.

Newly graduated PAs will ask a lot of questions of course, but I have seen incredibly experienced PAs who really know their **** as well. And even MDs will often call other specialist MDs for recommendations too. What about pharmacists? We don't see patients, diagnose, or prescribe (and when we do it is on a very limited basis where we have to adhere to a strict protocol). As for the money, PA seems to be the best bang for your buck right now. Only two years of school and you make $90-100k per year right out. You can't beat that. Many foresee saturation soon, but I don't think it will reach the level that pharmacist is at right now.

It is because I've medical scribed that I see just how little patient interaction there is as a MD and PA that it turns me away from the profession (also there's no way my grades will land me into a MD anyway). If I wasn't there, the MD would be literally staring at his tablet thumbing and poking away at the screen rather than have direct interaction with the patient. As much as direct interaction goes it usually is when the MD performs the physical exam and enters the room. For the PA it is even worse as they document like crazy. And I like to talk and face with people even if it's a few minutes of consultation, which is much more than the doctors and PAs I've worked with (and this is in family medicine as well where I would think they should have the most interaction). Probably went hand in hand with waitressing so long.

If you want patient interaction, become a nurse. Pharmacists get even less patient interaction than MDs or PAs in hospitals . If you want to work retail...well we all know how that industry is sinking. In the environment I'm working in, with all the continuous cuts, I feel like I have less and less time to counsel or talk to patients. But even when I do, the impact I can make on patients' health is minimal due to our lack of prescriptive authority. Over half the time when someone has a question for me, I have to tell them to go talk to their doctor because there's only so much you can treat with OTCs.

Regarding the investment, I have the pharmD financially covered which is why I stated loans are not a problem for me. Well, the wording was a bit weird on that one. I meant I would get out of a pharmD debt-free.

GI bill or parents paying for school? Either way wouldn't rather invest your free tuition money into something rewarding?

Also on a personal scale it's something I kinda have done with my mother since very young with chinese medicine and we still do it. Our kitchen closet looks like it would come out of an ancient chinese apothecary shop. Gingseng, mint, dried gogi berries, dried dandelions, cinnamon sticks, and the list goes on all sitting in glass jars. We make a lot of herbal infusions with them for different ailments. So I took a liking to naturopathic pharmacy and wanted to pursue it.

There may be path for this as a pharmacist but I'm not familiar really. Perhaps work in an independent that focuses on selling natural meds as well. However independent pharmacies are going the way of the dinosaurs the way PBMs are reimbursing them. Why not just become a naturopath?

 

[Weirdy]

There will be less patient interaction as a pharmacist compared to MD/PA/RN.
Even with the constant changes in EHRs.

You are a scribe. You have first hand accounts of this. Am not sure why you would think pharmacists have greater patient interactions than you have already witnessed.

 

[ursaruna]

There will be less patient interaction as a pharmacist compared to MD/PA/RN.
Even with the constant changes in EHRs.

You are a scribe. You have first hand accounts of this. Am not sure why you would think pharmacists have greater patient interactions than you have already witnessed.

Well I only ever worked with two doctors. But between those doctors it's true. The first one just whizzed through patients - cramming as many as he can in a day. He owned the clinic and treats it like a business. But it left a bad taste in my mouth seeing how his patients were upset they waited an hour to see him to only get like a 7-8 minute consultation mostly of him talking over the patient. In the words of another doctor that worked there "he's a better businessman than a doctor".

The second one I worked for cared more but when I first shadowed him there without a scribe to learn the workflow, he was staring more at his screen than the patient. Except when performing the PEx and coming in to talk a little bit about the patient's HPI. It's not very ideal.

I see more face to face interaction with the pharmacists I've worked with than those two doctors. This is what I have witnessed under my experiences. And note my experiences is a small sample size. 2 doctors, 2 NPs, and one PA.

I also like the work-life balance in pharmacy. As in the words of one of the pharmacists told me "it's a good job for mothers letting you make a decent salary while working part time and spending time with your family". An MD and NP on the other hand...lets just say that it often comes to staying 1 or 2 hours after work finishing up documentation while my doctor goes through all the notes left for him by MAs at the end of the day. You can imagine if the doctor didn't have a scribe there he would spend an extra hour.

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I also work for a pharmacist that tells me over and over to avoid pharmacy school. And he would rather go for a doctor if he were in my shoes. So I asked him why he didn't go become a doctor. He just told me cuz he wasn't a smart man. So I asked if he would rather be a doctor, why not go back to school to become a doctor. He complains about being too old (he appears to be in his 30s). He also told he regretted not doing residency as he feels it's one of the biggest reasons he's stuck in retail. He didn't pursue residency because he was sick of school and just wanted to start making money.

I told him he has a leg up because of his knowledge in medicine and credentials as a pharmacist to go into medical school. If I were in his shoes, sure I pursue something higher like a DO and it helps that I have the salary of a pharmacist to help pay for school. But I'm not. I'm just a student. I've worked with first-generation and international students also pursuing the medical field and most of them aren't pursuing an MD either. It's really easy to tell someone to pursue an MD, but to us first-gens it's like telling us to land on Mars. We don't have the resources, connections, or support networks - and then there are those with language barriers. Plus some of the onboarding scribes I've trained are orphans. These two were pursuing an MD, but one's goal is to score in the 80th percentile on the MCAT. In the end he settled to be a preceptor scribe for various specialties. The other settled to work for a pharmaceutical company making a 50k salary.

The % chance of becoming a doctor for a foreign student from ground 0 I feel is very very small. And regarding the tuition for medical school, it's not happening. It's only applying to pharmacy school. But if I were a pharmacist, I would very much pursue an MD or DO. I might have to take out loans, but it is less risky because I can fall back on pharmacy than as a student pursuing an MD or DO. At least that's how I feel about the situation.

 

[ursaruna]

You may have to ask dental forum about this but if you look at statistics (current and projected), dental is much better off. Current dentist unemployment rate is lower than pharmacist. BLS projects dentist jobs to grow 20% over the next 10 years, meanwhile pharmacists will only grow 6%. Recent HRSA publication projects 14.1% oversupply of pharmacists by 2030. That's like 18k unemployed/underemployed pharmacists.


Newly graduated PAs will ask a lot of questions of course, but I have seen incredibly experienced PAs who really know their **** as well. And even MDs will often call other specialist MDs for recommendations too. What about pharmacists? We don't see patients, diagnose, or prescribe (and when we do it is on a very limited basis where we have to adhere to a strict protocol). As for the money, PA seems to be the best bang for your buck right now. Only two years of school and you make $90-100k per year right out. You can't beat that. Many foresee saturation soon, but I don't think it will reach the level that pharmacist is at right now.


If you want patient interaction, become a nurse. Pharmacists get even less patient interaction than MDs or PAs in hospitals . If you want to work retail...well we all know how that industry is sinking. In the environment I'm working in, with all the continuous cuts, I feel like I have less and less time to counsel or talk to patients. But even when I do, the impact I can make on patients' health is minimal due to our lack of prescriptive authority. Over half the time when someone has a question for me, I have to tell them to go talk to their doctor because there's only so much you can treat with OTCs.


GI bill or parents paying for school? Either way wouldn't rather invest your free tuition money into something rewarding?


There may be path for this as a pharmacist but I'm not familiar really. Perhaps work in an independent that focuses on selling natural meds as well. However independent pharmacies are going the way of the dinosaurs the way PBMs are reimbursing them. Why not just become a naturopath?

If one is willing to relocate anywhere then you will find a job as a pharmacist. I'm not a fan of diagnosing. Nor any surgical procedures. Hate blood. I can stand working with dead things like cadavers, but not the living. Don't have to deal with that in pharmacy.

I think when I mention patient interaction, it's more on the "customer side of things". And I definitely don't want to work in hospital pharmacy. I think you underestimate how much impact your consults and checks are in pharmacy. You are the last line of defense between a patient's medication and them taking it. There are so many errors on the doctors' side of things, I believe a pharmacist's role is vital. Some things I found common related to prescriptions are sound-alike drug names, misinterpretations of abbreviations, and uncommon shorthands. Some doctors even are aware of their mistakes, but still do it anyway and expect the pharmacy to understand it. You NEED pharmacists because of these issues! And it's quite common.

Also, I see plenty of patients that go see their doctors but don't have money for the medication. Especially apparent during donut hole times. Like what's the point of diagnosing if you they can't obtain the solution? They mind as well save their time and go to a local pharmacist to recommend them something OTC and affordable. Imo it's better than spending time and money for a doctor's visit that doesn't include an affordable solution.

 

[Timbo]

I also like the work-life balance in pharmacy. As in the words of one of the pharmacists told me "it's a good job for mothers letting you make a decent salary while working part time and spending time with your family". An MD and NP on the other hand...lets just say that it often comes to staying 1 or 2 hours after work finishing up documentation while my doctor goes through all the notes left for him by MAs at the end of the day. You can imagine if the doctor didn't have a scribe there he would spend an extra hour.

If one is willing to relocate anywhere then you will find a job as a pharmacist.

These are two contradictory statements. If you're going to be a mother and have a family, you are NOT going to have the flexibility to relocate anywhere. I mean unless you're okay to randomly move your family to Alaska because you found a part time position there. Secondly, the saying that you will find a job if you are willing to relocate anywhere will only be true for so long. It's still possible today, but 10 years from now? Unlikely. People keep telling themselves these rural areas are an infinite bottomless well for jobs. You realize that there are currently~15,000 new pharmacists graduating per year meanwhile retail pharmacists have been continuously closing, merging with other companies, and cutting hours right? Just in the past few years, CVS merged with Target, Walgreens bought out half of Rite Aid and closed most of those stores, Shopko closed all their pharmacies. I work for one of the largest chains in the nation (I won't say which), but last year we probably hired like 5+ pharmacists in our district. This year we hired 1 and are no longer hiring any interns. Same thing is happening in our neighboring district. Same thing happening in another state according to a friend of mine. Things are getting bad fast. Although I agree with you that the work life balance as an MD can be terrible.

I'm not a fan of diagnosing. Nor any surgical procedures. Hate blood. I can stand working with dead things like cadavers, but not the living. Don't have to deal with that in pharmacy.

I ask many of my students why they chose pharmacy and this is the #1 answer. In my opinion this is a terrible reason to choose pharmacy because you are choosing a profession based on the negatives of other professions. Secondly if you don't have diagnostic or procedural skills, what else do you have that's not easily replaceable by technology? All this drug knowledge you have memorized in your head is available to anybody with a smart phone or the internet. Also pharmacy computer software is getting smarter and smarter by the day. They detect drug interaction, automatically calculate recommended dosages, make formulary suggestions, etc. The need for pharmacist will continue to decrease because of this.

I think when I mention patient interaction, it's more on the "customer side of things". And I definitely don't want to work in hospital pharmacy. I think you underestimate how much impact your consults and checks are in pharmacy. You are the last line of defense between a patient's medication and them taking it. There are so many errors on the doctors' side of things, I believe a pharmacist's role is vital. Some things I found common related to prescriptions are sound-alike drug names, misinterpretations of abbreviations, and uncommon shorthands. Some doctors even are aware of their mistakes, but still do it anyway and expect the pharmacy to understand it. You NEED pharmacists because of these issues! And it's quite common.

No need to lecture me lol. I work as a retail pharmacist. Yes you catch errors and I'm not saying pharmacists aren't needed. But what happens when you catch an error? You call the doctor's office to talk to the receptionist to make sure they didn't mean Macrobid instead of Macrodantin. Legally you're not allowed to make any clinical judgments even though you know the patient most likely needs Macrobid BID not Macrodantin. Then the patient is angry at you because prescription wasn't ready as promised. Then you are behind in queue because of this issue so then corporate gives you crap because script count is down and you got a bad customer review.

Also, I see plenty of patients that go see their doctors but don't have money for the medication. Especially apparent during donut hole times. Like what's the point of diagnosing if you they can't obtain the solution? They mind as well save their time and go to a local pharmacist to recommend them something OTC and affordable. Imo it's better than spending time and money for a doctor's visit that doesn't include an affordable solution.

90% of the time, if the patient is on a prescription medication either 1) they are no OTC equivalent or 2) doctor has already tried to put them on OTC or non-pharm therapy first and it hasn't worked. Yes there are times when I do help people like that, but only very rarely.

I also work for a pharmacist that tells me over and over to avoid pharmacy school. And he would rather go for a doctor if he were in my shoes. So I asked him why he didn't go become a doctor. He just told me cuz he wasn't a smart man. So I asked if he would rather be a doctor, why not go back to school to become a doctor. He complains about being too old (he appears to be in his 30s). He also told he regretted not doing residency as he feels it's one of the biggest reasons he's stuck in retail. He didn't pursue residency because he was sick of school and just wanted to start making money.

I told him he has a leg up because of his knowledge in medicine and credentials as a pharmacist to go into medical school. If I were in his shoes, sure I pursue something higher like a DO and it helps that I have the salary of a pharmacist to help pay for school. But I'm not. I'm just a student. I've worked with first-generation and international students also pursuing the medical field and most of them aren't pursuing an MD either. It's really easy to tell someone to pursue an MD, but to us first-gens it's like telling us to land on Mars. We don't have the resources, connections, or support networks - and then there are those with language barriers. Plus some of the onboarding scribes I've trained are orphans. These two were pursuing an MD, but one's goal is to score in the 80th percentile on the MCAT. In the end he settled to be a preceptor scribe for various specialties. The other settled to work for a pharmaceutical company making a 50k salary.

The % chance of becoming a doctor for a foreign student from ground 0 I feel is very very small. And regarding the tuition for medical school, it's not happening. It's only applying to pharmacy school. But if I were a pharmacist, I would very much pursue an MD or DO. I might have to take out loans, but it is less risky because I can fall back on pharmacy than as a student pursuing an MD or DO. At least that's how I feel about the situation.

He's right he IS too old to pursue an MD (financially speaking). Medical school is 4 years + 3-7 years residency. By the time he finishes school and pays off all his loans, he will already be near retirement age. And why exactly is your pharmacy school tuition going to be paid for but not medical school? For most people it's completely financially stupid to plan to go to pharmacy school first then go to med school. You would have essentially wasted 4 years of your life plus like +$150k worth of tuition and fees. And if you go to med school immediately after pharmacy you would be letting that +$150k loan grow at an interest of 7% WHILE taking an additional six figure loan for med school. Be ready to be in debt forever if that's your strategy.

 

[ursaruna]

Can anyone tell me which schools that will take a 90th percentile on the PCAT with my Pharmcas GPA?

 

[BC_89]

if I were a pharmacist, I would very much pursue an MD or DO. I might have to take out loans, but it is less risky because I can fall back on pharmacy than as a student pursuing an MD or DO. At least that's how I feel about the situation.

This is a waste of resources, time, and opportunity cost. If you want MD/DO fine. You have to do a DIY post-bac and do much better in school. However, if your running to pharmacy only to have an end goal of being a doctor, you need to reevaluate the idea of being a full-time student for a living with debt and no income. You will burn out and regret not just pursuing what you wanted in the first place while putting your health at risk.

As for your question regarding a 90% percentile PCAT: Yes, some new candidate status or "pop-up" pharmacy program will take you. These days maybe other programs if you cast a wide net. Since your schooling somehow is covered, apply to a majority and wait for the email letter for an interview invite.

Fair warning though, If your study habits don't change you will fail out before graduation. Getting a fulltime job as a pharmacist is high risk, but don't let the schooling fool you. It is no cake walk.

 

[VictorOfHungerGames]

It wouldnt matter what your gpa is or whether some schools take pcat or not. The real question is will you have a job once you torture yourself through pharm school, somehow pass your boards (even if you get into a pharm school, based on your current gpa your chances of passing classes in pharm school such as ID and cardio are pretty low, let alone pass the board), you probably will be jobless for up to a year after graduating. Once the employers such as myself see that you just graduated and didnt have a job for months, i probably would pass on your resume anyways. Basically, i am not hiring simply bc you would have to complete with hundreds of other pharmacists who are much more experienced and skilled than you are.

After all that you still wanna go to pharm school, be in debt with $200k+ loans and become nothing more than a glorified pill pusher, then have at it lol

 

[Nguyen]

Can anyone tell me which schools that will take a 90th percentile on the PCAT with my Pharmcas GPA?

No, we cannot tell you which schools will accept you based on your PharmCAS GPA and 90%tile PCAT because we aren't faculties there nor do we have any affiliations with these schools. Your best shot? Obtain the highest PCAT score you can get and apply broadly- starting from ground up (lowest rank to highest rank pharmacy schools). This is to increase your chances of being accepted the first time you apply.

 

[PharmtoCS]

Can anyone tell me which schools that will take a 90th percentile on the PCAT with my Pharmcas GPA?

Any school. Getting a 90th percentile merely gives you brownie points if you alredy qualify for $200k+ in student loans or can otherwise demonstrate that you have the ability to pay their tuition.

 

[right500]

School admission stats are available here. You have a wide variety of schools at your disposal.

Not to belabor the point but pharmacy is on a downward trend. Optometry and podiatry (eyes and feet) are often underappreciated fields and I expect diabetes and population-level aging to drive increased demand in both. DO physician schools could be on your radar with those stats if you pump up your overall GPA somewhat (there are many unconventional career fields for physicians). Depending on how long since you took certain classes, you may have to retake them.

 

[VictorOfHungerGames]

Any school. Getting a 90th percentile merely gives you brownie points if you alredy qualify for $200k+ in student loans or can otherwise demonstrate that you have the ability to pay their tuition.

Well as long as youre breathing and able to sit through boring lectures and torture yourself for no reason just to dispense metformin all day, i dont see why anyone shouldnt be a pharmacist lol oh btw, you wont have a job once you graduate no matter what your gpa or pcat score wouldve been. Just fyi.

 

[sunshao]

UW is a good school. I would look at schools affiliated with fellowships/residencies and look at the residency programs that have accepted residents from which school mostly. Also, got any good recipes from your time working in the Asian restaurants?

 

[ursaruna]

School admission stats are available here. You have a wide variety of schools at your disposal.

Not to belabor the point but pharmacy is on a downward trend. Optometry and podiatry (eyes and feet) are often underappreciated fields and I expect diabetes and population-level aging to drive increased demand in both. DO physician schools could be on your radar with those stats if you pump up your overall GPA somewhat (there are many unconventional career fields for physicians). Depending on how long since you took certain classes, you may have to retake them.

I have actually researched on optometry in the past and I believe by US Bureau of Labor states that the last time I checked available jobs were around the 5,000-8,000 range...NATIONALLY. That is extremely low mind you. Way worse than pharmacy. Also I would really like to work in the state I grew up in since I've worked really hard to build the rapport with pharmacists and doctors I've worked with here - that and I am handling medications and patient visits of a lot of people I know such as my high school teachers and fellow students from past. I like working with the community I am in now, but of course I am also open to moving out-of-state as needed.

I mention this because if you have ever been to Oregon, there is a crap ton of podiatrists and chiropractors here. At least from the towns I've been in. Physician schools on the other hand...I have to admit it was really fun working with doctors as a scribe and to follow their thought patterns when it comes to diagnosing, but I'm going to be honest that I'm not a fan of the extremely long work hours. UNLESS you own your own practice, sure, but most of the doctors that I know who own their own practice (or at least the ones I've worked with) already have the financial backing to start that. And I don't. Not saying it's impossible, but highly improbable is what I'm trying to imply.

 

[GravityBeetle]

I have actually researched on optometry in the past and I believe by US Bureau of Labor states that the last time I checked available jobs were around the 5,000-8,000 range...NATIONALLY. That is extremely low mind you. Way worse than pharmacy. Also I would really like to work in the state I grew up in since I've worked really hard to build the rapport with pharmacists and doctors I've worked with here - that and I am handling medications and patient visits of a lot of people I know such as my high school teachers and fellow students from past. I like working with the community I am in now, but of course I am also open to moving out-of-state as needed.

I mention this because if you have ever been to Oregon, there is a crap ton of podiatrists and chiropractors here. At least from the towns I've been in. Physician schools on the other hand...I have to admit it was really fun working with doctors as a scribe and to follow their thought patterns when it comes to diagnosing, but I'm going to be honest that I'm not a fan of the extremely long work hours. UNLESS you own your own practice, sure, but most of the doctors that I know who own their own practice (or at least the ones I've worked with) already have the financial backing to start that. And I don't. Not saying it's impossible, but highly improbable is what I'm trying to imply.

Not sure where you found 5000-8000 jobs? According to BLS, there were 40k total number of jobs in 2016 which is expected to grow by an additional 7200 over the next 10 years. In 2017 there were 1658 graduates from optometry school. So for optometry supply is growing 2.3x faster than demand (1658 divided by 720) although they are probably not taking into account people retiring and graduates not going into traditional optometry positions. In the meanwhile pharmacy is expected to only grow at 17,400 jobs over the next 10 years according to BLS, but almost 15k pharmDs graduate each year. This means pharmacist supply is growing over 8x demand. There's no argument which is worse.

Also I have some experience applying for jobs in Oregon last year. I used to work for a large national chain and called the district manager for Oregon to see if I could get a transfer there. He told me they haven't hired a single new pharmacist in the Portland area for over 6 years.