Am I making a horrible mistake?

[Discovered Attack]

Here's my story, sit back because it's a trip.

I did pretty well in high school but decided the SATs weren't worth studying for. Got a score somewhere in the 2000's and was happy going to a mid tier school. A family friend suggested I apply for a dual admissions program for MD/DO schools and I ended up being accepted for several of them. I ended up going to a university partnered with a DO school. Provided I hit a certain GPA (I think 3.3) and a certain MCAT score (26 I believe) I would be admitted to the medical school. The GPA really wasn't an issue, I ended up getting something like a 3.7 after three years there. Having the guarantee of a seat in medical school made me complacent about studying for the MCAT however. I got a 24 the first time just winging it and I figured I would just wing it a couple more times until I hit it. I ended up getting a 24, 22, 24 and finally 27. Things are looking up at this point, I completely screwed myself for MD schools but who cares right? I have a guaranteed seat in my DO school.

Well, my parents decided that because of my careless attitude I should find my own way to pay for the final year of college (this was after I got a 24 on my 3rd attempt and my parents were convinced I was not going to hit my score). That happened this summer. I somehow managed to scrape some loans together to finance my final year but since it took some time there was a hold on my transcript and I wasn't able to get my application to the DO school in on time (nullifying my dual admissions seat). I finally got my transcript hold taken off and my primary out. I applied only to DO schools because I figured I was screwed for MD anyway because my multiple wings. I got my secondaries 2 weeks ago and am getting them out just now. I'm in a situation where it's so late in the cycle that I am probably not going to get into any DO schools. To make matters worse, I was homeless for part of the semester (literally living out of my car) and ended up FAILING an english req I was taking online and got a C+ in another class. My transcript was out before this happened but my GPA tanked to 3.5. I'm re-taking the english class next semester but I don't know what I should do now. I am seriously considering applying to Caribbean schools that start in August.

TL;DR

Took MCAT 4 times and got 24, 22, 24, 27
Have a GPA of 3.5

Am I making a mistake? Will I even be successful attending a Caribbean school or should I start looking at other professions? I know I can definitely do a lot better than my scores suggest. I don't know if it is worth it to waste a year and still be marked as a "re-applicant" for DO schools next cycle. I'm still young (21 y/o) and I made a lot of dumb mistakes in the past couple months that are already costing me. What should I do?

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[Skip Intro]

What should I do?

What should you do? Grow up.

You can't "wing it" as a doctor.

 

[Skip Intro]

I applaud your parents, by the way, for cutting the umbilical cord and pulling the pacifier out of your mouth,

-Skip

 

[Discovered Attack]

What should you do? Grow up.

You can't "wing it" as a doctor.

I appreciate the pacifier jab you made there but if you could elaborate on whether I should 'grow up' at a DO school next year or ship myself away to the Caribbean this coming August and your reasoning behind it, I would like that very much as well! I realize that winging the MCAT (repeatedly) wasn't the best idea ever, but in the situation I was in it made some sense, and to a certain extent even worked out. It was unfortunate that the application portion fell through due to holds on my transcript (poetic justice I guess?) but I am trying to salvage what I can at this point. I wouldn't have the GPA I have if I winged all of my finals and I certainly won't be winging my USMLE's. I just want to be sure I can actually come back to America and have a decent shot at a mid to high-mid tier residency if I do end up going to the Caribbean and if it even makes sense for me to do so.

 

[UBC2014]

Trolllolol

 

[bedevilled ben]

I just want to be sure I can actually come back to America and have a decent shot at a mid to high-mid tier residency if I do end up going to the Caribbean and if it even makes sense for me to do so.

Nobody can give you that assurance, and if they claim that they can then they're lying to you. The future status of Caribbean IMGs is uncertain, and the NRMP landscape is changing every cycle for us. There are still opportunities out there for those that hustle, but you have to manage your expectations, have good planning and alternatives, have access to people and resources, a proven history of hard work, and a little bit of luck. You sound like you're short on all of those things. I'm not saying you shouldn't pursue medicine at all, but I think (especially if you're 21) that you should take a couple of years to get yourself firmly reestablished before considering taking on a half-million dollar 10-year endeavor like medical school. Poke around on these fora and you'll find plenty of stories. Doing poorly at a Caribbean school can leave your career and finances damaged beyond repair.

It's good that you're recognizing that you've made some bad decisions in the past. Make some good ones for a while and see where that takes you.

 

[bedevilled ben]

Trolllolol

The story is familiar enough that it doesn't matter. Everybody wants to think that their story is unique and warrants special consideration, but when you boil it down to the salient details, we've heard most of these songs before.

 

[Mad Jack]

Reapply DO. Even if it takes you a year or two, you're basically guaranteed a residency and are much more competitive for more competitive fields. As a Carib grad, mid and high tier residencies aren't an option for 99% of students. Even as a DO, such residencies will be a fight- mid tier ACGME is doable in many specialties, but takes a lot of work. Not properly preparing for the MCAT was incredibly foolish, but you'll learn your lesson in time.

 

[Skip Intro]

The story is familiar enough that it doesn't matter. Everybody wants to think that their story is unique and warrants special consideration, but when you boil it down to the salient details, we've heard most of these songs before.

I think this is more the story of someone sitting in a palace who had something handed to them on a silver platter and, instead of being grateful and thanking Jeeves for serving him, upended that platter and spilled the caviar all over the floor. Now, he wants to walk away to some other establishment instead of getting down on his hands and knees and cleaning up his own mess.

OP: You are probably a really smart dude. Stuff, for the most part, likely comes to you easily in intellectual pursuits... especially when you're interested in it. I imagine that you probably haven't had to work too hard for anything in your life. You could probably go to medical school in the Caribbean - right now - putz along and do okay. You'll probably even pass the Steps on the first try with your current educational modus operandi, although you probably won't exactly rock them. You won't be a neurosurgeon, or a orthopedic surgeon, or a dermatologist... but I think you're probably more interested in the title "doctor" without actually being one. That may be unfair.

Obviously, I don't know you. (For all I know, you could simply be trolling.) I have met many people like you, though, in my life. Some of them went to Ross. Many of them failed out of Ross.

So, my advice to you - at age 21 - would be to buckle down, study your tookus off for the MCAT, take it again and get a 30+ on it, and re-apply to U.S. medical doctor (MD) granting programs in the next cycle. I would not hurry-up and go to the Caribbean now. That's my advice. Prove that you actually deserve to be a doctor, not that it should simply be handed to you because you're smart.

No one in medicine cares that you're smart; they expect it. They will care if you're lazy.

-Skip

 

[Discovered Attack]

I think this is more the story of someone sitting in a palace who had something handed to them on a silver platter and, instead of being grateful and thanking Jeeves for serving him, upended that platter and spilled the caviar all over the floor. Now, he wants to walk away to some other establishment instead of getting down on his hands and knees and cleaning up his own mess.

OP: You are probably a really smart dude. Stuff, for the most part, likely comes to you easily in intellectual pursuits... especially when you're interested in it. I imagine that you probably haven't had to work too hard for anything in your life. You could probably go to medical school in the Caribbean - right now - putz along and do okay. You'll probably even pass the Steps on the first try with your current educational modus operandi, although you probably won't exactly rock them. You won't be a neurosurgeon, or a orthopedic surgeon, or a dermatologist... but I think you're probably more interested in the title "doctor" without actually being one. That may be unfair.

Obviously, I don't know you. (For all I know, you could simply be trolling.) I have met many people like you, though, in my life. Some of them went to Ross. Many of them failed out of Ross.

So, my advice to you - at age 21 - would be to buckle down, study your tookus off for the MCAT, take it again and get a 30+ on it, and re-apply to U.S. medical doctor (MD) granting programs in the next cycle. I would not hurry-up and go to the Caribbean now. That's my advice. Prove that you actually deserve to be a doctor, not that it should simply be handed to you because you're smart.

No one in medicine cares that you're smart; they expect it. They will care if you're lazy.

-Skip

I can assure you I am not trolling; however, I do wonder often what kind of sick joke life has decided to play on me. Your description of me is eerily accurate enough for me to take your advice into serious consideration. I know that I definitely want to be a physician but I feel like the MD boat has sailed a long time ago for me though. I am not sure how good my chances are with my four scores in the 20's and now a failed course (that granted I'm retaking but it still puts red flags all over my application). I know I can get a 30+ score if I buckle down for the next few months but I fear that it all might be for not. At least with DO schools that have grade forgiveness and consider your most recent MCAT score I stand a decent chance if I get my primary out on Day 1. Some of the newer DO schools that I didn't bother applying to also wouldn't consider me as a 're-applicant' which could guarantee I stay in the states. It's so frustrating to see all of my peers moving on to grad school and me having to sit there and watch. The general consensus here seems to be that Caribbean schools aren't for me (however the reasons seem to be varying).

 

[Skip Intro]

If you go to the Caribbean, you will be getting an MD.

You have sabotaged yourself. Life isn't playing any cruel tricks on you.

You need to learn to both take personal responsibility for your failures... as well as learn how to enjoy and accept your successes.

-Skip

 

[wannabie]

My advice: avoid the Caribbean/international route. As they increase American med schools, the Caribbean ship is sinking FAST. It's already a nightmare. But it's be turning into a death/career trap.

 

[Skip Intro]

My advice: avoid the Caribbean/international route. As they increase American med schools, the Caribbean ship is sinking FAST. It's already a nightmare. But it's be turning into a death/career trap.

Yes and no. Discussed at length in other posts.

http://forums.studentdoctor.net/threads/why-is-the-caribbean-a-bad-decision.1029336/#post-14755866

http://forums.studentdoctor.net/threads/really-lost-need-advice.981187/#post-13848849

-Skip

 

[ChrisGriffen]

Medical school chews this type of person up

DO NOT under any circumstances make this decision without really thinking about it. If you aren't willing to work hard this is not the life for you.


Its not just medical school. This career requires hard work. Ask any attending.

 

[Discovered Attack]

Medical school chews this type of person up

DO NOT under any circumstances make this decision without really thinking about it. If you aren't willing to work hard this is not the life for you.


Its not just medical school. This career requires hard work. Ask any attending.

I doubt I'm going to get 'chewed up' by medical school. I am more concerned about doing well in a Caribbean medical school and realizing it doesn't matter because I can't get matched. If I'm going to take on 400k worth of loans I need to know I'll have a decent shot at making any of it back. Just reading stuff like "A cautionary tale.." is spooking me about this venture.

 

[frappalino16]

The Caribbean schools should always be a last option after expending all your opportunities at matriculating into a US school (MD or DO). No one is entirely sure what the outlook is for current and future IMGs, but one thing is certain. Going to a DO school will put you at an advantage over any IMG when applying to residencies.

 

[IlDestriero]

Your application to MD schools is DOA. Explaining why you repeatedly didn't take the MCAT seriously will make you DOA at any DO interviews you might manage to score.
You need a few years of application rehab showing that you are mature, focused, not an entitled brat, altruistic, etc.
Years.

 

[IlDestriero]

Or roll the dice and take your chances in the Caribbean. Worse case you end up without a residency and 300k in debt. It will take you many years of continuing to live in a car to pay that off without a physician level income.

 

[ChrisGriffen]

I doubt I'm going to get 'chewed up' by medical school...

K.

 

[Discovered Attack]

Sorry for rezzing this thread, I took Mad Jack's advice and reapplied to DO. I have been accepted to 2 schools so far and have 4 more interviews lined up. This has been a pretty stressful time in my life, but if there is anyone else in the type of position that I was in, Don't lose hope and reapply!

 

[Skip Intro]

Sorry for rezzing this thread, I took Mad Jack's advice and reapplied to DO. I have been accepted to 2 schools so far and have 4 more interviews lined up. This has been a pretty stressful time in my life, but if there is anyone else in the type of position that I was in, Don't lose hope and reapply!

Congratulations!

-Skip

 

[Discovered Attack]

Update:

I received some PMs asking what I did to improve as an applicant, etc and what I told my interviewers about my MCAT scores. Since I will no longer be checking SDN, I will try to answer them here. A week after I posted this thread, I started doing patient watches at hospitals in the Boston area. Since I had some research experience from undergrad, I was also able to find a job as a research associate at Dana Farber. I re-took the english class while working those two jobs and got an A. Meanwhile I also worked extensively on my personal statement and made several improvements from the previous cycle. I had it peer reviewed as well as professionally reviewed for grammar/tone.

In terms of the application itself, I applied on Day 1 and applied very broadly. I tried to keep the turnover rate of secondary's to 1-2 weeks. During interviews, not many schools asked about my multiples takes on the MCAT surprisingly. About half were closed book so the issue never came up. In one interview I was asked about them and I was very upfront with what happened. I then explained what I had been doing to make myself a better applicant. I was later accepted to this school. Although it may seem like your application is mediocre or DOA, the reality is that a lot of premed students face similar problems. I think applying early and broadly helped me the most in getting admitted. Thanks everyone that provided input way back in January, and to those considering the Caribbean please take a better look at your application and see if you can get into an american school before making that kind of a decision. Although I was impatient and seriously considering going the Caribbean route several months ago, I am sooo glad I decided to re-apply first.

 

[ewax]

delete

 

[Skip Intro]

Update:

I received some PMs asking what I did to improve as an applicant, etc and what I told my interviewers about my MCAT scores. Since I will no longer be checking SDN, I will try to answer them here. A week after I posted this thread, I started doing patient watches at hospitals in the Boston area. Since I had some research experience from undergrad, I was also able to find a job as a research associate at Dana Farber. I re-took the english class while working those two jobs and got an A. Meanwhile I also worked extensively on my personal statement and made several improvements from the previous cycle. I had it peer reviewed as well as professionally reviewed for grammar/tone.

In terms of the application itself, I applied on Day 1 and applied very broadly. I tried to keep the turnover rate of secondary's to 1-2 weeks. During interviews, not many schools asked about my multiples takes on the MCAT surprisingly. About half were closed book so the issue never came up. In one interview I was asked about them and I was very upfront with what happened. I then explained what I had been doing to make myself a better applicant. I was later accepted to this school. Although it may seem like your application is mediocre or DOA, the reality is that a lot of premed students face similar problems. I think applying early and broadly helped me the most in getting admitted. Thanks everyone that provided input way back in January, and to those considering the Caribbean please take a better look at your application and see if you can get into an american school before making that kind of a decision. Although I was impatient and seriously considering going the Caribbean route several months ago, I am sooo glad I decided to re-apply first.

Again, congratulations. Don't forget everything I said previously. Work hard. Especially if you are smart. Don't be lazy. The journey has not yet even begun...

-Skip

 

[DoctorSynthesis]

I doubt I'm going to get 'chewed up' by medical school. I am more concerned about doing well in a Caribbean medical school and realizing it doesn't matter because I can't get matched. If I'm going to take on 400k worth of loans I need to know I'll have a decent shot at making any of it back. Just reading stuff like "A cautionary tale.." is spooking me about this venture.

Careful dude med school is hard. I'm sure you're capable of it (speaking as a current osteopathic medical student) capable doesn't mean much. Take @Skip Intro advice seriously. You can't just float through DO school you will fail out with this attitude. Come prepared to work your ass off if you do all will be fine. With the attitude expressed in that post you will most certainly be chewed up and I don't say this to be mean I'm just giving you a fair warning.