all hype??

[carve em up]

I can find examples of threads in nearly every specialty listed here on SDN that state "(fill in the blank specialty) has gotten more competitive over the last couple of years." Is this all just a bunch of hype or what?? Clearly 90% of specialties cannot have all gotten more competitive. And I'm not referring to the never competitive FP and psych residencies either.

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[doctorsbookmark]

I can find examples of threads in nearly every specialty listed here on SDN that state "(fill in the blank specialty) has gotten more competitive over the last couple of years." Is this all just a bunch of hype or what??QUOTE]


So funny, yet so true. I noticed that as well

 

[Finally M3]

Heh, we'll find out next year in March if it's all hype

 

[xanthines]

I'm not trying to be an a$$hole here (it comes naturally! ) but if there are more people applying to all of the residencies (more DOs/FMG's/whatevers) and/or the number of slots are decreasing overall (budget crunch) then wouldn't that mean that all the specialties have gotten more competitive?

Just a thought.

-X

I can find examples of threads in nearly every specialty listed here on SDN that state "(fill in the blank specialty) has gotten more competitive over the last couple of years." Is this all just a bunch of hype or what?? Clearly 90% of specialties cannot have all gotten more competitive. And I'm not referring to the never competitive FP and psych residencies either.

 

[Finally M3]

I don't know if it was just my experience on the interview trail, but I met a ton of DOs....

And DOs aren't listed under the US graduate statistic that AAMC compiles....

 

[amdap]

I have heard that many people flocked to peds this year (peds matches were way up this year) because many don't want to deal with aging or chronic care, hospice, etc. - that is one example of how peds may have gotten more "competitive" with just more applicants.

Also, I think standardized test scores (i.e. boards) have raised their average by a bit, so many may feel that they have to do a little better to get where they want. Just a thought.

 

[doctorsbookmark]

I heard people saying..
"PM&R is getting more competitive"
"Anesthesiology is getting more competitive"
"Pediatric is getting more competitive"
"Pathology is getting more competitive"
"Radiology is getting more competitive"
...if everything is getting more competitive.. some specialties must be dropping in popularity!!

Derm? Ophthal?

 

[amdap]

I heard people saying..
"PM&R is getting more competitive"
"Anesthesiology is getting more competitive"
"Pediatric is getting more competitive"
"Pathology is getting more competitive"
"Radiology is getting more competitive"
...if everything is getting more competitive.. some specialties must be dropping in popularity!!

Derm? Ophthal?

I didn't mean to imply peds was actually getting more competitive. I have no idea. I was just offering one explanation of why people might think specialties are getting more competitive. I think all specialties tend to wax and wane over time with supply and demand. There's no magic formula, either - I know someone who matched in ortho with boards below the mean - so I tend to question how "competitive" anything really is, anyway . . .

So, to answer your question carve em up, yes it IS all hype.

 

[ears]

Couple of possibilities.

One, the now-universal (or nearly, anyway) adoption of ERAS means that it's very little effort for people to apply to LOTS of programs, and so they do. Therefore, it may be that over the past few years, the number of APPLICATIONS has gone up (which may be what people are looking at when they say "Foo is getting more competitive!").

Two, the actual Step I scores for each year have been climbing steadily for a while. I think the mean is now more than ten points higher than it was just ten years ago. So even though the people matching into Foo are actually about the same relative to their cohort, their apparent Step I scores are probably a few points higher than they would have been a few years ago.

In either case, you could have people thinking that a field is getting more competitive even though the same number of people are trying to apply with the same kinds of profiles relative to their cohort.

 

[prominence]

So even though the people matching into Foo are actually about the same relative to their cohort, their apparent Step I scores are probably a few points higher than they would have been a few years ago.

Whats Foo???

 

[ears]

It's a secret lifestyle specialty; cushier than Derm, and more money to boot.

But I've heard that it's getting REALLY competitive lately.

 

[mosche]

My usmle is 236, and I have a considerable amount of research (3 primary author, 8 secondary author); however, I doubt that I'll be able to match at a top tier "foo" school-- oh well, there's always derm!

 

[Teufelhunden]

OBGYN, which used to be moderately competitive, is now an easy match (for obvious reasons).

General Surgery also is much less competitve than it used to be (?)

 

[Fermata]

OBGYN, which used to be moderately competitive, is now an easy match (for obvious reasons).

Which is odd because if you can survive the residency.....the fellowships can offer a lot better lifestyle.

 

[Mirror Form]

Which is odd because if you can survive the residency.....the fellowships can offer a lot better lifestyle.

True, but I've heard those lifestyle specialties like fertility are extremely competitive so there's no guarantee that you'll end up with a good lifestyle if you do OB-gyn. And besides, who wants to have to work their a$$ off even harder then a normal OB-gyn resident and deal with all the stress of trying to match into one of those fellowships while doing an ob residency?

 

[avgjoe]

Which is odd because if you can survive the residency.....the fellowships can offer a lot better lifestyle.

Is that true even those practicing MFM? I've heard mixed things - some say good lifestyle/money, some say good lifestyle/terrible money due to malpractice, and others say "why oh why wld you even think of that? )

And how hard are the actual fellowships (during the 3 years I mean?)

now that most residencies are 80 hrs, maybe the numbers for ob will go up soon if this is true since 'surviving the residency' will become easier..

 

[Fermata]

now that most residencies are 80 hrs, maybe the numbers for ob will go up soon if this is true since 'surviving the residency' will become easier..

I don't think this will be happening until the malpractice crisis gets under control.

 

[Finally M3]

I heard people saying..
"PM&R is getting more competitive"
"Anesthesiology is getting more competitive"
"Pediatric is getting more competitive"
"Pathology is getting more competitive"
"Radiology is getting more competitive"
...if everything is getting more competitive.. some specialties must be dropping in popularity!!

Derm? Ophthal?

Peds is getting more competitive?

Radiology is the most competitive of the above you listed. Derm and Optho are still competitive as hell. The increases in PMR, Gas, Path I think are more recent, and are coming at the expense of IM and FP.

Surgery, contrary to popular belief, is still quite competitive. All those unmatched surgery spots last year were prelim spots. There were only 1-2 unmatched categorical spots last year.

 

[Teufelhunden]

I don't think this will be happening until the malpractice crisis gets under control.

This malpractice madness will work itself out in the next 5-10 years. The pendulum has to swing back at some point. And when it does, I think it will be the 'golden era' for OBGYN. Reason? Well, a lot of OBGYNs are retiring early AND OB is less popular than ever among new grads...so I'm anticipating a shortage of OB's in the near future. So, when malpractice finally does get under control, the OBs will be in a good position (supply/demand wise).

Just my opinion.

Oh yeah....and if I'm wrong, I'll just do a fellowship.

 

[Teufelhunden]

True, but I've heard those lifestyle specialties like fertility are extremely competitive so there's no guarantee that you'll end up with a good lifestyle if you do OB-gyn. And besides, who wants to have to work their a$$ off even harder then a normal OB-gyn resident and deal with all the stress of trying to match into one of those fellowships while doing an ob residency?

I've been wondering this myself. I hear REI is a difficult match. Gyn/Onc and Uro/Gyn are also competitive. I think MFM is fairly easy, because of the current climate. God...think about it....with the OB malpractice crisis...who would want to add "high risk" to OB?

With that said, I think I'd like MFM....I think the physiology is enthralling. I thnk it would be a very challenging and rewarding career.

 

[avgjoe]

With that said, I think I'd like MFM....I think the physiology is enthralling. I thnk it would be a very challenging and rewarding career.[/QUOTE]

Exactly - the number of different conditions they see makes it really interesting on a daily basis.
Anyone know if people who do MFM also do gyn? I think I'd miss the surgery aspect of gyn if I just did mfm.
Abt the supply/demand thing, the number of mfm's are also probably reducing dramatically now, therefore resulting in a good time for them once the malpractice issues are worked out.

 

[prominence]

Peds is getting more competitive?

Radiology is the most competitive of the above you listed. Derm and Optho are still competitive as hell.

sorry, dermatology is more competitive than radiology.

 

[euromd]

high-risk OB

 

[Fermata]

sorry, dermatology is more competitive than radiology.

He was talking about those that were in the list.

 

[carrigallen]

General Surgery also is much less competitve than it used to be (?)

Actually this is reversed now.

Gen Surg only had 3 unfilled spots last year (discounting internships) BEFORE the scramble. So, a revolutionary change in the popularity of GenSurg occurred last year. Likely due in part to the 80 hr week regulations.

Of all fields, it is fair to say GenSurg has made the most astounding increase in popularity in the last fiscal year.
***

In general, however, I believe the overall perceived increase in "competitiveness" of many residencies is due to several things:

1. ERAS permits mass applications per applicant
2. Allows ability to apply for "double match" in two different fields
3. Steady decline in Family Practice/Peds applicants
4. Increased interest in lifestyle fields (students less traditional)

For example, in the past an applicant might do double ERAS to apply to both IntegPlastics and GenSurg as a backup. (Since normally plastics is done as a fellowship). Another not uncommon combination is rads/anes.

You can imagine how if 15% of the applicant pool did double match, it would inflate the numbers by 15%. Most of these applicants are "reaching" for a competitive specialty, so they are making the numbers for competitive specialties even higher.

 

[Finally M3]

sorry, dermatology is more competitive than radiology.

I was talking about that list o' programs (rads, gas, pmr, path). Optho, plastics, derm, radonc are the most competitive fields, in part because they have much fewer spots than other fields, and the lifestyles associated with them...

As to increase in popularity of GenSurg...are any programs really following the 80 hour rule? Everything I have heard on the down-low is that they aren't....and now they are using MS3s and MS4s for even more scutwork than ever before (since 80 hour doesn't apply to them).

 

[Pinky]

Several years ago, when the television show "ER" was at the height of its popularity, EM was quite difficult to get into. I wonder if it is still as competitive now that the show isn't as popular as it used to be.

 

[Teufelhunden]

Several years ago, when the television show "ER" was at the height of its popularity, EM was quite difficult to get into. I wonder if it is still as competitive now that the show isn't as popular as it used to be.

I don't know how competitve EM is right now, although I can tell you that around here, it seems like everyone and their stinking brother wants to do EM.