Advice for M3 MD/PhD interested in academic radiology, research

[medM3phd]

Hi radiology, I'm an MDPhD student at a non-MSTP/not top-40 program; PhD was in rads-related engineering (dissertation focused on AI-based medical image analysis); strong publications with citations in good journals/conferences; step1 was 240. I was always into medical imaging, since college bc my background is physics/CS. I would like to maintain some research during residency, perhaps even Holman pathway. My personal goals are to train and work at a large research-friendly academic center in a metropolitan area. Salary isn't a big deal, but I have a family so the idea of owning a home eventually and balancing work/life are important to me. My specific questions are 1. am I competitive for these upper-tier academic programs where I could achieve these goals, and 2. are my specific goals likely attainable in DR? I would appreciate any candid and honest advice - thanks for taking the time

(PS: Full disclosure, another field I was interested in is RadOnc and the outlook over there was somewhat negative on the field)

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[Cognovi]

1. am I competitive for these upper-tier academic programs where I could achieve these goals

Yes, if you get good clinical grades/evaluations.

2. are my specific goals likely attainable in DR?

Yes.

 

[Dave1980]

I would like to maintain some research during residency, perhaps even Holman pathway.

Holman pathway is only for rad-onc I think. You will have time to do small projects on the side during rads residency so I wouldn't take additional time off. Not that many MD/PHD go into rads so i think youll be competitive at all of the top programs.

 

[Glassmaster]

That isn't quite correct. Somewhere on the average of 1-3 DR residents per year do the Holman Pathway: ABR.

To the OP, I wouldn't count on doing the Holman pathway as it ends up being a negotiation with the department to give you that much research time. In general, it has to be the right fit between the department, program, and resident and is something that is applied to once you are already a resident (late R1 or R2). Instead, I would focus on finding the DR residencies that offer a research track, which is generally a year of research during your 4 year residency (though at least one place makes it an extra year in a 5 year residency). Those programs will be interested past research productivity and whether you can discuss your research thoughtfully in addition to the standard stuff like boards scores, grades, and whether you will be a good citizen in the reading room.

As far as owning a house as a resident, that can be done more easily in come cities than others depending on cost of living and housing prices.

Happy to answer any questions about radiology research tracks, the ABR's Holman Pathway for DR residents, etc.

 

[Cognovi]

Holman pathway is only for rad-onc I think.

Of course this is incorrect. Holman himself was a diagnostic radiologist. It just so happens that rad onc, in general as a field, has emphasized research productivity more, both in its recruitment and residency structure. More than 80% of Holman pathway residents have been rad onc. Very few applicants for the Holman pathway have been denied by the ABR. Rather, there is 1) self-selection, and 2) program-selection. If you want to do Holman pathway, you have to convince your program to give you that much time away from clinical service. Often this negotiation becomes contingent on your salary support, which boils down to your ability to win a RSNA trainee research grant ($30k for 1 yr) at the least, or be at a program with a T32 grant.

 

[Dave1980]

Of course this is incorrect. Holman himself was a diagnostic radiologist. It just so happens that rad onc, in general as a field, has emphasized research productivity more, both in its recruitment and residency structure. More than 80% of Holman pathway residents have been rad onc. Very few applicants for the Holman pathway have been denied by the ABR. Rather, there is 1) self-selection, and 2) program-selection. If you want to do Holman pathway, you have to convince your program to give you that much time away from clinical service. Often this negotiation becomes contingent on your salary support, which boils down to your ability to win a RSNA trainee research grant ($30k for 1 yr) at the least, or be at a program with a T32 grant.

Not according to the ABR (ABR)

The Holman Pathway is designed for the exceptional trainee who has both strong clinical abilities and a background in research. Entry implies a commitment to basic science or clinical research. (Trainees who leave the research pathway must complete the standard five years of training, including four years of radiation oncology training.)

 

[guytakingboards]

Not according to the ABR (ABR)

The Holman Pathway is designed for the exceptional trainee who has both strong clinical abilities and a background in research. Entry implies a commitment to basic science or clinical research. (Trainees who leave the research pathway must complete the standard five years of training, including four years of radiation oncology training.)

The Holman pathway is also an alternate DR pathway: ABR

I came from a program that had several people do the Holman pathway. I have very mixed opinions on the caliber of radiologist it produces and only 1 of the ~6 people i knew who did it ended up in academics doing actual research. Most ended up in PP anyway, some ended up in academics lite barely doing any research.

 

[GadRads]

The Holman pathway is also an alternate DR pathway: ABR

I came from a program that had several people do the Holman pathway. I have very mixed opinions on the caliber of radiologist it produces and only 1 of the ~6 people i knew who did it ended up in academics doing actual research. Most ended up in PP anyway, some ended up in academics lite barely doing any research.

Can you clarify on the caliber of radiologist?

 

[guytakingboards]

Can you clarify on the caliber of radiologist?

It's just a numbers game. The average DR resident gets 48 months of radiology time. Due to research time commitments, the Holman residents in my program get 27 dedicated months of DR.

 

[GadRads]

It's just a numbers game. The average DR resident gets 48 months of radiology time. Due to research time commitments, the Holman residents in my program get 27 dedicated months of DR.

I think 27 months is too little. Should be 36 months.

 

[Glassmaster]

As I said above doing the Holman pathway has to be the right fit for the resident and their goals. It makes no sense to do the Holman pathway and then go into private practice. I agree with the above sentiments that for such folks intending to have a more general practice, cutting down the clinical time can only be harmful. On the other hand, if someone is going to be an academic sub-specialist (and also run a research lab), what matters most is getting adequate training in that sub-speciality and related ones during residency and fellowship. Honestly the greatest barrier to that is the ABR's requirement to still do 3 months of mamms (and 4 months of nucs), even if one will never read a mammogram after residency, which reduces flexibility in crafting a clinical schedule that makes the most sense for one's future goals.