A Surge in US Medical Schools
- Thread starter Ericokle
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This guy completely dodges the question:
Oh, OK, sorry to ask such a dumb question.
And yet his answer is inadvertently right on the money.
We will end up competing for jobs just like lawyers, forced more increasingly into employed positions in which we slave away at spirit-breaking medical labor, pushed to move the meat with ever greater "efficiency," all in the name of increasing profits for our hospital employers or mega-groups.
The problem has never been "not enough physicians," the problem is that nobody wants to work in certain places--those places where the proportion of medicare/medicaid patients is highest. The solution to the bogus "physician shortage" is to increase medicare reimbursements to primary care physicians, which will allow them the financial freedom go where you want them.
Oh, OK, sorry to ask such a dumb question.
And yet his answer is inadvertently right on the money.
We will end up competing for jobs just like lawyers, forced more increasingly into employed positions in which we slave away at spirit-breaking medical labor, pushed to move the meat with ever greater "efficiency," all in the name of increasing profits for our hospital employers or mega-groups.
The problem has never been "not enough physicians," the problem is that nobody wants to work in certain places--those places where the proportion of medicare/medicaid patients is highest. The solution to the bogus "physician shortage" is to increase medicare reimbursements to primary care physicians, which will allow them the financial freedom go where you want them.
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The US government is insolvent. Medicare reimbursement is not likely to increase. Frankly, things have gone so far in the wrong direction that there is no solution. The best course of action is to phase out Medicare so that physicians will no longer be dependent on an insolvent entitlement program.
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You said it buddy.
D
deleted89854
Do we really want to end up in a tiered system like law schools have, where admission to a place like Quinnepiac (now with new med school!) is essentially worthless in terms of finding a job. All for the low low price of 40K per year.
I think until we reach the point where we have no residency spots left for Americans, let alone IMGs, we're good to go vis-a-vis training more doctors. There is no need to import thousands of overseas professionals every year to fill spots American students would LOVE to have, if only they could have gotten a med school spot. I've got nothing against an international med student who wants to come to America to make a living, but if we have Americans who want the job it makes absolutely no sense to me not to train THEM instead of importing IMGs.
What I find a bit ominous is that most of these new med schools are going to be privately funded. There are THREE new med schools set to open in my state in the next few years. All three are affiliated with public universities and, as far as I know, all three med schools are privately funded. I can't shake the feeling that these people see a goldmine in terms of skyrocketing tuition costs. They know they can charge whatever for those spots and they will still fill. It's a little scary.
What I find a bit ominous is that most of these new med schools are going to be privately funded. There are THREE new med schools set to open in my state in the next few years. All three are affiliated with public universities and, as far as I know, all three med schools are privately funded. I can't shake the feeling that these people see a goldmine in terms of skyrocketing tuition costs. They know they can charge whatever for those spots and they will still fill. It's a little scary.
So the surge will be in full effect over the next few years? When do you think the stampede might peak?
I agree there're too many med schools in caribbean, upwards of 50 schools. Cash cows. The Big 4 are on same edu standards with the stateside schools though.
Some offshore school may go bankrupt?
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Not right away, but some of them eventually will. When the writing is on the wall, and applicants realize that no one has matched at some of these schools for 3-4 years in a row. It will be over. The big 4 will still survive, but even they will suffer a drop in applicants, because it will be much tougher to match from those schools. It's pretty hard to commit to spending 250-300k on an education which will allow you to maybe get a residency in FM in the middle of nowhere, if you're lucky. The good news is it will be easier to get into an American school, and there will be more American doctors. To me it doesn't make sense, at all, to import so many physicians when we have so many qualified people who are denied a medical education in our own country.
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Well, for some of the more competitive specialties, a hierarchy is already starting to develop, as it is more difficult for applicants from unranked schools to match, given similar step scores.
In all honesty, FMGs (many of whom were academic elites back home) are often far more qualified than these bottom of the barrel kids, who can't get in anywhere.
In all honesty, FMGs (many of whom were academic elites back home) are often far more qualified than these bottom of the barrel kids, who can't get in anywhere.
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Only cream of the crop FMGs get a chance to make it here in the US. I rather have them than American kids, who couldn't get accepted to one of the 120+ schools in the US. If you can't get a 30 on the MCAT and keep a palatable GPA, then it's probably best to try your luck in something else. I see no reason to give them any crutch, simply because of their emblem on their passport.
Everything else equal for 2 candidates, the pecking order is still US MD > US DO >> U.S.-IMGs (within this, Big 4> others) >>> US-IMGs learning in 3rd world non-Eng. school >>> Foreign-born FMGs, correct?
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From a residency director's perspective I agree with you. It is very tempting to take a FMG who has proven himself to be one of the very best students in his home country to even have a shot. This is even more true with the 80 hour work week. There is still the same amount of work to be done in those 80 hours, and a lot of these FMG's have already been practicing medicine for years in their own countries.
From an American citizen's perspective, however, and as a citizen of the world, I disagree. We have plenty of people here in our country who would make great doctors and aren't getting the chance. Why should we bring in foreign nationals to do that work? Also, it is detrimental to the foreign nations, many of which are desperate for quality physicians and healthcare access, for us to drain their top minds and talent in the field.
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Numbers aren't everything. American citizens who grew up in the United States tend to have much more intelligible accents and can understand what their patients are saying more rapidly. Think of it as an efficiency thing. If a foreign IMG doc has enormous knowledge as demonstrated by his test scores, but cannot get information out of a patient and into the IMG's mind as rapidly, he may not be any more efficient than a dumber American who at least knows what the heck the patient is talking about. Same for the other direction : the American might be 'dumber', but at least the patient knows what he's being told, and the American might have greater 'emotional intelligence' and might have a better shot at convincing the patient to change his or her lifestyle.
BTW, my MCAT score was a 38, thanks for asking. I go to a U.S. M.D. school.
BTW, my MCAT score was a 38, thanks for asking. I go to a U.S. M.D. school.
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Depends what field the physician is in. There was a survey done a few years ago, where they asked patients if they wanted a doctor with good bedside manners, or one that was top of the class in medical school.
The patients responded that they prefer a friendly primary care physician, but for a specialist, they preferred that he/she be top of the class. And I have to echo those sentiments.
I don't know why you felt you had to impart your MCAT score. You want a cookie? Oh wait, this is SDN. I'm all out of cookies to hand out.
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Because the first response to my post would be trying to make it sound like I was a dumb American at a bottom of the barrel Caribbean school.
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