2.861 gpa, WHAT ARE MY CHANCES???

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sushichubs

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Hello,

I just completed my 4th year as a UCLA Psychobiology undergrad with an overall GPA of 2.872, (side-note: I completed my major and medical school pre-requisites, but I put a hold on my graduation just in case I decide to take more classes to boost up my GPA). I initially was not aiming toward medicine (I was looking more toward psychology), but after volunteering at several departments at the UCLA medical center, I decided that I really want to pursue a career in medicine. Here are my medical pre-requisite (science) grades:

LIFESCI 1 B+
LIFESCI 2 C
LIFESCI 3 C+
LIFESCI 4 C

CHEM 14A B
CHEM 14B C-
CHEM 14BL C
CHEM 14C C+
CHEM 14CL B
CHEM 14D C

MATH 3B B
MATH 3C C

PHYSICS 6A C
PHYSICS 6B B-
PHYSICS 6C B

PHY SCI 5 C
MCD BIO M140 C
CHEM 153A C
CHEM 153L B

I understand that my grades are far below medical school standards, and possibly many of the SMPs (due to immaturity and a rocky relationship), but I would like to know if I still have a shot at this.

I plan to study hard and take the MCAT this January; I plan on shadowing a doctor during this study period as well. I would like to apply for the fall 2008 SMP admissions early in 2008 (January/February).

My question is do I have a chance at SMPs and eventually medical schools given my undergraduate grades?

And if I do, what else should I do to improve my application for both SMPs and medical schools? Should I take more classes at UCLA after my MCAT (would I be able to submit my SMP application in January/February and say that I'm still taking classes to improve my GPA?). Any suggestions as to what would make me stand-out as an applicant (notable extra-curriculars)?

And how important are the letters of rec.? I have a Japanese T.A. that could probably write me a good LOR (he is now a good friend of mine and can talk more about my character) and probably could get a decent (although less personal) letter from a Psychobiology professor (I got an A in the course); but since I did not perform all that well in the sciences, I probably should not ask, say, my Chem 153L professor for one? Given these circumstances, would you recommend me taking more classes at UCLA after I take my MCAT (and hold off on applying early to SMPs) to get a solid letter of rec. from an academic advisor as well as to boost my GPA?

In brief, what are my chances for SMPs and medical schools, and what would you suggest me doing in the next few years (best plan-of-action/timeline)?

Lastly, where do you guys recommend me applying for SMPs?

I would greatly appreciate your advice; thank you very much for your time!!!
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A Master's doesn't undo a spotty undergrad record. With that said, what's the point of a grad degree if you get screened out due to your undergrad grades? You need to take more undergraduate courses, probably only one year's worth, and get all A's. Get the GPA up to at least 3.0, then apply to an SMP. At least you won't be screened out from most med schools when you do apply.

I don't think any SMPs would really take you unless you had a very high MCAT, except maybe VCU (supposedly they are more "forgiving," when it comes to admissions for the SMP). It's for your own good they don't accept you yet, though. Like I said, get the GPA up to 3.0, then do the SMP.

As far as where to take classes, it doesn't really matter, as long as it isn't a community college. Take them at a school you know you can get a 4.0 in every class.

The Japanese LOR thing, hmmm, not sure a TA would really suffice. Maybe if you could get the actual professor to write you one.

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Do Postbac (informal or formal) at CSULA or another Cal State. I wouldn't try to raise your GPA by taking upper division science courses at UCLA. Do well on the MCAT. If you get a low/mid 30, and raise your GPA over 3.0, you should be a good candidate for a SMP.
 
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VCU is very forgiving for admissions to their SMP-like program, generally you need above a 2.8 and above a 25 MCAT. If you dont get above a 28 I wouldn't bother applying this year. An SMP can help you over come one set of low numbers (traditionally low GPA) but it is much more difficult to overcome low gpa and low MCAT.

The program is quite hard. My classes were as difficult if not more difficult than the first year of medical school. It also really prepares you to do very well in medical school so people who finish the Basic Health Science Certificate Program (cert program) and get in, generally are near the top of the medical school class.

If you can get a 4.0 in the program you will get into MCV provided you are not an arrogant prick during your interview and all other things are in order (volunteering, secondary medical experiences, decent LORs).

Outside of this program there is also EVMS which requires a 2.75 GPA. They generally have an excellent success rate for medical admisisons but admission to their SMP is much more difficult.

I do agree w/ the above posters, especially if you are trying to get into a UC. The safer route would be to improve the Ugrad GPA and then do an SMP. However the quicker route is to just jump right into an SMP. Be warned though, SMPs are generally considered a last chance. If you mess up in an SMP you wont get into medical school, period.
 
Yeah, the SMP is definitely the last resort.

Not to scare you, but you know about the med schools in the Caribbean, right? Well, recently there was a member posting in the Caribbean forums here who got rejected from St George's (The best Carib school, for arguments sake) with a 33 on the MCAT, a low undergrad GPA (~3.0 I believe) and like a 3.0 from an SMP. So doing average to poorly at an SMP can keep you out of a Caribbean school these days.

I'd say do undergrad, then SMP. No need to rush things, one year extra won't kill you.
 
So it seems as though I should raise my GPA before applying to medical schools.

How about this: I score well on my MCATS, apply to SMPs and tell them that I plan on taking some UCLA classes for the spring and possibly summer quarters, take some classes at UCLA as stated (raise my cum. GPA to at least 3.0), attend the SMP in fall '08, do well there (with academics and extra curriculars), and apply to medical schools??

Are there any SMPs (that have a easier program than VCU's) that will be welcoming of me given that I score well on the MCATs and that they know that I will be taking more UCLA classes to raise my GPA in the spring/summer before entering in fall '08?

Will medical schools be more welcoming of me as well, given that I score well on the MCATs and raise my UCLA undergrad cum. GPA to at least a 3.0 in the spring/summer (and does it look bad that I skipped fall and winter '07 quarters to study for the MCATs/shadow a doctor/prepare SMP applications?).
 
sushichubs said:
So it seems as though I should raise my GPA before applying to medical schools.

How about this: I score well on my MCATS, apply to SMPs and tell them that I plan on taking some UCLA classes for the spring and possibly summer quarters, take some classes at UCLA as stated (raise my cum. GPA to at least 3.0), attend the SMP in fall '08, do well there (with academics and extra curriculars), and apply to medical schools??

Are there any SMPs (that have a easier program than VCU's) that will be welcoming of me given that I score well on the MCATs and that they know that I will be taking more UCLA classes to raise my GPA in the spring/summer before entering in fall '08?

Will medical schools be more welcoming of me as well, given that I score well on the MCATs and raise my UCLA undergrad cum. GPA to at least a 3.0 in the spring/summer (and does it look bad that I skipped fall and winter '07 quarters to study for the MCATs/shadow a doctor/prepare SMP applications?).
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I don't understand why you want to keep taking courses at UCLA? According to your transcript you haven't gotten a single A there...
 
Thanks guys, for your input, by the way.

In response to the last comment, I'd like to study hard and perform very well on my January MCAT and apply to fall '08 SMPs in February; therefore, I can only take classes from the spring to summer. I don't think that there is a post-bacc program for that timeframe, and I also heard that taking classes at a school lower in ranking than your undergrad school is unwise (doesn't prove that you've improved). I think that I can do well in the spring/summer at UCLA, since I am now very motivated, living at home, and done with the drama that came with my last relationship. Also, I plan on taking "easy" upper div science courses there (med 99) as well as some GPA boosters that are recommended by peers.

With that said, and if I do all that I stated above and do well, I'm hoping that I have a shot at this. Any advice is appreciated.
 
sushichubs said:
Thanks guys, for your input, by the way.

In response to the last comment, I'd like to study hard and perform very well on my January MCAT and apply to fall '08 SMPs in February; therefore, I can only take classes from the spring to summer. I don't think that there is a post-bacc program for that timeframe, and I also heard that taking classes at a school lower in ranking than your undergrad school is unwise (doesn't prove that you've improved). I think that I can do well in the spring/summer at UCLA, since I am now very motivated, living at home, and done with the drama that came with my last relationship. Also, I plan on taking "easy" upper div science courses there (med 99) as well as some GPA boosters that are recommended by peers.

With that said, and if I do all that I stated above and do well, I'm hoping that I have a shot at this. Any advice is appreciated.
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Up to you, but in general med schools care more about what your GPA is and less about where you received the grades. Getting 4.0 in classes at a cal state will improve your profile much more than getting 3.5s in classes (or worse) at UCLA. I'd just swallow your pride and take classes at cal state. That is, of course, if you care about getting into med school. Of course, you're free to do whatever you please.
 
I'll look into the cal state option... if I can enroll in classes during march-august '08, then I'll give it a shot. I just don't know what the procedures are for someone like me who is still enrolled at UCLA, but finished her undergraduate B.S. degree, and who wants to take additional science classes from march-august '08 to boost up her GPA.
 
sushichubs said:
I look into the cal state option... if I can enroll in classes during march-august '08, then I'll give it a shot. I just don't know what the procedures are for some one like me who is still enrolled at UCLA, but finished her undergraduate B.S. degree, and who wants to take additional science classes from march-august '08 to boost up her GPA.
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Cal State LA has an "informal" post-bac program for people to improve their status. You may want to look into it. Are you done with your degree? Why not enroll immediately?
 
sushichubs said:
So it seems as though I should raise my GPA before applying to medical schools.

How about this: I score well on my MCATS, apply to SMPs and tell them that I plan on taking some UCLA classes for the spring and possibly summer quarters, take some classes at UCLA as stated (raise my cum. GPA to at least 3.0), attend the SMP in fall '08, do well there (with academics and extra curriculars), and apply to medical schools??

Are there any SMPs (that have a easier program than VCU's) that will be welcoming of me given that I score well on the MCATs and that they know that I will be taking more UCLA classes to raise my GPA in the spring/summer before entering in fall '08?

Will medical schools be more welcoming of me as well, given that I score well on the MCATs and raise my UCLA undergrad cum. GPA to at least a 3.0 in the spring/summer (and does it look bad that I skipped fall and winter '07 quarters to study for the MCATs/shadow a doctor/prepare SMP applications?).
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Yes, do this; realize, though, this is your big chance to shine. Make this count. If you have 128 credits right now, and take 15 credits @ a 4.0 this fall, you will end up with a 2.98 by the winter. That's close enough to 3.0 to get into at least VCU's SMP. Don't worry about looking for an easy one; none of them are easy, they are medical school classes. Taking another 15 credits of "easier," science classes in the spring and killing the MCAT (has to be >=30 for you at this point) at a 4.0 in the spring will give you a 3.07.

Make sure you volunteer in the meantime.

With a 3.07, really good volunteer experience, and >3.5 in an SMP should give you a good shot at some schools. Apply MD and DO. Honestly, any school in Cali is probably not a reality at this point for you, though.
 
I checked my gpa, and it's now at a 2.872 (not much of a change, but still...). I really would prefer not taking any classes from now until the end of January (so that I could really focus on studying for the mcats, putting together good applications for the smps, and shadowing/interning two doctors in the area; also, I currently don't really have any transportation means to get to ucla daily, except for a long bus route... but if necessary, I might have to resort to that).

Is 2.872 a good enough overall gpa for some credible smps (my science gpa is probably lower than that, as listed above), or should I suck it up and take a class or two in the fall (sept-dec)? I'd rather take classes in the spring/summer '08 to improve my chances for med schools, which I plan on applying to later down the road, but not for smps (unless I apply to smps later in '08... but doesn't applying late to smps ruin your chances for admissions?).

Also, I don't think that I can get a solid letter of rec. from a chem/physics/bio/math teacher for the smp applications (since I didn't receive any great grades in those classes); but are upper division psychobiology professors okay?

Thanks much!!
 
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I'm taking the mcats this january... and i'm determined to do well (very focused on studying from aug till the test date).

For perrotfish: So an overall 2.8 gpa can get you into many smps...
-What smps did you apply/gain admittance to, and which one did you end up choosing (and why)?
-When did you apply (does it make a big difference if you apply very early in the cycle)?
-What was your mcat score, may I ask?
-What was your undergrad science gpa (does that matter)?
-How important were your letters of recommendations for your smp admissions (who wrote them)?
-What were your extra-curriculars?
-And are you planning to take more undergrad classes to boost up your undergrad gpa (for later medical school admissions)?

Sorry for all of the questions... I just want to make sure that I don't mess up in the whole process.

Thanks much guys!!! :)
 
Don't you have to apply and be waitlisted somewhere to get into Tulane's SMP? I'm assuming the OP isn't going to fill out AMCAS until after the SMP?

Perrotfish said:
SMPs: EVMS, Tulane, Drexel, VCU certificate program. I ended up choosing Tulane because they have a 95% accept rate from their program, are a better school to go to, the program only costs $12,000, and they let you take anatomy with cadaver dissection rather than sticking you in a cell bio class.

When to apply: I think Drexel and Georgetown do rolling admissions, but everyone else evaluates everyone all at once, so it doesn't matter when you apply.

MCAT: 34T. Expect to spend at least 30 hours a week, and probably more like 40-50, just studying for the MCATs for several months beforehand.

Extra Cirriculars: I shadowed a doctor, did some volunteer work with local Catholic Charities, was an SGA rep, and held a lot of positions in my fraternity. Nothing huge or impressive.

More UGrad: No, once you're in an SMP your performance in it is all that matters. Do well and you get into medical school, don't do well and you never will.

Science GPA: Also about a 2.8, no idea how much it matters relative to overall GPA.

Letters of Rec: I have no idea how important they are. Honestly I'm not sure AdComs even really have a consistet opinion about what they want, so when you ask questions about the relative importance of UGrad GPA or Letters of Rec I don't think you're ever going to get an answer that applies to more than one year's adcom at one school.

Good luck with your applications.
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Don't you have to apply and be waitlisted somewhere to get into Tulane's SMP? I'm assuming the OP isn't going to fill out AMCAS until after the SMP?
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Yeah that's true, you need to be waitlisted at a medical school to get into Tulane's programs. All the other ones I listed have no such requirement, however.
 
I'm in a similar situation as the person who started this thread. I've already taken all of the lower-division requirements and some upper-division classes. In the lower-division classes I did terrible (mostly C's and some B's) but did better with the few upper-division classes I've taken (only B's). My GPA is the same (2.87). However, I'm not a science major (Psych). Should I apply for a M.S. program or try for post-bacc? I was interested in SFSU. Can anybody give me their opinion of that program? Thanks.
 
thanks for the response perrotfish... it's given me some hope for now :)
 
Oh man i am going to UCLA as well and i am in MIMG major in similar situation. Pretty crazy.
 
stick with undergrad courses. after all, that's all the AMCAS cares about. plus, UCLA is so rich in resources. the reason why i would not take courses at CSULA is because you have access to world-renowned profs at UCLA. u can plug into their labs, do some awesome research, and get great letters of recs. once u leave ucla, u pretty much cut out the ultimate excuse of being able to approach these world-renowned profs, which is being a UCLA undergrad. so, milk it as much as u can.

at the same time, i wonder whether taking more courses at UCLA would be helpful towards boosting ur GPA given ur past record there. i know UCLA's tough, and people are right, GPA matter much more than where u took ur courses.
 
The reason why I'm choosing smp over more ugrad classes is the time (I think it would take too long to boost up my gpa to a competitive level) and an extra degree (if I don't do well in smp, I still get a masters, although I don't know if that's much of a help). I think that smps somewhat allow you to "start over" in a new setting; if you do well in 1-2 years, some med schools will accept you. Also, if you do somewhat well, some of the smps will accept you into their own med/D.O. school; but I still need to research more on that (like which schools exactly).

If you guys have any more advice, I'd appreciate it. Thanks!!!
 
I think with your GPA you could get into an SMP, but the problem will still be with your UG GPA. I don't agree with one of the previous poster's that said your UG GPA is irrelevant once you do an SMP. Your SMP grades may be great, but with below a 3.0, your application will still get screened out by a decent amount of schools. With a really low GPA (<3.0, and a science below 2.8) your best bet is to keep taking UG classes to get both to at least a 3.0 At least that way you might be able to avoid having your application trashed before a human being ever sees it.

If you are sick of UG classes and just want to get into an SMP, though, I'd reccomend somewhere that has a decent track record of getting their grads into their own med school. EVMS is a good example, I think. Since you can make connections with the department at the school you do your SMP at, you might be able to get them to overlook your UG GPA once you do well in their med school classes. Still, your UG GPA is looked at first, which will put you out of the running at many schools.

Oh yeah, and if you are taking time off from school completely to take the MCAT, make sure you destroy it. Since you should have much more time to study now, you are going to want to be aiming for a higher score than most would be content with.
 
I definitely am looking for those SMPs that really help their grads into their own med/osteopathic school. If you know of any more of such SMPs, I'd love to hear it! I've looked into the EVMS program, but I've noticed that not many apply to their program, and I'm wondering why. I'll try contacting them to get more info.

And I'm also thinking about taking more ucla undergrad science classes in the spring and/or summer quarters to boost up that ugrad gpa (I'm hoping that that would be enough time to boost it up to a 3.0?), but of course, if I can get by without doing so, that would be more ideal (less time, money spent).

Till then, I'm just focusing on the mcats!

Oh, and what about those that have gone to SMPs, but did not eventually make it into medical schools? Do those people benefit from the programs in any way? Just curious.
 
sushichubs said:
I definitely am looking for those SMPs that really help their grads into their own med/osteopathic school. If you know of any more of such SMPs, I'd love to hear it! I've looked into the EVMS program, but I've noticed that not many apply to their program, and I'm wondering why. I'll try contacting them to get more info.

And I'm also thinking about taking more ucla undergrad science classes in the spring and/or summer quarters to boost up that ugrad gpa (I'm hoping that that would be enough time to boost it up to a 3.0?), but of course, if I can get by without doing so, that would be more ideal (less time, money spent).

Till then, I'm just focusing on the mcats!

Oh, and what about those that have gone to SMPs, but did not eventually make it into medical schools? Do those people benefit from the programs in any way? Just curious.
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I think a lot of people apply to EVMS but they don't accept a very big class. I still think your best bet is to take classes at a Cal State until your GPA > 3.0, then SMP.
 
sushichubs said:
Oh, and what about those that have gone to SMPs, but did not eventually make it into medical schools? Do those people benefit from the programs in any way? Just curious.
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Not sure I know what you mean. Are you asking if you can use the degree to help you get a job? It's probably not very useful, to be honest, for anything outside of getting into medical/dental school.

I wouldn't worry too much about getting in somewhere if you do well in the SMP, though. If not an allopathic school, I'd be very confident in your chances of getting into a DO school. They are far more forgiving of low UG GPAs, especially if you show strong improvement. There have been people that get in with sub-3.0 GPAs, given that they have over a 30 on the MCAT. These people didn't even have master's degrees. Check out mdapplicants.com for some anecdotal evidence.
 
drizzt3117 said:
I think a lot of people apply to EVMS but they don't accept a very big class. I still think your best bet is to take classes at a Cal State until your GPA > 3.0, then SMP.
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Agreed on both accounts, both about EVMS and going to Cal State then SMP. They have a small entering class, compared with Georgetown and BU. Cincinnati is also a very small program, and has the advantage that you will have Ohio residency by the end of the program (good if you get into an Ohio med school).
 
sushichubs said:
Hello,

I just completed my 4th year as a UCLA Psychobiology undergrad with an overall GPA of 2.872, (side-note: I completed my major and medical school pre-requisites, but I put a hold on my graduation just in case I decide to take more classes to boost up my GPA). I initially was not aiming toward medicine (I was looking more toward psychology), but after volunteering at several departments at the UCLA medical center, I decided that I really want to pursue a career in medicine. Here are my medical pre-requisite (science) grades:

LIFESCI 1 B+
LIFESCI 2 C
LIFESCI 3 C+
LIFESCI 4 C

CHEM 14A B
CHEM 14B C-
CHEM 14BL C
CHEM 14C C+
CHEM 14CL B
CHEM 14D C

MATH 3B B
MATH 3C C

PHYSICS 6A C
PHYSICS 6B B-
PHYSICS 6C B

PHY SCI 5 C
MCD BIO M140 C
CHEM 153A C
CHEM 153L B

I understand that my grades are far below medical school standards, and possibly many of the SMPs (due to immaturity and a rocky relationship), but I would like to know if I still have a shot at this.

I plan to study hard and take the MCAT this January; I plan on shadowing a doctor during this study period as well. I would like to apply for the fall 2008 SMP admissions early in 2008 (January/February).

My question is do I have a chance at SMPs and eventually medical schools given my undergraduate grades?

And if I do, what else should I do to improve my application for both SMPs and medical schools? Should I take more classes at UCLA after my MCAT (would I be able to submit my SMP application in January/February and say that I'm still taking classes to improve my GPA?). Any suggestions as to what would make me stand-out as an applicant (notable extra-curriculars)?

And how important are the letters of rec.? I have a Japanese T.A. that could probably write me a good LOR (he is now a good friend of mine and can talk more about my character) and probably could get a decent (although less personal) letter from a Psychobiology professor (I got an A in the course); but since I did not perform all that well in the sciences, I probably should not ask, say, my Chem 153L professor for one? Given these circumstances, would you recommend me taking more classes at UCLA after I take my MCAT (and hold off on applying early to SMPs) to get a solid letter of rec. from an academic advisor as well as to boost my GPA?

In brief, what are my chances for SMPs and medical schools, and what would you suggest me doing in the next few years (best plan-of-action/timeline)?

Lastly, where do you guys recommend me applying for SMPs?

I would greatly appreciate your advice; thank you very much for your time!!!
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Don't waste your time... My buddy had a 3.0 GPA & 30 MCAT, great LOR's, Interviews...BLAH BLAH BLAH... He should be 3 years ahead of me but after getting rejected the 3rd year in a row and 10K+ on AAMC application fees, he went to St. George's and is doing just fine... I'm serious though, if the MCAT is a 24-27 and not a 30+, go Caribbean (big 3, ROSS, SGU, AUC) and don't spend years trying to gain admission when you may already be done somewhere else and back in the states...Just my opinion...
 
spreebee said:
Don't waste your time... My buddy had a 3.0 GPA & 30 MCAT, great LOR's, Interviews...BLAH BLAH BLAH... He should be 3 years ahead of me but after getting rejected the 3rd year in a row and 10K+ on AAMC application fees, he went to St. George's and is doing just fine... I'm serious though, if the MCAT is a 24-27 and not a 30+, go Caribbean and don't spend years trying to gain admission when you may already be done somewhere else and back in the states...Just my opinion...
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That's an option but the OP could probably be accepted to a US MD program within two years with a year of good postbac performance and a SMP. I think US DO/MD programs are vastly superior to Carribean if you are interested in anything beyond primary care.
 
spreebee said:
Don't waste your time... My buddy had a 3.0 GPA & 30 MCAT, great LOR's, Interviews...BLAH BLAH BLAH... He should be 3 years ahead of me but after getting rejected the 3rd year in a row and 10K+ on AAMC application fees, he went to St. George's and is doing just fine... I'm serious though, if the MCAT is a 24-27 and not a 30+, go Caribbean (big 3, ROSS, SGU, AUC) and don't spend years trying to gain admission when you may already be done somewhere else and back in the states...Just my opinion...
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Carribean schools, the big 3 included, are an option but not a great one. There are all sorts of issues with variable class work, variable clinicals, difficulties getting a residency not to mention the obscenely high attrition rates.

I personally would recommend you exhaust all other resources before going Carribean.

drizzt3117 said:
That's an option but the OP could probably be accepted to a US MD program within two years with a year of good postbac performance and a SMP. I think US DO/MD programs are vastly superior to Carribean if you are interested in anything beyond primary care.
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I definitely agree.

If you have a solid performance on the MCAT, do very well in a post-bac and do exceptionally in the SMP you will most likely get into an allopatic school. Sure there are a lot of 'ifs' but allopatic is not out of your realm yet.
 
Plus, going to the Caribbean is an even bigger gamble if you had problems in undergraduate courses to begin with, which contributes to the irony of Caribbean med schools; they attract those with bad grades, but the type of person who will survive is the type who is smart and also very self-motivated.

It's a much better idea to do an SMP. Your transition to med school will be easier, because you will be familiar with a few first year courses already. You can gauge your abilities and have a headstart when you enter med school. Worse comes to worse, you head down to the Caribbean after your SMP and know you won't be wasting your money, because you'll know you can pass the material.

I'd probably be put on suicide watch if I was one of those poor souls that wastes 75 grand on a year of med school education in the Caribbean only to flunk out with no degree and no marketable job skill. It is wise financially and emotionally to exhaust options in the US first!
 
Meatwad said:
Plus, going to the Caribbean is an even bigger gamble if you had problems in undergraduate courses to begin with, which contributes to the irony of Caribbean med schools; they attract those with bad grades, but the type of person who will survive is the type who is smart and also very self-motivated.

I'd probably be put on suicide watch if I was one of those poor souls that wastes 75 grand on a year of med school education in the Caribbean only to flunk out with no degree and no marketable job skill. It is wise financially and emotionally to exhaust options in the US first!
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My favorite is people who can't get above a 6 on each section of the MCAT, then expect to go to the Caribbean and pass their boards without thinking twice. The MCAT weeds out a TON of people with better scores, now you're competing on level with people that averaged 10 a section on the MCAT - how is that going to work? There's a reason schools love Verbal scores, they are the best predictor (better than GPA) of board scores.
 
I'm confused about why everyone that wants to get into an SMP takes the MCAT over the GREs when many of the programs will accept GRE scores, which are much easier to score higher with.

I mean, you're going to have to eventually take the MCAT but at least you'll rest easy knowing you made it into an SMP....
 
lindell12a said:
I'm confused about why everyone that wants to get into an SMP takes the MCAT over the GREs when many of the programs will accept GRE scores, which are much easier to score higher with.

I mean, you're going to have to eventually take the MCAT but at least you'll rest easy knowing you made it into an SMP....
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The timing is the issue. If you havent taken the MCAT when you matriculate into the SMP, you will have to wait until the summer after the SMP. It would be near impossible to study for and take the MCAT while keeping up with the work for the SMP. So, with a few months of studying for the MCAT, you would then have to apply late for the next cycle. That means you have a glide year.

Many people take the MCAT before so that they can apply while in the SMP. That way they dont have a glide year. Sure GRE is easier but you're going to have to slay the beast at some point. Might as well be before the SMP.
 
lindell12a said:
I'm confused about why everyone that wants to get into an SMP takes the MCAT over the GREs when many of the programs will accept GRE scores, which are much easier to score higher with.

I mean, you're going to have to eventually take the MCAT but at least you'll rest easy knowing you made it into an SMP....
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probably because it will make you stand out more as long as you dont bomb the mcat, also there might be a chance you do realy well and so all you have to worry about is gpa while in the program
 
Meatwad said:
Yeah, the SMP is definitely the last resort.

Not to scare you, but you know about the med schools in the Caribbean, right? Well, recently there was a member posting in the Caribbean forums here who got rejected from St George's (The best Carib school, for arguments sake) with a 33 on the MCAT, a low undergrad GPA (~3.0 I believe) and like a 3.0 from an SMP. So doing average to poorly at an SMP can keep you out of a Caribbean school these days.

I'd say do undergrad, then SMP. No need to rush things, one year extra won't kill you.
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I have had friends who have been rejected to that carribean school as well. ave gpa 3.4 and mcat 26.

med schools do screen out people with sci gpas less then 2.8--and yours def looks like it. I would say do a post-bac--not a SMP. i think you need to retake your basic science course work.
 
lindell12a said:
I'm confused about why everyone that wants to get into an SMP takes the MCAT over the GREs when many of the programs will accept GRE scores, which are much easier to score higher with.

I mean, you're going to have to eventually take the MCAT but at least you'll rest easy knowing you made it into an SMP....
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i took the gres because i wanted I applied for september and was applying around june. I had a high gpa--for an average SMP applicant. If you have a low gpa (below a 3.1), it is your best interest to take the mcat and show them that you are strong in your sciences.
 
drizzt3117 said:
That's an option but the OP could probably be accepted to a US MD program within two years with a year of good postbac performance and a SMP. I think US DO/MD programs are vastly superior to Carribean if you are interested in anything beyond primary care.
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i disagree with this comment. many of my peers have returned and have gone into Emergency residency and other specialities. YOu just have to work extra hard...just like you would work in a SMP. And everything rides on your boards.

But I do agree that if you get accepted to an allo. school--it is easier to get into a speciality then going to the carribean. but don't feel that it is out of reach if you do choose that road.

any decision you make...there are a lot of "maybes"--but if you do well (high gpa)--then you'll be okay with whatever speciality you want to indulge in.

good luck
 
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