You guys are going to love this.

[TheDeal93]

"I just need to get something off my chest, because it seems to be coming up a lot lately... I hate it when people ask me, "You're so smart! Why didn't you apply to medical school?" First of all, pharmacy school is harder than medical school. Yeah, that's right. If you compare [blank] School of Pharmacy to the School of Medicine, you'll see some stark contrasts. Whereas the medical school is a block-system, PASS/ NO PASS, "exam-every-three-weeks" type of curriculum structured by therapeutic area/disease state, [blank] Pharmacy is a hot mess of 4-5 concurrent courses, ALL GRADED on NO CURVES with exams nearly every single week of the quarter. In fact, this week I have 3 exams in the span of 6 days-- PCOL/PCHEM (which is essentially 2 classes of pharmacology & pharmaceutical chemistry) on Wednesday, biopharmaceutics on Friday, and then my SECOND physiology exam of the quarter on the following Tuesday. I just had my FIRST physiology exam this past Thursday. Additionally, Dr. [blank], PharmD, MD-- [blank title]-- told me herself that pharmacy school is more rigorous than medical school. And this is a lady who went to both. She went to [blank] for medical school and [blank] (a three-year year-round PharmD program) for her PharmD. Unprompted, she told me pharmacy students have it far worse because understanding the chemical basis of drugs-- and how they work in the body-- is more challenging than understanding pathophysiology and disease progression. It's a matter of chemistry v. biology-- if you like chemistry and want to be a health care professional, you go to pharmacy school. If you like biology and want to become a HCP, you go to medical school. So even though doctors are at the top of the health-care hierarchy, just know that PharmDs work twice as hard for half the appreciation. /endrant"

Came across this post online. Had to share it here. Thoughts?

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[Foot Fetish]

I'd rather not work in a CVS telling people where the diaper isle is for the rest of my life...

Anyway, even if the schooling for pharmacy was harder (it's not), the actual day-to-day job of a physician is way more intellectually challenging/stimulating. With the exception of some clinical pharmacists who provide consults, pharmacists do not really do much problem solving. They just move pills. Physicians, on the other hand, have to actually figure out what's wrong with people and how to fix it.

 

[sliceofbread136]

Nobody cares

 

[Psai]

I've never worried about how hard my school is vs others. It's never even crossed my mind to try to compare because I don't feel a need to. Says a lot when others do.

 

[XxThaDoggxX]

Nobody cares

This.

 

[zero0]

That's cool. On an unrelated note, I genuinely worry about pharmacy students. The level of ignorance about future job prospects and the like I see from them rivals that of pre-meds going to the Caribbean. It's a darn shame what's become of that profession.

 

[NaOH]

Ha. Hahaha.

True about the job market though.


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[Doctor Strange]

I was in pharmacy school. Med school is definitely harder.

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[The Knife & Gun Club]

I'm actually curious what the job market looks like for pharmDs after graduation.

Like, I can't imagine all those people are dropping all that money and working so hard (I doubt it's harder than medschool, but sure it's no cake walk) just to work in a cvs/Walmart/whatever. What are the jobs that these people are gunning to get? Inpatient pharmacist? Work for a pharmaceuticals company? Academics/research?

 

[NaOH]

I'm actually curious what the job market looks like for pharmDs after graduation.

Like, I can't imagine all those people are dropping all that money and working so hard (I doubt it's harder than medschool, but sure it's no cake walk) just to work in a cvs/Walmart/whatever. What are the jobs that these people are gunning to get? Inpatient pharmacist? Work for a pharmaceuticals company? Academics/research?

Majority of jobs are chain retail. We've had new schools popping up like mushrooms for the last 8-10 years, most of them private, expensive, and taking very marginal candidates who end up with 200k+ debts and effectively years of indentured servitude to CVS/Walgreens. Academia is pushing to turn us into midlevels, creating 1 and 2-year residencies (and I've heard calls for a PGY-3, wtf). Unfortunately, with the saturation in much of the country a residency is basically required even for staff jobs. Training us for more clinical duties is fine, but we still haven't figured out how to get paid for it, so a lot of hospitals aren't interested in adding the positions.

The comparison to Carib med schools is sadly appropriate.


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[Dires]

that reeks of insecurity

 

[evilbooyaa]

 

[deleted480308]

I've done tar roofing in fl......take that pharmacy and med school!

 

[evilbooyaa]

Damnit, doesn't seem to be working:
To those dedicated, http://giphy.com/gifs/new-O5NyCibf93upy

 

[Strider_91]

I've done tar roofing in fl......take that pharmacy and med school!

This. Crazy appreciation for education after you work a job that is brutal and realize that you could be doing it for the rest of your life...

 

[PikminOC]

I was in pharmacy school. Med school is definitely harder.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G900A using SDN mobile

You are obviously lying.
Med school and residency are a breeze. Look at all the time we have work jobs while in med school!

 

[AlwaysContrary]

I'd rather not work in a CVS telling people where the diaper isle is for the rest of my life...

Anyway, even if the schooling for pharmacy was harder (it's not), the actual day-to-day job of a physician is way more intellectually challenging/stimulating. With the exception of some clinical pharmacists who provide consults, pharmacists do not really do much problem solving. They just move pills. Physicians, on the other hand, have to actually figure out what's wrong with people and how to fix it.

I would say you're sadly misinformed, lol.

 

[AcademicNeurosurgery]

Nice bump

Not sure why there is this need in health care for each profession to try to flex their muscles. I know it's corny but my experience (albeit somewhat limited) has shown me that a team-based approach really works.

And as a personal aside, I can guarantee I would struggle in pharmacy/nursing/law/business school etc. simply because I am not interested in those fields so I tip my hat to other health care professionals and respect that they are experts in their fields.

 

[BidingMyTime]

I don't think anybody seriously thinks that pharmacy school is harder than medical school, certainly the amount of material covered in medical school is greater. Certainly the lady in the OP's story who graduated both is an outlier, there are *ALWAYS* outliers, look at Dr. Mercola, or even Dr. Oz. If the lady in the OP's story is actually sincere in believing pharmacy school is harder, then I suspect that is because of a difference in the teaching quality and her own personal learning style at her 2 individual schools, her personal experiences are hers, but she is incorrect in applying them to everybody else.

 

[AcademicNeurosurgery]

I don't think anybody seriously thinks that pharmacy school is harder than medical school, certainly the amount of material covered in medical school is greater.

I am curious as to how you came to this conclusion.

 

[AlwaysContrary]

I don't think anybody seriously thinks that pharmacy school is harder than medical school, certainly the amount of material covered in medical school is greater. Certainly the lady in the OP's story who graduated both is an outlier, there are *ALWAYS* outliers, look at Dr. Mercola, or even Dr. Oz. If the lady in the OP's story is actually sincere in believing pharmacy school is harder, then I suspect that is because of a difference in the teaching quality and her own personal learning style at her 2 individual schools, her personal experiences are hers, but she is incorrect in applying them to everybody else.

well medical school is only 2 years of lecture while pharmacy school has 3 years.. hmmmm

 

[tymont12]

well medical school is only 2 years of lecture while pharmacy school has 3 years.. hmmmm

...I don't get why you're trying to start a realllllly arbitrary fight. No one cares that you are wallowing in a 3rd year of classes...med students got better stuff to worry bout.

 

[AcademicNeurosurgery]

...I don't get why you're trying to start a realllllly arbitrary fight. No one cares that you are wallowing in a 3rd year of classes...med students got better stuff to worry bout.

Although their comment was a bit abrasive, there is some validity to it. First, if you look at curricula of pharmacy schools, they take many of the same courses we do (biochem, micro, phys, path, and obviously a bunch of different pharm courses...some even have a gross anatomy course). So it seems like those who are dismissing pharmacy school as being so much easier than med school are making their conclusion based on their belief that pharmacists are inferior. If not, I'd love to see some evidence of how people made this judgment.

Also, M4s at my school (and even on these online forums) boast about how M4 is all downhill after interview season with most being on vacation post-match. It puts things into perspective when you objectively consider how inefficient M4 is for medical students. Might be a bit of an oversimplification but medical school can easily be 3 years + an interview season and that's it, especially if you go into something that doesn't require away rotations.

I don't think the difference between med school and pharm school (or other professional schools) is as simple as people make it out to be.

 

[Dr. Rafiki]

This thread is like those kids in grade school who were always convinced that THEIR dad was so much more bada** than anyone else's dad

 

[AcademicNeurosurgery]

This thread is like those kids in grade school who were always convinced that THEIR dad was so much more bada** than anyone else's dad

There are so many other things to derive satisfaction from in the health care field than whose school was tougher...

 

[sovereign0]

There are so many other things to derive satisfaction from in the health care field than whose school was tougher...

Like digital-manual fecal disimpaction!

 

[Stagg737]

So it seems like those who are dismissing pharmacy school as being so much easier than med school are making their conclusion based on their belief that pharmacists are inferior. If not, I'd love to see some evidence of how people made this judgment.

Based off of the few people I know that went to pharm school then med school, all of them said med school is/was harder. One of them even dropped out of med school to go back to pharm school because they weren't sure they'd make it in med school. Totally anecdotal, but everyone I've talked to in pharm school has made it sound easier than med school. I also don't think pharmacists are inferior, like you said it's a completely different degree.

 

[cakezyum]

I hope I can get a clinical pharmacist job after graduation

 

[AcademicNeurosurgery]

Based off of the few people I know that went to pharm school then med school, all of them said med school is/was harder. One of them even dropped out of med school to go back to pharm school because they weren't sure they'd make it in med school. Totally anecdotal, but everyone I've talked to in pharm school has made it sound easier than med school. I also don't think pharmacists are inferior, like you said it's a completely different degree.

Fair enough, anecdotal evidence from people who have been in both is probably the best we can do. I guess my point is that they are both challenging and any slight difference in difficulty is 1) likely insignificant and 2) serves no purpose other than feeding egos and creating separation between different professionals.

 

[ChordaEpiphany]

.

 

[ChordaEpiphany]

.

 

[meurotic]

Although their comment was a bit abrasive, there is some validity to it. First, if you look at curricula of pharmacy schools, they take many of the same courses we do (biochem, micro, phys, path, and obviously a bunch of different pharm courses...some even have a gross anatomy course). So it seems like those who are dismissing pharmacy school as being so much easier than med school are making their conclusion based on their belief that pharmacists are inferior. If not, I'd love to see some evidence of how people made this judgment.

Also, M4s at my school (and even on these online forums) boast about how M4 is all downhill after interview season with most being on vacation post-match. It puts things into perspective when you objectively consider how inefficient M4 is for medical students. Might be a bit of an oversimplification but medical school can easily be 3 years + an interview season and that's it, especially if you go into something that doesn't require away rotations.

I don't think the difference between med school and pharm school (or other professional schools) is as simple as people make it out to be.

Nailed it.

 

[ChordaEpiphany]

.

 

[Psai]

Although their comment was a bit abrasive, there is some validity to it. First, if you look at curricula of pharmacy schools, they take many of the same courses we do (biochem, micro, phys, path, and obviously a bunch of different pharm courses...some even have a gross anatomy course). So it seems like those who are dismissing pharmacy school as being so much easier than med school are making their conclusion based on their belief that pharmacists are inferior. If not, I'd love to see some evidence of how people made this judgment.

Also, M4s at my school (and even on these online forums) boast about how M4 is all downhill after interview season with most being on vacation post-match. It puts things into perspective when you objectively consider how inefficient M4 is for medical students. Might be a bit of an oversimplification but medical school can easily be 3 years + an interview season and that's it, especially if you go into something that doesn't require away rotations.

I don't think the difference between med school and pharm school (or other professional schools) is as simple as people make it out to be.

Even if course titles are the same, they do not take it into the same depth or breadth as medical students.
Pharmacy school is easier than medical school. They also pick from a weaker pool of applicants.
This has nothing to do with whichever field is "inferior". There's nothing to compare. They are difference.

Let's talk about 4th year of medical school after you've done it, thanks.

 

[Aerus]

There's really no point for medical students to discuss this since the average layman already thinks medical school is harder than pharmacy school, whether it actually is or not. So why are we wasting time debating this? Who are we trying to convince?

 

[JP2740]

Fair enough, anecdotal evidence from people who have been in both is probably the best we can do. I guess my point is that they are both challenging and any slight difference in difficulty is 1) likely insignificant and 2) serves no purpose other than feeding egos and creating separation between different professionals.

There's no comparison whatsoever... I have multiple friends and family members who are pharmacists. It is honestly no comparison whatsoever.

 

[AcademicNeurosurgery]

Even if course titles are the same, they do not take it into the same depth or breadth as medical students.
Pharmacy school is easier than medical school. They also pick from a weaker pool of applicants.
This has nothing to do with whichever field is "inferior". There's nothing to compare. They are difference.

Let's talk about 4th year of medical school after you've done it, thanks.

So I can't talk about 4th year but you can talk about pharmacy school and the depth and breadth of their courses? And you claim that they pick from a weaker pool of applicants but it has nothing to do with whichever field is "inferior"? Hypocrisy and a contradiction in one post, you've outdone yourself tough guy.

 

[sliceofbread136]

So I can't talk about 4th year but you can talk about pharmacy school and the depth and breadth of their courses? And you claim that they pick from a weaker pool of applicants but it has nothing to do with whichever field is "inferior"? Hypocrisy and a contradiction in one post, you've outdone yourself tough guy.

You aren't giving 4th year enough credit. The first half which includes subIs, aways and step 2 I actually found significantly more work than ms3. Even after interview season I still put in a decent amount of work (this is more variable). You can't just pretend it doesn't exist.

 

[Lexicon0]

Although their comment was a bit abrasive, there is some validity to it. First, if you look at curricula of pharmacy schools, they take many of the same courses we do (biochem, micro, phys, path, and obviously a bunch of different pharm courses...some even have a gross anatomy course). So it seems like those who are dismissing pharmacy school as being so much easier than med school are making their conclusion based on their belief that pharmacists are inferior. If not, I'd love to see some evidence of how people made this judgment.

Also, M4s at my school (and even on these online forums) boast about how M4 is all downhill after interview season with most being on vacation post-match. It puts things into perspective when you objectively consider how inefficient M4 is for medical students. Might be a bit of an oversimplification but medical school can easily be 3 years + an interview season and that's it, especially if you go into something that doesn't require away rotations.

I don't think the difference between med school and pharm school (or other professional schools) is as simple as people make it out to be.

Unless fourth year is done drastically differently at your school, this seems to be an oft perpetuated misconception on these forums. I think most of the 'downhill' experience stems from the fact that the pressure is off from a grades standpoint once ERAS is submitted. As fourth years, we still had to do a slew of rotations in our fourth year most of which were Sub-I's (multiple surgical sub-I's, ICU sub-I's, etc). In my class, the people going on vacation post-match are the ones that meticulously planned their fourth year schedules. A good chunk of my class is still doing rotations and we're about 2 weeks from graduation.

 

[AcademicNeurosurgery]

You aren't giving 4th year enough credit. The first half which includes subIs, aways and step 2 I actually found significantly more work than ms3. Even after interview season I still put in a decent amount of work (this is more variable). You can't just pretend it doesn't exist.

I never pretended it didn't exist and specifically mentioned in scenarios where people don't have to do subIs. I don't intend to convey that M4 is a breeze for everyone, especially not for those entering competitive specialties. Just saying that it is important to keep things in perspective when having this discussion. While pharmacy has three pre-clinical years, some med students plan a substantially lighter schedule towards the end of M4. While pharmacy school classes in biochem, micro, etc. don't cover the same "breadth and depth" according to the all-knowing @Psai , pharmacy schools teach several additional classes in pharmacokinetics, pharmacodynamics, etc.

The comparison is not black and white and, frankly, is irrelevant. I only joined this conversation to provide an alternative perspective to the MD students who still think it's all about the doc. The most amiable and competent faculty/preceptors at my school never crap on nurses/pharmacists/surgical techs. The abrasive ones crap on everyone. You get to choose which type you want to be.

 

[AcademicNeurosurgery]

Unless fourth year is done drastically differently at your school, this seems to be an oft perpetuated misconception on these forums. I think most of the 'downhill' experience stems from the fact that the pressure is off from a grades standpoint once ERAS is submitted. As fourth years, we still had to do a slew of rotations in our fourth year most of which were Sub-I's (multiple surgical sub-I's, ICU sub-I's, etc). In my class, the people going on vacation post-match are the ones that meticulously planned their fourth year schedules. A good chunk of my class is still doing rotations and we're about 2 weeks from graduation.

I doubt our M4 structure is that different from other schools. We do send significantly less people into surgical fields and other fields requiring aways so the majority of folks I spoke to were heading into FM/IM/peds/psych. A few scheduled "research rotations" and took a study block for Step 2 CK. Plus the rotations they are on were intended to help with what residency they matched into so they tended to enjoy these rotations. I'm sure for folks like myself who want to go into a surgical field fourth year is a different story.

Didn't intend to mislead, my apologies.

 

[Psai]

I never pretended it didn't exist and specifically mentioned in scenarios where people don't have to do subIs. I don't intend to convey that M4 is a breeze for everyone, especially not for those entering competitive specialties. Just saying that it is important to keep things in perspective when having this discussion. While pharmacy has three pre-clinical years, some med students plan a substantially lighter schedule towards the end of M4. While pharmacy school classes in biochem, micro, etc. don't cover the same "breadth and depth" according to the all-knowing @Psai , pharmacy schools teach several additional classes in pharmacokinetics, pharmacodynamics, etc.

The comparison is not black and white and, frankly, is irrelevant. I only joined this conversation to provide an alternative perspective to the MD students who still think it's all about the doc. The most amiable and competent faculty/preceptors at my school never crap on nurses/pharmacists/surgical techs. The abrasive ones crap on everyone. You get to choose which type you want to be.

It's not crapping on other people to know that your schooling was more rigorous and intensive than other people. What a strange notion.

Also it's definitely all about the doctor.

 

[NeuResurgens]

Seems like a decent percentage of students in all the other health professions are prone to try and pick fights and junk measuring contests with medicine.

 

[mehc012]

I mean, yeah...that Pharm school sounds way harder than my med school. But any prof can make any subject arbitrarily difficult by changing the schedule and grading parameters around. In this case, I wonder: is the school harder because it has to be given the material that needs to be mastered for graduation, or because it was set up in an unnecessarily challenging way? Because the latter is really just an indictment of the school administration rather than a statement on the difficulty of medical vs pharm practice.

Also, as a chemistry major who wanted to go into healthcare...yeahhhh no way I would have gone Pharm despite the 'chemical' nature. It just wasn't something I found intellectually stimulating.

 

[Woolman9]

"I just need to get something off my chest, because it seems to be coming up a lot lately... I hate it when people ask me, "You're so smart! Why didn't you apply to medical school?" First of all, pharmacy school is harder than medical school. Yeah, that's right. If you compare [blank] School of Pharmacy to the School of Medicine, you'll see some stark contrasts. Whereas the medical school is a block-system, PASS/ NO PASS, "exam-every-three-weeks" type of curriculum structured by therapeutic area/disease state, [blank] Pharmacy is a hot mess of 4-5 concurrent courses, ALL GRADED on NO CURVES with exams nearly every single week of the quarter. In fact, this week I have 3 exams in the span of 6 days-- PCOL/PCHEM (which is essentially 2 classes of pharmacology & pharmaceutical chemistry) on Wednesday, biopharmaceutics on Friday, and then my SECOND physiology exam of the quarter on the following Tuesday. I just had my FIRST physiology exam this past Thursday. Additionally, Dr. [blank], PharmD, MD-- [blank title]-- told me herself that pharmacy school is more rigorous than medical school. And this is a lady who went to both. She went to [blank] for medical school and [blank] (a three-year year-round PharmD program) for her PharmD. Unprompted, she told me pharmacy students have it far worse because understanding the chemical basis of drugs-- and how they work in the body-- is more challenging than understanding pathophysiology and disease progression. It's a matter of chemistry v. biology-- if you like chemistry and want to be a health care professional, you go to pharmacy school. If you like biology and want to become a HCP, you go to medical school. So even though doctors are at the top of the health-care hierarchy, just know that PharmDs work twice as hard for half the appreciation. /endrant"

Came across this post online. Had to share it here. Thoughts?

WRONG!

 

[AcademicNeurosurgery]

Also it's definitely all about the doctor.

You must be a joy to work with.

 

[787593]

This thread is like those kids in grade school who were always convinced that THEIR dad was so much more bada** than anyone else's dad

My dad is 50 and can bench 315. Also, 12 reps with 225.

Your move...

 

[Dr. Rafiki]

My dad is 50 and can bench 315. Also, 12 reps with 225.

Your move...

We could spar back and forth, but I'll just skip right to the end: my dad is BATMAN

 

[dadaddadaBATMAN]

We could spar back and forth, but I'll just skip right to the end: my dad is BATMAN

Bullsh*t, i use protection.

 

[ridethecliche]

EM doc today talked about how awesome it is to have a good clinical pharmacist to run things by and come up with a good plan for management of complex patients and how they're such a great part of the team.

That must really piss off the pharmacists.